Wordwolf, I don't know, but I do know that only a short time following this time, the LC of Florida TRASHED my husband in a meeting. Spoke of how he didn't believe God, failed to be a good husband and father, lost the fight, let the adversary win and kill him.
I don't know if he also added that he'd lost any rewards because of all of the above, I was not invited to the public thrashing.
I have a big sticker in my Bible that TWI printed, listing what they feel are the 5 "crowns," or rewards for believers at the bema:
THE CROWN INCORRUPTIBLE -- is received for exercising self-control in all disciplined training (whatever THAT means!;)-->)
THE CROWN OF LIFE -- is received for standing approved before God by rightly dividing his Word in our lives (all the time? some of the time? how about once by mistake?)
THE CROWN OF REJOICING -- is received for winning people to the Lord Jesus Christ after we have rightly divided the Word (so it doesn't count if you were Catholic and brought your friend to Sunday school?!)
THE CROWN OF GLORY -- is received by leaders in the body for feeding God's people with His Word (am I only a leader if I run a Twig?)
THE CROWN OF RIGHTEOUSNESS -- is available to all born-again believers who love his appearing (this one's a freebie, but you schmucks have to work for the rest, sorry)
I remember seeing a little "crown counting" going on when I was in. So sad that that branch leader thought he would somehow comfort you -- oh good, I'm glad he was around long enough to get everything... -->
TWI became a one-upmanship by works -- not for salvation, but for crowns!
I'm not sure I believe the TWI teachings about rewards. I used to live in light of the Hope but not anymore. It's to complicated for my simplistic mind.
From your post I gather your husband was a great man. It also sounds like he lived his potential in all areas. Future crowns be Damn. Sounds like he was a CROWN.
quote: I'm not sure I believe the TWI teachings about rewards. I used to live in light of the Hope but not anymore. It's to complicated for my simplistic mind.
Imbus -- --> --> --> --> -->
Perhaps the teachings of twi are hard to understand, but how hard is it to understand the Hope??
Our lives on Earth are like the period, our eternal life is represented by the long dashes. What we do in this brief lifetime DOES have an affect on our eternal life.
I believe there is great comfort in what that Orlando BC said, "Your husband has every single reward, he's got them".
Other Christian ministers teach on rewards because JESUS talked about them in the four gospels (that twi said were for our learning, but NOT addressed to us). We should re-read and learn from THE TEACHER, Jesus the Christ, regardless of what twi taught.
Ya know, it might be easy to agree had the LC then not turned him into creamed soup to the entire state of 'believers'.
This was a man that knew my husband for all of about 5 weeks, and these people that sat there having to listen to his puke...some of them never met him.
Maybe that's what this is about for me. People saying my husband had, didn't have, whatever, rewards.
I never quite understood the teachings on the rewards either.
I do believe that TWI held the rewards over our heads to motivate us towards doing what TWI wanted us to do, not necessarily that which was actually Godly.
God knows our hearts, our lives, our needs and what he wants to bless us with, its all up to him.
We just have to live day to day and let our Heavinly Father bless us as he see's fit, and I don't know one good father on this earth who doesn't want to do for his children.
My husband is a great father, but I know GOD is the best and is capable of more than I can possible even imagine.
Shellon darling ...... I believe your husband is in the best hands he can be in, don't worry he has our Heavenly Father looking out for him, whom I believe loves us unconditionally and is a very understanding and fair God. I believe he wants to bless us all.
Shell you know I don't go to church, but I can still believe in God and that he will do all he can for each and everyone of us.
Mat 5:46 For if ye love them which love you, what reward have ye? do not even the publicans the same?
Mat 6:1 Take heed that ye do not your alms before men, to be seen of them: otherwise ye have no reward of your Father which is in heaven.
Luk 6:35 But love ye your enemies, and do good, and lend, hoping for nothing again; and your reward shall be great, and ye shall be the children of the Highest: for he is kind unto the unthankful and [to] the evil.
Jud 1:11 Woe unto them! for they have gone in the way of Cain, and ran greedily after the error of Balaam for reward, and perished in the gainsaying of Core.
It seems to me that doing good for the sake of rewards is missing the point rather badly.
Nothing ever changes when it comes to religion. The mindless do gooders of Christ's day thought God was going to reward them for all the hard work and discipline they put into their world view.
There are people even now that think God is going to reward them because they helped people get born again or gave money or taught the bible or ran a fellowship or spoke the word or went in the Way Corp or any of that puke they take upon themselves to do because they want to think they are doing Good and right.
I can hear it now, "But Jesus I went witnessing for you thousands of times, I ran a fellowship in my home and help people understand the bible. I prayed with people and helped them get their lives on the right track....bla...bla....bla.."
Of course Jesus will tell them that he didn't ask them to do any of that stuff they took it upon themselves so why should they be rewarded for it? Just like the once upon a time leaders in the future who will claim the same kinda crap, Jesus want even know who they are.
The only people who get rewarded in life are those who participate in it. Life is a gift of love and blessing. What could be more rewarding to God than hearing, "thank you this is the best present ever?" All those idiots who think they are burdened with righting the wrongs and helping the downtrodden and poor think to much of themselves and not enough of God and his gift.
If God has something for me to do He will tell me. If He has something for me to do for someone else He will tell both of us. Otherwise I just enjoy the organic grant from God. I have found it very rewarding especially once I freed myself from the bondage of Herod and the Pharisees or to put it in more modern terms the religious and political dogma of this world.
Thanks Golfie, the LC was and still is, Bob M**ni*an.
The Branch dude was Paul. I always and still feel sorry for him.
My husband was a good man, but no more good than others. I don't believe he earned more rewards than others, earned em quicker or suddenly got something differant when he died. I think he would have enjoyed the father of the year plaque tho. :D-->
This issue does not get to me, really. I just remembered it in the middle of the night and found it interesting in my process that it'd come up suddenly.
I was in twi for about 16 years, with 14 of those years being fully aware that it was feces. I never took everything said, taught, read, suggested seriously.
This might have been a line when words were needed for the widow, a courtesy thing.
Golfie said: Forgive them for they know not what they do. Goey remined us, "love your enemies" that drives them nuts oe else they might change and get blessed
===============================================
I thought about this statement further. I can forgive alot in regards to Bob's death now. I would never have expected that BC or LC to take me aside and say something like "you know, we are going to trash him after about a week or two, lie to you during the entire process and you should get you and your babies out of twi now!"
Both men and many people after did what they were taught to do, what was expected of them to cover their own behinds.
This is not to excuse them, their words or actions, but to understand that the alternative, for them, was not possible.
Forgiveness is not a problem, except for those that were my children's family and choose to deny their existance. That's another thread isn't it?
I can forgive the BC and LC for having mouths that spewed composte, have no balls, cower to a ministry that holds their guts hostage, are cowards sure. That's been done.
It's a shame those twi(t)s don't "do the word" according to those verses Goey posted. They have no fear (real fear - not respect) about having to give an account for their actions. If I had done 1/100th of the things that BC and LC have done I'd be shaking in my boots and trying to set things straight.
Those 2 and their entire families, from what I hear, are the same cold hearted, callous, a$$ kissing, money loving wannabe ministers sucking on the cold hard ti**ies of the head twi(t).
What could possibly have invalidated them so that this was not a
redundant statement?
How could he LOSE a reward?
Wordwolf, I believe we discussed this in the past in the context of folks from TWI (presumably Victor Paul and Craig) and others who royally screwed up, following TWI's teaching that "shall not inherit the kingdom of God" means "no rewards at the gathering." Presumably the evil works destroy (burn?) the rewards, or at least that's how I understand that at this point.
insurgent said: Those 2 and their entire families, from what I hear, are the same cold hearted, callous, a$$ kissing, money loving wannabe ministers sucking on the cold hard ti**ies of the head twi(t).
My feeble little brain has always thought that rewards were in the plus column of the book of life.
You know every single thing ou have done in your life you get to see in front of GOD. THe bad and the rewards those times when GOD said "well done good and faithful servant".
But the rewards aren't going to get you into heaven. Only faith and following Jesus Christ the son of GOD as our savior and redeemer will do that.
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WordWolf
A related question:
What could possibly have invalidated them so that this was not a
redundant statement?
How could he LOSE a reward?
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Shellon
Wordwolf, I don't know, but I do know that only a short time following this time, the LC of Florida TRASHED my husband in a meeting. Spoke of how he didn't believe God, failed to be a good husband and father, lost the fight, let the adversary win and kill him.
I don't know if he also added that he'd lost any rewards because of all of the above, I was not invited to the public thrashing.
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shazdancer
Dear Shellon,
I have a big sticker in my Bible that TWI printed, listing what they feel are the 5 "crowns," or rewards for believers at the bema:
I remember seeing a little "crown counting" going on when I was in. So sad that that branch leader thought he would somehow comfort you -- oh good, I'm glad he was around long enough to get everything...
-->
TWI became a one-upmanship by works -- not for salvation, but for crowns!
Regards,
Shaz
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imbus
Shell,
I'm not sure I believe the TWI teachings about rewards. I used to live in light of the Hope but not anymore. It's to complicated for my simplistic mind.
From your post I gather your husband was a great man. It also sounds like he lived his potential in all areas. Future crowns be Damn. Sounds like he was a CROWN.
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Mary Cate
Crowns--
The only ones I know I have are on my teeth.
Anything else is speculation and is just not relevant, motivating, comforting or anything that I will bother with right now.
Like imbus said - just too complicated.
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frank123lol
I thnk only God knows who gets rewards not twi
Sellon your husband sounded like quite a guy
look forward to meeting him at the return
That is what we comfort one another is we will be in Christ pressence do we need anything more?
Yep twi trying to put a spin on even that
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dmiller
Imbus --
--> 
--> 
--> 
--> 
-->
Perhaps the teachings of twi are hard to understand, but how hard is it to understand the Hope??
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imbus
D,
Maybe what I should have said is that I don't use The Hope as a motivator. I let my moment by moment relationship with God be the drive or energizer.
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Wacky Funster
touche imbus...
absolutely...
I never understood "rewards"...seemed more like a cop out to me than a true love for god and doing service from the heart.
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Golfie
Dear Shellon,
It may be "Providential" or a coincidence, I have been reading a small book (120 pages) A LIFE GOD REWARDS by Bruce Wilkinson.
.------------------------------------------------------------------------->>
Our lives on Earth are like the period, our eternal life is represented by the long dashes. What we do in this brief lifetime DOES have an affect on our eternal life.
I believe there is great comfort in what that Orlando BC said, "Your husband has every single reward, he's got them".
Other Christian ministers teach on rewards because JESUS talked about them in the four gospels (that twi said were for our learning, but NOT addressed to us). We should re-read and learn from THE TEACHER, Jesus the Christ, regardless of what twi taught.
God bless you.
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Shellon
Golfie
Ya know, it might be easy to agree had the LC then not turned him into creamed soup to the entire state of 'believers'.
This was a man that knew my husband for all of about 5 weeks, and these people that sat there having to listen to his puke...some of them never met him.
Maybe that's what this is about for me. People saying my husband had, didn't have, whatever, rewards.
Maybe it doesn't matter
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Tom Strange
Then again, maybe it doesn't matter what some puffed up LC said... you know your husband's heart, so does God...
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Shellon
That's true Tom
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Digitalis
I never quite understood the teachings on the rewards either.
I do believe that TWI held the rewards over our heads to motivate us towards doing what TWI wanted us to do, not necessarily that which was actually Godly.
God knows our hearts, our lives, our needs and what he wants to bless us with, its all up to him.
We just have to live day to day and let our Heavinly Father bless us as he see's fit, and I don't know one good father on this earth who doesn't want to do for his children.
My husband is a great father, but I know GOD is the best and is capable of more than I can possible even imagine.
Shellon darling ...... I believe your husband is in the best hands he can be in, don't worry he has our Heavenly Father looking out for him, whom I believe loves us unconditionally and is a very understanding and fair God. I believe he wants to bless us all.
Shell you know I don't go to church, but I can still believe in God and that he will do all he can for each and everyone of us.
We are his kids
Digi
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Goey
TWI only taught one side of the reward stuff.
Here are some select verses of the other side.
Mat 5:46 For if ye love them which love you, what reward have ye? do not even the publicans the same?
Mat 6:1 Take heed that ye do not your alms before men, to be seen of them: otherwise ye have no reward of your Father which is in heaven.
Luk 6:35 But love ye your enemies, and do good, and lend, hoping for nothing again; and your reward shall be great, and ye shall be the children of the Highest: for he is kind unto the unthankful and [to] the evil.
Jud 1:11 Woe unto them! for they have gone in the way of Cain, and ran greedily after the error of Balaam for reward, and perished in the gainsaying of Core.
It seems to me that doing good for the sake of rewards is missing the point rather badly.
Goey
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early2it
Nothing ever changes when it comes to religion. The mindless do gooders of Christ's day thought God was going to reward them for all the hard work and discipline they put into their world view.
There are people even now that think God is going to reward them because they helped people get born again or gave money or taught the bible or ran a fellowship or spoke the word or went in the Way Corp or any of that puke they take upon themselves to do because they want to think they are doing Good and right.
I can hear it now, "But Jesus I went witnessing for you thousands of times, I ran a fellowship in my home and help people understand the bible. I prayed with people and helped them get their lives on the right track....bla...bla....bla.."
Of course Jesus will tell them that he didn't ask them to do any of that stuff they took it upon themselves so why should they be rewarded for it? Just like the once upon a time leaders in the future who will claim the same kinda crap, Jesus want even know who they are.
The only people who get rewarded in life are those who participate in it. Life is a gift of love and blessing. What could be more rewarding to God than hearing, "thank you this is the best present ever?" All those idiots who think they are burdened with righting the wrongs and helping the downtrodden and poor think to much of themselves and not enough of God and his gift.
If God has something for me to do He will tell me. If He has something for me to do for someone else He will tell both of us. Otherwise I just enjoy the organic grant from God. I have found it very rewarding especially once I freed myself from the bondage of Herod and the Pharisees or to put it in more modern terms the religious and political dogma of this world.
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Golfie
Shellon,
I thought you wrote the BC praised your husband, but the LC slandered him. Was the LC AL by any chance?
Forgive them for they know not what they do. Goey remined us, "love your enemies" that drives them nuts oe else they might change and get blessed.
I wish you well and your family.
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Shellon
Thanks Golfie, the LC was and still is, Bob M**ni*an.
The Branch dude was Paul. I always and still feel sorry for him.
My husband was a good man, but no more good than others. I don't believe he earned more rewards than others, earned em quicker or suddenly got something differant when he died. I think he would have enjoyed the father of the year plaque tho.
:D-->
This issue does not get to me, really. I just remembered it in the middle of the night and found it interesting in my process that it'd come up suddenly.
I was in twi for about 16 years, with 14 of those years being fully aware that it was feces. I never took everything said, taught, read, suggested seriously.
This might have been a line when words were needed for the widow, a courtesy thing.
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Shellon
Golfie said: Forgive them for they know not what they do. Goey remined us, "love your enemies" that drives them nuts oe else they might change and get blessed
===============================================
I thought about this statement further. I can forgive alot in regards to Bob's death now. I would never have expected that BC or LC to take me aside and say something like "you know, we are going to trash him after about a week or two, lie to you during the entire process and you should get you and your babies out of twi now!"
Both men and many people after did what they were taught to do, what was expected of them to cover their own behinds.
This is not to excuse them, their words or actions, but to understand that the alternative, for them, was not possible.
Forgiveness is not a problem, except for those that were my children's family and choose to deny their existance. That's another thread isn't it?
I can forgive the BC and LC for having mouths that spewed composte, have no balls, cower to a ministry that holds their guts hostage, are cowards sure. That's been done.
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insurgent
It's a shame those twi(t)s don't "do the word" according to those verses Goey posted. They have no fear (real fear - not respect) about having to give an account for their actions. If I had done 1/100th of the things that BC and LC have done I'd be shaking in my boots and trying to set things straight.
Those 2 and their entire families, from what I hear, are the same cold hearted, callous, a$$ kissing, money loving wannabe ministers sucking on the cold hard ti**ies of the head twi(t).
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oldiesman
Wordwolf, I believe we discussed this in the past in the context of folks from TWI (presumably Victor Paul and Craig) and others who royally screwed up, following TWI's teaching that "shall not inherit the kingdom of God" means "no rewards at the gathering." Presumably the evil works destroy (burn?) the rewards, or at least that's how I understand that at this point.
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Shellon
insurgent said: Those 2 and their entire families, from what I hear, are the same cold hearted, callous, a$$ kissing, money loving wannabe ministers sucking on the cold hard ti**ies of the head twi(t).
==============================================
Whoa, tell us how you really feel. ROFL
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templelady
My feeble little brain has always thought that rewards were in the plus column of the book of life.
You know every single thing ou have done in your life you get to see in front of GOD. THe bad and the rewards those times when GOD said "well done good and faithful servant".
But the rewards aren't going to get you into heaven. Only faith and following Jesus Christ the son of GOD as our savior and redeemer will do that.
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Shellon
But the rewards aren't going to get you into heaven
==============================================
Thank you
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