I would love for some people to understand the "mindset" of adoring someone as a father figure (yes, in my case because I was very much in need of one), and THEN to have that trust betrayed, when you think you really....
Oh I can't express myself. Thank you, Kristen, for being a writer, and for your courage and your love and your sweetest heart.
I've heard the robe thing from other posters here, seems like it was a common thing for him, he was already prepared to get what he wanted, those special campus suites and the motorcoach were set up for these things.
I almost don't want to read Kristin's book because of how much the last line of the part II interview upset me, I feel I will have to be in a certain mindset to read it in order to weather the intensity of the revulsion I'll feel toward that basturd and the regret and pain I'll feel for his victims.  I am embarrassed that I was ever proud of my association with twi...
When I went to the all-girls college way home to visit before my graduation night of PFAL, he was in the bathroom getting ready
He had the bathroom door open. When I walked by, as he was blowdrying his hair, I glanced in, and he turned around fully nude and smiled
I was a person with confused boundaries, to say the least
But when I did ask my major undershepherder, she explained that thing about how spiritual he is and that flesh is not really anything. I forget now but you get the gist
No one just does that. Â Normal people don't leave the door open and just stand there and turn to deliberately expose themselves.
This guy had to have been preying on women early on to be so bold. Â
He nonchalantly asks Jimmy and Judi Do*p about orgies being ok will God, he preyed upon his secretary before twi in Van Wert, he had a mysterious nefarious liason with the woman who told him about Bullinger, I wonder if he preyed upon Dorthia before he married her? Â
His perversions had to have started way back when he was young. Â
He just ain't right, these actions just ain't normal.....
I did not expierence what many of you did exie. But that bathroom thing had to be nasty and your mind or common scense had to tell you that was wrong.
Point is I thought many things were wrong but I took that koolaid too and told myself I would understand later (as I spirtually grew, what a crock of dung). I think that is what a lot of people do not understand about bieng abused. They say we had freedom of will but they took it away from us saying we would see how right they were in the future. Thank god my future only lasted 6 years plus..
You raise honest concerns about vic in his younger days. "... he had to be preying on women early on to be so bold.... perversions had to have started way back when he was young... he just ain't right, these actions ain't normal..."
The early part of vic's life is pretty blank to us. For young adulthood, we've been at least a little misled about his schooling; then told that he simply 'left' church he was pastoring, merely because he made a choice to favor of da verd. I dunno what happened with him; but - what if he had been fired? or urged to leave over some stuff like this...? His personal history, given a part of 'twi - lore' is so one sided, skewed and spun. Lots of missing pieces.
Aren't normal people (guys in leadership-teaching-speaking capacities) inclined to mention publicly of loving their wife?
Or loving their kids? at least once in dozens of years?
VP criticized his family, and publicly tolerated his wife.
Aren't normal people inclined to admit to a least an occasional mistake? Or allowing that maybe just maybe a mistake could happen?
VP criticized others, but not himself.
I was so fooled, not only did I think he was normal... I also thought he set an example to follow.
Time to pull away the curtain.
Ex... 30+ years ago (although I thought I knew so much), I wish...
He left his church in Van Wert because he, in fact, did get his secretary pregnant while he was the pastor there while being married with children. Â I believe he must have been forced out because of it. Â I never heard him say anything good about those church leaders, and in fact, he stated that religion is one of the cruelest institutions in the world; misdirected anger.
My recollection of public things he said about Dorthia were positive, although I never understood why certain people would say women wanted to be like her and should aspire to be like her or use her as a model. Â She was very quiet and reserved, didn't display very much emotion, which I attributed to her rural Ohio upbringing and culture, rarely said anything publically and it was evident that she had given up a lot to support her husband. Â I'm sure those living at Hq's had more interaction w/her and saw more, I only lived there for a short time post vp.
I recollect that he spoke of giving away JP, I think to a relative when he was 6 months old, depite Dorthia's and Don's objections, when they all went to India, other than that I can't think of him ever effusing or emoting over his kids.
Someone here posted a while back they thought it was vp's mom who was the source of his sociopathic behavior, although the details are limited and sketchy. Â He must have been abused or regularly exposed to an abuser as a young person to be that bold and so good at hiding it. Â
It took long time before any of us on a large-scale knew about vp's predilections, he had fortified himself at twi with so many of his henchmen and handlers, those who covered for him and who also indulged with him.  Perhaps the only ones who really know of his family's legacy and origins for abuse are his surviving relatives.
...And how long will the Wierwille apologists continue to live in denial?...
...and not just the handful that hang out here...but the many who belong to splinter groups, independant "twigs", and the many who belong to the waycorps website...this man was a monster and shame on all who continue to glorify him and sing his praises...
shame on them all...
i am sick to my stomach after hearing how this old, manipulative, self-centered pedophile used women like this...
i used to compare vpw to balaam, but now i think he is far worse than balaam ever was...
even a donkey couldn't get this guy's attention...
and still some folks insist that vpw did "acts of kindness" and "genuine good"... (gag)
if anyone thinks that vpw did any "genuine good and kind" act, i can guarantee you that it was just an i-l-l-u-s-i-o-n...
it is notwithin the nature of a false prophet to do "genuine good"...
if people can't see thru vpw, they won't have a chance when the coming world dictator rises to power...
cuz that guy is gonna be one smooth talker... and he will do signs and wonders that will make your head spin...
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rascal
((((((excathedra)))))) never invisible, , however I feel that I way as well. Never underestimate the impact your own personal testimoney has had on others. For many of us it was the first inkling we
excathedra
thank you so much billy
pawtucket
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Sushi
Maybe this will help.
HERE!
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excathedra
Thank you so much, Sushi, for that song. I LOVE it! I've listened to it three times since you posted it.
I've been trying to think of a song for darling Kris and the doctor (and of course myself).
So far, the only one I've come up with is (but I know there's something better to express myself)--
http://youtube.com/watch?v=JtmgQEv1pLQ
I know, wing.
--
I would love for some people to understand the "mindset" of adoring someone as a father figure (yes, in my case because I was very much in need of one), and THEN to have that trust betrayed, when you think you really....
Oh I can't express myself. Thank you, Kristen, for being a writer, and for your courage and your love and your sweetest heart.
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excathedra
--
Whenever I hear this song, I do think of my beloved father and father in the word
--
"I lose my way"
--
My heart can't possibly break when it wasn't even whole to start with
--
The sad thing is I tried to trust again after my growing-up years. I guess I was grown up as a freshman in college.
Thank you veepee.
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excathedra
As weird as this might sound, I'm so thankful Kris was a minor. It gives more I-don't-know-what.
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excathedra
I do want to dedicate this to the doctor--
Because of you I never stray too far from the sidewalk
Because of you I learn to play on the safe side so I don't get hurt
Because of you I find it hard to trust, not only me, but everyone around me
Because of you, I am afraid
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PurpleDays
What a heartbreaking song capturing the heartbreaking reality of too many.
PD
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excathedra
This is what the doctor did to that angel Kris
"I lose my way
And it's not too long before you point it out
I cannot cry
Because I know that's weakness in your eyes
I'm forced to fake
A smile, a laugh everyday of my life
My heart can't possibly break
When it wasn't even whole to start with"
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now I see
I've heard the robe thing from other posters here, seems like it was a common thing for him, he was already prepared to get what he wanted, those special campus suites and the motorcoach were set up for these things.
I almost don't want to read Kristin's book because of how much the last line of the part II interview upset me, I feel I will have to be in a certain mindset to read it in order to weather the intensity of the revulsion I'll feel toward that basturd and the regret and pain I'll feel for his victims.  I am embarrassed that I was ever proud of my association with twi...
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excathedra
When I went to the all-girls college way home to visit before my graduation night of PFAL, he was in the bathroom getting ready
He had the bathroom door open. When I walked by, as he was blowdrying his hair, I glanced in, and he turned around fully nude and smiled
I was a person with confused boundaries, to say the least
But when I did ask my major undershepherder, she explained that thing about how spiritual he is and that flesh is not really anything. I forget now but you get the gist
I'm ashamed
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excathedra
I just said on another thread that God - Christ - can find you and lift you out of the depths of hell - but remember don't stay in hell
i heard kelly clarkson wrote this song when she was a teen. that's all the more reason i thought of kris. (love you)
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now I see
No one just does that. Â Normal people don't leave the door open and just stand there and turn to deliberately expose themselves.
This guy had to have been preying on women early on to be so bold. Â
He nonchalantly asks Jimmy and Judi Do*p about orgies being ok will God, he preyed upon his secretary before twi in Van Wert, he had a mysterious nefarious liason with the woman who told him about Bullinger, I wonder if he preyed upon Dorthia before he married her? Â
His perversions had to have started way back when he was young. Â
He just ain't right, these actions just ain't normal.....
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justloafing
I did not expierence what many of you did exie. But that bathroom thing had to be nasty and your mind or common scense had to tell you that was wrong.
Point is I thought many things were wrong but I took that koolaid too and told myself I would understand later (as I spirtually grew, what a crock of dung). I think that is what a lot of people do not understand about bieng abused. They say we had freedom of will but they took it away from us saying we would see how right they were in the future. Thank god my future only lasted 6 years plus..
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excathedra
NORMAL PEOPLE DON'T DO ANYTHING LIKE THAT NEVER MIND A FRUCKING MINISTER
I have no problem admitting that I was not "normal." Sorry I was abused as a child and then I was still in the "teen" in the end of my age
Come on
It's easy to talk about it now. I'm 51. But guess what, that sick mother was I don't know probably about that age
Vomit
I know I always ask this, but how old was he in 74-75
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now I see
born in 1916, died in '85, he was 69 then, so 58-59 years old in 1974-75, he was definitely a serial predator. Â
He should have been sent to jail for life, and had all his money given to his victims, or at least drawn and quartered.
Howard Allen is still alive, I wonder if he's still liable for what went on under the auspices of twi?Â
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excathedra
wow so i was getting frucked by my grandfather
in the word
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justloafing
Edited........NowISee did the math before me.
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Ham
"I'd rather see a sermon, than hear one any day.."
the words of the vicster condemns himself, and those like him..
"they hold(?) the truth, but they truth does not hold them.."
wow.. what a "sermon".. he really "holds" the "word"..
ptooie.
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now I see
I'm so sorry (((excie))), I wish he had been outed before he died so that his vicitims could get some public justice.
I guess he'll get it in the end.
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Sushi
Glad you liked it, exc. Helped a bit when I heard it too.
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wing
Now I See...
You raise honest concerns about vic in his younger days. "... he had to be preying on women early on to be so bold.... perversions had to have started way back when he was young... he just ain't right, these actions ain't normal..."
The early part of vic's life is pretty blank to us. For young adulthood, we've been at least a little misled about his schooling; then told that he simply 'left' church he was pastoring, merely because he made a choice to favor of da verd. I dunno what happened with him; but - what if he had been fired? or urged to leave over some stuff like this...? His personal history, given a part of 'twi - lore' is so one sided, skewed and spun. Lots of missing pieces.
Aren't normal people (guys in leadership-teaching-speaking capacities) inclined to mention publicly of loving their wife?
Or loving their kids? at least once in dozens of years?
VP criticized his family, and publicly tolerated his wife.
Aren't normal people inclined to admit to a least an occasional mistake? Or allowing that maybe just maybe a mistake could happen?
VP criticized others, but not himself.
I was so fooled, not only did I think he was normal... I also thought he set an example to follow.
Time to pull away the curtain.
Ex... 30+ years ago (although I thought I knew so much), I wish...
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waysider
Credibility
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now I see
He left his church in Van Wert because he, in fact, did get his secretary pregnant while he was the pastor there while being married with children. Â I believe he must have been forced out because of it. Â I never heard him say anything good about those church leaders, and in fact, he stated that religion is one of the cruelest institutions in the world; misdirected anger.
My recollection of public things he said about Dorthia were positive, although I never understood why certain people would say women wanted to be like her and should aspire to be like her or use her as a model. Â She was very quiet and reserved, didn't display very much emotion, which I attributed to her rural Ohio upbringing and culture, rarely said anything publically and it was evident that she had given up a lot to support her husband. Â I'm sure those living at Hq's had more interaction w/her and saw more, I only lived there for a short time post vp.
I recollect that he spoke of giving away JP, I think to a relative when he was 6 months old, depite Dorthia's and Don's objections, when they all went to India, other than that I can't think of him ever effusing or emoting over his kids.
Someone here posted a while back they thought it was vp's mom who was the source of his sociopathic behavior, although the details are limited and sketchy. Â He must have been abused or regularly exposed to an abuser as a young person to be that bold and so good at hiding it. Â
It took long time before any of us on a large-scale knew about vp's predilections, he had fortified himself at twi with so many of his henchmen and handlers, those who covered for him and who also indulged with him.  Perhaps the only ones who really know of his family's legacy and origins for abuse are his surviving relatives.
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jen-o
i am sick to my stomach after hearing how this old, manipulative, self-centered pedophile used women like this...
i used to compare vpw to balaam, but now i think he is far worse than balaam ever was...
even a donkey couldn't get this guy's attention...
and still some folks insist that vpw did "acts of kindness" and "genuine good"... (gag)
if anyone thinks that vpw did any "genuine good and kind" act, i can guarantee you that it was just an i-l-l-u-s-i-o-n...
it is not within the nature of a false prophet to do "genuine good"...
if people can't see thru vpw, they won't have a chance when the coming world dictator rises to power...
cuz that guy is gonna be one smooth talker... and he will do signs and wonders that will make your head spin...
no wonder the whole world follows after him...
vpw is chump change...
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