waysider

Wierwille deliberately took John 10:10 out of context and misrepresented its message despite his insistence on understanding scripture in light of its context. Then he built an entire class/ministry around its misrepresentation. I'm not so sure I can interpret that as "starting out good". I have no interest in comparing The Way to the RC Church. The analogy is a "strawman" at best.

Still comparing The Way to the first century church? Reflecting on my years spent living in a Way commune has shown me such comparison is a cruel delusion.

There is a poster who frequents this site who calls them TVT's (TWI Verbal Traditions). He insists that any adverse effects of TVT's must be our own fault because we listened to them. Another twist of "blame the victim".

He had armed guards and thugs that he dispatched to silence the naysayers. I think there must have been a reason for that.

Some people see Wierwille as a guy who started out good and then went bad. I see wierwille as a guy who started out bad and then went nuts.

Many guys have come to you with a line that wasn't true and you passed them by.

Yes, that's what Wierwille taught. It's like I said before, he conveniently pulled out the "counterfeit" explanation wherever and whenever it worked to his advantage.

"lambano, laballo, ballo, throw the ball, throw it out" Yeah, yeah---That's it Throw the whole thing out!

Pompous bastages!

Fits like a hand in a sock.

Nice post, sky4it

From what I understand, dreams are merely your mind's method of dealing with unresolved issues. From that perspective, they have definte meaning, but the meaning is not transferable from one person's dreams to the next person's dreams. In other words, a red Corvette may mean something specific in my dream and something entirely different in yours. Have you ever had this happen? You're pushing a shopping cart through the grocery store and every so many feet you get zapped with an electrical shock. Why? Because static electricity builds up in the cart until it reaches a point of discharge. Same thing with your mind. It can only hold just so much "energy" before it needs to discharge. This is so much more comforting that TWI's explanation that "dreams are caused by devil spirits". So, in TWI, if you had dreams, how could you discuss or consider them when doing so meant you were confessing to devil spirit influence? It doesn't seem very healthy to suppress the reality of what's really taking place.

Yes to both questions. As part of the Fellow Laborer program, we were required to work full time at secular jobs while living in a commune styled compound. I think the inconsistancies were probably obvious to at least some of our non-Way coworkers. We frequently had to rationalize and justify our involvement to people at our jobs who had honest questions. I think, to some extent, it may partially explain why people can come to GSC after being out for several years, and still feel they have to justify the time and effort they put into a false endeavor back in "the good ol' days".

P.T. Barnum didn't try to pretend he was anything other than what he was.

My question was twofold, Clay. 1. Have you heard them? (You answered that you have.) 2. What is your reaction to them? (I'm still waiting for this one to be answered.)

We just love ya.

Yikes! That means that, according to THIS, 66% of the world's population believe the Devil is the true God. I better stock up on Green Cards and go WOW as soon as I can.

I'm just curious, Clay. Have you listened to any of the following links? If so, what is your reaction? http://www.greasespotcafe.com/main2/radio/episodes/the-road-to-the-letter-to-the-board-of-trustees-1987.html http://www.greasespotcafe.com/main2/radio/episodes/kristen-skedgell-on-losing-the-way.html http://www.greasespotcafe.com/main2/radio/episodes/kristen-skedgell-more-on-losing-the-way.html

Actually, I believe it was taught that they themselves were not required to believe but believing by someone else was required on their behalf.

Ceiling?? We don't need no steenkin' ceiling! Are you limiting God er sumpthin'?

My memory on all the details is fuzzy. I don't remember if it was a plaque or a piece of hand-tooled leather. For all I know, there may have been more than one instance. The one I am referencing , if I recall correctly, occurred in about 1974, at Lakewood (Ohio) Public Hall. Whether it was this particular one or a similar one he referenced at a SNS, I don't know.

Well, you kids just need to get your believing up!

Yeah. It might even provoke someone who is already suicidal to feel there is no escape from eternal damnation if they are told all hope for salvation is lost. R.I.P., Billy---I still miss you.

When I took PLAF (The Wonder Class) in 1972, The Unforgivable Sin was still being taught. Here is that teaching from page 42 of the silly-bus. ************************************************ THE UNFORGIVABLE SIN Sin against the Holy Ghost. Blasphemy against the Holy Spirit. 1. Two gods-II Corinthians 1:2,3; 4:4 2. Blasphemy-Matthew 12:31. Mark 3:29. Luke 12:10. 3. Two seeds. Genesis 3:15. Compare John 8:12ff. 4. Born again--seed of Christ--love of God--love. I John 3:9-15. 5. Born again--seed of Satan--hate of Satan--hate. I John 5:16. THE UNFORGIVABLE SIN TWO SEEDS Body/Soul---------------------Body/Soul BORN AGAIN---------BORN AGAIN Seed of Christ-----------Seed of Satan Love of God---------------Hate of Satan Eternal Life---------------Eternal Death Children born of Christian parents I Corinthians 7:14. Hebrews 1:14 CONCLUSION: "To have eternal life is to have eternal life. It is not to manifest the holy spirit. That is something else. Power or ability comes into evidence after one has believed and received the holy spirit. The life and nature of God in you at the time of the new birth is the potential to power, the door to it. Acts 10:38. The power of the new birth is in the renewing of the mind, knowing what you have received and are in Christ Jesus." ********************************************************** :realmad:

Here's Buzzy Linhart's take on the subject.