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I agree with you in what you are saying here. In a lot of ways the 'life is spiritual' mantra is just an escape route from reality and facing things for TWI members. In that it is like drugs. People have a problem in interpersonal relationships, instead of fixing it they get high. In TWI, when people have a problem with interpersonal relationships, instead of fixing it they just drop back to the mantra 'life is spiritual', label the person they are having problems with as having 'spiritual problems', and cut off communication with them. Voila - problem solved! But in reality, they just push it downstream, as they haven't themselves changed to be able to cope. That's what's wrong with the whole 'mark and avoid' thing, or the modern equivalent - 'probation'. The directors haven't solved their corporate problems, or developed themselves in handling interpersonal relationships. They just issue and edict and voila! This is also why they will continue to get worse and worse over time! Instead of TWI fixing HR policies and problems that are ridiculous, outdated, and something that if anyone in the organization would pursue education in that area they could easily fix, TWI instead looks at the issue as a 'spiritual' problem. The only 'spiritual' problem is in the thickness of some people in high position's skulls. Instead of TWI fixing issues with teachings that are dull, boring and lifeless, they rely on tired policy as if the decision some leader made at a previous time somehow is more tried and true because it has been around. In reality the opposite is true - living corporations thrive on change. Corporations that fail to change go bankrupt, get bought out, disband, fail. "Life is spritual" is a frickin' excuse. It's an excuse for not working to obtain results. It's an excuse for being hard-headed and hard-hearted. It's an excuse for not being humble enough to change when overwhelming evidence dictates it. It's an excuse to allow people a reason to remain a loser. That's right, TWI people - you're a loser. Because you make excuses like 'life is spiritual'. Life is not spiritual. It's hard. For everyone. The only thing spiritual about your life is your personal relationship with your Heavenly Father. That's between you and Him. And if people will stop using that relationship as a justification and take responsibility for the other areas of their life, they'd be far less easily duped by charlatans.

And......The Wahkeena Nature Preserve teaches that life is natural. And......The National Football League teaches that life is football. Imagine that! Twi is in the business of sales and marketing. Every slogan, every cliche, every wierwillism has a market to exploit.......pamplets, books, magazine articles, tapes, t-shirts, music, abs, etc. The MLM machine is churning out yearly themes and catchy phrases to capitalize on....what sticks, what doesn't? How did martindale's "the promised land of the prevailng word" slogan work? How many crossed over into that "promised land" of milk and honey? How much greater were the results?.....more revelation? more deliverance? more abundance? AND, FOUR YEARS LATER......MARTINDALE IS OUSTED FOR SEXUAL PREDATION. Like a barking charlatan, twi is always selling....... Let the buyer beware.... <_<

There is also so very much in "nature" that we don't fully understand, even if we come up with some sort of explanation. And I think there are influences (call 'em spirit if you like) that affect the wider world around us. But not everything is "spirit" influenced. TWI taught us to look for "devil spirits" everywhere and over-spiritualize everything. We know the "theory" of what causes a volcano to erupt. But can we predict it? Or is it an "attack of the adversary" if it happens to take place when (say) a TWI class is about to take place? The theory of plate techtonics (say) is surprisingly recent. Maybe in a couple of hundred years time, human beings will laugh at that as much as we might laugh now at ideas of "humors" in the body. "Common sense"? Well, who invented common sense? God gave a few basic rules to help us get along. Even people with no religion have "common sense." For an organization that prided itself on its ability with personal relationships - TWI was worse than an erupting volcano. The simmering hatred of the outside world manifested itself in TWI in the dramatic explosions from LCM and others. The concept of "spiritual anger" was everywhere. But the Lord's compassion, forgiveness, kindness, and genuine concern was nowhere to be seen. TWI focused on Jesus's confrontation of Pharisees (never even seeing themselves as Pharisees) and never on Jesus's compassion for people. Forgiveness is such a big thing, and one which many of us here have had to (re)learn. There are heaps of threads on the topic. I'm thankful, as are you, OldSkool, for the loving kindness and forgiveness of friends and family and indeed the general public, as damaged relationships are worked through and repaired. It's grace beyond what could be expected from those we have injured. God gave us brains to think things out. And that involves a realistic assessment of what is going on.

How bout this one: "Odd that VP would hear God telling him to shut up, but not to keep his pants zipped."......A quote from Jim ... Simply classic! I couldn't stop laughing!

Well, I am late to the party, but I will say, socks was probably my fav Way Prod. musician - he was wonderful, and since he was a guitar player and an excellent one, I was always watching his fingers as he played his Gibson LP Custom (correct, that's what it was, wasn't it?). When I was in high school and we'd drive to HQ for a weekend in '72, I'd go watch JN rehearse and let Ted know I wanted to be in it someday. I had been playing in "rock" bands through high school and really wanted to be in JN - as did a lot of other young people. Then I went in the corps. I was blessed to be able to be in the corps dance band, and, also, to write music for it. Why did I write music for it? Because it was supposed to be dance/rock music - TWI didn't really have that type of music, so someone had to write it, and I've always been good with coming up with riffs, rockers, etc., so I stepped up and wrote enough to get us through, plus with others that we were able to "rock up" from Way prod recordings. It was a lot of fun. My last year in -res, I was blessed to be picked to run - uh - "coordinate" the corps dance band. We had had an excellent dance band my first year, and so my last year, after the first rehearsal, I did not feel some of the musicians were up to speed and dismissed them and went to H*l*n S*dd*th and told her and asked for some others please. I did this because, in the "world," if a band member wasn't good enough you let him go and found someone who was. It was all done innocently enough. Well, she read me the riot act - and, of course, now, much older and wiser, I don't blame her. I got everyone back, we rehearsed and we got quite good. And I loved seeing these people come alive in a band context and really feel like there was some place in the "impersonal" corps program, where they could shine and be a part of a group that just had fun - lots of fun, no rules, no regs, no bible over the head. They may not have been as good as the first group, but I think I loved them more and had a greater time with them. Wonderful people. When I was on staff at Emporia, me and Rick Panyard (of Good Seed fame and college division) put together the staff Dance band because quite a few staffers played, it was done by ourselves, for the fun of it. It lasted a couple of years and was also great fun. It was all great fun because VPW was not involved. Somehow, this had all slipped under his radar. Then I get to HQ. I said to D. Bailey, let's start a '40s big band, swing thing, the music my dad played, and I loved and grew up with, there are plenty of musicians here to do it. We rounded up people who wanted to, had a rehearsal, had fun, and it sounded great. VP gets wind of it, I later hear he's scrapped it and wants to make it some sappy dinner/supper type thing. We all said no thanks. Then VP wants to do another country band. I was asked to play guitar, said, well, ok. I think it was with people who had been in a group called the Jordan River Ramblers - a forerunner of Way Caravan. Anyway, the bass player leaves, and I am forced to play bass. Ok, I've never played bass, played the scale for each chord, it sounded decent enough. One night, we have to show up at the Minster theater. VP is there wants to watch us play and critique us. It was awful, yells at me because I am not constantly smiling and looked at my guitar as a I was changing a chord. I was not a happy camper. Neither were the rest of the people he railed on. I told Ted, I quit, I don't care what VP thinks. VP comes and finds me next day, says I played great. I'm thinking, what kind of game is this, first you yell, then you say something opposite. I stayed a little while longer and the band shortly thereafter fell apart - thank God. I guess my point is, when we were left to ourselves to do it, bless others and have fun, it was great. But VP took the blessing out of it. By the time I had arrived at HQ I had known for years I did not want to be in Way Prod. It seemed so stifling, it was so controlling, they also had let go some of the best talent because it seemed to me, if someone truly had "charisma" it was a threat, and they would be gone. I liked the people in Way Prod., but to me, the music was always very mediocre, except the early '70s, before VP really starting having a hand in it. From about '76 on, it did nothing for me. Personally, VP was of a different generation. While building the ministry, he let the kids have their fun because it attracted other people to his ministry. Once it had grown, I think is when he really started clamping down and I saw some of the best musicians treated terribly. Socks, I think as time went on, and you had left, there was a JN reunion some years later. You came back, did not have a guitar then, but I did not like the way the Way Prod people were treating you - it was an attitude they had, you were such a wonderful sweet person. Maybe I'm remembering wrong. I think that was the last time I saw or spoke to you. Anyway, that was my experiences on the fringes of Way Prod. I left HQ in the early '80s, went to NYC and played metal, thrash and hardcore for a decade, from CBGB's to every club in NYC and had lots of fun...