Paradiseden

Linda McDuffie (last name spelling??) was ordained. She was a member of an early corps.

Hi Catcup! I have a very similar arrangement with my wife and it has worked for us...22 years and counting. I have a bible meetings on a regular schedule and my wife comes when she wants to. Also, she attends a local church each Sunday. I go to the church every so often because I want to and nearly everyone in the church asks her why I do not come more often (to many scriptural differences although I have taught the scriptures there on several occasions). Many times over the years (mostly in the Way), I have been told I should tell my wife she should do this or that and especially "make" her help me and spend less time attending her church. To this I reply ... hahaha ....why? She loves God and so do I. Our way of doing things in our marriage has and continues to work for us. Like you, we made several agreements BEFORE we got married. One such agreement that we made years ago that has worked for us concerned our kids and our money. Since in my job I make many financial decisions, I always get the final decision in this area. Since she spent/spends many more hours with our children than I do she gets to make the final decision in that area (although many times I try to use my "extended sales communication skills" to get her to see it my way!! She is quick to remind me "You forget, I have taken some of those communication seminars!!! I know what you are doing"). One thing I have learned over the years is that many organizations (both biblical and corporate) and this certainly includes the Way, do not like people who can think for themselves and/or have the mental strength to sometimes question what they are told or what they are told to do. They come across in public saying they encourage it, but the truth is many times, they do not. Ironically, a good number of people who have offered us "advice" on how we should do things in our marriage (that they did not agree with) are now divorced. I am not so insecure that I need to "control" my wife. She is smart and intelligent and she has the same spirit in her that I have in me and I know my scriptural responsibility as a husband and father. Although I have disagreed with her many times over the years, we work it out. Anyway, we all think we are right in our own mind.

For all of you who love Miles of Smiles music, the CD is now available for purchase on eBay. Go to ebay.com....search Wierwille. This music is available as well as a number of other CD's of Way music that has been out of print. Happy listening!!!!

Good News!!! The Miles of Smiles music (CD) will be available soon. I will let you know as soon as I know they are available.

And you think you had a bad hair day. Where is my Mom? She is supposed to catch me. Why isn't that person in front of me moving? My brother said this was going to be fun. Lord, please come back...right now! I thought they said this was a slide down the mountain not a slide off the mountain.

Thanks to all who responded to this topic. I recently purchased a copy of Miles of Smiles on eBay. It happens that a few days after I started this thread, Catcup put one up for auction. Thanks again to all!

There is no way Martindale could ever run a fortune 500 corporation making decisions the way he did as president of the Way. The decision to have all the Way Corps go full time proves when it came to running a corporation he did not know what he was doing. Furthermore, the way he yelled and carried on at times he would have been fired before the ink dried on his first paycheck. The reason he was able to get away with this behavior in the Way was because of the corps structure and he had a lot of "yes men" running around. If they didn't do what he said, he fired them or shipped them to the other side of the country.

Hi. I am looking to purchase a copy of the Miles of Smiles tape/CD by Steve and Bev Strick. Thanks.

Trevor....when I tell my wife how neat and tidy I am. She says "yeah right...I see how neat and tidy you are when I come back from visiting my parents for a week."

This topic gives me a good laugh. My wife and I have been married for 22 years and I still have stuff I want to keep. She has been wanting my stuff moved out of the house for many years. Fortunately, the property where I have my business has a basement. A few years ago, she couldn't take it anymore and ask me to get rid of it (mostly books and magazines). The solution...I simply moved it all to my basement at the building where I have my business. Recently, she was in my basement and saw I have been adding to my "collection." Now she says..... "When are you going to get rid of most of that stuff in your basement. Who's going to get rid of it if Christ does not come back in your lifetime?..... Not Me!!!" I simply thought to myself...like I care (it could all be thrown out in about three hours on a Sunday afternoon) and then I laughed out loud.....hahahahahahahahahahahahahahaahahahaha. She rolled her eyes, shook her head and walked away.

I think the local area took a big hit in the financial area, especially in August. If I remember correctly, the Way did as much business as it could in the local area and not only New Knoxville. During the Rock of Ages there were between 15,000 and 20,000 people in town buying gas, groceries, medical supplies and a whole lot of other camping type products. To small business, having this many people be in town, for some business owners, would make their whole year. The same thing happens today during the Christmas season, for most small business, a good or bad Christmas retail season makes or breaks their whole year. Since I am a small business owner, most people I talk with have no idea how small of a profit margin a small business owner survives on. There isn't any doubt that not having the Rock of Ages during the month of August was a huge financial hit.

The Way going full time was probably one of the greatest mistakes in the history of the Way Ministry. In my opinion, the main reason it was done was the rationalization that if the corps were full time, the ministry would acquire more members (oh...that's right..I forgot...the Way doesn't have any membership) and as a result, the membership would increase and as a result, more people would financially give to the Way because there would be more people "in" the Way. The decision was a disaster from the beginning because it was not "revelation from God" (I know that because I now have the benefit of looking at the results) and many many more previously faithful Way followers left because of it including corps. The whole decision backfired from what it was supposed to do. Expenses increased at a previously unimagined rate and the number of followers did not increase substantially, if at all, to offset the higher expenses. Especially, with all these new staff corps being full time and the salaries that came with their full time status. In addition, during this time,the legalism coming from Way headquarters reached a new all time high. The life of the full time corps and the followers were micromanaged to the point of being ridiculous. Of course, this was all being promoted by Martindale as "the will of God." The reason Martindale was able to make this type of decision provides one more great example of the stupidity involved with how decisions were made and continue to be made at "Way World." Many of the upper leadership there have been on staff for so long they can not really relate as to what is going on in believers (members) lives. "Way World" is what is says....they have a world of their own and many have lived in that environment for so long they continue to make stupid decisions. Inspite of what they say....in many areas it is not based upon the truth of the Word of God but protecting the ministry at all costs ( One great example of this is all the spin that were put out by Way headquarters concerning Martindale's sexual relations with women....that it was a one time happening) even to the point of rationalizing that lying is ok. They say they love the followers. However,their lack of concern (proven by their actions) for the individual believers (members), who are still part of the organization, is a powerful witness to the hyprocrisy that goes on there. Their decisions and respecter of person attitude has hurt thousands. Of course, there aren't many problems with those "in' until they refuse to do what they are told and then they are labeled all sorts of names (ie: not faithful, possessed etc.). Also, the rules are not the same for everyone... it is more.... do as I say not do as I do. As long as many of the old timers are still running "Way World" this is for sure...very little has and will change. What Way headquarters has done a good job about is stopping the leaks and that is why we have very little new information coming to the Greasespotcafe. That having been said, you can be sure of this...it is the same legalistic organization is was a few years ago. Only now, they do not have anyone who can really lead and very few people there feel comfortable in talking about what they really think because of the risk (risk of being kicked out, mark and avoid etc.). This kind of mentality assures any organization of continued failure in the future because everyone is "walking on egg shells" and afraid to bring up ideas that probably would benefit the organization as a whole. Most of the people who could think for themselves have left. The ones who continue to stay in, for the most part, are people who have been blinded by their long term involvement, are relatives/spouses who want out but can't leave yet or are "gravytrainers" who either do not want to have get a real job or are afraid or both.

Having been raised Catholic, I am not a big fan of the Catholic Church. They still practice so much doctrine that is not in the scriptures. For instance: Confessions of sins to a priest to be forgiven. Priests and nuns cannot marry. Saint and statue worship. That what the pope says can be infallible. I thought the Bible said Jesus Christ was the only perfect man. Mortal and venial sins. Limbo and purgatory. Praying to Mary and the rosary. Mary assumed into heaven. Holy water and communion (that is, that the actually turn the bread and wine into the actual body and blood of Christ). If you die on without going to church on Sunday it is a mortal sin and as a result, you then go to hell. Given some time, I could think of many more. I would like any present Catholics reading this to explain how the "good work" the Catholics presently do somehow makes up for not being accountable to God to change their present beliefs to line up with what the Bible actually says. And to admit, that the millions of murders (this is not speculation but a historical fact) they are responsible for were wrong. We talk about the Way being a cult. The truth is, the Catholic Church is by far the largest cult in the world and it has held the number one position for centuries.

I would make a $500.00 donation to obtain a copy of the PFAL class on DVD or VHS.

Jim Doop posted on the "John Lynn Leaves CES" thread (Open Forum) a few days ago. Yes, it has been confirmed that this is the real Jimmy Doop of the former Way West (early 70's).

The real Jim Doop posted on the "John Lynn Leaves CES" thread in the Open Forum a few days ago. Maybe he will tell his story here.

Another great example of the insanity and double standard that continues to go on at...... The Way. I look back and think....what has changed there in the past 20 years....mmmm...pretty much nothing except the control. They are alot more controlling and Martindale's influence turned it from being a nice little cult into being a controlling and manipulating, big cult. Now it has turned full cycle...only now it is a controlling and manipulating little cult again. This reminds me of a conversation that Howard Al**n once had....when ask by a believer who was being kicked out/fired...."isn't this our ministry." H.A. responded with something close to...... you cannot speak out against the corporation in this way and if you worked for any other corporation in America..... blah blah blah blah blah.

Remove all posts where the poster simply agrees with what someone else has said and does not add any new information to the topic. There are many of these. Eliminate all threads with less than 10 posts. The lack of activity probably means the content was not that important. The Open Forum would contain a lot of these.

......"we want people to be fully informed because we understand people" Ha Ha Ha Ha HA.....really. Anyone who has been in the Way or is currently in the Way knows this statement falls into the big lie catagory... not only 6 years ago but 13 plus years ago and still going on today. I could make a long list of the things they have lied about....but I don't really think it is necessary...there is more than enough first hand testimony here on Greasespot to prove that.

I was "in" for about three years when I came to know what the Way really believed about sex outside marriage. Although I was not married at the time, I found out that the branch coordinator, who was married, was having regular sex with a college student friend of mine. Also, when the area coordinator (married) came to town to run the Christian Family and Sex class, most people were aware that they were spending the night together during the class. Around this time and after CFS, I was having sex with my girlfriend and finally we decided that our hiding it was ridiculous and we moved in together. As a result, the branch coordinator and then his assistant wanted to come in our home to inspect our living arrangement. They knocked on the door (at different times) and told me what they wanted to do. I politely told them both no. There wasn't much they could do. They had not been a good example and I knew that it was taught...if you can handle it... it is ok. . In looking back, it was a bad decision on our part because it wasn't being a good example and/or living up to what the Bible actually says. By the way, that same girl I moved in with has been my wife for the past 22 years.

This is more of a WOW story than a Corps story although it involved my corps coordinator on her second year (out on the "field"). At WOW training at the Rock of Ages we were told no drinking for the year and we could not work outside our city. My corps coordinator was one of the greatest believers I have ever met (to this day and this happened over 20 years ago). Also, she hated rules and regulations that didn't make sense and if they didn't make sense to her she would break them and suffer the consequences. Anyway, we had a really hard time finding a house especially since we had three young (under seven) children (none mine) in our family. Also, ten days in, my WOW brother splits. So we finally get our house (no furniture) and we decide to celebrate. My corps coordinator comes back after calling our limb coordinator to let him know we had found a house and moved in. She says, " I told him we were going to celebrate"......but I didn't say how as she with big smile on her face lifts her newly purchased six pack of Bud out of her grocery bag (Note: kids were asleep). I knew right then and there everthing was going to fine....and it was. Many, many people got born again that year. Also, a related story, we were told we could not leave the city for work. We had to stay in the city. So two weeks in, our money is running low because all of us were having a tough time finding employment to work around the kids school schedule. Anyway, I take this job for a day... moving furniture. I show up the next morning and ask the mover what time we will be back....he says 7 PM. I am thinking great...I'm gonna make some money. I get in the truck and we start driving..as we leave town I ask him where we are going....I find I am not only leaving town for the day but leaving the state!!! When I came back home, someone ask where did you move furniture....All I said was "you don't want to know.....but look at all the money I made (wink)!!!

Earnest Martin's book was called the Birth of Christ Recalculated ( My copy is SECOND EDITION Copyright 1980 IBSN 0-9605604-0-8). Later, the name of the book was changed to The Star That Astonished the World. The original book (BOCR) was published by the Foundation For Biblical Research, Pasadena, California and Newcastle-Upon-Tyne, England (I have the book somewhere in my basement) and the author was Earnest Martin (who recently died in Portland, Oregon). The Way got almost all of the scientific information and the date for the birth of Christ from Martin's book. When Jesus Christ Our Promised Seed was published there was a footnote referencing The Birth Of Christ Recalculated. After obtaining a copy of the book, I was amazed at the amount of information from this book that was in JCOPS. I was in The Way at this time when JCOPS was published and it was presented as if The Way biblical research department came up with the research for the Sept 11 date. Nothing could be further from the truth. The date and research was published way before The Way published JCOPS. I have read the book The Birth Of Christ Recalculated and have a copy of The Star That Astonished The World (haven't read this one yet). The Birth of Christ Recalculated is a great book. The Way does have other information from the scriptures in JCOPS that is interesting. If someone wants to obtain a good knowledge of this topic, I would suggest reading both The Birth Of Christ Recalculated (The Star That Astonished The World) and Jesus Christ Our Promised Seed.

There really isn't any question that the Way leadership has lied to the followers numerous times and I am sure they somehow believe that it is ok with God (probably using some Old Testament record they have rationalized and/or intepreted wrong). Knowing this about the Way's behavior reminded me of a quote I heard years ago (not sure of the author): "Everyone is right in their own mind"

"How to get thrown out of twig?" Don't show up.

"How to get thrown out of twig." Ask any question that makes them uncomfortable.