WaywardWayfer

WB, I wonder if we picked up some of those characteristics in our strict modeling of the examples we had. I see a lot of those characteristics in people and they don't seem to be alcoholics, but they are die-hard Wayfers who obey every command of leadership. Many of the ones I see with these characteristics ARE TWI leaders.

Unfortunately, Eagle, I'm not surprised. That's the good ole "love of God in the renewed mind in manifestation in the household" for you.

def59, I'd also like to know what you're talking about.

Shuks? I hear what you're saying about "horse sense", but that was UH who said that and it's easily dismissed with "chapter and verse" about any topic where TWI doesn't want you to operate horse sense, such as buying a home, getting a student loan, getting a loan to start your business, marrying someone non-TWI, etc.

Imbus, Wyteduv, Digi and Bowtwi, Thank you for sharing with us. I agree, Dovey, that many times we can't even imagine the pain that people are going through. I think it's probably very saddening and frustrating to God to see His kids going through so much turmoil. Eventually there will be no more sadness and no more tears for all of us. But until that day, some of us handle the sadness and tears (real or exaggerated in our own minds) very differently. My heart breaks for the people who feel that extremely depressed and the families who love them.

I remember hearing that too, Chas, but I thought it was during the building of the multi-million dollar room. I think they said a WC person working on the project got M&A'd because he eventually put his foot down to LCM. I'll look in the archives and see if I can find it.

Many people believe(d) whatever they were told because "LCM" or "VPW" said so, so it must be true. I'm ashamed that I was one of them. I've looked and can't find any research from any Biblical scholars who agree with the TWI teaching that the first sin of mankind was a lesbian encounter between Satan and Eve. And even if I did find something, it would not mean that LCM was correct in his assumption. Do you think that TWI's teaching on this subject is correct, shuks?

Are Jehovah's Witnesses considered a "Christian" organization? How about the Mormons? If I buy a "Rev" title or a PHd on the Internet, regardless of how much work I did to get the title, am I entitled to call myself a Rev or a Dr.?

Okay, Oak. :)--> JT, that makes sense. Funny how they change the rules to avoid lawsuits in some areas, but don't change their behavior to avoid them in other areas. -->

I don't think the Bible talks about these men specifically, but I do think that they are going to have an awful lot to answer for and they will be held accountable for the things they've done to God's kids. I also think that the other leaders who are still covering for these 2 men and have not come clean about their evil ways will have a very rude awakening at the return. God talks about them in the sense that he points out the characteristics of evil men like VPW and LCM. I'm just sorry I didn't realize it sooner.

We've asked for specifics on what was changed in the Prevailing Word editions and if any of the teachings were changed. We got no answer.

Ditto what WW said. I for one am glad that people post here and don't mind rehashing the same subjects over and over. I don't get to eat here as often as I would like and sometimes I miss things. If they weren't repeated I would never hear about it. Also, people are coming here every day. New people checking out TWI on the web before getting involved and people in wanting to get out or starting to realize that TWI is not giving them the full story and even lying about what they are telling them. If you've moved on and this type of forum isn't your "thing" then please move on.....No one's got you chained to the booth you're in.

Shuks, maybe you were asleep during that part. He very clearly said that the first sin of mankind was the lesbian encounter Eve had with the Devil. He did teach many times about homosexuality being the lowest of the low (forgetting about VPW's teaching in PFAL regarding no sin being any bigger than another sin). No one here has said that "eating an apple" was the first sin of mankind, so I don't know where you're coming from. The gist of the comments has been that there is no proof that the first sin was a lesbian encounter. Furthermore, just because some artist painted it that way and just because LCM made illogical leaps of interpretation of some words - that does not mean that he is correct in his assertion that the first sin of mankind was homosexuality. You don't have to become a scholar, God knows I'm not, but you've mis-read what has been written. I'm leaning toward the "pull my finger" theory, myself.

Shuks, he walked away from an abusive cult not his mom. Just because he wasn't with TWI does not mean he wasn't actively involved in her life.

Hi John. I hope you're healthy and stockpiling all the dough you can since you must have come to the realization that TWI does not take care of it's own, no matter how loyal they are and no matter how much they claim that they do for people. If you're looking for people you think might help you make an escape from there, I'm sure many of us would volunteer to help you. I hope you can sleep well at night. I really do. I hope you believe what the Bible says about having to answer for what we've done. I really do.

We were having a social get together with some of our friends (Way and non-Way) and had also invited our local WC to the get together. When we mentioned that we would be having wine and beer at the social they told us under no uncertain terms were we to have alcohol at the get together. The same thing happened later when we were having a branch-wide dinner. We wanted to serve wine with dinner and were told we couldn't. I guess they don't trust us to be respectable. Or maybe they are afraid they can't control themselves around alcohol and may end up saying some things they shouldn't.

Who exactly is "The Living Word" speaking? Is is VPW or LCM? ;)-->

Digi, I think it started out that way. I remember hearing that "exhortation" in my fellowship, but later they started telling people they shouldn't have to use THEIRmoney and gas and time to go buy a money order for YOUR abundant sharing. I thought it was a local thing, but I suppose it wasn't.

I don't recall any verses stating that anyone has a right to know what you do with your money or, much less, tell you how to spend it. Who the he** are they to tell us what we can and can not do? And what schmucks are we to let them? Geez... I get soo peeved thinking about how much power I gave them over my life.

I honestly thought that something horrible was going to happen to me when I first posted at WayDale. I worried about being possessed and worried about my family or leadership knowing that I came here. No one got revelation that I've come here. Nothing horrible has happened to me or anyone in my family. I've not been accused of being possessed, but, I have become really good at wiping that slime off the bathroom mirror. :D--> Once someone comes here it's painfully obvious that they don't want us to come here because they don't want us to know what they're hiding. People are getting more bold and more independent in TWI and the more they talk about not coming here, the more people will come here. I hope they keep coming and that new ones come every day.

I think Mr. Linder voted and maybe one other member of the WAYGB. I voted for #4, but see how people could vote #5 just as easily.

Sadie, are you referring to your experience in live teachings? I specifically remember Craig saying the things that Hope remembers from the taped class with him teaching it. Do you really think that the devil was working in people who did not return or are you being sarcastic? I'm having a hard time reading the tone of voice in your post.

So what I'm hearing you say is that had everyone followed the rules it WOULDN'T have been such an abundant life?

He did teach about Lilith, but it was in context of degrading and poking fun at some other religion that believes in her. He did also basically say that we have to take his word for it (Eve and the devil as a lesbian) if we can't see what he taught. I'll look this week-end and see what the notes in my syllabus say. He used a lot of the words in those verses as hominyms (spelling?) - Example: "good for the eyes" with "eyes" being some Hebrew word that also means "fountain" as in the fountain of juices flowing from a woman's privates or something along those lines.

Sounds like typical TWI double-speak to me. Sounds good on paper, but I can almost hear the crescendo in Craig's voice and him yelling in parts of it and then calm and diplomatic pleading to the emotions in other parts. They are great wordsmiths, those Wayfers.