WordWolf

Actually, that's why YOU think other people care, or the reason you wish to attribute to why they care. Paraphrased, they care whether he lied and deceived because they're eeeevvvviiilll like that. I think the reason is better explained elsewhere. This is why we care... http://www.greasespotcafe.com/editorial/pl...m-wierwille.htm

http://www.monpa.com/dwc/world.html

Is this the first time you've heard that vpw wildly plagiarized? If so, then proceed immediately to http://www.empirenet.com/~messiah7/vp_stiles.htm http://www.empirenet.com/~messiah7/vp_stolenrthst.htm

Re: vpw's multiple acts of plagiarism... First, What is plagiarism? http://www.indiana.edu/~wts/pamphlets/plagiarism.shtml http://science.widener.edu/svb/essay/plagiar.html http://www.turnitin.com/research_site/e_wh...plagiarism.html http://hnn.us/articles/514.html http://people.brandeis.edu/~teuber/usemplagiarism.html http://www.lib.duke.edu/libguide/plagiarism.htm http://www.piercecollege.edu/faculty/kudlers/termpaper.html Citing sources: http://www.dartmouth.edu/~sources/about/what.html http://www.turnitin.com/research_site/e_citation.html http://www.lib.duke.edu/libguide/citing.htm Ok, so, now we know what plagiarism is, and how to avoid it, a few things to remember. A) All HIGH SCHOOL students are taught to avoid plagiarism. B) All COLLEGE students are taught to avoid plagiarism. C) All candidates for a MASTERS degree are taught to avoid plagiarism. D) All candidates for a DOCTORATE are taught to avoid plagiarism. Hm, flashback. vpw stated at ROA '79-and this is on the tapes-that he completed the requirements for his Doctorate before he completed the work for his Masters. The obvious implication of this is that it was easier to complete the Doctorate, which means it had easier requirements. So, did vpw know what plagiarism is, why it's wrong, and how he should avoid it? That should be beyond question. So, remembering all that, why do we care? http://www.greasespotcafe.com/editorial/pl...m-wierwille.htm

(Paw): "YoPhoto, I would like to talk to you about a trade. You take Mike for 3 posters of your choosing."

Oh, I don't know about "no quarter".... I think idolatrous errors can be exposed with some decorum. I think we've done so in the past, and can do so again in the present and future. We have class, we have couth. No need to carry on as couthless cads, is there? I've got extra couth here if you need me to e-mail you some or something. I got it off e-bay. ;)-->

This thread is intended to serve in a similar function as the underground hits: "Digest..." and the "Ubiquitous Index" did. Apparently, few told me how much so many of them liked it. So, this is a new edition. Apparently, Mike has decided that, since people have mostly stopped telling him to stop eating Paw's bandwidth and memory space, and only mentioned stopping for a different board, this represents some sort of deficiency on their part for not bringing up yet again what he has consistently shown a casual disregard for. "Maybe some of my regular antagonists are so blinded by their rage against me that they didn't see the opportunity when it was right in their faces. ;)--> " ==== When Mike has previously said he wanted to group all his comments about other threads into one thread, it was pointed out before that he would then be isolating his posts from the context they originated from, divorcing them from their natural connections. Since that seems to be on the agenda now, I've made this thread, partially to offset that. Links from one thing to another thing can be posted here for easier reading (and less hunting by the reader.) "My purpose in posting is NOT to aggravate anyone, but to help." MY purpose in posting is NOT to insult, but to inform and help facilitate the honest exchange of ideas. My intention is to include Mike's ideas intact, and to summarize some of them intact and add commentary when appropriate. Mike's separating his posts from their original threads, I'm doing the same-but alongside the original, with dates and page-markers to make them easy to find. "The reason I continue is because I firmly believe the message I have embraces is true even if nobody believes it, AND that it is vital to all." The reason I continue is because I firmly believe the message put forth by Mike is false even if everyone believed it, AND that it is harmful to those who embrace it. Therefore, I wish to facilitate INFORMED decisions about the doctrine, statements and so on that he puts forth, so the reader can make an informed judgement. Mike's still putting forth that his message is "the contents of the written PFAL", despite the accounts showing that, often, what he has said is the OPPOSITE of what the books say. I'll repeat those and add newer proof as situations warrant. Mike's announced his intentions to attempt to prove that vpw's plagiarism of Stiles, Leonard and so on were NOT plagiarism (nor copyright violation, I imagine), and his intentions to excuse vpw for drugging, molesting, raping and kicking out women. "I may also do one on the sex issue..." For those wondering, "the sex issue" is what I was just referring to, minus the euphemistic tag removed. "I'm one of the few who have taken advantage of the great information and instruction available to those who come back to PFAL with intentions to meekly master it. By 'meekly' I mean 'recognizing it as God's revelation and not merely vpw's opinions'." I think that statement speaks for itself. =========== Now then, for the rest of you people... This is a public forum. You can post whatever you want, and I have no authority to enforce whether or not I like that. (Pawtucket and the staff can do that.) I would ASK, and respectfully request of my fellow posters that they try to consider a few ground-rules as profitable and agree to use them. (You guys have been pretty good about this in the past, and for that, I thank you.) A) "Rule" 1. Pro-Mikes-message, anti-WordWolf's-message stuff goes in Mike's thread that this accompanies. Anti-Mikes-message, pro-WordWolfs-message stuff goes in THIS thread. Everyone gets to play in their own thread, and no boggarting the other person's thread. If people want to see Mike go on for pages and be patted on the back, they can. If people want to see WordWolf go on in critiques of those pages, for pages, and have his fur stroked, they can. B) "Rule" 2. With that in mind, anyone can post on either thread. (If Mike wanted to wildly support a post of mine without debate or qualification, or an attempt to sneak an insult in, he would be welcome to do so.) C) "Rule" 3. Please keep the posts relevant to this thread and the thread it's commenting on. Please, please. The goal here is intelligent critique and insightful commentary, not casual conversation. D) "Rule" 4. Please keep insult posts off this thread and the thread it's commenting on. (If you must, please make it a brief post.) Please mind the goal: critique and commentary, not insults or snaps. Those dilute the substance of the material presented. E) "Rule" 5. Anything relevant to intelligent critique and commentary of the accompanying thread and its posts are welcome here. That includes links to webpages with direct refutations of something said, or direct links to posts at the GSC with direct refutations of something said. When commenting on the other thread, please, PLEASE cite the page and date of the post you're commenting on. If possible, be more specific than that. F) "Rule" 6. Nobody needs my permission to post anything on this thread. I ask posts mind these so-called "rules", but I encourage intelligent, insightful participation at any time by any poster on any relevant topic. (So, don't ask me if it's ok to post a link or make a tasteful comment-just post it. You're adults and don't need me holding anyone's hand.) G) "Rule" 7. "Be excellent to each other." Try to respect posters on both threads, even if you think their every post drips with stupidity. In doing so, you will respect your posts, and demonstrate the class you should have directed towards you. :)--> Thank you all, and I look forward to the unsung task I have volunteered for once again. :)-->

From what I've seen, this is currently the most popular scam.... http://www.snopes.com/inboxer/scams/carsale.asp

God bless and hello. For the benefit of those reading along, please don't take offense if I add a few spaces and maybe punctuation. I think it will mean more people will read this, and I think more people SHOULD.

HCW, I don't really have issues with most of what you said. It's a familiar saying around here-and you haven't seen it YET but it comes up- that everyone's twi experience was DIFFERENT. It sounds like you have given this some thought, and are currently giving it more thought. It also sounds like you're not lumping everyone into one stereotype or another. That's good because a lot of us did a cold, logical analysis of things and came to some unpleasant conclusions. BTW, some of us have been here for YEARS and HAVE examined issues of why we got in, why we stayed, and so on. Some of us DID leave at the first sign of real trouble. Some of us didn't. I WILL take exception to something you said at the end, though. ===== "You say VP was all of these horribly negative things to you. OK. I accept that. But. What was it about YOU that you apparently didn't know it was wrong to f* a married man? A minister? You must love yourself enough to ask yourself the hard questions." ===== First of all, these issues have been explored a LOT around here. There's been sociological, psychological, theological discussion on this. Some people have suggested that the women were/are liars, or that it was all consentual. Some people denied saying that while saying it. So, please don't think that anybody was waiting around for YOU before discussing this. Second of all, since I'm NOT one of the injured parties, I'll step back for a bit and leave THEM to speak for themselves.

I think announcements of problems are premature, since he SAID he was going to make some changes, and that would temporarily block access for a time. (It's also possible there's a problem, but I won't think there's a real problem, unless the site comes back completely rewritten, or is offline for a month or something.)

If you guys are going to interrupt a thread on an entirely different subject, I reserve the right to preserve some of the highlights from your commercials. Oh, almost forgot.... If you're still referring to the cut-and-paste origins of "vpw's" books as a "spurious charge of plagiarism", save yourself the trouble of looking up your explanations. After months and months, you STILL don't understand what plagiarism and copyright are and how they work. It's is technically accurate to say that you believe God Almighty told vpw to plagiarize the work of BG Leonard, JE Stiles, EW Bullinger and EW Kenyon. You believe his plagiarism was justified. You believe it didn't harm anyone. You believe it was a good thing. However, the fact of the matter is that none of those, EVEN IF ENTIRELY TRUE, change the fact of the plagiarism. If he had been taken to court on charges of copyright infringement, the court would have thrown the book at him. (Figure of speech-they would have found him guilty beyond question and made him pay for breaking the law.)

"Betraying Dr's revelations is betraying God." Hey, Tom, if you're reading this thread, here's another one for your summary....

You know, if anyone ELSE said this, they'd mean the BIBLE. Any new readers of yours would have no idea that you've rejected the Bible and refer to a book "by" vpw, cobbled together by cutting and pasting works from BG Leonard, JE Stiles, and EW Bullinger. By "He can save to the uttermost", you DID mean GOD ALMIGHTY, right? I wanted to make absolutely sure you didn't mean someone else....

I take it this would not be the time to rave about Firefox and its many fun "extension" widgets.... Like "Adblock" and "NukeAnything" and "BugMeNot" and some of the others, right?

I was waiting to see who'd be the first to mention that.....

Although there are a few people here that believe that, you unfairly stereotype the vast majority of us. Most of us know that some people saw deliverance from all sorts of things. Most of us know there were some good teachings. Most of us know that most of the people who were involved were involved for good or best reasons. We WERE some of those people, remember. We haven't experienced total amnesia and just memorized a report handed to us by some "cult expert". We handled the evidence ourselves, we were eyewitnesses to some things. Our positions vary, but they're a bit more complicated than "vpw sucks!" ======== Personally, as for the India trip, I will accept that you saw photographs. I have not seen these photos, nor have I corroborating reports from others who saw them. Therefore, I believe you saw something and were told what that something was. I'm slow to automatically accept that they were -vpw getting a key to a city -a crowd thronging a train specifically because vpw is on the train I've seen many photos on the internet, claimed to be of different things. (The tsunami is the most recent.) The vast majority were NOT of what was claimed of them. Further, I'll address one photo which you did not describe but said you saw, the man with the healed arm. Now, supposing vpw's story is 100% true, AND the photo you saw was of that exact man in that exact encounter, here's what we know about the photograph.... Someone was using an old-style camera, contemporary to the 1950s. They had it ready and was prepared to take, or taking, photos of the crowd from the back of a train about to move. (It takes 2 hands to use such a camera.) They happened to catch the unrehearsed, unprepared, candid shot of this miraculous healing, and managed to catch it in the second or two before the train pulled out, or snapped it of the man waving his arm after a train. This person then probably had to grab the railings with one firm grip, since they were on the back of a moving train and could be thrown with NO hands supporting them. Mind you, if a picture WAS taken from the back of the train, depending on the moment it was taken, it would show vpw praying with a man standing on the ground as the train was beginning to move, or a man waving wildly behind a train. Neither of those exactly guarantees a miraculous healing was in process. Now, if you'd seen a grainy, home-film off the back of the train, for this oh-so-cinematic moment, now, THEN we'd have something. You'd see the withered arm unwither and envigorate, then sprung to full effectiveness in moments. As it was, you saw a photo of something, and were told what that photo of something was. Is it possible that what you were told is not precisely what happened? Might this have been an instance where someone wanted to see somethng, were told what they saw, and trusted that account-yet the account was not correct? A number of people here can detail the miraculous snowstorm vpw claimed blockaded him into a city-complete with angels on the phone with him. vpw's account was the only one of that incident that jibes with his story. All objective accounts show not a single snowflake anywhere near this city. (He stopped telling this story after a while.) Finally, almost nobody here believes that vpw had zero substance to what he taught, Almost nobody here believes that women threw themselves at him, or threw themselves on a bed because vpw said so. To claim that we do, again, unfairly stereotypes us. Feel free to look around thousands of other threads. We've discussed relative merits and liabilities to just about everything connected with twi from before there was a twi. The only thing we seem to agree on is that lcm had fewer redeeming qualities than vpw.

Can't have the facts interfere with our little bubbleworld, can we? "This is the best of all possible worlds." ("Candide", by Voltaire.)

Indeed, WW, very cinematic! It always reminded me of the last scene to that 1940s era movie, "Abe Lincoln in Illinois"-(that I often confuse with "Young Mr. Lincoln", 1939) which I haven't seen in decades. Abe Lincoln (who sports his newly grown, trademark facial hairs) is standing on the caboose, finishing a speech as the train is slowly pulling away from the station...I bet this picture made quite the impression upon "Young Mr. Wierwille". I wonder if there's anything in that movie about Abe receiving a key to the city? As I said, it's been years... Thanks, Dan. Me, I was sure he'd seen that specifically in a movie somewhere, but I'm not a movie maven. I wonder when TCM or AMC is showing that movie next... I'd love to review it and see how many things I recognize from it. Personally, I think the cinema made quite an impression on him. Supposedly, when he was young, he would tear around on a motorcycle, almost as if he was Brando in "the Wild One". (Was it "the Wild One"?)

What's the religious story on the tsunami? Well, if you're an idiot, these are the headlines... A) People who disagree with us were the primary target. They should repent and agree with us. B) People who are in our group were hit because they are not zealous enough and need to be more committed. C) Send me money and buy my book.

Hello. BTW, HCW, Since all the accounts of the famous India trip rely entirely on vpw's accounts, I've gotten skeptical of everything except the rough outline-he went to India and dropped his family for a bit. A lot of the other stuff sounds like a recount of some movies of trips to other countries. "I was given the Key to the city, and carte blanche to teach there whenever I wanted." No witnesses, no letters displayed. The book he wrote on the Mission Field was on display-I've read it, it's a short book-but NEVER anything with an official letterhead, no commendation, no medal, no citation, no nothing. "I was followed by crowds of people who wanted healing." Funny almost none of us ever saw vpw produce a miracle of healing in the USA-virtually all of those were off-camera. Further, he never got a rep for teaching a lot on healing, which usually goes along with a great grasp of the subject-the "healer" teaches his students how to heal. "I was on the back of a train in Jubbulpore. As it was about to pull out, a man who's not a Christian asked me for healing. I prayed, and he got a miracle of healing. I shouted to him about his being healed in the name of Jesus Christ, just as the train was pulling out." Such a cinematic scene. So impractical when dealing with an actual moving train. Also never repeated in twi, even though CHRISTIANS went up to vpw and asked for healing. One guy was told he'd have to take pfal FIRST. (You would think that if he got the deliverance first, he'd be the most dedicated student in the room, wanting to learn how it's done.) Mind you, I can't PROVE vpw bs'ed us on the whole trip, but I think the absence of anything backing up his tales, plus the cinematic quality of them, argues a healthy skepticism. Perhaps it was meant to add a colourful flavour to his life, like that guy in "Big Fish".

You're thinking of "Blast From the Past", I think. Myself, I keep humming one of the songs from "Les Miserables", since I noticed that there's a number of people who signed the Guestbook, but the messageboard's hardly become a thriving community. I've seen boards with a dozen people with more activity than this. Of course, that's their business entirely.

"possess". No matter if you owned something, and exercised authority over it, you couldn't say you "possessed" it because "only the devil possesses." "create" "Only God can create."

Many, many congratulations, dude! (He said, far too late...)

Why'd they buy an overpriced, overpowered machine? Same reason they always spent poorly: incompetence. Someone convinced them they needed something this powerful, and nobody there had the brains to know better. Or, of they did, the powers-that-be aquelched dissent. So, now they use a mighty cray computer and a t-1 to play "Solitaire" all day. :D-->