waysider

Never happened, Dude. Not only did Mr. Wierwille fail to cite his sources, he made a concerted effort to conceal their origin. So, he wasn't simply a plagiarist, he was a plagiarist with a nefarious intent. That's some bad chicken.

There are factual errors in PFAL, quite a few of them. These are not matters of opinion. Your opinion and my opinion can be different. Facts, on the other hand, stand on their own, without anyone's blessing or damnation. Why, if the PFAL material is divinely inspired, does it contain legitimate, factual error? You needn't respond. The question is rhetorical.

You do know the definition used in the Advanced Class were plagiarized, don't you? Even if they hadn't been, it would be a circular argument using the Advanced Class to prove its own validity.

There is a whole narrative that goes with the hook shot story. Wierwille apparently told this story to Way Corps at one of those nite-owl type events. There is a thread on it here somewhere. He also claimed to have had the original idea for McDonald's but the debuhl stole it and gave it to Ray Kroc. He also claimed to have played basketball at the pro level (minor league, I think). Lots of tall tales, as well, involving his credentials, which have since been shown to be bogus.

Yeah, I'm stymied, alright. Stymied by why you think an unrelated topic belongs on this thread. Start a new one or move on with the discussion at hand. .

The key to understanding why we put up with this is that leadership made it seem as if WE were the ones who were flawed, not them. We had to persevere to prove ourselves worthy. You probably had somewhat similar experiences in boot camp.

He was transcribing The Grapes of Rats.

As was one of those ignorant, idealistic youths, I resemble that remark.

It's still plagiarism. He didn't cite his sources...ever. Not only that, it's his admission he lied when he said *he took all his books to the dump and relied on what God told him to look at in the Bible. *(That was the point he was trying to make with his phony "snow on the gas pumps" story.)

Yeah, none of us do...which is why you should get to the point. Wierwille was a plagiarist, not just any plagiarist, a hardcore plagiarist. Quite a bit of what he plagiarized has been shown to be scholastically deficient. (That means wrong.) You know it. I know it. Lots of people know it. So, why do you continue to exalt and promote the works of a plagiarist? A brief synopsis will suffice, as I understand the time and energy factors first hand.

Let the records show: It is Mike's contention that Wierwille's books are the result of divine revelation. "Do you think there are any modern God-breathed documents given in modern English? " What I think about that particular concept has no bearing on the topic at hand. I suggest you start a thread that more specifically addresses that question.

What happened to question 1.?

Why not both?

In a nutshell, the *odd* belief that got them kicked out was that Wierwille's so-called research was flawed. (Thou shalt never challenge the word of The Teacher)

Admittedly, this is a bit off topic (aside from establishing the credibility of a source), but you do realize he wasn't really a *Dr.*, don't you?

It's all in how you look at it.

Yes, he seriously said that and meant it. But, hey, he's back again, so maybe he can clarify the issue.

Welcome back, Mike. I'll cut straight to the point. 1.After investing so many years into studying Wierwille's books, are you still of the opinion they are the product of divine revelation? 2. Do you still hold to the assertion that, when Christ returns, He''ll be brandishing a PFAL book in his right hand? 3. Are you still chasing after that elusive *golden pony*? An extensive dissertation is not required, just a simple synopsis will suffice.

Ahh, but here's the rub. In Way World, having such thoughts would be considered thinking evil of your brother, a sign of spiritual weakness and unrenewed mind. You wouldn't want anyone to think you're spiritually weak, now, would you?

HERE

Don't worry, leadership will let you know.

In my opinion, it went downhill pretty fast, as soon as Wierwille saw that he could use it as a marketing tool. As early as the mid 1970's, creativity had been replaced with marketability.

Upper leadership knew the retention rate of new recruits was abysmal. That's why they pushed so hard to run more and more people through the class. It's like fishing. You cast your line countless times in expectation of an eventually successful catch. It also explains why the *donation* (price) fluctuated so widely over the years. It was adjusted to suit whatever the market would bear, not to fill a profit expectation. As recruiters, we were an unpaid sales force, working without commission. Last I heard, The Way is sitting on about a 60 million dollar nest egg. Peanuts in today's economy. Nothing to take lightly, though.

Wierwille said he asked God for a sign regarding the direction of his life and career. The result was an unprecedented snowstorm that was so intense it quickly covered the gas pumps at the filling station across the street. It was recounted in a book called The Way: Living in Love. You can revisit a thread that was devoted to an analysis and review of the book HERE. It's rather lengthy but a good read, nonetheless