Ham

I think sometimes the thing is updating.. I have found its usually available after a couple minutes or so.

Especially the "use and usages" of holy spirit, in the form of an appendix. RHST was 90% Bullinger's work. Dusted off and polished up perhaps, but you see Bullinger's unmistakable watermark in it.

I would agree. But I haven't exhaustively looked at their works like I did TWI's. I would, but I'm just too tired.. heh heh. "We believe the Bible is accurate" "We believe the Bible can be trusted" kind of generic, almost could be considered public domain.. But any vey doctrine, and I am thinking of the supposed "original" work in the holy spirit field- if I don't see documentation listing Stiles, Bullinger, Leonard, Vaylee (sp?) and others, it WOULD kind of bother me. You do make a good point, a copy of a copy of a copy is still: a copy.

It looks like as far as all practical details are concerned, YES. Donna's still living on welfare (vey money), and loy is supposedly out in the cold cruel world.. but legally, on paper, probably not.

Interesting what this little "historical" reference leaves OUT- the division, the mad groping for power.. the adultery. Just like the fairy tale, I guess they lived "happily" ever after..

I dunno.. definitely not guilty of the gross plagiarism that is TWI.. I read their work on the hope. They basically said, "we read this, others say that, therefore we think the word 'rapture' is more appropriate.." or descriptive. Interesting that they acknowledged folks with DIFFERENT beliefs. Pre-tribulation rapture doctrines, post-tribulation rapture doctrines.. Seems what TWIish was left in the couple of more recent works was better documented.. I have not exhaustively read all their works, so I can't have any more than a general opinion.

Plus they seem to tend towards documenting their source material, thoroughly. At least in the materials that I personally read. There's actually a real works cited section in the back of the stuff I read. That's the second thing I would give them credit on, that they are academically honest. More than you can say than for the "parent" organization.

Momentus, I never had anything to do with it, can't comment on that.. but I've read a LITTLE of CES's materials. To me, it looks like old TWI doctrine, polished and honed to "perfection". Their book on One God did seem to handle a couple of controversial sections in the bible, a little bit better than vics assumptions. I have to give them some credit for original thinking.

Therefore it makes perfect sense why they ABANDONED it. Maybe even self-righteous hucksters may eventually say "enough is enough".. Oughta sell the brooklyn bridge only so many times. After all, there are LOADS of other bridges in the world just begging to be sold.. lots newer, too.

CFF is kinda what der vey wished that they once could have been, I think.. But names are fine. If not BOT/BOD/former BOT/BOD, we kind of disguise the names. Like we know W*yn* Cl**, J*h* Shr*y*r, and others in that organization that were once with TWI.

he even plagiarized that little scenario..

Well, The Man.. I agree. It could be quite cruel.. Sometimes, just for myself personally, I'd like to know if my "sense of humor" really helps or if its just p*ssing somebody off.. Hard to tell most of the time.

*shudder*

More questions than answers here, I guess..

Really? Was that the state of the art at that time? 8000 watts.. lessee. That's a BANK of EIGHTY one-hundred watt bulbs. I wonder how valid this claim is. I know the old film formats required a higher light level than modern equipment, but was this the norm?

Yep. Like he WAS a John, or a Paul.. sure left a lot to the imagination. I remember a couple of people claiming how great vic was, because he did indeed "see it". The claim didn't exactly square with his self-confessed lack of knowledge about the book of Revelation and the end times..

I would agree. Probably the soundest argument I think I have ever heard you put forth Mike.. "and many bodies of the saints which slept arose, And came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many" One more point to throw into the fray: it says "many" bodies of the saints, not "all". Could this possibly give David an exemption to this alleged "ressurection"?

I still think a "throw tomatoes at poster" or some kind of equivalent would be appropriate, along with a "do something nice" for poster. Sometimes people don't know what kind of effect their posts are having. people could anomously evaluate said posts. Who knows, maybe it would be cruel.. some folks would get a pretty nasty beating..

"cannot" describe.. good grief. He seems to stop short of claiming he went to the "third heaven and earth" like John and Paul.. sees "undescribable" glory or something.

They did seem to drive people to extremes..

Well, its 2:30 AM here, and THE stupid mosquito sprayer jusT Had to bE buzzing down THE street. Shoulda taken a fly swatter to THE darn thing..

Pretty girls surely were a plus.. but I think I was young and dumb. Too young, too inexperienced- easy mark. Got sucked in way too easily. I loved the "love"..

I don't know if I exactly hate THE WAY. More like I hate what they did, what they do, or rather, what I found out what they did, hiding behind their self-righteous facade, at least when I was in the organization.

I wonder how much mileage they're gonna try to get out of that one.. "gee, we were actually on TV twenty years ago, before we got the beating of a lifetime for it.." Your ABS, not exactly at work..

Never heard anything about this character. Anybody know what happened?