HCW

Hey gang! Thanks so much to everyone who spoke out in my support. I really appreciate it. You guys know the respect I have for you. I do think though that I should respond to CK's attack, post or whatever you call it. Lots of folks out there don't know me much if at all like many of you guys do. VP was one of MANY mentors I've had (and still have) in my life. Lots of folks have had impact on my life in positive ways & some negative. I don't really view him above of below anybody who's ever taught me any thing at any time. I'm equally thankful to them (or you) all who've taught me stuff. Failure? ME? I don't think so. I'm thinking that I'll hold off on the suicide thing at least until I'm standing before my oldest daughter 2 1/2 years from now when she completes her undergrad degree from Yale where she's currently carrying about a 3.6 GPA. I'll be there at the ceremony to tell her for the umteenth millionth time how proud of her then tell her the exact same thing I've been telling her since the day she was born 20 years ago.... "Daddy loves you!" Then there's the high school graduations of my two boys, then their graduations from college.... all of the things we seek to accomplish along the way in their lives, not to mention the goals I have for myself. Let's not forget the littlest one, my baby girl who just turned 5 a couple of months ago. I have PLENTY to live for. Too much to list it all here. I even like posting here at the cafe. I use this stuff to practice honing my communication skills while I strive to make coherent point about this stuff. Stuff like Raf's comment about the "other uses" VPW had for the motorcoach. That was a mind blower for me. I think about that often. VPW in some wasy is such an enigma a study in contradiction. I DO think, over all he was "a great man." He accomplished a good deal of things, positive. Yet the horribly heavy weight of his negative accomplishments - - that's the thing about him that is very hard to get over, past or around. Wouldn't you agree? Those who've experienced the dark side of VP, most especially might. CK, your rants ar emore laughable than anything. No. I'm most likely not gonna mix it up w/ you. I will say this for any & all in reach of this message. There are some fundamental things, some things which shaped, in a very positive way, my character that I learned from VPW. I can't deny that. Were he alive today he'd be proud of me. As would my Dad, my teachers, coaches, family & friends, CHidren and some acquaintences are. I'm even proud of myself. I can thank VPW and TWI for a LOT of what makes me, me. First & foremost however.... I thank GOD for being w/ me through some incredibly dark & bright days throught my 48 years of life. I look forward to a great 2007. I live what I lived, remember what I remember and stand by my comments. I teach my children.... Lies don't change the truth. You can't MAKE me anything - - including angry. Try as you might. I'm growing in a lot of ways. Spending time here at the cafe helps me grow. I like it here. Why would I want to kill myself? BTW, CK. "Almost ALL of the Wierwilles aren't dead. They have children you know. I'm still friends w/ ALL of them that I ever knew. They like me & I like them too. I don't approve of anything bad VPW did or anything anyone does. I just do my best to "prove all things & hold fast to the good." God told me to do that. I still study his word. I put lots of time into that, just like I saw VPW do. Mostly though. My MOMMY told me that she had read the Bible through 13 times. I have yet to reach that goal. Bottom line is that I just don't put more importance on VPW than his life warrants. There are tons of folks in my life who were & are more important to me than he. He was what he was when he was it. I am what I am when I am it. Catch my drift?

Sure. In 1978 when I first came to HQ I lived in the loft above the Snack Shop in the courtyard of the Wierwille home for a few months until moving into a unit. Back then Howard Allen was VP's driver and valet. HA would stay up all night and drive through out the night to get VP from location to location while the believers were sleeping then he'd do minisrty stuff during the day. It was normal and usual for the coach to arrive @ home during the wee hours of the morning. I'm a very light sleeper. There were many nights that I'd hear the coach pull in. The hissing noise of the airbrakes would awaken me. Many times, I'd get up & go say "Hey" to Howard as their usual routine was that HA would leave the coach running and walk across the courtyard over to his house across from the BRC. It was pretty usual that folks would take advantage of being awakened and go down to the basement of the BRC where they where J*@n Ma#@*%& was usually up late getting stuff ready for breakfast. Long story short. It was usual and ordinary to see the coach pull in, HA leave & go to bed, chat w/VP for a few, then he'd go into the coach & work. We, or sometimes I, would go get a midnite snack, hang out swapping yarns in the BRC basement for a while w/ some of the midnight "regulars" and go back to bed around & the light would still be on in the office window of the motorcoach. Normal. There were occasions when that would happen and VP would start his usual unending stream of meetings all day long after having been up very late the night before. I'd be up late myself, leave for shower & then work & come home around 6:00 - 6:30, relax a bit, then go back into my office & work til 8: - 9:pm (or later). The coach would be running all day, same light on. That was usual. We all put in a lot of hours back in those days - gladly. We had many great times in those days. Lots of great moments. I'd visit w/ VP & Mrs. on a regular basis on the back stoop of their house. VP & she would sit there looking at the stars often when VP came home. VP set a fantastic example of endlessly working hard for the believers while we were moving the word over the world. ******************** You don't hear comments like that here much because most of the folks who visit the cafe simply weren't there. I think there were only about 20 - 30 guys who lived in that loft over the years. There are accounts of what it was like in Elena Whiteside's book, "The Way Living in Love." I got to live a little of that lovey-dovey stuff. I'd say that 1979/80 was the last year(s) of the "Good ol' days @ HQ." I saw possessed people walking around HQ & getting healed, just by "His healing presence" at HQ. It was cool. When I came back to HQ staff in 1983 after going through the Corps. The place was much different, colder; less caring, etc. There were times when VP would join us all in the BRC kitchen & we'd feast on whatever. He'd tell us about the trip he'd just finished, ask us about life @ HQ while he was gone, etc. Ralph, Vince, VP, HA, lots of guys would frequent the kitchen for midnight snacks & lots of funny stories about, "Remember the time when...?" Great times. simply great.

Somebody else probably already told you this, but in the immortal words of Woody the Cowboy, "Ride like the WIND Bullseye!" I know, personally, how tough it is to break off young love. Basically, anyone who is currently in TWI is crazy. The things you mentioned about your girlfriend are insanity, and abuse. Based on your apparent sincere desire to seek help for your situation. You deserve better. Better is available. Go find better. Later dude.

I looked at the link to the CES Board.... Can anybody tell me which of the original 12 apostles was the CEO, CFO, Director of Outreach, Director of... etc., etc.? I'd really like to know. Thanks in advance.

Actually,. The reason we "lost" was that we were fighting a losing battle. That was my point, which you obviously missed Cmikeon. I'll put it bluntly. You cannot win in a fight to "save" TWI no more than any man can add a cubit to his stature by simply thinking it into being. The point is that the "wrong" elements of VPW's character were as firmly ingrained into the leadership culture of TWI as any "good" parts of him. People, most specifically the leadership, chose to embrace the "I wanna be king" parts of VPW's leadership and the individual weakness in their character cultivated the seeds that VPW had sewn. HUH? That is PRECISELY what I'm talkin' bout! You, cmikeon, obviously don't know me at all. Anyone who does know me knows just how reduculous a statement that is. WHY can't you speak in plain english rather than use idiotic terminology to speak for you? "...the devil walked in and shut it in your faces..." ??? Just exactly what does THAT mean? I mean, other than a classic example of how much you're controlled by "Wayhead?" I'll show you that. Just as soon as YOU show me ANYWHERE in the Bible where it says "standing" will be hard. Actually, EVERY, church DOES do it. Some churches "stand" with God "better" than others, of course. The vast, overwhelming majority of churches, however, suffer from the SAME affliction that TWI did and does. Their leader wants more in the deepest depths of his (or her) heart to be KING more than he wants to serve THE king of kings. On some levels, this "was TWI great" thing, has become VERY simple for me. How is that, you say? Well, JESUS said it all, very succinctly. "He who is the greatest among you shall be your servant." Now, as Oldiesman pointed out, I knew VPW personally. I was more than an acquaintence of his. In fact he actually mentored me, taught me a lot of stuff personally over a period of almost 20 years. I'm an actual, friend of the family of the Wierwilles. A good bit of my interaction w/ him was on a personal basis when nobody else was around. That being said, I observed him putting in COUNTLESS hours working, studying and serving us all as Founder & President of The Way International. He earned my respect in that regard. I could write LOOOOOONG posts of personally wonderful experiences w/him. I'm on record here at GS as saying he was like a surrogate Grandfather to me. Coming from me, that is a FABULOUS complement. I used to have twig in his basement. Mrs VPW and Wanda W. would prepare snacks for our twig. On several occasions Mrs. VP showed us her personal photo albums which had photos in it of ALL of the "legndary" stories VP told in the original PFAL class. Part of my job at HQ was to be the keeper of the TWI hisorical photo archives. In so doing I spent hours & hours w/ the oldest of TWI old timers asking them questions like, "Who are these people in this shot and why does this pitcute matter?" I spent the better part of an entire year organizing shoeboxes of photos, categorizing them and dating them. That project came directly from VPW to me, I reported to him directly about it. We talked about a LOT of "things & stuff about the ministry and had a private relationship that went beyond, student/ teacher or employer/ employee. It was THAT stuff.... The fact that when VPW found out (unbeknownst to me) that I needed $$$ (as in hundreds) for tuition to finish The Way Corps or be thrown out; he personally paid my tuition. Then he sent me a handwritten note to let me know that it was paid, and by he & Mrs. I was also one of a handful of people who were there when VPW "passed the mantle" of TWI to LCM. I heard what was said, heard the prayers, the prophecies, manifestations of the spirit, shot photographs of the event, participated in it. It was the rehearsal of what happened at the public ceremony that many of you may have attended. You don't get any more inside TWI than that. The fact that he had earned enough of my respect that I felt honored to help dig his grave. Doug McM... who was thrown of TWI grounds so famously, was there also. The people who gug it out with shovels, spades and dirt under our fingernails, that list was a "who's who of the "top" leadership of TWI. (I would add that few if any of the present TWI leadership were there.) We all felt, at least at the time that that time was a highlight of our lives. We did some GREAT and PHENOMENAL things in TWI, contributed to changing the cultural course of "church" in America. Things that are commonplace in churches today, many, many of them we did in TWI 30 years ago. All that being said. I now believe after many cathartic moments in the almost 20 years of being OUT of TWI that VPW succombed to his desire to be KING. Again, more than his desire to SERVE the King. CMikeon like to try I dazzle people w/his supposed knowledge of the scriptures. Perhaps it is youth, or at least youth in the same scriptures he purports to know that he missed the simplest of points. There is a scripture that speaks to the point that those who were among us, but no longer are among us were never actually AMONG us. If they were truly and actually among us, they would still BE WITH US. That scripture speaks to a simple, unalterable principal. It is what it is. TWI is what it is NOW, because it was what it was when it was it. Things grow. I tree doesn't grow to become a building. Bluntly. If TWI, ever was actually GOOD. It would STILL be good. It has been a HUGE horse pill going down sideways for me to swallow to come to the conclusion that I was WRONG. DEAD WRONG. I used to think that TWI was something good being corrupted by "evil" ones that was worth fighting for. That's why I spent years of my life "fighting" for it. What I now see is that the ones I percieved as "evil" and the misdeeds they purpetrated were precisely the same as the sweet smell and pleasant feeling I get when I walk through a flower garden. Both are the inevitable result of the growth of the seeds that were planted and cultivated by their caretakers. As much as I may have loved and respected VPW. I'm FORCED to admit by the fruit of his life & minstry that HE was wrong. What he built in TWI was NOT good. Many many of us who helped build TWI accomplished some absolutely AMAZING things. We had some awesome times. God DID bless us with many, many, many signs miracles and wonders (...which follow those that believe - - HIM, that is....). BUT. The ROOT, in the heart of the heart of the man who was at the helm. As they say in TWI.... His heart wasn't right. If his heart was right, it would have BEEN right. And in being right he would have DONE right. If his heart was right he would have made different, as in better decisions. In answer to my own question about the whole, "Ambassador One/President - I'm a really important guy" thing. I brought that up because: wouldn't it have actually been MORE impressive if one would build an empire that rivals the US government if said empire looked different? I mean Air Force One, really isn't very cool looking... is it? Catch my drift?

TWI, the ministry had insurance.

My personal experience w/ TWI includes, and I'm not so proud to mention this, my "writing off" things that I saw that were definitely NOT "good" and basically ignoring them. I wrote things off to: "Well, people are people and nobody's perfect." Then I switched my position to one who was "fighting for what we knew to be right." In retrospect I see that all we were really doing was just fighting. Fighting for a cause by definition requires that there be a cause that is good, just and basically "right." It gets blurred when one throws in this Biblical truth: "All the ways of a fool are RIGHT in his own eyes." You can find that in proverbs, folks if one is so inclined to look for it. History tells us that all types of folks have fought for all types of causes, some "right" some "wrong." In some ways what is or isn't "right" is a matter of perspective, or a matter of individual perception. I believe VPW taught a LOT of "right" things. Right as defined as universally "good" for whomever applied the precepts he taught. I also believe VPW taught a LOT of WRONG things. Wrong as defined as universally detremental for whomever applied the precepts he taught. Just what was it we were fighting for? Why then, if we were SOOOOO freakin' right, did we "lose?" If GOD be for us WHO can be against us? As much as at one time I wanted to believe VP was "right" and "good," when I now, at this point in my life w/ a few miles under my belt, some worn tread on the tires of my life. After having had and taken the time to distance myself from the perceptions and perspectives that was & IS TWI... I feel compelled to say, objectively speaking, TWI was NOT great. People have good times in prison, locked away for life. Jeffery Dahlmer was a pretty bright guy. Charles Manson is one of the most brilliantly persuasive and gifted public speakers one will ever see. My personal experience w/ TWI was prompted by my attempts to be faithful to my promise I made to my Mom. The promise was based on a Bible teaching, a truth I heard for the first time, after having been raised "in the church," taught by VPW: Prove ALL things hold fast to the good. TWI, was NOT "good." Its foundation was not based on the desire to be "good." "Good was not what was in the heart of its founder as his reason(s) for starting it. "A house that is built on sand will NOT stand. When the wind and the waves come rushing in it will SURELY fall." ( I think it was Jesus who said that.) VPW taught me that God is truly real and that He, God, loves me. For that I am eternally grateful and thank God for VPW's teaching me that. That was a GOOD thing. I also saw VPW, while serving in his position as "the man of God," slurring his words, singing and sloppy drunk at the first HQ staff Christmas party I ever attended as a member of HQ staff. I took pictures of him. His being drunk like that was a BAD thing. It was universally and wholly bad because the Bible he SAID he gave his life to live and "make his own" clearly said, so simply, "be not drunken...." I should have walked. Right then, on the spot. BUT. I didn't. I chose to ignore what I KNEW was "wrong" and justify the behavior because of who I THOUGHT he was. Even though I SAW, with my own eyes that VPW was intentionally NOT living as "the man he knew to be." That, my friends was ME being under the influence. I was under his control. As much as my free thinking self hates to admit it. I was a FOOL who was being fooled (this is by the Biblical definitions of the same). I see life much more simply now than I did then. Why? Because I'm FREE from the influence. I now believe that when I person chooses to use (as in accepting it as a part of himself in the way HE chooses to communicate) any of those freakin' TWIT terminologies he is, as they (TWI) so often put it, "opening himself up" to what I'm calling "the influence." The principal used in the movie industry... The willing suspension of disbelief. This is how we believe that an actor is the character he's portraying. This willing suspension of disbelief is why we cry real tears during "Fried Green Tomatoes." I willingly "suspended my disbelief" when I saw VPW drunk. I should have believed that he was a a hypocrite. In fact I DID. I was appalled and shocked by what I saw. To my credit, I guess, I decided to never just swallow everything he said lock, stock & barrel. Buy now, I realize that that was BS. I was lying to myself. I accepted what he said by NOT walking. I gave his actions my approval by not quitting and contining to FOLLOW him. This is what happened to us ALL, to varying degrees when we joined TWI. Oh yes we DID join! Even though there was no "membership" we sure as hell joined it. TWI. VPW, LCM and now Rosalie & co. took advantage of us. They are criminally taking advantage of the current followers of The Way even as we "speak." Riddle me this Batman.... Just why is it that people involved in TWI are "followers" when Webster's Dictionary defines their involvement as being "associates." Big difference between followers & associates. How come I'm welcome to spend the night at my sisters' homes in PA any time but I'm not allowed to set foot in my sister in Christ Rosalie Rivenbark's house? I thought everthing TWI owned belonged to EVERY believer. Rosalie's just a steward of that really cool, one of a kind custom built home, w/an inground pool in the back yard. (I guess Way Builders couldn't have put in a community sized pool for the rest of the staffers to use back there in the trailer park. I guess there wasn't room on the more than 300 acres to put in a pool for the average Joe Believer who works on staff?) Well... I digress. Isn't my sisterhood in Christ, as a member of God's family, a little bit BIGGER and BETTER and a LOT longer lasting than the fact that I shared my Mom's womb w/ my fleshly sisters. Didn't Jesus say that we should forgive "seven times seventy?" No. He says we should "mark and avoid" our brothers and sisters in Christ who decide they don't want to swear allegiance to Craig. The problem w/ using the TWIT terminology is that one stops THINKING and starts FOLLOWING. And they sure as hell aint following GOD. VPW wanted, so desperately, for people to follow HIM. He used the framework of Bible teaching for HIS OWN purposes. That, in my very educated opinion, is how he lived life on the see-saw, good/bad. I was not only there, I actually "been there, done that, and for a long time time it was ME who DESIGNED the T'shirt. What was in his heart, regardless of ANY and ALL good he did was basically WRONG. He didn't teach the stuff he taught so we could have personal relationships w/ GOD. He taught what he taught so we could have personal relationships w/ HIM. VPW wanted, above all else, to be KING. He wanted to live, "in your face" to his detractors. He CREATED the monster we know as LCM, the star of TWI II. Some of you know far better than I ever could VPW as the monster, the star of TWI I. Some of you know that the times I and others describe as "the good ol' days of TWI" were in fact not so darn "good" after all. I could go on and on and describe VPW and life @ HQ from a different perspective and prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that King, master & leader was what VPW was after. He wasn't lying when he said he never wanted to be "the man of God." "From the HEART flow the issues of life." He just wanted what he got... to be "king." Take a look at the history, even the published history of TWI. There is nothing in it like VPW saying, "I always wanted to, and have had for all of my life a burning desire to know God and His word as it hasn't been taught for centuries." What is there is how he got mad at this person, how he disagreed w/the church, how he was a renegade in his youth, how he did this, that and the other thing, "in the face" of the community. I witnessed probably hundreds of decisions VPW made through the years I was on staff there that I personally felt were, "not the best PR" for the ministry. He was always more like "giving the finger" to folks who said we were a cult, etc. At the time we sorta liked it. It went w/ the general protest everything nature of the times..... BUT. It was wrong. Why? Chapter & verse. We didn't, as a ministry follow Jesus' edicts chapter & verse. Even when we gave "authorities" the finger, it was like F-U. When Jesus gave "the finger" he was ALWAYS pointing out how it was THEM who had already given GOD their middle finger. Big difference in terms of which side of the fence one is on. Looking back the 8 years of my life spent on staff @ HQ were the most stifling and frustrating of my ENTIRE career. Even when I was fired by companies w/ lack of morals & ethics, I was actually treated BETTER. I see clearly now because I'm not looking at things w/ a pre-conceived notion that "this is good." I now see that when I was working @ HQ and felt, "man, doing this is a pain in the rear...." What was actually going on is that they were shoving a huge stick up my foot. Can anybody tell me the Biblical significance of naming the company's corporate jet parallel to what the President of the US (the most powerful man in the whole freakin' world) calls HIS corporate jet? VPW even had them paint the darn thing thing to look just like the President's plane. He even had the interior done in a similar fashion. He even had ME design a Founder & President's seal to look like the US President's official seal. They developed official protocals that were the SAME as the the US president's. We even had secret security for VP during major events that was just like the Secret Service. All this was "necessary." ??? Sure. For the man who wanted to be king. I think you catch my drift. I'll close this in honor of the season w/ a reminder that the man born King of angels, God's only begotten son whose birth we celebrate at this time of year.... He never had a corporate camel. Born in a manger. Rode on a donkey. He who was greatest among us was our servant. HE never had a song written to apologize for not living as he should. He who WAS the man of God. Quite simply, LIVED LIKE IT. Undeniably. Merry Christmas everybody!

I think it IS frightening, very frightening, at least to me it is. Nowadays I wonder, and have for a LOOOOOOOONG time, why it is that people in TWI just can't seem to speak in plain English. I've long felt that all of the "wayspeak" contributes directly to the individual giving up his free will and willingly giving up control of his mind and subsequently, his life. I think at one point TWI was "good." Problem is that most all of the "bad stuff" happened simultaneously with the good. People in differing locations and dealing w/differing people simultaneously had VERY different experiences. Personally, my Mom was VERY skeptical of my involvement w/TWI when I started going to twig in 1974/75. I had "good" experiences so she made me promise to her, which I did that I would "get out" at the point which I saw it as being "bad." I saw just how bad it was, from the inside out, when I got canned from TWI staff @ HQ in 1988. I saw just how bad it IS, from the inside out, when my current job took me to TWI HQ a couple of months ago. The current TWI minion is SOOOO "far under" that they think they are, figuratively speaking, seeing green when in fact it is very dark black that they are looking at. At the center of the thing is this crazy Wayspeak thing. There is a subtle difference between conforming "to belong" and conforming under the influence, as in being controlled. When I see the convoluted speaking patterns, the over use of specific terms, like "our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ." (WHY can't they just say, Jesus? Or The Lord? or something? Why do they ALL say it ALWAYS the SAME way????) When you MUST use the term, and when one finds themselves shackeled to the use of terminology as the average rank & file TWIT is.... You are under their control..... PERIOD. THAT is freakin SCARY.

Hi Linda... Long time no speak, good to "see" you again.... In response to the question of this thread... Two words.... BULL S#!+ A quick look at the scriptures in the book of Acts tells us when the believers of the day, under specific threat of their very lives said, "... we ought to obey GOD, rather than men." Period. I do remember the talk about suggestions from "the man of God" being tantamount to a command. I bristled at it at the time and frankly never really bought into it. I know that the statement comes from the millitary where they are teaching soliders basic RESPECT for their leadership - in the specific context of the military. We aint military. ... also, I always felt that we were really in no position to "command" anything of anyone, anyways.... Still aren't....

I went WOW twice. I flat out refused to go WOW rather than go to college. I felt VP was a little over the top about what it would do fer ya. I didn't let anyone talk me into going WOW after I graduated high school. Figured the "10 yrs growth..." could wait and that I'd only be better equipped as a WOW w/ more education. Was it worth it? For me, yup. Although the second WOW year was about 10 months of literal hell. Seriously. I learned that the ideal to send WOW's into small town USA was NOT of God. Learned that a LOT of small towns are HQ for a LOT of really "not nice stuff." They can get away w/ it because most everyone who live there is into it! YAAAA!!!!!!!! God had to save my life a few times that year. IMO going WOW is "nice place to visit but I don't recommend living there."

... There is very little about current TWI that is actually truly religious. The Meshach of the Bible didn't "find the safest place" in the burning fiery furnace. Their fire raged and they danced in it and came out without even the smell of smoke on their clothes. Any religiopus person worth their socks would have thanked God in some way for saving the house.... Even if he was shamelessly plugging his church he would have somehow thanked GOD... on what day was it... THANKSGIVING???? Morgensen's account is the PERFECT example of what TWI is about. A chimney fire is a normal occurance for those who DON'T properly maintain their chimneys. Hmmm.... "he who is faithful in that which is least... ??? They didn't even know the place was on fire until they saw & smelled it.... I guess GOD didn't know it was burning? Long story short, they called 911 before they called on God, then they took it upon themselves to save them selves, then they figured out a way to draw attention to themselves and make themselves look good when in reality the MOST Godly thing they could have done about it was to clean the damn chimney in the first place. Then they make a whole lot more of the event than it actually was.... I mean isn't the next room over a safe place from the fire in a brick chimney? Its not like the whole place went up in flames them kitty kitty came prancing from the ashes unscathed. Hey. How many people whose house almost burns down find a way to get an article in the paper about their church? I'm wondering how they got around to mentioning it to the reporter...??? GOD had NOTHING to do with this saving of the darn cat. The cat, it seems, was actually smarter than the owner. :-)

Whereas I absolutely DO feel it important for people to give account of their negative experiences at th the hand of TWI leadership, etc., I also feel it necessary to point out thtat these most unfortunate incidents mentioned in this thread were or are the actions of individuals. There was never anything about TWI, the organization or corporation which sanctioned child abuse. I know this to be fact. I worked there, in the publications dept., and worked with individuals who originated the publications dept. Please be advised that EVERYTHING published by TWI had to pass through the legal dept,. (ad nauseum in some cases) before it could be published. UNFORTUNATELY. Many, many, "leadership" misused the power they had in just about every way imaginable. Child abuse being among the most heinous ways. Personally, I felt, and feel it abusive to children the way that The Way and many other religious organizations simply expect "performance" out of their children and a commitment to ministry that the parents may have but their children have absolutely no grounds or foundation to adopt. I am a leader in ministry, a WC grad and currently serve in lay leadership. I truly wish to God that my children would have the same and even greater commitment to God that I do. However, just because I'm committed to serve as I do is absolutely NO grounds for my children to wish to do the same. No moreso than I can expect ANY of them to adopt my career choice. People in ministry, in general, cram to much down their children's gullets. Before I'm flamed.... I'm also a stepparent of a child who was abused, two actually. The FIRST thing I did was to call the local police. Abuse is a crime. Child abuse is a most heinous crime. IF you or anyone you know has been victimized in this way PLEASE contact your local authorities. Yes. Its an ugly battle in front of you & the "solution" via the system, in and of itself can qualify as further abuse. BUT. You can't let these (insert the expletive of your choice) get away w/ it. Also. My opinion is that we can't let the heinous acts of certain unseemly individuals brand any organization. Even if its one we don't like, even one who is guilty of similar abuses.

I had a recent experience w/ TWI that probably fits this thread better than others. I took a "day job" about a year ago as a technician doing Dish Network satellite installations, when my the ad agency I was working w/ took a turn to the south in term of how much $$$ we were bringin' in. You know gotta pay those stinkin' bills, that sorta thing. At any rate, lo and behold, one day a few weeks ago, my route for the day included a four room install at, you guessed it, TWI HQ of all places. My sometimes quirky sense of humor prevailed over my disgust over how they treated me... so rather than give the install to some one else, I went to do it. Long story short. I was flabberghasted by how right they THINK they are there when compared to how clearly I could (and most anyone would) see just how freakin' WIERD they are. What was most shocking to me, is how EVERYONE speaks that wayspeak stuff! Just look at thier website and the posts from their ventures on the web. "Normal" folk just don't talk like that. They not only don't see how they talk as wierd, they EMBRACE it. AND they actually win some converts, and have a crop of young folk who are lifetime commited to it. That's just one thing.

TWI is not dead. Its current version is very much alive and (at least in their thinking) well. As a business entity they hit critical mass long ago and is very much self sustaining and they will most likely NEVER actually die. That, to me, is a VERY disturbing thought. Therefore, for as much as some may view what goes on here as whining or people who "just won't let it go." My opinion is that that opinion is at best an uninformed one. Becoming freed from the clutches of TWI is a long and in some cases arduous process. This cafe helps immessurably in moving folks down the road to freedom from TWI. Problem is that the current followers HAVE NO IDEA of how trapped and controlled they are by TWI. Those of us who are X TWIits must needs follow the process to FIND out specifically how controlled we were and maybe... still are. The secret to their success lies in how successfull they have been in geeting people to buy into "Wayworld" in such a manner thet the individual has NO IDEA that they are under the control of the organization. In fact the individual thinks they are in a class of the freest fret thinkers in the world. GS Cafe helps us, all of us do that. That is a VERY valuable thing. Post ON! My brothers & sisters... post on with whatever you feel you need to post! This website is a GOOD thing. But then again that's just one guy's opinion. For whatever that's worth. :-)

Sure. People had varying experiences w/ VPW. I had varying, as in good & bad, experiences w/ him myself. What I was trying to express was that it is difficult to say wht the BOT actually did, as expressed in POP without having a simple, VPW vs BOT perspective. The BOT perspective, in answer to this question was "nothing." Or "Not much." VPW's perspective was "a LOT." There was a LOT of infighting on staff concerning the old vs the new ways. They, the BOT, certainly changed a LOT of policies that effected everyday life @ HQ and through the ministry. Some of the changes were brought on by growth of the corporation. At least on paper.... I always felt that if we were in fact "God's ministry" we would not have tried so hard and spent so much money lining up w/ "corporate" ways of doing things and did things "God's way." God's way being clearly defined by the Bible. Things didn't go that way. For example: There was a time when ANY believer could rent ANY vehicle in TWI's fleet (including Ambassador One the corporate turbo pro w/ jet enhancements). The BOT changed this policy saying that it was driven by IRS rules. I, among others, felt this was BS. I've told the story on GS before about how I went in w/ another staffer and we rented one of the limos and went on a double date to a local drive-in with a couple ladies from staff. It made for a really cool date. The new rule put the kibosh on that kind of thing and took a lot of "heart" out of the way we did things. Hard to know stuff like that w/o being there. It was VPW's policy that EVERY piece of equipment, EVERY asset that the ministry owned belonged to EVERY believer because it was YOU, as in YOU the believers, who supported the ministry financially that paid for every stinking thing we used every day. We staffers didn't actually support the minstry because most of us got 100% of our income FROM the ministry. This meant, to me, that I owed each and every believer my very life because you paid for the roof oever my head, my vehicles and even the food I ate which kept me, and my family ALIVE. I'm sure you guys know that the average TWI staffer doesn't think that way today. What did the BOT do? They led TWI down the path to where it is today. Sure you can lay that at VP's feet as he was "the man". Facts remain, however that VP instituted a LOT of policies & procedures that made TWI a really cool place to live & work at one time. Interesting however that he also do the things that he is so much maligned for here in these foums. At the same times and even on some of the same days. Honestly speaking, my total experience w/ VP was that he was like an adopted Grandfather to me. I'm sure not many here share that kind of experience. In short I'd say, which is not so much vague as it is paraphrasing, that the BOT killed the Godly heart of HQ which lived in the staffers. Those of us who really believed in our hearts we were serving GOD and functioned as independant thinkers, strong individuals who really weren't there to serve VP; we had a heart for GOD. The BOT either got us to change to the "dark side" or got rid of us. Many of us REFUSED to be broken and we were FIRED. Some, like myself in the most heinous ways. The issue is perspective. I was a malcontent, a violator of company policy. Therefore eligible for termination on those grounds. MY perspective was that I felt it more important to spend time with my wife and three children than to leave them home while I sat through a tapes of teachings I had already attended when they were taught live. I felt I should study my notes from said teachings w/my wife. BOT said I was wrong because WC grad staff was "required" to attend Corps Night. Their perspective was, "If you don't support the Corps by going to Corps Night how can we expect the current WC to attend either?" I felt that was BS. I said. "Maybe because they are PAYING to be here as a part of their COLLEGE and it is one of their CLASSES? I'm here as PAID staff to work my job from 8 to 5 - - M,T,W,T,F. After work time my time is MINE to do w/ as I choose. Catch my drift? Later.

I think that to answer the question of this topic one has to take a position, a side if you will. Nowadays, most folk who frequent the cafe have taken the position (i'm characterizing it this way for communication's sake ONLY) that "the whole dang thing was wrong from the get go." The whole dang thing being TWI, especially VPW and his "followers." Followers being "leadership who shared in his errant ways and deeds. You just can't get there (to what they did "wrong") from here (that position). You'll get pretty much what we've got here in this thread. As one who lived @ HQ and worked there through the 80's I can tell you a perpective that I observed from my POV. Again, this is not the be it all, end all perpective... just my educated opinion. One can't find the detail in POP from looking at it outside in. The detail lies in what was SOOOO different about life in TWI while VPW was in charge and how it was after LCM took over. How we related to each other in general on staff and throughout the ministry on a daily basis was very different, as in worse. POP atttributed those changes to the LCM, DEW, HA. BOT. Those of us who lived the days when life @ HQ was actually "family" and who were hacked off greatly by the cold, corporate TWI of the mid-late 80's had the position, VPW regime = good vs. LCM regime = bad. Good= Godly Bad= "turned away from" God. As TWI turned in its ways, that was tantamount to turning away from God. I can speak for us rank & file TWI staffers of the day and tell you that we got up EVERY morning and went to work believing that we were doing our uptmost for God. VPW & what he did or did not do were not part of our daily day.

... So. Then I guess WHO one addresses is more important than WHAT they say? AND... If said person is ANGRY and expressing it in an extreme manner, then others whom said person is NOT addressing should DISMISS what said extremely angry person, addressing some who are "messed up" says ans NOT what the angry one actually meant. Oh. I get it. Rather than say that the person made contradictory statements on the topic, with said statements being based more on to whom the person was speaking than what he actually believed. We should believe that the person only made base, hideously ugly statements about the topic when he was angry and speaking to thos whom he considered as "messed up." THEREFORE. Since one is messed up, its OK, for someone (who is angry at you BECAUSE you're messed up) to yell ugly things at you.... BECAUSE... after al he really doesn't mean it. He only does that because he's extremely angry. AFTER ALL... its normal for angry people to say things they don't mean. SO any time LCM yelled ugly things, it was because he was angry. WE should dismiss them all because he really didn't mean it... ANY of it. OK. THANKS What the hay! All this time I was thinking LCM was a liar, a jealous angry bastard so filled with self loathing that he spilled it out all over anyone and everyone whenever he felt like it. Now I can sleep better, knowing that LCM never really meant the stuff he said. Especially when he was angry.

Is Craig gay? Hmmmm...... "THEREFORE YOU have no excuse or defense or justification, O man, whoever you are who judges and condemns another. For in posing as judge and passing sentence on another, you condemn yourself, because you who judge are habitually practicing the very same things [that you censure and denounce]." ... is what the Bible he teaches from says. Romans, chapter 2, verse 1. The context of that statement, or at least the verses immediately prior to it are the one speaking about... ( who'd a thunk it?) HOMOSEXUALITY. "The next verse! Why don't they EVER read the next VERSE!" Hmmm.....

Among actors and professional athletes, when one gets like WAAAY too full of himself, the saying goes: "He's starting to believe his clippings." (or something to that effect.) People in the public spotlight often start believing the positive things written about them, then start acting like they are "great," usually as in "greater than you." Then they really become a-holes, nobody, even their best friends can tell them anything contrary, or in any way negative about their behavior. They begin to think their excrement smells like roses. Outside in when we see them we go, "What's that funky smell?" All the while they are languishing in what they feel is a sweet smelling aroma. That would describe TWI. From what I've seen of them in recent years, they seem to "believe their clippings." Problem is, THEY wrote the majority of them, like 98%. The other 2% were written by people they duped into writing what they told them of themselves. An iconic reference for me is those "Singing Ladies of The Way." When Trudy Bayne first made the scene @ TWI she would light up the stage like a true broadway performer, Claudette would give you goosebumps performing a song you'd heard a hundred times before. Now they have all of the stage presence of a group of cardboard cutouts. Why can't they see that? Any apparent "change for the better" w/TWI is nothing more than a veneer like a piece of fine LOOKING pressboard furniture that one would buy at K-Mart. Underneath its just not actually what it represents itself to be. There is NO reason to return. If you were able to glean some good from your TWI experience, thank God for it and move on with your life. As the years go by God will show you more and more of Himself. The more you see of God the more obvious the answer to the question of this thread is. I want to say, "I aint mad at them." But. When one sees them for what they actually are, its very hard not to be. NO. Emphatically. NO. Don't go back. Don't even think about it.

Impossile... Not gonna happen. In fact, to quote the REAL Groucho Marx, "That's the most rediculous thing I ever heard." PLUS. It wasn't VP's words that changed your life, it was what you did that changed your life. So often people leave out that little, but OH so important piece of reality when defending somone they like who taught or mentored them. What YOU did changed your life. What VPW DID changed Excie's life. You are giving VPW credit in YOUR life for what YOU did. What you are doing is a type of WORSHIP. Idol worship. You don't realize this because "you don't know the scriptures, not the power of God." Good gravy. Then you think that spitting on Excie... ... and insulting her friends is a part of the ROLE you play here?You can speak positively of the positive things VP did or said without causing "even the slightest discomfort" to ANYONE he abused. You didn't because you JUST DON'T WANT TO. Any and ALL of his victims are fully aware of the fact that VP had some qualities in his life. You and the list of VPW supporters you list have demonstrated a disturbing pattern of behavior that allows you to personally attack anyone and everyone you feel had attacks VPW. VPW, himself (who I knew personally) publickly admitted all over the country that last vialble years of his life, "I WISH I WERE THE MAN I KNOW TO BE." Just what in the world do YOU think he was referring to? The indominable sin nature that exists in ALL men? BULLSH!% He knew EXACTLY what he was talking about and to WHOM. However, it was, as the song says, "too much too little too late."... for too many. If you could see past the end of your freaking nose for ONE minute, you'd surely see th at "your role here" is actually that of "bull in a china shop."

About the doggie video... I'm thinking that was us, the 11th. We were loud and vocal about a LOT of stuff. I remember being sickended by it and wondering how SHOWING us stuff like that somehow accomplished more than telling us about it. I think we saw it during the first part of the year during the advanced class. They showed us "the whole gamut of films, the spychic surgery, the oriental kid who made images on poloroid film w/his mind by saying "Pow!" We made a lot of noise abou tit, asked shapr stining questions, complained, the whole nine yards. Maybe the 12th complained too?

I'm not running to the defense of JAL, but....How do you know he HASN'T done acts of "real contrition" privately? Just what is it about renonucing his ordination(s) that defines contrition? What will his begging our forgiveness actually accomplish? If John called me personally or wrote me an email or paper letter begging my forgiveness for the way he treated me while attempting to throw me out of the 11th Corps.. what would that accomplish? What would it change? I felt he was wrong then, would his saying to me, "Howard, I was wrong, I beg you to forgive me," make him any more or less wrong? Would it do much more than give me the emotional satisfaction of him lowering himself before me? I don't think so. Nor do I think his or anyone's announcement of; "The ordination I operated under was bogus and made a mockery of God...." would accomplish anything. No nothing at all that is substantitive.. Again. Nothing beyond giving one seeking some self satisfaction of his own just that. I know John Lynn and I'm 100% certain that HE grieved Rochelle's loss of life as I did. I looked into his eyes when he was giving me the boot, I saw as much respect as he'd ever given me (which was substantial). He actually felt that my leaving the in residence WC at that time was what was best for me AND that I would, sans the rigors of the program, blossom and be able to return a few months later as one of the top guys in the 12th WC. I simply felt he was wrong. I fought for my life and my place in the Corps. Unfortunately my dear friend Rochelle didn't do that. She took her own life. Suicide, by definition is an extreme act of selfishness. They leave the living to suffer and punish us with their loss. For whatever their reason, the act accomplishes the same thing, it punishes us who loved them so. John was caught up under TWI, as we all were. (It is quite possible that John Lynn sat at his desk and decided, finally to give the word that "I was gone" from in residence at the same time Rochelle was deciding finally, to kill herself and did it. The two events were simultaneous, she was 1,000 miles away but it was roughtly the same time.) Rochelle and others handled the pressures of it by taking their lives. Perhaps they thought, as I once did, when I sat on the floor of my bedroom with a loaded shotgun trying as Might to put it in my mouth and "end it all".... Perhaps they felt that their life was as ruined as I felt mine was; ruined by my own hand, at my own decisions... irretrievable. How can I live on? How can I continue even one more moment? I can't. One thing we all had in common is that we were all caught up in a web of deceit authored by the enemy of us all. My experience tells me that I was being decieved into believing that ending my life was a viable solution for the pressures of life I was feeling so heavily upon me at the time. I was saved by the thought that I had a daughter who needed my life THEN to help develop her own. To kill myself would have robbed HER of a father. I picked myself up off the floor that day because I could NOT do that to HER. The one who seeks not but for to steal, kill and destroy won a few rounds. We all handled the pressures we were under in different ways. We were ALL under the "same" pressures. He killed a few of our beloved brothers and sisters. Destroyed a LOT of our dreams; stole even more from our lives. It is HE, the enemy, who should acknowledge the wrongs, apologise with acts of true contrition. As we still, to this day FEEL the anger that demands, "I want to see some REAL contrition from these people." While we demand they renounce this and apologise for that, I beg you. ... Have we truly moved on? While we feel these things are we looking back, looking through a window through time at what was then or are we STILL "in" it, living it now? Are as free from as we think? I think not. John Lynn is as clean as the blood of Christ washed him over 2,000 years ago. IF we believe that we are ALL, and WHEN we believe that we are ALL, just as washed and as clean from our sin, ANY and ALL sin; as clean as clean can be, it is then and ONLY then that we CAN understand... When we understand that we will surely say, "His slate is as clean as MINE. His sins are no dirtier than mine." IF and when we believe, truly believe what Jesus accomplished for us ALL, we will OFFER forgiveness to "these people" whether they ask for it on their knees or not. Regardless of what we each did or didn't do, we are ALL just as clean as the other. AND... We won't mock God with statements like this, Miraculously? There IS NO OTHER WAY to clean one's slate, all of the "real contrition" and apology and renouncing in the world can't clean ANYTHING. As we bite and snap at each other now, whose side are we really representing? I would suggest that if you cannot forgive THEM, you are not free. I speak unto you a more excellent way. Merry Christmas everbody!

Someone here mentioned earlier something about TWI raising the dead. That's exactly whatthey're trying to do, breathe "life" into "the ministry" and raise IT from the dead. I'm hoping that anyone actually considering going back will see just how heinous TWI is. They made people live on grounds there just because they had the space and were paying to heat it and light it. They made WC become full time paid staff so they could control you. It really makes sense to have the faithful who would send tithes & offerings into the "storehouse" from income outside of TWi leave their jobs and beome paid 100% of the income out of the same "storehouse" they were previously contributing to??? That would be the same as a car dealership forcing people to turn in their leased vehicles for a lesser vehicle that the dealership paid for and paid the maintenance and fuel costs.

Go back? In a word, No. A second word would be, Why? A third word would be, to what? Since I left TWI, the last Friday before Corps Week I've lived close enough to TWI; for the last aprox 6 yrs in Dayton and all of the years prior to that in New Knoxville. My perspective is enhanced by my daughter's who until graduation last June went to school K-12 at New Knoxville School with ALL of the Way kids; who, like her are "second generation" Wafers. Most of the kids are second generation WC the rest are second generation TWI staffers and a few are the children of the new staffers who've moved there to work @ HQ. I haven't considered going back to TWI, no not for one minute. Right now it would be a roughly 55 minute drive for me to go to a STS and for about 11 years it was a 3 minute drive. Why not go back? It takes a while away from TWI being exposed to "normal" people living "normal" lives to clearly see just how ABnormal TWI is now and yes, how abnormal it was, even back in the good ol' days. My daughter growing up, asking the typical questions a growing kids asks of her Dad... my having to ANSWER them adds a something to the whole mix. I could go on and on w/ reasons. If you want me to get specific, ask me specific questions. For right now I'll focus on the kids, what their parents have passed on to them about what being a believer is, and how one should behave as a Christian. Children learn what they live and they are ALWAYS a reflection of their parents. Granted sometimes the relfection is like a warped carnival mirror, but.... At any rate. The first scene is a Saturday afternoon at my home. Jasmine & I have long talks on Saturdays until she left a few months ago for college. This particular time she was upset about how "the Way kids" (that's what "everybody calls them) had treated a lady who was well into her 80's. They were on some sort of school field trip. I've gotta pause her to give you a little more of the lay of the land. If you take the entire group of NK high school students grades 9-12 you have between 50 & 80 kids. The juniors & seniors do more events together than the other, which means that you have the same basic group of about 30 kids (max) at stuff, ususally its about 10 to 15 of the same kids at "everything." Depending on the topic, be it sports or academic, you get about 10 to 20 kids with about 7 to 10 kids that overlap. Jasmine was in "everything" so she knows "everybody." BUT since NK is so small everybody is at least acquainted w/ everybody. This time, "the Way kids" had derided this little old lady to the point where the lady CRIED. Yes, cried, real tears, as in weeping. The lady was a Holocaust Survivor. She was speaking to a group of exceptional high school kids, which included a group from NK (which is an EXCELLENT school) the group had some TWI kids in it. They blasted this lady, who was there, who had photos and had expereinced it, they BLASTED her w/ TWI's anti-Holocaust rhetoric, until she cried. They only let up when my daughter, who had been urging them to let up the whole time, stood up, pulled rank on them as Class President, had to YELL at them and ORDER them to "JUST STOP IT! LEAVE HER ALONE! YOU DON"T KNOW WHAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT, STOP IT!!!" Jasmine's question to me was, "Why do they act like that Dad?" Through the years she's asked me many questions about TWI, based on the behavior of the way kids. Not one question was about something cool or good or "normal." Another question she posed to me was, "What is it with them that the Way Kids aren't allowed to ride with us in our cars?" With no public transportation in the NK area, "everybody" gets a car when they get over 16 and get their license. Some of the more concervative, cautious parents make their kids drive some old clunker they've had forever and kept for the kids when they bought their new one. (Their kid ususally "fender bender" wrecks it anyways.) A few kids don't get their own car but at least have access to the parent's second car or as in the case of one kid with a huge family, the family van that was as big as like, a small school bus. She didn't drive much ;-). None of "the Way kids" have their own cars. In a community like NK, that is an eyebrow raiser. Most parents reward their kids school performance w/a car, then use keepin' it to modify the teen's behavior positively. NO car, you can't do nothin' on the teen scene. When they kids are at a group school function, like NORMAL people do, they get together & decide whose house they're gonna congregate at aftwerwards, or which fast food place they're gonna meet at and make noise. TWI kids can't go. Their parents usually won't give then the car, or give them a ride, (which is an embarrassment for a junior and social DEATH for a senior) AND they are not allowed to get a ride w/ the other kids who have cars or access. This is an insult not only to the kids, but to the whole community. In NK we parents know each other we know which kids can be trusted w/ what. Some parents trust Jasmine to drive their kid around more th an they trust their own kid to drive. When Way parents won't allow their kid to ride w/ ANY of our kids they insult us all. Its like calling us fools for allowing our own kids to drive. It creates problems for the Way kids socially because they're "never there" when the events happen that kids talk about in school after the weekend. Sure, few people are at "everything," but the way kids are never at "anything." They only participate in "official" activities, most of the unofficial, spontaneous, teen stuff the kids do is off limits to TWI kids. They do their own stuff on grounds at TWI. The way kids are never a part of "everybody" they are always an "everybody" to themselves. Some of them are very likeable, talented and really cool kids, but their parents make sure there is ALWAYS a line of separation. Like during Graduation party season last year, the way kids (the few who came) only went to certain parties, all came and left together and could only stay for very short periods of time. It was like they're there but "not really" they don't really participate in what's going on. I could tell when I talked to them that they really wanted to "participate fully" but weren't allowed to and were not really allowed to say (or maybe were too embarrased to say) we're not allowed to. Sure, everybody only went to certain parties, only a few people went to "every" party. Its hard to get to every party because you'd have to leave your own.... However, everybody, knew that a certain few people whose homes were larger and more suitable for larger groups; their parties went on later in the evening and folks would end their parties earlier then congregate at the big one(s). Typical small town stuff, The Way kids were conspicuosly absent. What gets me is that TWI adults cuss like sailors and drink like fish. They won't, however allow their teens freedom to go to parties supervised by adults. AND they would'ntlet their kids hang out til curfew at the local fast food joint. It was BECAUSE the adults (who don't think like they do) are there and it was BECAUSE hanging out w/local kids, having fun might cause them to want to do it more often. I'd run into staffers on a regular basis through the years at NK school events, basketball games or track meets. More recently they've begun speaking to me and a few would go a little overboard acting and talking "normal." I was taken a little aback by how easly they bandied cuss words about. Just didn't seem to fit from someone who works for a church. They would get buddy buddy, then whenever it kinda naturally went to "we should do this again, this was fun," it was ALWAYS, "You can come to a service..." Like the "Ol' Jedi mind trick...." Just for kicks one time I invited an old WC friend of mine to have lunch when I saw her at a track meet. Her response was... "Sure, you can come to a Sunday Service." I was like, "I was kinda wanting to catch up on old times, sit & talk for awhile." She said, "Sure. There's plenty of time to talk after the service. :-)" (Cue Twighlight zone music... do do doo do....) :blink: To me, one of the most heinous things that's going on (that I'm sure they don't consider bad at all) is where they have convinced a really exceptional TWI girl whose a senior this year that she should put off college and go do their current version of the WOW outreach program. College entrance is designed to accomidate high school seniors planning to matriculate to a college after their senior year. Waiting a year can cost a kid a LOT in potential scholarships. I really don't know that a school that would offer a full ride, of half a ride to a high school senior would offer the same package to a person a year later. There are a LOT of stringent requirements for that stuff and "high school senior" is one of them. If you're not a high school senior you MAY not qualify, and summarily just not be considered. Not completely sure of the scholarship thing but I'm sure that TWI has done NOTHING to eliminate the "US vs THEM" mentality they've nurtured for years. They care NOTHING about what what they consider to be "of the world" and don't give one spit about what personal sacrifice an individual makes to be TWI. In short, they haven't changed at all. All they are doing is whitewashing the fence, they are making it appear like they are just "normal God loving people" a church just like every other church, just people who love God and want to spead His Word. They have even referred to themselves as a "church" in print in the newspaper. Nothing could be further from the truth. IMO they are more dangerous than ever. Remember, "The secret to his success is...." If you go back to TWI you must extricate yourself from life on this planet and go live in "wayworld." Nope. Not me, not for a minute. Problem is, they don't seem to see it that way. You won't either until you've taken enough time away from "wayhead" to begin to see how crazy it is. It is absolutely INSANE to tell your kid, "No, you can't go to Taco Bell after the game unless you ride with someone from our church." Kid says, "What if I ride with the class president, National Merit Finalist (at the time before she won it) whose Dad trusts her to drive 65 miles on the interstate, one way, ALONE every other weekend? He trusts HER to drive HIS OWN kids, why can't YOU trust her to ride me 8 miles to Taco Bell?" Parent says, "Her Dad isn't in TWI." Go back to THAT?

Probably. The Lima News is a pretty small newspaper and they don't have a lot of beat writers, probably one maybe two. Seems to me like the story is designed to give TWI an air of legitimacy, a "like any other church" pespective. The article only opens mentioning "her church" then mentions how she plans to put off college to participate in an outreach program "to spread the Word of God through her church..." how she is excited about that because it "will really help me get my spiritual priorites right." "The most important thing is to serve God, starting her "independant life right." The the article closes conspicuously stating how she is a member of The Way International (as if that's news) where she does volunteer work, acting as an usher. Even the title mentions "spirituality" first. The author must be a wafer. Isn't the subliminal message of the article, "Here's a kid who has her life's priorities "right" SHE is going WOW (or whatever they call it nowadays) putting of her worldly education to serve TWI, she's a leader, an exceptional person, well rounded and she's in TWI.... did I mention she's part of TWI? Her, the exceptional leader of people person that is." It is syrupy sticky, dripping w/pro TWI enuendo. PLUS. Locals almost NEVER call TWI "The Way International" they call it "The Way." A local would have written, "The Teenagere is a member of The Way...." NOPE. Not to lessen any of Tori's accomplishments. She IS an exceptional student. I know her, she's a good friend of my daughter Jasmine who was a year ahead of Tori at NK school. Neither I nor Jasmine are jealous of Tori for getting the ink in the article. I'm gonna throw out some facts, you draw your own conclusions. Jasmine was in some of the same activities with Tori and did the same thigns categorically as she. Jaz was one of less than 1% of ALL high school students in the country to be nominated and named to BOTH the National Honor Roll AND Who's Who Among American High School Students FOUR years in a row. And. Jaz was a National Merit Scholar, one of only 200 students in the entire country to win the highest level award. Plus she was one of only about five students in the entire state of Ohio to be accepted at Yale. The only one within a 100 mile radius of Lima. All of my proud papa bragging about MY daughter aside. The Lima News didn't write one word about Jasmine. PLUS. Lima is 30 miles away from NK. There are hundreds of well rounded students in the Lima School District for this woman to write about. Granted, Tori is special and truly exceptional, but.... How did this writer even hear of Tori? All of the things listed in the article are things local to the NK area. Again I'm not taking anything away from Tori. I like her, Jaz is happy for her to have an article written about her, as I am. Thanks for posting it, otherwise I'd never have seen it. I just don't think this article was an objective "hey let's write about a great student" thing. Personally I'm happy Tori got the ink. I tried to talk her into applying at Yale and following Jasmine there. It saddens me that she's going to put off school for a year like that. God can teach her the same "whatever" at college that He can teach her wherever she goes on the "outreach program." Tori's taking a year off to "to spread the word of God through her church" will not bode well on a college application. Few, if any colleges give scholarships for church participation. I'm thinking it will pretty much kill her chances at going to a lot of schools, probably cost her thousands in lost scholarship opporunities.