People seem to me to be overly worried about so called Grease Spot outsiders suddenly coming here and some how not upholding to Christian teachings about Jesus Christ. Below is a link to a teaching that I have shared with some of the Grease Spot posters.
For your information Refiner read this article and said he really liked it. Thought it was excellent. People need to understand that there are people, such as Refiner, who don't disagree with the spirit of Jesus Christ. Rather they disagree with the fundamentalist views of many of todays Christian leaders. Frankly, I agree with this assessment. In fact, like Refiner, I too do not agree with many of the so called fundamentalist views of scripture. Some are even based on down right ignorance of what the bible actually teaches about Jesus Christ. My main point of contention with them is that they seem to have lost the spirit of the teachings and replaced this with a brand of legalism. Furthermore, like in TWI, they seem to think they have a superior knowledge of the scriptures compared to others. Such ignorance should be rather obvious as the bible teaches repeatedly that only the meek will know and understand the spiritual things of God.
P-Mosh, Your suggestions about "What should be done" were very good suggestions IMO.
Thanks. I just wanted to throw some ideas out there.
quote:Originally posted by Psalm 71 one:
But something has been changing for quite awhile, and I can't quite put my finger on it. (By awhile I mean more than a year). More and more "anti Christ" posts have been made, and with more of an edge. More ridicule, more derogatory. I will say it again. I am fully aware that this site is not a christain site. Paw has always made that very clear. Something is different. And not for the better.
While I do understand where you are coming from, I see it from the other side as well. TWI is a Christian organization, and to me, it represents a lot that I see wrong with Christianity. The churches I attended with other family members growing up were just as bad, whether Baptist, Methodist, Catholic, Lutheran, or whatever. I also feel that my time in TWI made me aware enough of the bible to be able to determine what I feel is wrong or right about it.
The point I am trying to make is that what some people consider to be the sins of TWI, I consider all of Christianity to be guilty of to some degree. I also fail to see a difference in believing in Jehovah and believing in Zeus. I also find it somewhat offensive when I hear people using "America" and "God" in the same sentence because it feels like they are trying to impose Christianity on me or our country (which the founding fathers seemed to want to keep religion and government seperated.)
On the other hand I try not to be offensive in my posts when I discuss those things unless someone else is being so first. I don't think Refiner was being offensive when he posted "Why I reject Jesus" or whatever the original name was. The part where he said that the bible is B.S. was after a long argument had occurred, so although it was without tact and unfriendly, I do think he was responding in kind to how he was treated. I can't blame him for what he said without first blaming the others who participated in the argument on that thread.
quote:Originally posted by Psalm 71 one:
When a relatively new poster comes in and titles a thread with what to me was a VERY offensive title, and gets all sorts of support and backslaps, and then a poster who's been here for years states publically that she is offended by that, and is choosing to leave, and She's the one who (I know--IMO) is the one who gets lambasted--I say hmmmm. Something has changed-- and not for the better.
I think that what happened with Dot leaving was unfortunate. Also, I think that the reason Refiner got support was because it seemed like cowgirl was picking a fight with him and the girl from Oz. In fact it seems like some folks support their right to post, but vehemently disagree with Refiner at least, such as Raf.
Psalmie: I appreciate what you said, but it looks like few want to listen.
You know, so many people have asked, "Why didn't the 'good' leaders in TWI step in and confront VPW?" That's easy to ask after the fact. Most folks were so blissfully ignorant about what was going on that they didn't even want to hear that things might not be all WOWburgers and fries.
I'm afraid that unless people actually start to examine what's been going on, and take steps to correct it, they'll have simply traded one blind trust for another. Cripes, after Victor Paul Wierwille, you'd think we'd know better than to create an unquestionable Victor Paw Tucket in his image. I know he doesn't want that, and we shouldn't want it either.
Paw does have to lead the way through better moderation. Yet he can only delegate so much of that. The rest of us have to follow the example he sets and exercise self-restraint so that the Mods won't have to police this place 24/7. No, we don't have to all hold the exact same views, ideas, or beliefs, but we should hold the same manners.
I don't know where I have been lately but I guess I totally missed the controversy here. I very seldom read much of the OPEN posts so I missed the REFINER & OZ posts. The threads they posted to didn't catch my interest so I didn't open them.
After reading a few of their posts I went to their JW site and frankly I enjoyed their open and uncensored format. Maybe we can learn a little from them?
I guess us Ex-Wayfers think of ourselves as kind of special and that is OK, but a cult is a cult and by any other name smells just as bad.
EDIT - Sorry, but this may not be the proper thread for this comment.
As Zix correctly pointed out earlier, "Good" and "bad" posters have come and gone from the little cafe in cyberspace. When "good" posters leave, most of us feel sad because of there departure, and hope that they leave for the best of reasons. It is tragic when good posters leave because they think that there is too much B.S. going on. We have also seen that elequence of speech, many words and/or posts and obsure and/or credible references does not nessasarily make a view point correct.
Some people here have lost the ability to agree to dis-agree with a view point, and simply move on.
Debate is a good thing. Of course debate is at it's best when both side will actually think about the differing view.
It's almost funny...
It almost seems that the politics forums are becoming more "civil" than the open and twi forums (granted, there will always be an exception).
When a relatively new poster comes in and titles a thread with what to me was a VERY offensive title, and gets all sorts of support and backslaps,
Psalmie, I guess we see it differently (not much, just a little). What I saw was Refiner getting "all sorts of support and backslaps" NOT for his thread that offended, but for being attacked for having different views and (IMO) not being TWI. I don't think anyone "gave him all sorts of support and backslaps" because of his post. Some may have agreed with it, some disagreed. I saw folks (again IMO) "defending him" against the thought police. The way he was treated was so TWI-ish. I don't have to agree with what he says to agree with his right to be here. I wasn't put off by his "in your face" style of posting, but some were. I don't agree with the nastiness of some of his posts either. I told him that via PT. I warned him also that he needed to tone his style down a bit as that sort of display doesn't go over too well here. He was reacting to being attacked but that's no excuse to get nasty and I told him so. I understand, but it's not "how we do things here". We try to get along with each other even though we disagree about things.
quote:Psalmie said:
...and then a poster who's been here for years states publically that she is offended by that, and is choosing to leave, and She's the one who (I know--IMO) is the one who gets lambasted--I say hmmmm. Something has changed-- and not for the better.
Yes, but she also stated that she wasn't happy with herself for not "taking a stand" when other posters had posted "anti-Christian" sentiments and that now she felt she must. (at least that's what I got out of it) She is doing what she feels she needs to and that is her choice. She will be missed. BUT I didn't see any "she's the one who gets lambasted!"... Refiner posted about her on another board and that wasn't "fair" and he apologized for it (I know, the horse was already out of the barn)... but I didn't see anyone else "lambasting". What did I miss? I've seen nothing but support for her posted.
Yes, things change... that's the nature of this board isn't it? We grow, we change, we (hopefully) are different than we were a month or a year ago... but to cite that "she got lambasted" and then infer that was one of the changes is unfair. There was only the one post and it wasn't even posted "here" until someone went and got it. Her leaving has stirred emotions and I care for her more than you or others know... but it's her choice to leave to a "Christian" board. And folks are reacting emotionally because they care for her (IMO). but if she truly wants to be on a "Christian" board she's not coming back here even if the outsiders leave. I wish her the best. But I do not blame Refiner or GFO or any other poster for her leaving or anyone else leaving for that matter.
GSC is a community, a neighborhood filled (mostly) with folks of a common background in TWI. But it's also filled with folks who are EX-culties. Again, I'll quote from the last paragraph in the "About Us" section of this site: You may get caught in a food fight now and then, but unlike TWI, GreaseSpot Cafe is a place where questions are encouraged and people make up their own minds.
Psalmie: I appreciate what you said, but it looks like few want to listen.
You know, so many people have asked, "Why didn't the 'good' leaders in TWI step in and confront VPW?" That's easy to ask after the fact. Most folks were so blissfully ignorant about what was going on that they didn't even want to hear that things might not be all WOWburgers and fries.
I'm afraid that unless people actually start to examine what's been going on, and take steps to correct it, they'll have simply traded one blind trust for another. Cripes, after Victor Paul Wierwille, you'd think we'd know better than to create an unquestionable Victor Paw Tucket in his image. I know he doesn't want that, and we shouldn't want it either.
Paw does have to lead the way through better moderation. Yet he can only delegate so much of that. The rest of us have to follow the example he sets and exercise self-restraint so that the Mods won't have to police this place 24/7. No, we don't have to all hold the exact same views, ideas, or beliefs, but we should hold the same manners.
I wish you'd quit being so manipulative when you post.
You put all that in there and then close with "we don't all have to hold the exact same views, ideas, or beliefs"... which is (IMO) to make it all look and sound nice. IF that's what you really thought, why on earth would you start a thread like this in the first place?
I don't think ANYONE thinks that this place hasn't changed. This place changes as the people in this place change. Some are no longer into "it" or "feel right" here... many do.
I don't appreciate it when someone tries to "herd" the folks in a certain direction like this. One of the things I like here is the diversity of opinion. I do not appreciate subversive posts.
Tom: Funny how you left out the last six words of my post. Funnier still how you can accuse me of being "manipulative" and "subversive" while completely ignoring the whole point of my message. No one's "herding" anyone, Tom. Ask Psalmie and Zshot if what I said affected their own observations in any way they weren't already troubled about. What will you do if they say they never communicated with me about this? Ignore them, too?
So you don't like me, Tom, I get that. Subtlety has never been one of your longsuits. If you'd just look at what I'm saying, rather than what you wish I said, you might come to the same conclusion as all the people who voted "downhill".
Than again, you might not. I'll ask you this, then. Should there be no rules at all here? Should people be free to say whatever they want just so they don't have to take the effort to be polite? Is "censorship" a greater evil than "decency"? Should the Wierwille-worshippers get to accuse his victims of being vicious, character-assassinating liars? Should people be allowed to post gay Jesus porn? How about if we just started calling everyone who disagreed with us a "c**kb****g m*****f****r", 'cause we can? (It's not like we couldn't have said that in TWI, after all. Didn't Martindale use that phrase in a teaching at the Rock one year?)
Or perhaps maybe, just maybe, it's worth watching what we say for the sake of a little more peace? Accepting responsibility for what we say instead of hiding behind some "right" to say it?
Zixar, I quoted your post in it's entirety and left no words out... later I wanted to comment on the part that I found in contradiction to your thread.
quote:Zixar said:
So you don't like me, Tom, I get that. Subtlety has never been one of your longsuits. If you'd just look at what I'm saying, rather than what you wish I said, you might come to the same conclusion as all the people who voted "downhill".
You're wrong about how I feel about you...(like or not like, I don't even know you)... but I don't like it when I feel you (or anyone else) is trying to manipulate people. We have opposing views on some things, other things we have the same views on... this one we're opposed on I guess. Doesn't mean I don't like you.
You're right, I've never been accused of being subtle.
There you go again... If I would only look at what you are saying... how others have voted... THEN I might SEE...!! There's hope! NO... Zixar, I'd still see how YOU thought, and how THEY thought.. BUT it doesn't mean it's how I have to think. BECAUSE I DON'T THINK IT HAS gone downhill or jumped the shark.
NOW you take the stance that I disagree with the last six words (which were "we should hold the same manners") because I didn't comment on them???
VERY GOOD ZIXAR! Get the people thinking that I want a wild free for all here with nastiness and rudeness and no common decency! But that's not what I said nor what I believe... BUT YOU'VE PUT IT OUT THERE FOR THE GOOD FOLKS TO SEE!
If you've read any of my posts concerning "the outsiders" I've always been in favor of decency and good will and common courtesy. I've posted that here. I've posted that to the outsiders in private topics.
quote:Zixar said:
Or perhaps maybe, just maybe, it's worth watching what we say for the sake of a little more peace? Accepting responsibility for what we say instead of hiding behind some "right" to say it?
So now your crusade is "people posting nicely with respect for each other"... if that's it... I'm there with you.
If it's your attempt to manipulate others and sling mud all over the place... count me out.
It's not like I can read your mind, Tom. You were the one who created this whole "mud-slinging"/"manipulative" song and dance, and then you try to blame ME for it. That's a a classic example of building a strawman. Then, you get all bent because I called you on chopping up the last sentence so you could take the rest out of its context? I don't see how you can honestly talk about my supposedly being manipulative when you're doing that sort of thing.
Well... I didn't chop or get bent... it was my feeling that you were trying to bully people into something... that's all. And I felt I had to speak up about it.
If I was wrong about that, then I was wrong. But that's what I felt was going on.
Okay, so when I speak up about something, I'm bullying people. What is it called when you speak up about something, then?
Doesn't it bother you that so many people feel GreaseSpot has changed for the worse? Don't you want to do something about it, if you can? As you should be able to tell, it bothered me plenty, yet when I spoke up about it, some [expletive deleted] got so bent out of shape over a mere figure of speech that the whole thing became a joke, and not a very funny one at that.
Guess we need a new term, because "snowconing" a thread isn't meant to be malicious.
Well I guess it's semantics then maybe. But I didn't think you just "spoke up about something"... I felt you did more than that... look at the words I highlighted from your post above... those words (I felt) were meant to sway and grab at people's emotions...
and yes, there are people who feel that it's "going downhill"... there are also quite a few people that don't think that... so... we all have different opinions...
I just think that if you only wanted to "speak up" about something you wouldn't have phrased things the way you did... grabbing at people's emotions...
Why do you almost always have to "take shots" at people who disagree with you? That's something you need to look into IMO.
Zixar, it is real simple. If you want Grease Spot Cafe to be better come up with better posts. Either that or we can start offering you cheese with that whine of yours.
I do have to say for all your complaining, in the days in question you didn't alert me on any problem posts.... You want to see it made better then follow the suggestion I made ages ago, alert me about a problem. It is far better than complaining days later.
Wordwolf and a number of others have been vitally helpful in alerting me.
Paw: I reported Chuck's BS post on July the 4th. It was still there yesterday. Don't push this off on me. Apparently there are quite a few people in that "silent majority" you spoke of that don't report posts either, but are still unhappy with what's been going on. This is hardly just between you and me.
I didn't know what happened to Dot until she emailed me. You want to know why I haven't just left this place over it? Because unless something is done about it, you'll have more casualties just like her. I didn't see it coming, maybe you didn't see it coming, but we can see it now, right? Dot Matrix was not an acceptable loss. In hindsight, we both should have done something, but that's water over the dam now. In foresight, it will happen again if there isn't more consistent and timely moderation of the site.
Whose job is it to moderate this place if it's not yours? The poll was not loaded, no matter what anyone might say. I already told you what I expected to happen and was just as surprised at the outcome. Dmiller's poll is showing even worse results at the moment. Have you considered for the tiniest of moments that while a lot of people are all sweetness and light to your face, others may not have the guts to disagree with you publicly? It's not the polls' fault, Paw. No matter how ....ed you are at me, I only voted once. There are always going to be some malcontents and troublemakers in every crowd, so you're never going to get a 100% approval rating. That's just normal. But when two anonymous polls show that at least ten other folks aren't happy, even given the small sample size, it's time to do something.
Using your anti-son-of-a-bitch stick on me will still leave you with at the very least nine unrelated people disappointed in what this site has become. If it is a representative sample though, you've got a lot bigger problem.
Fires are always the easiest to put out when they're small.
Zixar, I am sure that Paw or one of the other moderators will look at the posts in question. I am sure they will be very fair and unbiased. However, when they reach a decision on them and if it is not favorable with your point of view, then you need accept their decision just like if it was favorable with your point of view.
Other than that, if you want a better Grease Spot Cafe start making better posts. Why don't you start an astronomy thread? If you do I will participate.
"Zixar, it is real simple. If you want Grease Spot Cafe to be better come up with better posts. Either that or we can start offering you cheese with that whine of yours"
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People seem to me to be overly worried about so called Grease Spot outsiders suddenly coming here and some how not upholding to Christian teachings about Jesus Christ. Below is a link to a teaching that I have shared with some of the Grease Spot posters.
http://www.waychrist.com/Lordship_JC.htm
For your information Refiner read this article and said he really liked it. Thought it was excellent. People need to understand that there are people, such as Refiner, who don't disagree with the spirit of Jesus Christ. Rather they disagree with the fundamentalist views of many of todays Christian leaders. Frankly, I agree with this assessment. In fact, like Refiner, I too do not agree with many of the so called fundamentalist views of scripture. Some are even based on down right ignorance of what the bible actually teaches about Jesus Christ. My main point of contention with them is that they seem to have lost the spirit of the teachings and replaced this with a brand of legalism. Furthermore, like in TWI, they seem to think they have a superior knowledge of the scriptures compared to others. Such ignorance should be rather obvious as the bible teaches repeatedly that only the meek will know and understand the spiritual things of God.
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TheInvisibleDan
I have two tvs in my living room.
It wouldn't surprise me if Red's a long lost
relative....
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Mister P-Mosh
Thanks. I just wanted to throw some ideas out there.
While I do understand where you are coming from, I see it from the other side as well. TWI is a Christian organization, and to me, it represents a lot that I see wrong with Christianity. The churches I attended with other family members growing up were just as bad, whether Baptist, Methodist, Catholic, Lutheran, or whatever. I also feel that my time in TWI made me aware enough of the bible to be able to determine what I feel is wrong or right about it.
The point I am trying to make is that what some people consider to be the sins of TWI, I consider all of Christianity to be guilty of to some degree. I also fail to see a difference in believing in Jehovah and believing in Zeus. I also find it somewhat offensive when I hear people using "America" and "God" in the same sentence because it feels like they are trying to impose Christianity on me or our country (which the founding fathers seemed to want to keep religion and government seperated.)
On the other hand I try not to be offensive in my posts when I discuss those things unless someone else is being so first. I don't think Refiner was being offensive when he posted "Why I reject Jesus" or whatever the original name was. The part where he said that the bible is B.S. was after a long argument had occurred, so although it was without tact and unfriendly, I do think he was responding in kind to how he was treated. I can't blame him for what he said without first blaming the others who participated in the argument on that thread.
I think that what happened with Dot leaving was unfortunate. Also, I think that the reason Refiner got support was because it seemed like cowgirl was picking a fight with him and the girl from Oz. In fact it seems like some folks support their right to post, but vehemently disagree with Refiner at least, such as Raf.
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Zixar
Psalmie: I appreciate what you said, but it looks like few want to listen.
You know, so many people have asked, "Why didn't the 'good' leaders in TWI step in and confront VPW?" That's easy to ask after the fact. Most folks were so blissfully ignorant about what was going on that they didn't even want to hear that things might not be all WOWburgers and fries.
I'm afraid that unless people actually start to examine what's been going on, and take steps to correct it, they'll have simply traded one blind trust for another. Cripes, after Victor Paul Wierwille, you'd think we'd know better than to create an unquestionable Victor Paw Tucket in his image. I know he doesn't want that, and we shouldn't want it either.
Paw does have to lead the way through better moderation. Yet he can only delegate so much of that. The rest of us have to follow the example he sets and exercise self-restraint so that the Mods won't have to police this place 24/7. No, we don't have to all hold the exact same views, ideas, or beliefs, but we should hold the same manners.
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OnionEater
I don't know where I have been lately but I guess I totally missed the controversy here. I very seldom read much of the OPEN posts so I missed the REFINER & OZ posts. The threads they posted to didn't catch my interest so I didn't open them.
After reading a few of their posts I went to their JW site and frankly I enjoyed their open and uncensored format. Maybe we can learn a little from them?
I guess us Ex-Wayfers think of ourselves as kind of special and that is OK, but a cult is a cult and by any other name smells just as bad.
EDIT - Sorry, but this may not be the proper thread for this comment.
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Zshot
I am tending to agree with Psalmie and Zix here.
As Zix correctly pointed out earlier, "Good" and "bad" posters have come and gone from the little cafe in cyberspace. When "good" posters leave, most of us feel sad because of there departure, and hope that they leave for the best of reasons. It is tragic when good posters leave because they think that there is too much B.S. going on. We have also seen that elequence of speech, many words and/or posts and obsure and/or credible references does not nessasarily make a view point correct.
Some people here have lost the ability to agree to dis-agree with a view point, and simply move on.
Debate is a good thing. Of course debate is at it's best when both side will actually think about the differing view.
It's almost funny...
It almost seems that the politics forums are becoming more "civil" than the open and twi forums (granted, there will always be an exception).
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Zixar
Well, someone finally removed the "bull****" post, so that's a step in the right direction.
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Tom Strange
Yes, things change... that's the nature of this board isn't it? We grow, we change, we (hopefully) are different than we were a month or a year ago... but to cite that "she got lambasted" and then infer that was one of the changes is unfair. There was only the one post and it wasn't even posted "here" until someone went and got it. Her leaving has stirred emotions and I care for her more than you or others know... but it's her choice to leave to a "Christian" board. And folks are reacting emotionally because they care for her (IMO). but if she truly wants to be on a "Christian" board she's not coming back here even if the outsiders leave. I wish her the best. But I do not blame Refiner or GFO or any other poster for her leaving or anyone else leaving for that matter.
GSC is a community, a neighborhood filled (mostly) with folks of a common background in TWI. But it's also filled with folks who are EX-culties. Again, I'll quote from the last paragraph in the "About Us" section of this site: You may get caught in a food fight now and then, but unlike TWI, GreaseSpot Cafe is a place where questions are encouraged and people make up their own minds.
Unlike TWI.
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Tom Strange
You put all that in there and then close with "we don't all have to hold the exact same views, ideas, or beliefs"... which is (IMO) to make it all look and sound nice. IF that's what you really thought, why on earth would you start a thread like this in the first place?
I don't think ANYONE thinks that this place hasn't changed. This place changes as the people in this place change. Some are no longer into "it" or "feel right" here... many do.
I don't appreciate it when someone tries to "herd" the folks in a certain direction like this. One of the things I like here is the diversity of opinion. I do not appreciate subversive posts.
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Zixar
Tom: Funny how you left out the last six words of my post. Funnier still how you can accuse me of being "manipulative" and "subversive" while completely ignoring the whole point of my message. No one's "herding" anyone, Tom. Ask Psalmie and Zshot if what I said affected their own observations in any way they weren't already troubled about. What will you do if they say they never communicated with me about this? Ignore them, too?
So you don't like me, Tom, I get that. Subtlety has never been one of your longsuits. If you'd just look at what I'm saying, rather than what you wish I said, you might come to the same conclusion as all the people who voted "downhill".
Than again, you might not. I'll ask you this, then. Should there be no rules at all here? Should people be free to say whatever they want just so they don't have to take the effort to be polite? Is "censorship" a greater evil than "decency"? Should the Wierwille-worshippers get to accuse his victims of being vicious, character-assassinating liars? Should people be allowed to post gay Jesus porn? How about if we just started calling everyone who disagreed with us a "c**kb****g m*****f****r", 'cause we can? (It's not like we couldn't have said that in TWI, after all. Didn't Martindale use that phrase in a teaching at the Rock one year?)
Or perhaps maybe, just maybe, it's worth watching what we say for the sake of a little more peace? Accepting responsibility for what we say instead of hiding behind some "right" to say it?
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Tom Strange
Zixar, I quoted your post in it's entirety and left no words out... later I wanted to comment on the part that I found in contradiction to your thread.
You're wrong about how I feel about you...(like or not like, I don't even know you)... but I don't like it when I feel you (or anyone else) is trying to manipulate people. We have opposing views on some things, other things we have the same views on... this one we're opposed on I guess. Doesn't mean I don't like you.You're right, I've never been accused of being subtle.
There you go again... If I would only look at what you are saying... how others have voted... THEN I might SEE...!! There's hope! NO... Zixar, I'd still see how YOU thought, and how THEY thought.. BUT it doesn't mean it's how I have to think. BECAUSE I DON'T THINK IT HAS gone downhill or jumped the shark.
NOW you take the stance that I disagree with the last six words (which were "we should hold the same manners") because I didn't comment on them???
VERY GOOD ZIXAR! Get the people thinking that I want a wild free for all here with nastiness and rudeness and no common decency! But that's not what I said nor what I believe... BUT YOU'VE PUT IT OUT THERE FOR THE GOOD FOLKS TO SEE!
If you've read any of my posts concerning "the outsiders" I've always been in favor of decency and good will and common courtesy. I've posted that here. I've posted that to the outsiders in private topics.
So now your crusade is "people posting nicely with respect for each other"... if that's it... I'm there with you.If it's your attempt to manipulate others and sling mud all over the place... count me out.
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Zixar
It's not like I can read your mind, Tom. You were the one who created this whole "mud-slinging"/"manipulative" song and dance, and then you try to blame ME for it. That's a a classic example of building a strawman. Then, you get all bent because I called you on chopping up the last sentence so you could take the rest out of its context? I don't see how you can honestly talk about my supposedly being manipulative when you're doing that sort of thing.
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Tom Strange
Well... I didn't chop or get bent... it was my feeling that you were trying to bully people into something... that's all. And I felt I had to speak up about it.
If I was wrong about that, then I was wrong. But that's what I felt was going on.
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Zixar
Okay, so when I speak up about something, I'm bullying people. What is it called when you speak up about something, then?
Doesn't it bother you that so many people feel GreaseSpot has changed for the worse? Don't you want to do something about it, if you can? As you should be able to tell, it bothered me plenty, yet when I spoke up about it, some [expletive deleted] got so bent out of shape over a mere figure of speech that the whole thing became a joke, and not a very funny one at that.
Guess we need a new term, because "snowconing" a thread isn't meant to be malicious.
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Tom Strange
Well I guess it's semantics then maybe. But I didn't think you just "spoke up about something"... I felt you did more than that... look at the words I highlighted from your post above... those words (I felt) were meant to sway and grab at people's emotions...
and yes, there are people who feel that it's "going downhill"... there are also quite a few people that don't think that... so... we all have different opinions...
I just think that if you only wanted to "speak up" about something you wouldn't have phrased things the way you did... grabbing at people's emotions...
Why do you almost always have to "take shots" at people who disagree with you? That's something you need to look into IMO.
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Tom Strange
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Mister P-Mosh
Snowcones just won't be enough on this thread, we need freaking Coldstone for this one...
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pawtucket
P-Mosh,
I appreciate your input. I will take them into consideration.
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Mark Sanguinetti
Zixar, it is real simple. If you want Grease Spot Cafe to be better come up with better posts. Either that or we can start offering you cheese with that whine of yours.
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pawtucket
Zix,
I do have to say for all your complaining, in the days in question you didn't alert me on any problem posts.... You want to see it made better then follow the suggestion I made ages ago, alert me about a problem. It is far better than complaining days later.
Wordwolf and a number of others have been vitally helpful in alerting me.
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Zixar
Paw: I reported Chuck's BS post on July the 4th. It was still there yesterday. Don't push this off on me. Apparently there are quite a few people in that "silent majority" you spoke of that don't report posts either, but are still unhappy with what's been going on. This is hardly just between you and me.
I didn't know what happened to Dot until she emailed me. You want to know why I haven't just left this place over it? Because unless something is done about it, you'll have more casualties just like her. I didn't see it coming, maybe you didn't see it coming, but we can see it now, right? Dot Matrix was not an acceptable loss. In hindsight, we both should have done something, but that's water over the dam now. In foresight, it will happen again if there isn't more consistent and timely moderation of the site.
Whose job is it to moderate this place if it's not yours? The poll was not loaded, no matter what anyone might say. I already told you what I expected to happen and was just as surprised at the outcome. Dmiller's poll is showing even worse results at the moment. Have you considered for the tiniest of moments that while a lot of people are all sweetness and light to your face, others may not have the guts to disagree with you publicly? It's not the polls' fault, Paw. No matter how ....ed you are at me, I only voted once. There are always going to be some malcontents and troublemakers in every crowd, so you're never going to get a 100% approval rating. That's just normal. But when two anonymous polls show that at least ten other folks aren't happy, even given the small sample size, it's time to do something.
Using your anti-son-of-a-bitch stick on me will still leave you with at the very least nine unrelated people disappointed in what this site has become. If it is a representative sample though, you've got a lot bigger problem.
Fires are always the easiest to put out when they're small.
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Mark Sanguinetti
Zixar, I am sure that Paw or one of the other moderators will look at the posts in question. I am sure they will be very fair and unbiased. However, when they reach a decision on them and if it is not favorable with your point of view, then you need accept their decision just like if it was favorable with your point of view.
Other than that, if you want a better Grease Spot Cafe start making better posts. Why don't you start an astronomy thread? If you do I will participate.
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Mary Cate
Quote from Mark S:
"Zixar, it is real simple. If you want Grease Spot Cafe to be better come up with better posts. Either that or we can start offering you cheese with that whine of yours"
I'll second that.
Zixar,
I like you. Does that make you feel better?
I just think your posts are dumb.
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Mary Cate
And another thing, Zixar...
Aren't you the guy that ran Rocky off?
I'd call that an unacceptable loss.
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