brideofjc

Jesus Christ gathered twelve MALE disciples...

Is that "inordinate affection"?

NO! It's called CULTURE. Although if you read the Scriptures, you will find that WOMEN followed him on the road as well as the men. Joanna supported Him financially and she was married to an important person and was therefore rich.

Geisha

I am not really agreeing or disagreeing with you. I just think that you care regardless and that to me is the heart of Jesus Christ's message.

Many of us, no matter what the word says in certain places know contrary and have a grip on what is right and wrong.

Yet many have differing opinions.

We are told to sin no more, then we are told that we are above sin, then we are told that all who are above sin are liars.

Then Paul the Apostle goes on for several pages saying that he does what he does, not because he does, but because he does...

Then we have the law of liberty versus the law of sin and death, and we are free indeed!

And all of this justifies telling a homosexual that their sacred love for their same sex partner is a devil spirit...

Where is the love in that?

The person has to desire to be saved. Telling the person that homosexuality is a sin is LOVE. Especially, if it keeps them out of damnation at the judgment throne.

How many homosexual teens have committed suicide because of this man's loving God?

James Dobson

(feed my lambs)

He is holding a Bible, not the superimposed title that was put on to the book. Let's keep the truth visible here. If you wish to make a joke, then say that is what you are doing.

And what would you call turning water to wine? Alchemy?

Dictionary.com

Al-che-my

(second meaning) any magical power or process of transmuting a common substance, usually of little value, into a substance of great value.

(One might also note that the word Alchemy is of Arabic/Persian origin.)

[/

Well, WW, water is a very valuable commodity, especially clean drinking water, so your dictionary entry would not technically apply.

Are you Muslim?

I don't think I ever was financially prosperous when I tithed or when I "abundantly shared". I even let myself get talked into going up to 14% at one time. We dropped back down to 10% for one reason or another and the "leadership" started hitting us to "increase the proportion of our giving", which we didn't. Right about that time we were able to trade our clunker in for a nicer car; the leadership immediately assumed it was because we had increased our percentage and announced that that's what we had done in a meeting. They were pretty peeved when I told them later that we had not increased. I still chuckle at the BC's response: "So you just were able to buy a car using worldly means, like saving money?"

Once I stopped tithing I got out of debt and have been in the best financial position ever.

You can still ABUNDANTLY SHARE with others....even if it isn't in a church setting.

Yes hitching your horse on a Sunday/Saturday was also considered unholy and a sin. But today holy days don't matter... and... God has not changed?

My Question is which "God" does not change?

I am already going to hell because I am "happily" uncircumcised. (TMI, oh well)

But God seems to not anymore mind the gentiles and their schmucks…

Adultery was handled by the same "punishment" as homosexuals. Was it to deter sexual freedom or disease? Cured pork has nothing to do with sex but has all to do with disease. So, were these laws instituted for health reasons and not sexual reasons?

You would think heterosexuals would at least score a few points with their bisexual God because they understand "the birds and the bees".

Adam and Eve understood the birds and the bees and without corrupting the Bible with all this Lilith stuff the original sin stands as heterosexual sex...

And leave it to the heterosexuals to invent Lilith and use the story to flip the "original sin" around to hate homosexuals.

If the lesbians and gays really knew what "the Christians" have thunk up and used Lilith for they would drop her like a limp wrist.

Effeminates and dykes are going to hell too? Because their sexual preference is too murky, like God's or God-like. Explain how two sexes can represent the image of one God?

Then we get this picture of and androgynous man and woman suck to each other's backs with two genitalia... Remind you a bit of this ambiguous God that...

"Is not a man that she should lie..."

I will get back to you.

Yes two millennium ago Jesus Christ was crucified by these same right and left brained fundamentalists, Mary Magdalene nearly lost her life by their hands also and it seems some are still hanging on to their nails and stones even today.

Homosexuality in the old testament is listed with the great sin of eating pork!

Eating pork is an abomination in the eyes of God and anyone who eats it is worthy of death! (cynical)

In the New Testament Paul the Apostle concludes there is neither male nor female (left or right brain) but all are one in Christ then he, Paul (an unmarried man) defines the natural use of a woman?

Isn’t there a bit of contradiction in this and some want to label this all LOGICAL?

Mary Magdalene was not the woman who was caught in adultery and almost stoned in front of the Lord Jesus. That was a misinterpretation and it has held on for millenniums. It wasn't just pork, there were other unclean things and the purpose of these things was to teach between holy and unholy since Adam/Eve lost the Holy Spirit after they sinned and therefore could not receive this information via the Spirit anymore.

You have to be MARRIED in order to figger out the birds and bees? :blink:

There isn't any contradiction and it is very logical indeed.

Blessings

Praise our Lord Jesus Christ...whether we see Him with our own eyes or we are raised from the dead...

HE IS COMING BACK!

I see that Ckeer beat me to the image of the signet ring. Also, when they carved pictures or letters into stone. This was considered to be permanent in their minds, never to be effaced and thus the image or type is created.

Amen!

He who gives of his bread to the poor is blessed.

I don't have my Bible here right now, but I believe it is in Proverbs.

Indeed, God loves a cheerful giver.

RFLMAO....

Nearly every morning my wife asks me if I want a cup of coffee and my answer is invariably to ask; do bears $hi+ in the woods?

It took her a while to get the meaning of this particular American idiom as they don't seem to have anything comparable in the *original* Greek language.

I'm going to show her this thread -- btw, thanks for the photo Ron, that's a real bute.

Now, what on earth am I going to ask her tomoorrow morning when she asks if I want a cup of coffee?...

Do bears $hi+ in Ron's oregano? :unsure:

Hey G2ME....sure there is!!!

Ho Kronos Ex-ete Ton Ther-on Tou Krap-atou Gay????

"Time to have beast crap on earth???"

As close as one gets without my UBS4 available right now! Could use some tweaking Im'm sure!

When is love real? When you are love and are loved by the Lord Jesus Christ!

Bride, thanks for your answers. I had run across the lady apostle too, when I found a Wikipedia on women in the Christian church and I've just glanced at some of it. Thomas Aquinas in the 13th century corrected someone else (St. Augustine??) who said that women were just "misbegotten men." Tom A. said this cannot be true, because that would mean God made a mistake when He made women. So, Tom A. decided that women were placed on earth to make babies. Period.

What else do men do when they get together? Well, I think the medical term is "flatus."

There is a ray of hope, in that Mr. Garden has mentioned he disagrees with other things this young pastor states. I will find it very interesting when they get to the part about women. They are meeting in our home next month, and I intend to be gone the entire time, since I'm sure they wouldn't want a lowly and unworthy female human being around to overhear divine secrets. I'm taking the dog, too, since she's a girldog and might gossip about the dogs across the street!!! :blink:

Either that, or I could hole up in the sunroom behind the dining room table where they will undoubtedly meet, with a racy movie and a bottle of wine, emerging only to use the toilet and laugh loudly at whatever they are talking about!

Well, maybe not.....

But there is no way in he11 I am signing the commitment sheet that was passed out at the last meeting, including how much sacrificial tithing I would do and promising "submission to leadership."

Been there. Done that. Got the scars on my heart to prove it.

WG

MIS - BE - GOT - TEN.......God MIS - sed (when He made just one man) and so He BE God and GOT - TEN (men) and W( r )O - lled them into one and said, "I have just made and "Wo(lled)-men!" Sorry, I couldn't resist! Excerpt from BOJC Theological Dictionary

"flatus." Hmmmm....which end? Is FLATUS for upstairs? Flatulence is definitely downstairs!

This is when it pays to have very heavy drapes in the parlor....as long as your toes don't stick out. Course the other female may give you away with the sway of the drapes along with her tail.

Never ever sign anything! Allegiance to God only!

The application for our new administration has a application that addresses this issue.

IT IS and always has been an issue for anyone who does not want or need any information on a personal level in the public eye to be used in any manner that may cause legal trouble or even embarrassment .

One of the many question on the application asks have you now or at any time kept a diary of your thoughts or feelings that could in any manner embarrass this adminstration?

Can you think how many individual and whole corporation have been brought down to nothing in the name of a few notes? it isnt just email that is subject to intense check it is all and everything one decides to write .

be careful , the one bit of information or adivice i did keep in my life is never write anything down that may one day be used as information against you.

what one associates with and who is vital information to those who make a living on exposing others to the public.

on a personal level i have experienced this: After i was marked and avoided I kept a diary of my feelings about the ministry its leaders and my pending divorce.

twenty years later my son found the note book and read it.

think about what I said ? much? it was not a moment i needed in my life and my son had no business knowing my own personal thoughts in a very difficult complex time in my life.

i regret he was exposed to it. at the time of the writing it did help i suppose but not worth the cost in the picture of the potential harm such writing can have .

call me radical , i work in a school at times, I hear the teachers and para's talk and chat amoung one another, you would want to think they are professional and could keep their mouth shut about the students they can not they are just as much gossip and slanders as much as any other group if not worse.

In middle school when my children where asked to write personal notes about feeling or family, if I felt it invaded our own safety or privacy i wrote a note to the teacher and told them they are not going to be given this information about my family and requested another question to complete the assignment.

the teahcers often speak very ill of their student amoung their own selfs and the adminstration esp. if they consider your child noncompliant or more work than they want to muster on any given day. those records go into the student personal file which as we write is now going electronic for all the world to hack into and use against a person some day.

think about it.

if your world has rose glasses where everyone plays fair and nice and honestly then go it, but by chance you live in this place that will do or scrape any amount of anything to destroy another just for kicks like everyone eles then i warn you about the serious implication such confidence could have on your life or your childrens life some day.

You are absolutely, unfortunately, very correct about what you have just said. This is why even George Washington had his wife, Martha burn every letter he ever sent to her after she had read it.

I have also had my journal stolen from me and used against me, so I quite understand where you are coming from on this matter. I have had to learn this lesson from the hard road taken and a gem that I just recently heard...one of those God moments....a coach was saying to a student...."keep your game plan to yourself." I took that personally for myself as well.

As far as teachers....again, unfortunately you are right having been in the break room with them at times...I have heard comments about students that would make the hair rise up on most parents' heads.

Well, more stuff...

The church we helped plant is dying and the young associate pastor wants to start a new, nondenominational fellowship. He and another man are the two elders, so far. He is training a few good men to be elders, one of whom is Mr. Garden, at least for right now.

This young man says that while perhaps some women may qualify to be deacons, there will never ever ever be a woman elder or a woman allowed to teach from the stage. Women, he informed us, can be vicious, terrible gossips, as Paul warns. (the worst I ever heard were men). So he is quite leery of women being in authority at all. Of course, I'm sure we are allowed to cook and clean.

He uses those same verses about women keeping silent, not teaching or usurping authority over men, and so on. These are, he says, universal truths commanded by God to be obeyed.

Mr. Garden does not believe this, so I don't know what he will do when they get to that part in the book (I sneaked a peek at the book, probably going to hell now )

I am thoroughly sick of this; the only thing that keeps me going is my son and DIL going to this church. The pastor has done a lot for him and I am very grateful. And the odd thing is, I don't want to be an elder or a deacon; all I want is a little respect and acknowledgment that I too am a worthwhile and not too stupid human being.

The link to Bethel Ministries that I posted earlier seems to imply that women do not have a personal relationship with Jesus Christ, only men. Wives have a personal relationship with their husbands, because the husband is the head of the wife and Christ is the head of the man.

I wonder how many perfectly great marriages have been strained because someone ran across this clap-trap. I feel like instead of being partners and best friends, we are, as the women's Bible fellowship was taught, to be master/servant. (Honest we really really were).

I only continue to be quite and patient about this because of my son and his family. However, if it ever gets to a point when he starts to wonder about some of the dogma, I will be happy to jump in and suggest we shop around a little.

WG

You should try showing them Romans 16 - Paul is addressing heads of church fellowships in Rome. Junia was an apostle and phoebe was a deaconess. Your so-called leadership is very wrong on these points. Youre right....some of the worst gossips are really men. Besides grunting...whatever else do you think they are doing when they are bowling, hunting, fishing, throwing darts etc etc

What was worse, when they got to the name of Junia...some MALE translator actually had the hutzpah to give it a male ending in the Greek so that it would agree with his personal doctrine on the WOG. The error has been discovered and it is correctly listed in the Greek NT. I think it was the church father, Jerome who did this lovely booboo.

The First Christian Church Disciples of Christ encourage women to rise up to whatever position they feel a calling. Our pastor speaks often on the subject and welcomes women to participate at all levels. You might check it out to see if there are any near you. They welcome everyone and really have no doctrine beyond the 2 great commandments Jesus talked about: love the Lord thy God with all your heart, soul, mind and strength and love your neighbor as yourself. Works for me!

That's because Disciples are a very liberal church. Because I am a woman, I tend to be liberal in this particular area if not in others. :)

OH REALLY?? You think the legal system is this country has ANYTHING to do with real justice? Yeah right.

The rich buy their justice and the poor go to jail. Even if you can manage an attorney--the DA can raise such a stink--you can't use the counsel you want.

If you HONESTLY think there is such a thing as justice in our system--you just might be deluded. It is hit or miss-just like this guy got his justice 50 perverts will get off.

I am so tired of hearing about a day in court--you know what a day in court means? All depends on who you are and what the system feels needs to be highlighted. It means NOTHING.

You want to do something good with your time. Find out about Minimum sentencing guidelines and lobby AGAINST THEM.

A day in court in this country has nothing to do with justice--you are better off on the internet--more truth is gleaned there--trust me our legal system BITES!

YES, INDEED IT DOES! Take for instance if a cop breaks the law by raping a woman, his fellow cops will cover up his dirty deed. Or the higher authorities will put out the word that nothing is to be done because they don't want the police force to look bad....especially in an election year.

And therein lies one of the biggest dilemmas an exwayfer can face.

VPW said cancer was caused by a devil spirit. His cause of death? Cancer.

VPW said alcoholism was a devil spirit. He lived in a constant state of drunkenness.

Same thing with sexual predation, etc., etc.

So were we following the teachings of a possessed man?

Or was that just one of the many things he was completely wrong about?

It doesn't look good either way.

Truly a possess-O

but not in O-R-E-O! :blink:

It is in the archives under churches, doctrines and something else.

I started that thread for an entirely different reason, mostly because I had taught in a small group in someones' home, at the leader's invitation, and the leader's wife got upset because a WOMAN had TAUGHT OUT OF THE BIBLE in front of MEN! It went on from there.

Perhaps someone can combine them at sometime if everyone so desires.

WG

Sounds like the leader's wife should try having a conversation once in a while with her husband!

Thanks, Geisha.

I think I am prepared to take on board that whether Bride or Body, it is just another figure of speech to represent a type of relationship. Like sonship. BoJC's idea of the Bride being taken out of the Body is a new concept.

As to a current thought posted above that we might be "cut off" or "no eternal security", I can't quite see that alongside this thread. A Body doesn't usually cut bits of itself off unless horribly diseased or mutilated such that the rest of the body would be at mortal risk (gangrene, for example). Cutting off someone does not fit either with the concept of a Bride becoming one with the Body: for a husband is to love and cherish his wife in sickness and in health. In the OT even a wife who whored around and was a horrendous disgrace was still loved and her husband went after her to bring her back into his household (Hosea).

It is a thought from Romans, Twinky. I didn't write it, but the HS through His revelation to Paul as he penned it. Scary isn't it? It won't be the body that cuts bits and pieces off of itself, but the judgment of the Lord Jesus Christ...it will be God who cuts out the pieces. Perhaps this will be how the body will finally be mature. I have often wondered how the body of Christ would ever be fully mature with so many so-called Christians content to remain sucking on bottles rather than craving the meat of the HS.

So it is most definitely a thought for prayer and meditation with the Lord Jesus Christ leading us.

Bride, I pretty much agree with everything you say.

Paul did preach to Jew and Gentile. But, it was Paul, and Paul alone, who received the revelation of the "mystery" from the risen Christ. Israel had the living earthy Messiah. Paul dealt with the Heavenly, risen Christ. Paul received this revelation when he was in prison. The prison epistles (which include Timothy) reveal the "mystery" - the new creation, and one body - his body.

But, you also have his other epistles, where he's seeing it, preaching what he knows to both Jew and Gentile (again, in II Cor. He tells them they will have a new celestial body), Romans was his foundation and it was built on, kind of preparing the Jews to accept the one body with the Gentiles, which he does in Galations, Hebrews and the non-prison epistles. Then you see the apex of the mystery revealed to him in Ephesians while imprisoned.

He talks about "my gospel." this was different from the gospel the apostles were preaching (the kingdom is at hand - repent). Because of "my gospel" he had to go to Jerusalem and explain it to the Apostles. There they gave him the right hand of fellowship and decided: they would continue to go to the jews, Paul to the gentiles. That is why Peter said, some of his teachings were hard to understand.

In the NT, you see Paul's understanding grow. Because of the "abundance of revelation" to Paul, there was a thorn in the flesh.

When we read the parables and prophecy given by Jesus in the Gospels, most were talking about the Kingdom, like the 10 virgins with oil. Since this age of grace, the age of this mystery was still a secret and not yet revealed, and since Jesus was sent to Israel, and was expounding to his Apostles, those are all to Israel. I believe the Jesus was talking about the end times when he returns from heaven and restores the Nation of Israel. There will be some who let their oil run out, when he returns it will be too late.

Yes, when Paul quotes the OT, there's plenty written to Israel to the descendents of Abraham. Those prophecies are fullfiled in Rev. when the Gentiles believe the preaching of the 144,000, and are martryred - the gentile "tribulation" saints. They enter into the Kingdom when it comes along with Israel, thus, are all nations blessed.

I see the Bible as prophecy which is all to and for Israel. But the NT - mystery, the new creation, jew and gentile one new body - is a parenthesis sandwiched in there. It doesn't take up much space. Then, the church is gathered, the holy spirit reverts back to working like it did in the OT - upon, not in. The church and Holy Spirit gone, the parenthesis is now ended and God picks up dealing with Jew and Gentile and the OT prophecies of the "end of days", Daniel, Ezekial, Isaiah, etc., Jesus telling Israel the signs to come, are now finalized and culminated in Revelation.

The NT believer is never told to look for times, seasons, moons, planets, blood red sun, abomination in the temple, etc. Those are end times for Israel. Israel will know, during the tribulation, when the Messiah will come, almost to the day.

Those of us in this parenthesis of the NT, the one body, are not told to look for signs. We are to look for Christ and his return. That's it. We look for him. His coming for us is different than his coming for Israel at the end.

Well, I'm not dispensationalist by far. I categorically believe that there isn't any separation between the Gospels and the church age. This was TWI doctrine and also to be found in the Scofield Bible, which I won't even buy a copy of because of their doctrinal notes. If there is a "parenthetical clause" that we are living in, well....parenthetical clauses and/or sentences can be easily removed from the whole and you would still have the context of the whole, with or without. I refuse to be pidgeonholed into a parentheses Plus, then why do we preach the Lord Jesus and His death and resurrection, if He only came to the Jews? Then He cannot be our Messiah if we separate such things. Dangerous indeed. For if He isn't my Messiah, then I'm not saved and neither are you, nor anyone else.

The Gospel that Paul was teaching was indeed the mystery that had been made clear to him that the Gentiles would also be included. However, this was also known in the OT, they knew that the Gentiles would see a great light, etc. However, they probably didn't forsee that the Gentiles would have the exact same calling as the Jews, but most likely thought that there would still be a difference between the two, with the Jews being closer to God. This is why they had a court of the Gentiles that was separate from the Jewish court.

The 12 apostles also saw the risen Christ and they watched as He ascended up into heaven and the Lord Jesus told the 12 apostles that He would be with them until the end. I see no difference at all. If you also recall, Paul made it very clear that the Gentiles were grafted into the natural olive tree. Furthermore, (truly scary) God could CUT US OUT if we didn't remain with Him. This is another reason that I do not believe in eternal security per se.

What scripture do you use to support that the Holy Spirit will revert back to "on and not "in", if there is one, could you please refresh my memory?

The parable of the 10 virgins is for us too, Sunesis. Oil is symbolic for the Holy Spirit. The aspect of it running out is because the believer's love grows cold and they cease to be close to the giver of the Holy Spirit, namely, the Lord Jesus Christ. The Lord Jesus is coming for those who believe on Him. For those that lived and died before His earthly ministry, they will be blessed with eternal life because they looked forward to His coming and so remained faithful. Those that remain faithful after His earthly ministry will receive eternal life based on their belief that He died and rose for them and His blood cleansed them of all of their iniquities, transgressions and sins.

I know you are pretty knowledgeable of the Scriptures, but I would also encourage you to look beyond the dispensationalist views, there's far more wealth of wisdom in the entire Christian story, rather than being satisfied with a parentheses.

Blessings!

Mr. Juedes, I totally agree with you - it is grace. Abraham was made righteous without the law by his believing. Paul in Romans shows how grace and faith supersede the OT law, and that is why Israel is blinded today by trying to do the works of the law for their righteousness. But that's a whole 'nother thread.

I know people who are into covenant theology will disagree with what I wrote.

But too many Christians today do apply things for Israel to themselves - the church.

Paul does use the analogy in Ephesians of us as a bride, but he does not say we are the bride. It is an analogy.

Too many promises to Israel are not for us, and too many promises to the One body are not for Israel.

I see no problem with God having two groups - those on earth, and the new creation in heaven.

As I said, they were called in two different time periods, have different callings and different spheres.

If you really compare them, you have to do some twisting to make them fit as one group.

I know you are a trained theologan and I am not. So I cannot argue point by point and go up against your credentials.

From what I have read over the years, what I posted is what I think. If you read the OT and the prophecies - as the Bible is basically a book of prophecy - it is magnificent what God has in mind for Israel.

I do not believe the "one body," the "new creation," the "one new man in Christ," us who are the "fullness of Christ's body" is the same as the Bride.

Hi Sunesis:

You really do not have to twist anything at all to make it fit. The Lord Jesus came to Israel to fulfill the prophecies concerning Him, which He did. I forget which post said it...that Israel was never called to evanagelize...that's not true...they were supposed to do it...they just never did. Well, some did. Israel was supposed to receive her Messiah...and if they had....they would as a whole have spread Christianity around the world faster than we have. The initial church was Jewish and then began to include the Gentiles, which was already prophesied as well in the OT that the Gentile nations would also hear the Gospel.

As far as being Body or Bride....I believe that when you get born again you become the body... as you mature and grow and enter into the Kingdom...I say enter into the kingdom after being born again (read the Gospels), which is why the Lord Jesus said that "few there be that find it..." and He was speaking to COVENANT PEOPLE! The Lord was not speaking to Gentiles when He said that. My personal take on it, is as you get deeper and deeper with the Lord, you step out so to speak and become the Bride. I do not personally believe that everyone in the body of Christ will be the Bride, but those "few there be that find it." If we look at the analogy that Christ is the second Adam, the first Adam's BRIDE was TAKEN OUT OF HIM. So I also believe that the the second Adam's BRIDE, will also be TAKEN OUT OF HIM, i.e. out of His Body.

Note also that the parable of the ten virgins, only five of them were ready...But they were all in "competition" for the Bridegroom. In 2 Cor 15 it speaks of an "out-resurrection" i.e. a resurrection of the resurrected if you will....this I believe will be the BRIDE and it will be the BRIDE that will rule with the Lord Jesus during His Millennial reign.

The whole OT is an age of grace.

The only difference between OT grace and NT grace is that the sacrifices of the OT (animal lambs) point toward fulfilment in Christ, while the NT points back to the finished work of Christ (the human Lamb).

THANK YOU!

By the way, the converse of the "bad husband" image is the "bad wife." I don't think Christ wants us to treat him as little respect, love, kindness, etc, that many wives show their husbands. So even in the "wife" image of what we are supposed to be to Christ, we have to look at the ideal not the typical human version. (Another digression- women were reated much better, and had more rights, in jewish society in the first century than people commonly think today. One evidence of this was the Bar Kochba letters found in a cave by the Dead Sea.)

The image of wife is very, very common throughout the OT (eg- Hosea) and NT. It's a powerful image to teach mutual faithfulness, love, commitment. It's just as important as "head." The two images teach different, but equally valuable, things. I don't see any value in ranking them.

I guess that would depend on which Rabbi you were reading. Various readings from the First century world regarding the treatment and the general train of thought concerning women were not as great as apparently R. Kochba thought of them. :unsure:

Christ Jesus and I have the same Father. So, if we have the same Father then I can not be the wife. If I am................sicko!!!!!!!!!!!

Think about it you guys.

You should read the wonderful imagery in Song of Solomon...."my sister, my wife..." This was allowed physically because they had different mothers etc.

seems to be something important here-

Isaiah 30

1Woe to the rebellious children, saith the LORD, that take counsel, but not of me; and that cover with a covering, but not of my spirit, that they may add sin to sin:

2That walk to go down into Egypt, and have not asked at my mouth; to strengthen themselves in the strength of Pharaoh, and to trust in the shadow of Egypt!

3Therefore shall the strength of Pharaoh be your shame, and the trust in the shadow of Egypt your confusion.

The Holy Spirit is The Lord Jesus' spirit...so Amen and Amen.