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Amen. It's not that it's not true - it's not EVEN true. It's bull$hit! Frankfurt goes on to explain bull$hit is never concerned with the truth - it is concerned with PERSUASION. What is wrong with a counterfeit is not what it is like, but how it was made. Like the four crucified counterfeit. Bullinger's logic, hermeneutics and textual analysis are all fallacious.* The conclusion of four crucified is based on flawed, phony premises, flawed assumptions and methodology (how it's made). It is a claim of historic fact but shrugs off a historical-critical approach in favor of an odious ride on a carousel of excrement - in favor of bull$hit methodology in order to persuade, to impress, to obscure, to zombify. Only the immature can buy the premises and conclusion. The "logic" of four crucified is similar to the logic used by flat-earthers: Truth and fact and evidence shall not get in the way of two grown men playing in the feces of another. It's not that four crucified is not true - it's not EVEN true! It's phony. It's bull$hit. * Bullinger on the surface seems impressive. And in a few ways, he is. HOWEVER, Bullinger was a dilettante. There are better lexicons and better commentaries without all the pretense and sleight of hand.

Because you, at the time, apparently had enough life experience against which to measure Rosalie's words and recognize them as Bull$hit. Hallelujah! Praise God! Amen! Old Skool, what a Righteous post, from my perspective! To Bolshevik I say that I can recognize the anguish you experienced because of what you described Waydale meaning in your life as a teenager. I am so sorry that you had to go through it. However, was your anguish caused by the exposure of The Way Corporation's evil acts and how people in the subculture at the time lashed out at you... or was your anguished caused by Waydale and P.A. having exposed what he did about what Martindale and corporate powers in The Way Corporation did? I can't answer that for you. But I hope you will be able to work through the issue and find resolution and peace somehow.

And for Victor and the Spinoffs (a lovely name for a mock rock group), it was (and for some still is) a MASSIVE con game. WE were/are the mark. Sure Victor made his case from scripture (in his pamphlet Christians Should Be Prosperous) But that was presented through the filter of contemporary culture, as opposed to exploration of the culture in the Book of Acts. The collegial culture among the believers at the time contrasts dramatically with the emphatic hierarchical culture of The Way, The Way Corporation, and The (counter-biblical) Way Tree. The two cultures are diametrically opposite. In the Book of Acts, did the apostles hoard the riches like The Way Corporation has in the 20th and 21st Century? Or did they assist the rank and file as a matter of course (rather than as a special act to make the apostles look heroic)?

Waydale had a HUGE effect on the way international. The trustees (before they started calling themselves directors) wanted very much for Paul Allen to disappear off the face of the planet. When he started waydale a huge expose of how TWI really works came pouring out and it was mostly putrid fruit. The directors love secrecy...why? Because their works are evil and they do not want how they really operate to come out in the open. Except now, thank to waydale/gsc it has. When the way international SETTLED out of court...yes...they basically gave the Allen's money to go away....grease spot cafe was born out of waydale. Why? Because as a condition of the settlement the Allens agreed to shut waydale down. Yes...the directors paid a huge sum of money to keep the truth from public record, shut down waydale, and for the Allens to go away. None of that would have ever happened when it did without waydale. I saw first hand how badly the directors were scrambling to conceal the truth. If you connect the dots...between lawyer fees, out of court settlements, etc....the way international spent millions over the martindale/Allen affair. Hows that for your abundant sharing at work? I was at HQ when Rosalie announced at the noon meal that they had settled the court case. I distinctly remember sitting there at my table thinking.,..SETTLED...WTF? Everyone around me was doing a standing ovation and many people were actually teary eyed that there was no more court case to worry about and the adversary had been defeated. I was so ticked they settled because to me it was an admission of guilt and a gross misappropriation of donations sent in by followers. This moment was really the fulcrum of me going from a starry eyed cult leader to waking the eff up to the truth that TWI's is an abusive cult. Waydale and Grease spot are responsible for exposing the belly of the beast. I would have never started posting here except I know first hand the impact these websites have had on TWI. Rosalie still had J0hn L!nder printing out GSC forums for her to read on a daily basis...and this was in 2008. She wouldnt put a computer in her office so she had Linder print out hardcopies. Why? They are looking for anything threatining or illegal where they can try and have GSC shut down. As you can see...that's an epic fail.

I consider Harry Frankfurt a good friend who I got to know, at least a little bit, from reading On Bull$hit.

Right there Wierwille, for those who have eyes to see and ears to hear, connected the dots to his "abundant sharing" mantra. This shows that is was all, or at least primarily, about HIM making a living by conning followers into believing God would "open the floodgates" to them IF they tithed and then some (to him). By all accounts, including records previously shared on GSC, it worked. Millions of dollars, it worked. Quite a scheme, wouldn't you say? Then there's the mere subsistence level wages The Way Corporation paid its employees... Btw, taking the PFLAP class at age 20 (on an island in the Atlantic Ocean), having had minimal life experience or college education by that point in my life, I did NOT, at that time, have eyes to see or ears to hear the reality of that economic scheme.

Interesting point, Nathan! Sometimes I wonder if there’s a part of my mind that is almost like a vacuum or a void – it wants to be filled with something…I was definitely in a search mode when I came across TWI…I let wierwille’s bull$hit fill that void for a while. Speaking of defining bull$hit – I read something interesting by Harry G. Frankfurt - he is professor emeritus of philosophy at Princeton University, where he taught from 1990 until 2002 – he has also taught at Yale University, Rockefeller University, and Ohio State University: “It does seem that bull$hitting involves a kind of bluff. It is closer to bluffing, surely, than telling a lie…Lying and bluffing are both modes of misrepresentation or deception. Now the concept most central to the distinctive nature of a lie is that of falsity…Bluffing too, is typically devoted to conveying something false…the essence of bull$hit is not that it is false but that it is phony. In order to appreciate this distinction, one must recognize that a fake or phony need not be in any respect (apart from authenticity itself) inferior to the real thing. What is not genuine need not also be defective in some other way. What is wrong with a counterfeit is not what it is like, but how it was made” From On Bull$hit When Frankfurt said what is wrong with a counterfeit is not what it is like, but how it was made – that got me thinking - one of the most revealing characteristics of wierwille’s bull$hit is the shoddy workmanship. Under scrutiny it does not hold up well. I like to think I've matured in my cognitive skills...for me now, there's nothing more satisfying than ruminating over well-made bull$hit.

It just showed a realistic view of a rainbow colored org