Ham

I think der vey THINKS they are the antithesis of the illuminati. They have ascribed to almost every half-baked conspiratorial theory that has a remote amount of plausibility. Supposedly, they saved us from the destruction of the constitution in the 1970's, then they supposedly saved us from another takeover, then they saved us from Y2K meltdown, by taking the right precautions.. I've heard claims how they saved us from famines and pestilence, "standing in the gap for da people". Mostly the "deliverance" is in terms of what DOESN'T happen. "Joe Schmoe, because he was faithful and abundantly shared, did NOT perish in a hurricane, unlike other greasespots.." I think the vey has to justify its existence, at least in the eyes of its followers. They hold up the illuminati, famines or pestilences as some kind of boogey man that only a VERY small, half baked, unimportant cult in podunk ohio can properly dispatch. The longer I have been out, the more ludicrous it appears..

Yeah.. I wouldn't be happy with TWI "writers" giving some kind of historic revision of my life either. Or slandered, like I lot of folks have had done to them. I wouldn't consider writing some articles for der veq mag hardly looking good on a resume.. no less an obituary. So.. what do I want on my tombstone? I'll take some ham, mushrooms, pepperoni.. Might be all I can get..

Here are the results of a similar kind of "training". The only difference I see, they are "secular", and momentus has a fine religious veneer. I wonder if CES really knows what they are messing with.. http://www.cultnews.com/archives/000781.html

Here is a little bit about the parent organization: from http://www.rickross.com/reference/lifespri...ifespring7.html No wonder they DEMAND you hold them harmless.

I think twi got our attention when we still believed in Santa Claus. Somehow portrayed God as some kind of Santa Claus machine, push the right buttons, and whatever you heart desires pops out the slot on the other side.

I wonder if the thin veneer of christian terms is an attempt to isolate the organization from attack by citing first amendment issues.. Double protected.. get through the hold harmless agreement, they can always claim they are practicing a religion..

Forgot all about those.. they were real whoppers.. All claims were validated by non-fulfillment. I've seen very intelligent people taken in by these claims.

I was looking at one of the websites.. these guys don't give up. The guys that run the thing argue something to the effect of, "well, you weren't part of the "training", so you don't have the right to say anything". Is that so? Do I need to drink cyanide before I am "privileged" enough to know it is poison? I do have some chemistry background, and that does qualify me to comment, without drinking it first. They even suggested to their critics, "take the training.. go see for yourself" Some already did.. some of the former "customers" are among the worst critics.. A potential critic would have to sign the hold harmless waiver. Hmmm, wonder what kind of "treatment" they'd get.. No sign? Well, maybe you're not willing to *trust* your "trainers".. Sign mine first. I'll bring a few "associates" along with me, if you don't mind..

Yep.. sketchy, at best.. Looks like a recipe for disaster- take people who by their own admission are not up to the par of professional psychologists, add a hold harmless agreement, and some "willing" victims.. bake for 3 days on high.. sheesh. Some of the good guys around here, that have been through that pressure cooker- I highly doubt they were the ones to vote death their team mates in the lifeboat exercise. To me, it looks more like an exercise in obnoxiousness and arrogance for those who were so inclined to begin with. Just remove the rest of the "restraints"..

That's why I put it in a PM.. I wasn't sure. :) Carry on..

I don't look for devils under the rocks anymore. I've found a couple of cults and con-men under them.. maybe it's the same thing "ham carefully replaces the rock, slowly backs away..."

Yep.. they had to invent a need. One of the favorites was the "devils under every rock" routine. Never mind what THEY were doing, look at da debil.. don't want to get jumped? *We* can fix that little "problem"..

Sounds like the Spanish Inquisition.. Apply enough "pressure" to force a change.. "Are you ready to recant yet, brother?" "Jeeves, bring the thumb screws.." Only difference, in the good old U.S.A., people are required to pay, and sign a permission slip.

from http://www.uia.net/~messiah7/mom_psychtechniq.htm "PHYSICAL discomfort" "may contain risks of PHYSICAL or PSYCHOLOGICAL injury.." anxiety.. hold harmless for DEATH arising from the "training"?? If any, I wonder how many have died. Death arising from the training must be in the hold-harmless agreement for a reason.

Well, I would reserve that priviledge to the Master himself. If loy helped anybody, especially later in his "ministry", I think it was in spite of himself. Mr. 123, I heard that claim too. He boasted about how many he ran off, people better than himself.

I think we got it back.

I don't like to disagree so much either.. Does God really need ME? perhaps, to do what he wants ME to do. I can't put what he wants me to do in the small box of starting a new work, "duplicating myself" so to speak.. I don't know if the world could even stand another one of "me" I would hope there is no room for another like me either..

Almost like "this buffoon is gonna do himself in, then, woo hoo.." This pic would make a rather interesitng "caption this"

What's up with that pic- that's what I was wondering. I was out before this pic showed the scene here. Anybody know the context? Was loy just "giggles" the clown? Rosie looks so "happy" it is almost troubling..

But what about this picture? I always wanted to ask.. I recognize the Hugh Hefner outfit, but the "colorful" wig? Is he dressed up like Timothy Leary, or what?

I hope nobody had to frame the "Hefner" picture

Naw, I didn't think you were rude at all. Sometimes I'm as clear as mud, just tried to clarify a little bit

"The Man of God for our Day and Time" 1. One enmeshed in grandiose self-importance. 2. certifiable lunatic

I remember when branch coordinator's wife came back from some minor surgery- these sycophants had meals and service planned for weeks in advance..

Yeah, I think that was what I was trying to say, in a different way. Just that to tell JL "God told me the trinity is true" would be one way to get off the CES "honor role".