WordWolf

"What could I do? I... left."

"He broke jail."

"I acquired transportation–"

"He stole a spaceship."

"The patrol acted in a hostile manner–"

"They fired on him."

"They've got no respect for private property – they damaged the bloody spaceship!"

Isn't Tim Lahay's theology on End Times accepted as accurate by many conservative Christians? It sounds very similar to what a Pentacostal friend of mine believed.

The position is by no means universally held, but a number of fundamentalists hold it.

So you don't see anything wrong with a game where children are blowing away(albeit without gore) unbelievers?

This is not a first-person shooter, nor a 2-D fighter game, nor a scrolling game,

nor even an MMORPG like World of Warcraft.

It's...a....strategy...game.

Having noted that, even the strategy/tactics portion is small, and generally,

kids won't be interested in it anyway because it LACKS the visceral connection

that people keep claiming it HAS.

Christian soldiers?Against the unChristians? How does it being 'after the rapture' matter? Is human nature supposed to change or something tat thta time? so anyone not a Christian will be evil?? So what happens to free will? Seems like there is only one will or death.

Is that not subtily teaching your kiddos that unbelievers really are evil? That someday they will have to die because they are really enemies? Us vs them mentality?

Of course that is some people's doctrine. TWI, others,too.

What about a Muslim game--war against the infidels? Would you let you kids read that fiction, and play that game without saying anything?

It doesn't make you uncomfortable?

The doctrines would be a separate issue. I only addressed the claim of violent content.

We don't have any violent "strategy" games in our home that glorify war, nor are gore movies allowed.

allowed to play. The incredible likelihood (although this is no guarantee-someone CAN select

the games carefully enough to avoid this) is that there is at least one game there which has

violent content, where the player's character beats down, shoots, slashes, explodes, or otherwise

destroys his enemies, either one on one or in groups and vehicles-

and that this is the MAIN PORTION of the game-what the player plays during the entire game.

I'd then compare that to this game, where a SMALL PORTION of the game has violence-

which is removed from the visceral appeal, since it's played out like a chess-match and not

the result of the player "pulling the trigger". Most video games are thus a LOT more violent

than this one.

Unless, of course, one is determined to ignore that and claim "the game is mostly about

shooting down unbelievers"-which was the position of at least one review, and one I think

was a complete error.

The Left Behind books have been discussed in my home also, though I won't stop my kids from reading them, they know why I don't like them and their exclusionist view, fear motivation etc.

And, no, I won't be buying the game so I can see it for myself. I read one of the books. I spent no money on it(someone was trying to convert one of my kids and gave them some), and watched the movie for free on TV. Not a fan.

Feel free to use your dollars to vote for the games/movies/books you want to see.

I do the same.

And no, I don't have any plans to buy this one, at present.

(I reserve the right to change my mind later.)

I got to visit with people still "in" (barely) this week who have some good connections, and I've come away with the realization that twi will not ever go away.

it's not a ministry.

it's a retirement plan for a small, select group of "chosen ones".

here's the unsubstantiated (and distilled) information I gathered:

the trustee cabinet salary is in the 70k/year range, on which they are, interestingly enough, able to purchase nice cars and homes without debt.

TWI does not need ABS. the organization has enough investments that it is self-reliant and can thrive quite well indefinitely without tithes, without meetings, without ministers, without a flock, without classes, without research. ministers, meetings, and members are only to present a pretty veneer of authenticity on the "christian ministry".

the services and fellowships are a sham. there is no longer any research nor is research on the field permitted, the only approved teaching topics at fellowships and STS are from VPW's published works, so basically all the present teachings (or is it still "present truth"???) is a regurgitation of plagerized material compiled 30+ years ago.

Actually,

the meetings and members are so the IRS doesn't shut them down-

it's so they can appear to be a non-profit organization/religion.

Oakspear, that statement exactly describes the exodus of 1989 in New York State to a tee..

SPEAK FOR YOURSELF, OLDIESMAN.

SOME OF US made a point of hearing from BOTH SIDES when each had the microphone

before making any decisions, and heard the bosses speak for themselves.

When I left, it was NOT because I was following men.

To be specific, I considered the basics of what one side said-

that the other was placing their own opinions above God-

to have been proven by what the other side said when they had ample time to

give their side.

In short, I REFUSED to follow men, and travelled alongside the NY believers

because they seemed correct to me at the time.

And when that seemed no longer the case, I slipped away.

Perhaps YOUR EXPERIENCE WAS DIFFERENT FROM MINE.

However, your description purported to speak for everyone who left,

and it certainly didnt speak for me,

and it didn't speak for Raf,

since it completely failed to describe the approach EITHER of us used.

A local pinhead, or group of pinheads, no more vilifies one group

than one GREAT local group means the whole organization is of God.

With a little checking, I found this:

http://www.leftbehindgames.com/pages/controversy.htm

LEFT BEHIND: ETERNAL FORCES

A statement from Left Behind Games Inc.

Troy A. Lyndon, Chief Executive Officer

Recently, much controversy has ensued due to published articles in the media which discuss the violence in our upcoming game, Left Behind: Eternal Forces. However, references to “praise the lord and pass the ammunition” or “kill in the name of God” or others were made by journalists spreading misinformation, which is absolutely not true. And for this reason, I have published this statement.

There is no blood or gore in Left Behind: Eternal Forces. The game is designed to be a classic battle between good and evil, but it does not gratuitously depict violence or death.

Others are concerned about the pre-trib religious doctrine believed by the Left Behind authors. Left Behind is not the Bible, it is a fictional story and accordingly, situations resulting from the stories' post-apocalyptic time-frame are used to encourage gamers to think about matters of eternal significance, a topic largely ignored by modern games.

Because our game is a ‘strategy' game, never does a player click a key or press a button to actuate a first-person violent act. Instead, control is managed by the player in much the same way as an animated chess game would be when pieces fight for position, except that in ‘real-time' strategy games, many pieces fight for position at the same time.

In Left Behind: Eternal Forces, the players' objective is to find ‘tribulation clues', which include Bible mysteries, codes and fascinating and eternally relevant information. In the initial missions, there is little emphasis on physical warfare and gamers are introduced to powers of influence which result in a battle for the hearts and minds of people. As missions progress, there are no ‘objectives' to cause war physically. However, physical warfare results when the player is required to defend against the physical forces of evil; led by the Global Community Peacekeepers.

Several months ago, there was a news story with erroneous information about the game. Unfortunately, some readers accepted the misinformation as being factual, and then the rumor mill and the blogs were off and running.

If you hear someone making negative statements about this game, we encourage you to ask if they have personally reviewed the game. If they are merely passing on hearsay, it is false and misleading information.

==============

"Strategy" games are not standard playing games. The player maneuvers characters

as if on a chessboard. Anyone who played Final Fantasy 7 may remember Fort Condor

or the Condor Fort Gold Saucer game (same game). This works the same way,

and often the word "TACTICS" is added to a game title to indicate it's about maneuvering

forces that then act INDEPENDENTLY. (Final Fantasy 7 players who moved on to

Final Fantasy Tactics were often VERY surprised, since that game played NOTHING

like a Final Fantasy series game.)

I, personally,

remember a review in a newspaper on the SuperNintento game "Bible Adventures"

and how violent it was. I was offended- by the REVIEW.

I'd already PLAYED the game. I was unable to find the violent scenes.

There was Miriam chasing Baby Moses, there was David the shepherd gathering

his flock, and the more interesting Noah's Ark segment, where you gathered

the animals 2 by 2.

Supposedly, there was some violence late in the David segment. However, the

reviews made it sound as if the characters onscreen ran around slashing infidels.

I'm seeing a similar situation with these "reviews."

At least concerning violence.

Now, objecting in general on religious grounds is a separate discussion,

and I expect each person to know their own conscience.

That suggests this is *looks up the title*

"11001001."

The string of numbers is too long to be worth memorizing, unless you're diehard.

The episode with the Bynars.

He said he believed in Jesus Christ and that God raised him from the dead; he said he loved Jesus Christ and Christ was his lord and savior.

I believe Wierwille when he said that, so yeah, I think and believe he is born again, because I believe that Wierwille was honest when he said that and God's Word is truth and will come to pass.

And you believed him when he said a blizzard pinned him into the city in Tulsa.

And that he saw a snowstorm and heard from God that he'd be the recipient of special

revelation hidden for nearly 2000 years.

And that twi's programs were always about serving the individuals.

And when he said he never threw anybody out.

And when he said he always fought to keep people in.

Etc, etc.

However,

quite a few of those were shown to be lies.

It appears as though, according to OM-logic, the alcoholic father who abuses his children is a good father because he "tells" them NOT to do what he does.

Thanks for helping me see the (il)logic so clearly, Mr. Strange.

And as a Christian leader, he would be a success if he teaches his children

plenty of good Sunday School and Bible every Sunday without fail.

His beating-them-to-a-bloody-pulp Mon-Fri at times, of course, are simply

expressions of his "flesh".

Since, years later, his children are able to recite whole passages of Scripture

and their meanings, in English AND Greek,

he obviously was a success as a Christian leader with them,

because they DID learn some Good Bible.

The flashbacks and facial twitches they still have, well, bringing them up only

speaks to the negatives in his life. Are we supposed to speak of his negatives?

After all, he taught them some Good Bible!

After all, none of us are perfect. And his imperfections causing lifelong damage

to some people, well, what does that matter?

After all, he taught them some Good Bible!

.....so it's Raf's turn.

To Raf:

That's correct.

I STILL think of that episode as "Res-Q", and probably will until I die.

Your turn.

To George:

PBPHBTHTBPBHT!!!!

I know very little, but it's probably more than the average GSC'er knows about it.

First of all, there's no "it"- North America had hundreds of nations, and lost possibly

95% of its "native" population as a result of wars with, broken treaties from,

and diseases carried by "colonizing Europeans."

That can make people a bit resentful.

Want an example? Look up "the Trail of Tears", aka "the Trail Where We Cried"

for a well-documented incident in the history of the United States.

And that's really only one story, mostly of ONE nation-the Cherokee.

He sounds angry-and I suspect he's picked up some of that.

If you want to empathize with him, understand some of that anger.

Don't give him any fake pathos bs where you pretend to understand and want him

to suck it up-that won't get his respect at all.

Another thing you'll want to understand...

You'll need to try to see things from a position of a deep respect for the land,

for nature, for all living things.

Not every nation was as enlightened as every other on that subject,

but what's taught around nowadays on the subject-

especially the insta-converts like he might be-

is that this is THE cornerstone of "Native American spirituality."

ALL things in nature are to be respected- for all things in nature are SACRED.

When you kill the deer for food, you thank the deer's spirit for giving you meat,

and you don't waste any of it.

When that's an attitude you can RESPECT and not simply bite your cheek over,

then you may be ready to communicate with him, and listen.

Before he is ready to hear you speak, you will need to hear HIM speak, and listen to him.

Of course, that's just my advice. You're free to dismiss it all you want.

Silence of the Lambs

Anthony Hopkins

"Bram Stoker's" Dracula

"My only regret is having to die and finding you here."

"First you take a piece of meat, then you put it in some heat, then you shove it in a bun-"

"'Shove it in a bun?' We do not 'shove it in a bun!' We place it carefully!"

"Now there, little Dee-Dee, eat the nice jackass meat!"

"It is NOT jackass meat! Those are 100% BEEF PATTIES that we shove into those, I mean..."

This was from the "Bridgeburger" episode. Rerun wanted to be in their commercial, and wrote

a jingle which scandalized the executive, and they wanted Dee to do the commercial.

Even though she kept calling it 'jackass meat.'

"Principal Bradley smells badly."

This was from the "freedom of the press"/underground newspaper episode.

They printed this, and it was quoted a lot back at them.

"Who did it? Who stole the bracelet?"

They gave Ms Collins a gag gift anonymously-an empty box. But she recognized Raj's handwriting.

So they were going to pretend it had a bracelet which was stolen.

"Which Doobie you be?"

The Doobie Brothers episode.

"Hello. I be Roger Thomas-which Doobie you be?" on the phone.

"I can't help it if I'm fat! It runs in my family!"

Nobody runs in your family-they all waddle!"

Rerun-Dee exchange.

"Mama?"

"What is it, baby?"

"I can't breathe...."

Raj-Mrs Thomas exchange, which happened a few times in a few variations.

"Whichever team has the fancier helmets wins."

Dwayne's very successful method of picking winning football teams.

"We worship Mother Nature. And Ralph."

"Ralph? Who's Ralph?"

"Ralph represents all that which is good and pure.

Ralph is a head... of lettuce."

"YOU WORSHIP

A HEAD

OF LETTUCE?"

My alltime favourite What's Happening quote.

Rerun joined the Baba Ram Baba cult. Which was a scam for his money.

He shows up in saffron robes. Bald. With a tambourine.

Rerun realized it was a scam when he overheard the ringleader.

So he and the good group freed the cultists-and their money-

by having Mother Nature appear at a meeting and give the money back.

"GET YOUR HANDS OFF ME!

It's not nice to feel Mother Nature!" -Mrs Thomas.

You feel fulfilled knowing that now, right?

Momma I can't breathe is the giveaway...

What's Happenin!

Correct!

"First you take a piece of meat, then you put it in some heat, then you shove it in a bun-"

"'Shove it in a bun?' We do not 'shove it in a bun!' We place it carefully!"

"Now there, little Dee-Dee, eat the nice jackass meat!"

"It is NOT jackass meat! Those are 100% BEEF PATTIES that we shove into those, I mean..."

"Principal Bradley smells badly."

"Who did it? Who stole the bracelet?"

"Which Doobie you be?"

"I can't help it if I'm fat! It runs in my family!"

Nobody runs in your family-they all waddle!"

"Mama?"

"What is it, baby?"

"I can't breathe...."

"Whichever team has the fancier helmets wins."

"We worship Mother Nature. And Ralph."

"Ralph? Who's Ralph?"

"Ralph represents all that which is good and pure.

Ralph is a head... of lettuce."

"YOU WORSHIP

A HEAD

OF LETTUCE?"

Ok, let's see here.....

"First you take a piece of meat, then you put it in some heat, then you shove it in a bun-"

"'Shove it in a bun?' We do not 'shove it in a bun!' We place it carefully!"

"Now there, little Dee-Dee, eat the nice jackass meat!"

"It is NOT jackass meat! Those are 100% BEEF PATTIES that we shove into those, I mean..."

"Principal Bradley smells badly."

Was this from that "ENTERPRISE" thing where they "explained" how the Klingons had the ridges and then

didn't have them, then had them again?

But that's the point-

twi drew near to God with their words ("The Word of God is our only rule of faith and practice")

but their actions were often VERY far from Him. (vpw trolling "Birth to the Corps" papers looking for the

next chick to drug and rape.)

One of the main points is that this happened;

another is the glib hypocrisy this exposes-

"Do as I say, not as I do-

and if what I say doesn't match God's Word, do what I say anyway."

It WAS "only if you do it our way", which WAS "crapola".

Dissent-even if based on Scripture-has never been popular at twi- especially when it was vpw or lcm

being addressed (and let's not even mention rfr.)

vpw put forth he was some sort of godly maverick who stood up categorically against the religious figures

of his day,

but stand up to vpw and you're on a bus home. Oh, and don't bother contacting anyone-they've all been

told you're possessed.

So, they taught-at times- that the Bible should be the only rule for faith and practice.

At other times, they were CRYSTAL CLEAR that you'd best do what you're told,

or there will be Trouble.

With a capital T and that rhymes with V

and that stands for Victor Paul Wierwille,

founder of twi and founder of trouble in twi.

This worm is exploiting the Javascript support within Apple's embedded QuickTime player. This is used in conjunction with a MySpace vulnerability that was announced two weeks ago on the Full-Disclosure mailing list.

This is a virus that attacks MySpace user profiles, using an exploit of the QuickTime player.

The vulnerabilities are being used to replace the legitimate links on the user's MySpace profile with links to a phishing site.

Translation:

The links in the user's MySpace profile then get changed to links for phishing sites.

So, people clicking on the links will be scammed.

Once a user's MySpace profile is infected (by viewing a malicious embedded QuickTime video), that profile is modified in two ways. The links in the user's page are replaced with links to a phishing site, and a copy of the malicious QuickTime video is embedded into the user's site. Any other users who visit this newly-infected profile may have their own profile infected as well.

Translation:

The MySpace profile will also be used to host a copy of the infecting video,

so others can be infected as well.

==========

What to do?

I don't think this affects computers THEMSELVES-just the MySpace network.

Until MySpace fixes it, though, the smartest thing will be to stay off MySpace,

or, failing that, to avoid clicking ANY links on MySpace no matter what.

In general, I'd keep my antivirus up-to-date as well, just in case something

(probably not this) can try to infect your computer.

Undercover Blues

Dennis Quaid

the Big Easy

"BOOGER"

This is from the series pilot of WKRP IN CINCINNATI.

Johnny Fever (Johnny Caravello, aka Johnny Midnight, aka....)

had been fired from his previous job because he had said "Booger"

on the air, and someone complained.

The asst manager gave him a list of music-and rock albums-to play,

and told him he had a lot more freedom here-

he could even say "Booger" if he wanted.

*leaves*

Johnny sets up a rock album on the second turntable, then reaches for

the first turntable, playing some easy listening stuff.

"So long, elevator music.... No.....YEAH!" *rips album off turntable, destroying it*

*starts playing rock music*

*turns on mike*

"OW! This is Dr Johnny Fever!..." etc.

*turns off mike*

*turns on mike*

"Oh, by the way....I just wanted to say.... BOOGER!!!!!"

I've actually seen that last line quoted since then.

all of those Klingon episodes from NG and beyond mix together like a plate of gagh for me. I can't tell one Kahless from another.

There's only 2 Kahless.

"Kahless the Unforgettable" was the warrior and General who founded Klingon society as it is now known.

He is said to have been a Klingon of impeccable honour, their greatest warrior,

and the inventor of the bat'lelth weapon (the "sword of honour" of the Klingons.)

To this day (in the shows), some Klingons wait for him to return, just as legends say

King Arthur will return.

The second Kahless was a clone from the genetic template of the original Kahless.

His knowledge is composed of the collected teachings and legends concerning Kahless.

He was installed ceremonial emperor of the Klingon Empire.

(Think of how the Queen of England can't just set policy.)

The political power of the Klingon Empire rests in the Klingon High Council.

"Kahless" is there to INSPIRE, to be a visible EXAMPLE to Klingons.

These quotes are most certainly from Deep Space 9, but I'm still unable to name

it yet. I like the first quote, though.

Funny how Sun Tzu's quoted-Picard quoted him as well in NextGen.

I don't know how to take that...

I'm giving you first crack at the answer because I think it's only fitting.

I'm familiar with the episode, but the reason I made a note of it TO remember

the relevant scenes is your own comments on it.

So hurry up and broadcast the answer for everyone,

unless you want me to take it.....

Pat

I learned the Word of God is our only rule of faith and practice,but it was in the 70s. However you might have noticed it does not seem to be a popular point of view here It's about as popular as a union leader at a Walmart store. It's a tough crowd but they can be tougher...............

Actually, Pat, I must make a correction.

As you might have noticed, "it" ("the Word of God is our only rule of faith and practice")

is not an opinion universally-held here.

However, quite a number of people DO hold it, and I'd say more than 1/2 the regular posters

are at least comfortable with the doctrine, whether or not they agree with it entirely or

mostly.

However,

it seems that "it" ("the Word of God is our only rule of faith and practice")

keeps getting confused-by some people- with

"something else" ("the Word of God was TWI's only rule of faith and practice")

and the majority of us say that "something else" was proven to be

COMPLETELY FALSE,

and that twi CLAIMED this (and claims it NOW) while following whatever

practice suits the office-holders, who then invoke a semblance of the verses

to justify the rules of faith and practice that they've already determined.

Generally,

so long as one isn't pushing that agenda

(or the "vpw never victimized anyone" agenda),

this is NOT a "tough crowd."