waysider

Is it a Fleetwood Mac tune?

Am I now surprised to discover that Wierwille coincidentally taught a relatively obscure figure of speech that seems to have been "researched" long ago by E.W. Bullinger? uuuhhhh.....no.

The Fig Tree Incident Wierwille taught there is a special kind of "believing", the Manifestation of Believing, that involves "believing" for something that's already been revealed to you via the revelation manifestations...predicting the inevitable... (see post #19 for definition.) He used the fig tree incident as an example. He went on to say it applied to every miraculous event mentioned in the O.T, as well....the walls of Jericho, the parting of The Red Sea, etc.... Men of God could "believe" for them because the outcome had already been revealed to them....That never made sense to me, even as I sat there hearing it for the first time, in the Advanced Class, all those years ago. It's like saying you are believing someone is going to ring your doorbell, as you watch them approach your front door. Where is there any "believing" in that? That makes it more like some kind of mental/verbal trickery, a dishonesty of sorts. And, to make it even more perplexing, the last part of the definition says, "It also imparts believing in others." Wierwille went on to explain that the kind of believing it imparts is the "law of believing" variety. But, wait a minute! We've just witnessed JL debunking that sort of "believing". So, at least that much of the definition, by virtue of sheer logic, must be erroneous. (If JL is correct in stating that "It's a lie. It's nonsense.") Of course, anyone who has spent any time on the front page of The GreaseSpot Cafe could have told you that it's nonsense long ago. It makes you wonder what's coming next. Is JL going to reveal to us all that thoroughly and throughly mean exactly the same thing? Will he reveal that apistia and apeitheia were misrepresented in the PFAL class and don't carry the connotations we were led to accept? I'm with you, Jerry. Unless he is willing to admit he taught this stuff himself, explain why he changed his mind and offer an apology regarding the matter, I don't see why anyone would seriously give him the time of day. Of course, if he were to do so, it would cast a shadow of incredulity on anything and everything else he has taught for so many years.

They were already doing this stuff ---at Carnegie Hall---in 1971! As much as I really did like some of the very early Way music, I don't think we were breaking any new ground. edit: I probably should have put this on the Way Musicians thread but so it goes.

Take your Sing Along The Way books and turn to Look In The Sky.

"Ignore buttons" and "reporting" have never been my style. I have no plans of changing that any time soon.

I'm ok if you're ok. As long as it really is "over now".....

This is baiting. It's not the least bit relevant to the topic at hand. It's only purpose is to inflame and provoke controversy. Take it somewhere else if you really must discuss it.

Maybe you and/or John could start a thread in the doctrinal forum and explore this a bit more closely. Just a thought.

R.I.P.,Cornell Dupree.

In contrast, here is what JAL is NOW teaching. (2:54-4:51) "One of the most amazing things about this is it's the same old lie that the devil has told for centuries. He just keeps repackaging it. And, the lie is that people can be like God in the sense that we can initiate things from within our minds. And, the thoughts we have within our little craniums somehow go forward into the universe. They go out of our craniums, into the universe and they bring us red sports cars or they bring bad things to those we don't like or one thing or another. And, it is a total lie and it's total nonsense. The sad thing is when it infiltrates the church, which it has to way too large a degree. In essence, what this law of attraction says is that whatever you get is because of something you thought SNIP Sometimes it's called the law of believing.But, it's not true." .......................... It was bad enough when people (on previous threads) were comparing VPW to a modern day David. And, now, here you are comparing JAL to a modern day Paul. There is nothing Biblical about VPW or JAL. It's a farce to think they (were/are) doing something of Biblical proportions.

John, did you even listen to the video clip I posted? JL is teaching that what Wierwille taught is dead wrong. Wierwille said you could change things just by thinking about them. It's plastered all over the first session of PFAL. Have you forgotten what he said killed the little boy in his example of how fear produces negative results? He said it was fear in the heart of the mother. In other words, she was able to cause a physical change in the material world by virtue of her thoughts Here's something along those lines from page 53 of "The Orange book: "Unbelief is believing; it is negative believing. On the negative side is doubt and on the positive side is confidence. confidence versus doubt; trust versus worry; faith versus fear. Doubt worry and fear are negative believing. Confidence, trust and faith are positive believing. These laws work with precision not only in the Word of God but in our own lives." ................................................. JAL taught this very same doctrine, as if it were the gospel truth, thousands and thousands of times over a period of decades.

They must be in a serious state of denial, then, because it was VP who taught them this "law of believing" in the first place.

Life goes on day after day, hearts torn in every way.

CLICK

Shining Star----EWF

Maybe. But, then again, maybe she was doing the same thing we used to do when we tried to cram PFAL down peoples' throats.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cJzIvj9IKcM&NR=1

Pretty impressive piece of work, Jerry. I, obviously, haven't had time to read it yet in any sort of detailed fashion. This caught my eye, though...."If the Bible’s promise of Christ’s return is utterly false and Jesus never comes back, we will still have had the precious experience of receiving salvation, walking by the spirit, ministering the grace of God to others, and being drawn into an intimate relationship with the Creator of the Universe. That’s more than enough for me.".... I think this is partly what I was alluding to in the Batteries not included thread. In that thread I posed the question, "What if everything about Christianity remained the same but eternal life wasn't part of the whole package? How would that change your opinion of (or involvement with) Christianity?" I asked that question of someone I know who was once in a cult that was similar to The Way. The answer I got shocked me. She said if she thought that was true she would just kill herself then and there. That really took me back. What about "today", the "here and now", living each day like it might be your last? All I can really do, personally, is try to follow The Golden Rule as best I can. If that's not good enough, the burden will be mine alone to bare.

:P

Well, this is along those same lines of what I was talking about. Maybe there is something about the way your inner-ears are built that gives you less than optimal balance in these situations. Or, maybe your depth perception isn't well suited for such tasks. Your mind and body have a knack for putting this kinda information together. Like a cat has a knack for evaluating whether a hole is too small to crawl through. (most of the time) So, your mind throws up a red flag of sorts. Generates a sensation we've come to know as "fear". Should you ignore it and try to walk that I-Beam, 4 stories up anyhow? Well, I guess that depends on how big your believing is. (snicker)

The irony of the law of believing is that, in some situations, fear can be your greatest friend. Fear can become that all important alarm that sounds when danger is imminent. Pretending it's a bad thing can cost you your life, as some unfortunately discovered