I think Martin Luther INTENDED to remain in the Roman Catholic Church, and his 97 Theses were meant to stimulate discussions, which were meant to trigger REFORM. However, since there were no reforms, there were limited options, especially for a man of good conscience. Frankly, Switzerland was well-situated as a location for the Protestant Reformation, which is probably why we got both Luther AND Zwingli from there.
If there had been reforms, things would have been very different. Then again, there had been centuries of momentum beforehand, so, looking back, I don't think reforms had a chance in that decade. Things were just too entrenched by then, which was why the whole concept of retail selling of indulgencies didn't seem as outrageous to some people as they would to, say, me in the present, or Luther and Zwingli when and where they were.
Everyone is welcome to post on every thread. However, there are certain assumptions on the doctrinal threads. In order to avoid having EVERY thread descend into an argument about whether God exists, we've asked unbelievers [including myself] to limit comments to that effect.
This is not to say we cannot post at all. But have called point. [for example, my posts as Raf in Idiom of Permission were critical of Christianity, but they really attacked a method of interpretation].
It can get nitpicky. When in doubt, make a quick comment and start a new related post in the appropriate subforum.
Believers should feel free to explore the meaning of scripture without constantly being on the defensive about being people of faith.
I think Martin Luther INTENDED to remain in the Roman Catholic Church, and his 97 Theses were meant to stimulate discussions, which were meant to trigger REFORM. However, since there were no reforms, there were limited options, especially for a man of good conscience. Frankly, Switzerland was well-situated as a location for the Protestant Reformation, which is probably why we got both Luther AND Zwingli from there.
If there had been reforms, things would have been very different. Then again, there had been centuries of momentum beforehand, so, looking back, I don't think reforms had a chance in that decade. Things were just too entrenched by then, which was why the whole concept of retail selling of indulgencies didn't seem as outrageous to some people as they would to, say, me in the present, or Luther and Zwingli when and where they were.
And sometimes I think the "modern" mind is asking too much.. sometimes "reformation" was two steps forward and one step back. At least in my opinion..
Excellent joke! My "mother in catholicism" once told me she thought Luther should have stayed in the catholic church despite all the hypocrisy, imperfections and impurities. So was Luther protesting primarily out of self-interest? Still working that one out in my head! "Slacktivism" is a new word for me ... 'keyboard warrior syndrome" maybe? I'm ok with keyboard warriors as long as it's not the only thing one does but only a tool or way to do much more as the need arises.
I don't see any warfare here.
You bring up a very good point- Luther should have stayed- had they wanted him. I think.. (dangerous, I know.. heh) Where else in God's Creation does one want to go.
In a practical sense at least.
So we just abandon humanity and walk off of the ends of the earth merely because it does not agree with us..
Did Luther want to stay.. absolutely. I think that he did..
It was about the only family that he knew. Interesting that his mentor was forced to show him Romans 10:9 and 10. One keeps asking the same question, pounding at the door.. eventually someone has to answer..
Maybe the Mentor was waiting for someone to actually believe..
In a practical sense religions either hate or reject me because that I view the individuals involved at the very least.. as equals. I am not inferior to you..
the last religion at my door threatened me with the most eternal fire and wrath that their religion might have to offer.. heh
In a practical sense religions either hate or reject me because that I view the individuals involved at the very least.. as equals. I am not inferior to you..
the last religion at my door threatened me with the most eternal fire and wrath that their religion might have to offer.. heh
some here have dealt with this..
This is why I love the wizard of Oz. It shows the little person behind the large act.
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Ham
Too bad that he was taken up among the Christian (?) Nationalists. Look at his further work..
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WordWolf
I think Martin Luther INTENDED to remain in the Roman Catholic Church, and his 97 Theses were meant to stimulate discussions, which were meant to trigger REFORM. However, since there were no reforms, there were limited options, especially for a man of good conscience. Frankly, Switzerland was well-situated as a location for the Protestant Reformation, which is probably why we got both Luther AND Zwingli from there.
If there had been reforms, things would have been very different. Then again, there had been centuries of momentum beforehand, so, looking back, I don't think reforms had a chance in that decade. Things were just too entrenched by then, which was why the whole concept of retail selling of indulgencies didn't seem as outrageous to some people as they would to, say, me in the present, or Luther and Zwingli when and where they were.
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modcat5
Gentle reminder, without singling anyone out:
Everyone is welcome to post on every thread. However, there are certain assumptions on the doctrinal threads. In order to avoid having EVERY thread descend into an argument about whether God exists, we've asked unbelievers [including myself] to limit comments to that effect.
This is not to say we cannot post at all. But have called point. [for example, my posts as Raf in Idiom of Permission were critical of Christianity, but they really attacked a method of interpretation].
It can get nitpicky. When in doubt, make a quick comment and start a new related post in the appropriate subforum.
Believers should feel free to explore the meaning of scripture without constantly being on the defensive about being people of faith.
Ok?
Please?
Thanks.
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Ham
And sometimes I think the "modern" mind is asking too much.. sometimes "reformation" was two steps forward and one step back. At least in my opinion..
Sometimes three steps back.
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chockfull
Sooooo.
Would there be a religion called “Twiggianity”?
A cult offshoot of the “Churchianity” religion?
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Ham
I don't see any warfare here.
You bring up a very good point- Luther should have stayed- had they wanted him. I think.. (dangerous, I know.. heh) Where else in God's Creation does one want to go.
In a practical sense at least.
So we just abandon humanity and walk off of the ends of the earth merely because it does not agree with us..
Did Luther want to stay.. absolutely. I think that he did..
It was about the only family that he knew. Interesting that his mentor was forced to show him Romans 10:9 and 10. One keeps asking the same question, pounding at the door.. eventually someone has to answer..
Maybe the Mentor was waiting for someone to actually believe..
too many thoughts and questions here..
Peace Friends..
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Ham
I've asked the same question to a few people at my door..
do you really believe that which you speak..
I'll believe along with you if you are what you claim to be. Just sign on the line.
I'll take your word for it. No argument if You Simply Agree.
I have not found any agreement yet.
If two of you agree...
hmm.
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Ham
In a practical sense religions either hate or reject me because that I view the individuals involved at the very least.. as equals. I am not inferior to you..
the last religion at my door threatened me with the most eternal fire and wrath that their religion might have to offer.. heh
some here have dealt with this..
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chockfull
This is why I love the wizard of Oz. It shows the little person behind the large act.
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