did the way international lead us into mental ill health?

[geisha779]

. . . Did the way international lead us into mental ill health?

I am pretty sure that I read TWI sometimes monitors this site(WayGB)?

Just imagine what they would think and say about this thread. . . . about us.

We all know the verbiage and the deep spiritual conspiracy theories which abound. . . . complete with a bloated sense of self-importance in God's TWI only kingdom.

Run that discourse through your head once, for old times sake, and that will pretty much answer the original question. :)

[waysider]

That's a messed up story. And I feel terrible about that lady who eventually died. But strangely -- because I don't know if this was your intended point -- what I took away from it was that nobody was killed, although several (or all) could easily have been. It seems to me that God might actually have been watching over this group.

Actually, someone WAS killed. He was run down by a tractor trailer as he hitched to L.E.A.D. In addition, one of our very own posters on GSC was kidnapped and raped. This L.E.A.D. story is just one of many. Another former poster here was maimed for life during the rodeo school phase. What you need to know to see this in perspective is that, even after these terrible accidents happened, The Way continued to subject people to these dangers, with little regard for anyone's personal safety.

There are hundreds, maybe thousands of similar accounts throughout TWI's history.

Suicides, child molesters that were intentionally shielded and hidden in the system, wife abusers, child beaters, people who died (yes, died) trying to "believe" for healing when they desperately needed medical attention.---- and so on.

Here is another one that deals with L.E.A.D.

EDIT

I apologize for the inappropriate joke I posted during the course of the linked thread.

Edited January 5, 2010 by waysider

[brainfixed]

I am pretty sure that I read TWI sometimes monitors this site(WayGB)?

Just imagine what they would think and say about this thread. . . . about us.

We all know the verbiage and the deep spiritual conspiracy theories which abound. . . . complete with a bloated sense of self-importance in God's TWI only kingdom.

Run that discourse through your head once, for old times sake, and that will pretty much answer the original question. :)

it is all very clear to anybody that's outside looking in that the way international (and any other cult for that matter) teaches some very unsound mind stuff, but the real problem is that when people are in the middle of that unsound mind stuff it isn't clear to them that it's unsound. and this makes me think of when i first was told that going to college isn't about getting an education as much as it's about broadening a person's horizon and getting a person some more world experience and maybe getting an education in those first couple of years. after coming out of a "teaching and research" focus this information was like telling me that there was no god! and the more i've learned in the world the more i've found out that without outside input people get pretty unsound in their thinking, which is the importance of isolation to cult leaders and other abusers because without isolation people would be exposed to more sound thinking processes and be able to see other options than the unsound thinking options provided by the cult leaders or other abusers. so trying to understand things from the outside looking in isn't going to happen, and that can be seen here on many different discussions when people talk about having to explain over and over again to their therapists and just even their non-way international friends just what things were like to the point that most of us just don't bother any more because it doesn't make sense because it was all of an unsound mind paradigm.

Edited January 5, 2010 by brainfixed

[waysider]

Adding a bit on "isolation".

It's not about being locked in a room all by yourself, although, I suppose it could be.

It's about associating only with people who think like you and support your belief system.

You can have a regular job in the 9-5 world and still isolate yourself if you never interact with those people in a meaningful fashion. The Way used this "not unequally yoked with unbelievers" mantra to bolster our isolation. It functions in a way that facilitate an unhealthy outlook on reality

[soul searcher]

Another familiar example of Mystical Manipulation. . . . IMO. . . . was SIT. It was not set up to be spontaneous, however, we were led into it. . . . either during the last session of the class, by way of RTHS book, or by someone who had taken the class.

Didn't it set VP up as someone spiritual? Someone who had great insight into the mysteries of God? It did serve to give him credibility. Didn't it make him look spiritually advanced? Give him some divine authority along with all his special revelation?

I KNOW this ticks some people off here, but just stop and consider. . . . please. Look at it from a biblical perspective if it helps. . . . . with all the scripture we can regurgitate, does any of it sound like God is going to unlock the mysteries of "perfect prayer" supposedly hidden since the 1st century. . . . . to a drunk who abused unstable young women for sport? Even if he did "borrow" the method. . . . there are real ministers out there for God to enlighten.

It can be induced. . . I led people into SIT while I was a WOW. . . . a few of them unsure there was a God. Fence sitters. If you set people up and the conditions are right. . . . anyone can do it.

Other religions, that have nothing to do with Christianity, SIT. . . does that mean it is their proof of the new birth as well? Wasn't it suppose to be a special gift for Christians to know that they know?

I am thinking. . . maybe. . . . VP just may have mislead us. .

http://bible.org/art...peaking-tongues

In the name of good forum citizenship, I posted a reply here:

[cheranne]

well...it sure didn't help it made me sick! And here you think it was about a "sound mind"

get Therapy ASAP for those recently coming out.

[JeffSjo]

IMO the short answer is You Betcha (I am from NW Wi. and Minn. after all)

But the mental illnesses that seemed to do the best in TWI seemed to be the ones that included being willing to be very abusive and/or controlling.

[Bolshevik]

For what it's worth, Bolshevik - - - I was "grown up" when I first took the class. I guess you missed my point that some (not all) were more interested in learning what might have been beyond the scope of their (my) learning experience at the time, and were willing to invest in the effort to learn. Granted - - - there were those who were promised "pie in the sky", so they signed on for the class as well and didn't get the desired results.

To suggest that your only "toothless retards" took the class, makes me wonder - - - Why are you living where you are, and having folks like that around you? Or - - - did you "grow up", and move away?? If you weren't a "product" of the 70's, please feel fee to refrain from commenting on that whereof you know nothing of. :)

Have a nice day, and Shalom!

I didn't say only "toothless retards" took the class. It was a simple observation, take it or leave it.

And yes, I owe my existance to twi.

[Bolshevik]

. . .

To suggest that your only "toothless retards" took the class, makes me wonder - - - Why are you living where you are, and having folks like that around you? Or - - - did you "grow up", and move away?? If you weren't a "product" of the 70's, please feel fee to refrain from commenting on that whereof you know nothing of. :)

. . .

I moved away, but they were wherever I went. Those retards.

Edited January 7, 2010 by Bolshevik

[Bolshevik]

Well, maybe for you, Bolshevik, but most of the people I met were what you'd call "normal." Everyone has needs of one sort or another, even if just the need for companionship. Are you, or were you, so perfect, then? Huh? Who is perfect, who has no needs, no "screw ups"?

Don't you think that is a bit harsh as a generalisation? Are you really accusing everyone here at the Cafe of being "mentally handicapped" or "just screwed up in general"?

What interested me was simply that there was some sort of coherent teaching. I was fed up with churches and wishy-washy stuff - nice people, but no Bible teaching to speak of. And here was someone who took me all sorts of different places in the Bible and (mostly) made it hang together. I'd already been reading for myself and wished I could understand better. The errors in PFAL I flagged away as imperfect knowledge that could be developed or expanded later; after all, it was a research ministry, and I was told that as research gave new light, the Ministry's teachings might change to take account of that. The Dead Sea Scrolls, I was told, were still being examined (for example).

I wasn't mentally handicapped or screwed up. I just wanted to know. And, it appeared, so did all the people who took the class with me or who subsequently passed through various classes. I don't remember any "weirdos", nor were any of the established grads, Corps or other people around, "weird". Some were a bit hard; some were a bit too "black and white", but all were confident in God, and that was a real change from the "if it's God's will" or "maybe" brigade of too many churches.

If you read posts here, you'll find that a lot of other posters also "just wanted to know."

The biggest handicap I had to deal with - was that it was taught by an American! Who was a bit creepy and didn't know the English language as well as he made out. But he still appeared to know more Bible than any church minister I'd encountered. And nobody who taught the Bible would deliberately lie, would they?

Guess the joke was on me.

Have you been to an ROA? Jerks, as far as the eye could see.

Coherent teaching? BS!!!

"Don't you think that is a bit harsh as a generalisation? Are you really accusing everyone here at the Cafe of being "mentally handicapped" or "just screwed up in general"?"

Didn't accuse everyone at the cafe of being mentally handicapped.

coherent teaching . . . lol

. . . Why are you living where you are, and having folks like that around you? Or - - - did you "grow up", and move away?? If you weren't a "product" of the 70's, please feel fee to refrain from commenting on that whereof you know nothing of. :)

. . .

course, if they come around, to they leave with teeth?