Measuring the Spiritual Pains of a Community

[sirguessalot]

Greetings all

I invite you all to take part (or not) in what may (or may not) turn out to be a profound exercise in hi-tech collective introspection, for lack of better words.

I will try to refrain from explaining a lot about this poll, but here are a few things i feel worth mentioning up front...

This poll is from a form that was developed by a man named Richard Groves, created to be used by individuals wishing to identify the specific nature of their interior suffering, and he has given permission for it to be used and modified. It is mostly being used internationally in the context of hospice care...but not only for those who are experiencing the end of their own life, but also for the family and friends who are with them, as well as for caregivers to help work through their own "caregiver burnout", as well as anyone facing painful transitions and changes in life...or even for those who simply wish to develop their own inner awareness. In other words...anyone can benefit from the exercise, at any stage of their life.

And I can answer most any and all questions about all of this and more, but i prefer to answer the questions as they arise, rather than trying to anticipate them all, so feel free to ask things in this thread. I will do my best to be clear...and at least translucent.

And keep in mind that this form was designed meant to be used by individuals, so posting as a community poll is going to be interestingly new. Your participation is kinda like stepping foot on the moon.

Also keep in mind that the results will merely be a snapshot in a window of time. Some use this form daily over long periods of time to measure spikes and patterns. I guess if we were to repost the poll a year from now, it will look quite different.

And please note that i do not intend to use the data for any purpose outside of the GSC. I have found a sense of belonging here, and my intention is to help the GSC see our selves more clearly.

I have seen that the well-known "through a glass darkly" may be more aptly understood as "a riddle in a MIRROR"...we are not looking through a window at something else...but into a murky mirror at our inner selves....

in other words...if Christ is within, the nature of Christ is seen more deeply via introspection and self-reflection..imho

and so this poll can serve as a collective mirror, of sorts. A little spit and polish never hurts the view.

as always...in curiousity, kindness, and precision

or as i like to call it... "playfully serious"

....

that said...

if you wish to participate...please select the option that most accurately describes “how you are within yourself” today.

and please feel free to post comments on the thread as well.

all space and grace...

+ODD

Edited January 18, 2008 by sirguessalot

[excathedra]

i can only vote on the alienated part and it won't let me

the other questions are just too tough, there's not an answer for me

i don't know why, maybe it depends on the given day....

love you T.

--

i'll read through them again and try to see why there is not an answer for me

[excathedra]

--

even on the given day, it doesn't work for me

part of my life is filled with purpose and meaning

i feel seriously alientated from just about most most people, but not the most important person in my life (my son)

i don't know about forgiveness, i think i'm okay with it, i don't feel any anger inside, mostly sadness

and finally, my hope is the hope about the future that we don't see yet

ps. i don't think my vote on the "relatedness" thing would have worked either

sowwy

Edited January 19, 2008 by excathedra

[sirguessalot]

no sweat, e

maybe some other time, or not

and its my first attempt at crafting a poll like this...so maybe ive made something unusable here...i dunno

like i said...seriously playful...the poll covers somewhat messy territory...so the "answers" can be messy too

maybe i'll reword it someday

all luv

[Ham]

"I feel very hopeful and optimistic"

and for the life of me, I can't find a single logical reason..

[Bramble]

I don't view unforgiveness as a spiritual lack of some sort, not when it involves a serious issue of damage or trust. While 'negative' emotions like fear, anger(from a non leader) where very much to be avoided in TWI, I believe they are internal warning symptons. Like physical pain, they are meant to be unpleasant, so you pay attention to the cause.

As far as hope...some see the spiritual as living in the moment...

[Kit Sober]

Thanks for the poll. Good thoughts from it.

I think Greasespot has been a big help in keeping me on the positive side of the "meaningful and purposeful"

Thanks, again Pawtucket, et al :)

[cman]

Interesting poll Todd.

I'm in the middle on the first two and somewhat high on the rest.

Is that crazy or what?

Maybe I'm just waiting for something...

I don't like doing that.

Rather be doing it now.

A good way to look at myself I think.

As far as the poll gets me thinking.

Thanks.

Edited January 19, 2008 by cman

[cheranne]

Interesting poll Todd.

I'm in the middle on the first two and somewhat high on the rest.

Is that crazy or what?

Maybe I'm just waiting for something...

I don't like doing that.

Rather be doing it now.

A good way to look at myself I think.

As far as the poll gets me thinking.

Thanks.

Intresting poll,but i would never forgive someone who would hurt my child intentioally,i would and do report child abuse,that has nothing to do with being a christian or non whatever,if someone came into your house raped your wife and kids and shot them what would you do?

[cman]

I don't think that question was in the poll okie.

[sirguessalot]

hi OKLAHOMA CITY WOW 78..welcome to the cafe

if someone came into your house raped your wife and kids and shot them what would you do?

i can only imagine that, unless one was some sort of saint, or at some other extraordinary stage of awareness and/or compassion, that one will be quite unable to forgive such an act/person, and would most likely be suffering from the wounds of that unforgivable experience all their lives...most likely especially in later years and on their deathbed

...which, imho, makes such a crime much much worse

it seems as if the capacity of community to forgive such unforgivability might go a long way to support such a person

and hold space for them if/until they make it through the other side of the unforgivability

of course, there have been many long threaded conversations on forgiveness at the GSC worth reading

my aim for this thread is to point towards 4 specific types of "spiritual" pain that are possible in each of us

...as simply noticing goes a long long way

though i realize this poll barely touches the tip of the tip of the icebergs of the whos, hows, whats, wheres and whys of them

...i suppose those details are for each of us to find ways to consider

the original form i created the poll from includes spaces for more detailed notes on each category

Edited January 21, 2008 by sirguessalot

[sirguessalot]

For anyone who is interested, I started a thread in Doctrinal called Doctrinal Discussion for Spiritual Pain Poll

Not sure if it is the best/right thing to do...but i did it anyway.

[excathedra]

i'm getting mad

is there such a thing as being at a place in awareness or compassion to understand your child getting murdered ?

jesus christ did that one for me

i can't EVER see going there myself

oh yeah i forgot it's christ in me

pffffftttttt

i'll tell you the same thing on my damn deathbed

Edited January 21, 2008 by excathedra

[sirguessalot]

i dunno, E

i hesitate to respond

cuz...not that i need to know why, but i cant tell if you are mad because you cant imagine your own self in such a state

or mad cuz you dont think its right/moral/sane for someone else to find themselves in such a state

or mad that you dont believe that anyone besides jesus christ has ever been in such a state

or mad that you dont understand how someone could be in such a state

or mad at me for suggesting such states exist at all

or something else entirely

its certainly not my intention to make anyone mad

and i hope it goes without saying that i also feel you are entitled to be as mad as you are

i wish i knew what else to say

Edited January 22, 2008 by sirguessalot

[excathedra]

i love you

thanks, t

never mind

[cheranne]

I don't think that question was in the poll okie.

SORRY.I didn't understand the question,i think symbolically alot,and i am not from oklahoma,i am just looking for lost people i knew in okc78.

[sirguessalot]

no sweat OKW78...some of us certainly do think symbolically...or in patterns....

i have come to understand and appreciate all personality types...for the different ways we learn and think

and im actually kinda glad you got mad, E...we learn from every thought and feeling ... though i kinda hope you arent mad now...

...id like to try and answer the question as impersonally as possible by saying "yes, it seems there are such places"

but of course, that answer doesnt even begin to touch the details of such a crazy messy idea...you know that

but ive noticed that such extreme examples are often given as a way to talk about the extreme bounds of forgiveness

though it usually shuts down the conversation instead...leads it in merely conceptual directions that dont even apply to the people talking

i think/feel most issues of forgiveness deal more with the everyday stuff...

like forgiving the tax man, or lawyers, or noisy neighbors, relatives, or society, ex-friends, or parents or children or siblings who have wronged us

but perhaps most especially forgiving our selves for this that or the other

i dunno...just thinking/feeling outloud

Edited January 23, 2008 by sirguessalot