Stayed Too Long

Having the training and your occupation as a dual diagnostic counselor, goes to show that anyone is subject to the lies and deception of the man you believe has your spiritual interest at heart. The reason GSC is here is to enable people, to once again think for themselves, by offering support from others who have gone through and came out the otherside. Read all that is posted for the past 20+ years to get the support you need.

Welcome. 

12 minutes ago, waysider said:

But I gave joy to my mother
And I made my lover smile
And I can give comfort to my friends when they're hurting
And I can make it seem better for a while.

I agree we contribute to people and events to make our life worthwhile, or it would not be too much fun at all. But that doesn’t seem enough for many people…..They have to become immortal and live forever, instead of being a being a passing September.

By the way I think she has a horrible voice.

5 hours ago, So_crates said:

What makes you think they want to improve? They got your Franklin; they have no motive to improve.

They wouldn't listen to anyone in 1986, what would motivate them to listen to anyone now? The ministry has always been: we give the orders, it's your job to get with the program. And you think they want to improve?

Can you point out a religion that doesn’t operate like TWI? 
Try telling the Pope their is no purgarory? See if he thanks you for pointing out the error and drops purgatory from their catechism? The Pope didn’t take to kindly to Martin Luther telling him indulgences could not be bought and paid.

All groups, religious ones included, have rules that are very difficult to change, TWI didn’t invent brandishing those who went against their beliefs. It happens today still in other religions. 

5 hours ago, waysider said:

My life, it's only a season
A passing September that no one will recall.

 

HERE

Great song to underscore the actual worth of one’s life. It demonstrates how we are but a drop of rain, a spec of sand sweeping through a large desert, or  a small ripple across the mighty oceans, as we venture through our short existence on this planet. Some have the need to be remembered much more than the falling crystal of snow that helped fill a large river.
They donate huge sums of money to have schools named after themselves, pay $5 for a brick with their name engraved on it to be used in making a walkway, or give $millions to be remembered by having their names attached to a newly discovered planet billions of light years away.

Some have the need to be immortalized, and do so by creating a god(s), who were, are, and always will be. They have no beginning and will have no end, and only exude love. Their followers will also become immortal. However, these created god(s) do have their limits, given by those that created them, as to whom they will love, or even allow into their group(s). One group of creators, decided their god would only accept others who believed on the lord Jesus Christ. This Jesus Christ god will only love those, that believed he died and was raised from the dead. But a branch of the JC’s dropped this requirement all together, and proclaimed their JC god will only accept you if you get dunked in the river and are baptized. Another sect of the JC’s only demanded you pray the sinner’s prayer, and you would be welcomed in.

A simple search on the World Wide Web of “gods”, will open a whole world of created beings by those who decided to give up their free wiil thinking, and submit to made up creations.

1 hour ago, waysider said:

Easy's Gettin' Harder Every Day.

I think the song covers very well the saying, “Life’s a bit** and then you marry one.” Not much to look forward to, eh?

Trying to keep up with all the religions of the world can also get harder everyday. Which one will you follow to ensure you get to cross into the pearly gates? Or is it purgatory, first? It is just so complicated anymore.

When people have to face an uncomfortable situation they create some kind of spiritual outcome to deal with their uneasy feelings. Prior to the 1990’s, when a pet died they were buried and that was the end of it. Then, to make grieving “pet parents” feel better, the Rainbow Bridge concept was introduced. Now, not only will grieving “pet parents” see their dead relatives in the future, but they will also be reunited with their deceased dogs, cats, turtles, birds, rabbits, worms, or any pet they owned who died. 

I can see how the concept of being reunited with dead ones came to be. Overtime, the grief of being away from deceased family became too much to bear. And the belief of being reunited with one’s loving relatives was born. Of course, for some reason, there were caveats thrown in. If Christian, and depending on which religion you followed, some family members might not meet you in the air. If RC, hope and pray your did not die with a mortal sin on your soul, because you will suffer life eternal with the devil. If you were of the belief one had to confess Roman 10:9&10, and your brother Andy didn’t confess, you can forget seeing him again. If your family worships Islam, the best you can get is 27 Virgins wating for you. I am sure there are religions you and I have never heard, who have their own rules for seeing lost loved ones.

The hereafter world is sure getting more and more complicated and crowded.
 

1 hour ago, chockfull said:

If the Bible contains accurate accounts then all the stories aren’t people living principles perfectly.  Paul’s conversion flipped his script dramatically.   This could just be another story about girls taking the bloodline too seriously and doing some twisted shiz as a result.

Please explain your logic in claiming it means something different.  Or that it’s all fictional.

In your previous post you stated you were not interested in proving if the bible could be interpreted correctly. You said it would only be an argument.

Personally, I didn’t believe we were arguing, but having a conversation, expressing differing opinions. If you would like to have a conversation about our differing views of the bible, I am all for it. But if you believe it will only lead to an argument, or lead to you not bring interested in further discussion, let’s end the post here.

12 hours ago, Rocky said:

It seems to me, both STL and you (NathanJr) made good points. It also seems to me this is only an issue in Western Civilization because of Christianity being the dominant way society frames the issue. Then again, in Islamic regions of the world, people who don't believe in Islam and Allah are infidels, right?

IOW, it's all in how the society in which you live looks at it.

Rocky that is a good conclusion. At least in Christian and Islamic countries, a non believing person has a label placed on them.

15 hours ago, chockfull said:

My logic is that God breathed doesn’t mean the same thing as when VP was hyperventilating over it.

Sorry for previously missing your logic in determining what God breathed is. To summerize, if VPW interpreted the scripture to mean XYZ, you would interpret it to mean ABC?  How do you know it should not be accurately interpreted to mean GHI? 
 

All I am attempting to show is that, depending on the mind set of the interpreter, a verse can mean anything whatsoever. Thus, it is not possible to apply an accurate interpretation.

 Inspiration still allows the artist leeway in producing the end product.  A judge bent on punishment will have a fundamentalist hard line interpretation of “Theo pneustos” that wants to catch the believer in a trap.  It sounds more like your reading into the meaning and demand for answers.  What made you decide that your interpretation of God breathed is the only correct one?  Please choose any number of scriptures to show why your view is uniquely right and clarify what that view is please.

I read an article recently asking why there even has to be a term for anyone not believing in god? If you don’t believe in the tooth fairly or santa clause there is no name applied to your unbelief. 

1 hour ago, chockfull said:

Maybe the story is in there to show that manipulating godly appearing results through ungodly methods doesn’t work.  People are just tricking themselves.  What you sow you reap.

“Maybe the story is in there to show…..”. Again, is your “maybe” about what the scripture means, any better than someone elses “maybe?” Please explain your logic determining that, “Maybe the story is there to show that manipulating godly appearing results r thtough ungodly methods doesn’t work,” please?

36 minutes ago, chockfull said:

My logic is that God breathed doesn’t mean the same thing as when VP was hyperventilating over it.  Inspiration still allows the artist leeway in producing the end product.  A judge bent on punishment will have a fundamentalist hard line interpretation of “Theo pneustos” that wants to catch the believer in a trap.  It sounds more like your reading into the meaning and demand for answers.  What made you decide that your interpretation of God breathed is the only correct one?  Please choose any number of scriptures to show why your view is uniquely right and clarify what that view is please.

I do not  believe any view of the bible is correct because it has no relevence in our lives. It has good ideas just as any book would, but it is of absolutely no authority other than containing good ideas. To base one’s life’s beliefs on what it dictates is, IMHO, a real mistake. As you so well point out, it is of any interpretation that the reader wants to apply to it. A judge bent on punishment, will according to you, have an interpretation other than someone else will have. There in lies the problem; it can be interpreted anyway someone wants to.

To me VPW’s  interpretation of the bible is as valid as any ones. There are over 45,000 Christian religions worldwide today. Which interpretation is accurate?  Then throw in Baha'i, Buddhism, Hinduism, Islam, Jainism, Judaism, Shintoism, Sikhism,Taoism, and Zoroastrianism. What is wrong with their interpretation of who God is?

No where have I stated my view of the scriptures is uniquely right. To me the bible belongs in the library filed under fiction. Fiction books have good ideas, and may be entertaining, but contain no rules to live life by.

You have not stated what your logic is when determining if a given scripture is, or is not, God breathed?

On 3/4/2023 at 2:58 PM, chockfull said:

Yeah I’m gonna side on the “not God breathed” side of that one.  Whatever that means.

Maybe some jack Mormons can get inspired by it lol

 

What is your logic when deciding which scriptures are God breathed and which are not God breathed? What made you decide  this verse is not God breathed? Please chose a scripture from the bible and tell why it is God breathed?

The greatest secret in the world today, is that man created God, not that God created man. For some unknown reason man has given his creation crazy powers over himself. Man has equiped God with the authority to cast man into the eternal fires of hell. This made up God, also has even been given the power to even judge man’s personal thoughts. 
Of course, it totally depends on which parts of the world man lives, as to what the made up rules are that must be followed. If one comes from the Middle East, Alluh demands that all infidels be killed that ignore his nonexistent powers. Also woman must be covered from head toe, except for a small slit around her eyes, so she might avoid bumping into everything,  as she walks, always being escorted by a male relative. And the male is looking forward to his death, so he will have 70 virgins at his disposal. What happens when the women are no longer virgins, is not known?

People who reside in the America’s, are thankful their God somehow impregnated a virgin (are virgins a recurring theme in the minds of men who have madeup their God)? Within a few years of this son being born, God demanded his son suffer unimaginable tortures, and be murdered by hanging on a cross until dead. If this God performed these unexplainable acts today, he would at the least, be in prison the rest of his forever life, or his forever life, somehow ended.

These are only two of the versions of these Gods, as there are many, many versions of this fraudulent God in the world today, so one can pick which one they want to control their lives.

Sam Pruyn on YouTube.

Stevie Kay music on youtube.

On 7/17/2021 at 11:32 AM, Twinky said:

My friend is the safeguarding officer at a big church.  There have been over the years various issues.  What exactly do you do with the paedophile in your congregation?  The rapist?  The man who beats his wife?  Especially if the victim is also a member of the same congregation!

The church recognises that ALL are sinners.  ALL of us have sins; some are more obvious and some are still hidden away.  And so the church continues to welcome these people into the congregation.  Forgiveness, yes, but wisdom too.  There is a price to pay.  Perhaps an abuser may not attend certain services (which the victims attend).  Perhaps an abuser may only attend if someone else (a nominated person) is also there. I don't know all the rules for ordinary congregants, I only know that each case is determined on its own circumstances.  And every care is taken to ensure the safety of vulnerable people, of victims. The diocese would deal with abusive clergy; there are other rules for such.   

Safeguarding is taken very seriously these days.  Pretty much all churches have safeguarding policies which are openly available on their websites.  Nominated persons are named, with contact details.  Anyone who has any contact in a leadership-type capacity with children or vulnerable adults has to get a police-type clearance certificate from the Disclosure and Barring Service.  (This doesn't apply just to churches.)

Where is TWI's safeguarding policy?  I don't see a link on their website.  Anyway, it'd probably still be the foxes in charge of the henhouse.

Nor does CFFM appear to have a safeguarding policy.

What do you think of the law that requires all sexual abusers and violent offenders to register with the State they live in of their current addresses and the crimes they have committed? Their offenses are made available to anyone who does a search of offenders. They cannot live within a certain distance from schools and cannot hang out where children congregate. 
If I had children and these preditors showed up as one of my neighbors, you can bet I would instruct mt kids to keep away from them, and I would watch them like a hawk.

59 minutes ago, T-Bone said:

I recall LCM saying that in many an after-meeting when I was in residence…but often he dealt with our more immediate concerns – like sleep deprivation – about which he liked to quip something like you’ll get to sleep all you want in heaven…

I think that must have been the double secret way corps principle and it even had a retemory verse:

…the wicked…cannot rest... Isaiah 57:20

 yeah that way corps program was wicked alright...

…all praise to him who lets me sleep zzzzZZZZ zzz   ZZZzzz

 

I recall hearing Howard Allen saying we only needed 3 to 4 hours of sleep a night. I don’t know if that was all the sleep he managed every night, but I certainly could not function on such little sleep. Is that all the rest the corps received each night?

3 hours ago, waysider said:

Did you mean to post this in THIS forum?

Good one! I should have looked at the forums more closely. Lol.

My wife is a RC and her priest is retiring soon and will be provided housing and living expenses for life. Does anyone know if TWI their retired workers are taken care of for life? 
I am just not referring to the BOD, but those who spent their lives on the field in whatever capacity as directed by TWI?

On 3/12/2023 at 3:28 PM, cman said:

Seems to me the things thought foolish might be looked into a bit further if seeking spiritual understanding. Reminds me of vpw being against spiritualism, could be that he never understood 

I spent over 20 years looking into seeking spiritual understanding via TWI.  You can argue they are a cult, were a counterfit, and only their only interest was promoting VPW’s sex life. But I spent 9 years with the RC’s and a few years with a local church seeking spiritual understanding, but always came up empty. Why wasn’t I seeing so called signs, miracles, and wonders? Maybe 1 person being raised from the dead or 1 person with AIDS being cured would have convinced me there really was spiritual understanding. I never even saw a cold cured in 30 years.
 

I did see TWI leaders killed in a car accident, but didn ‘t see them brought back to life. Our fellowship followed the WOW handbook and barely saw any results. My best friend was a RC believer, but died young from cancer. We prayed and prayed for him to be cured, but he died. I gave 15% of my money to the church for God to bless me financially, but only found myself 15% poorer.
 

When I compare actual life to what the bible says it should be, the bible comes up short. I had no choice but to accept reality, and forget about god, at least the one in the bible. I have been apart of seances, levitations, and operating ouija boards, that didn’t require any training or praying to perform them. We just decided to do them and they produced results. That is the best I can compare  to spiritual understanding.

On 4/3/2023 at 9:51 AM, Mike said:

I have learned a full one percent of the population is afflicted with this disease.  I also learned that there is very little known about schizophrenia, and that there is no chemical test for it; only the hunch of a psychiatrist can be obtained as a diagnosis.

 

Doctors rely on much more than a hunch when diagnosing schizophrenia. Although there is no test that can be performed in a laboratory to determine its existence, there are well defined symptoms that define the disease, as set forth in this article.

https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/how-is-schizophrenia-diagnosed

9 hours ago, cman said:

Is that what really happened? Previous teachings and learning should be looked at with some reason, logic and intellect.

That is my understanding of what really happened. Please provide the previous teachings and learning that should be looked at with some reason, logic, and intellect. Thank you.