outofdafog

RADAR - you are so right on there. If one didn't live day by day under the tight scrutiny of TWI2 - it is hard to understand - and of course this is not written to undermine any one else's experiences earlier on in the ministry. Wrong things went on for a long time in TWI - just different wrong things. Mark - that was beautifully put. uhm if only it were that easy to put into practice :)-->

So, we're all in our 20's again and the parents aren't home! Party at outofdafog's pad man............bring your own.....uh whatever.

The building of the WOW auditorium was one of my first red flags about the direction the ministry was going. Of course I kept this opinion solely to myself. You could begin to see TWI evolve into the very thing they continued to teach that they were not - an organized religion. But still I stayed and convinced myself "nah, we are different than those religious organizations." Anybody now can see that those Sunday trips to HQ became totally like going to church. Even more severe than your basic hometown church. Corps showing up in matching trench coats, hats and briefcases. Everyone milling around the "statue of Wierwille". Mandatory attendance within a 250 mile radius. Come on, where is the grassroots fellowship that brought us all together. Remember when going to fellowship was fun? If there is anything that those of us who are out can be thankful for, is that we are out.

I feel too that I am coming back to more of the core of who I was before TWI. Maybe the teenager in me is there because I took PFAL at 18, and from then on threw myself into the "work FOR, uh duh I mean work of the ministry." Maybe that is how and where some of my emotional growth became stunted. I have thrown caution to the wind so to speak, and done a few things to "validate" my freedom and decision that ABSOLUTELY NO ONE WILL EVER CONTROL ME AGAIN" since I have been out. Now I am settling in again. Of course this past year I lost my mother also and this has brought a lot of emotional turmoil as I have gone through the grieving process. So I am working on it, but sometimes those old "TWI" mandates still come to mind in my day by day activities. For example, I might decide to take a different way home from work, and the first thing my stomach does is jump with fear. For a split second or two I think I am being "tricked by the adversary" to take a different route, so he can hurt me and that God won't protect me because I changed my mind on which route to take home. (Anyone who was in TWI2 can probably relate to this). To get over these types of incidents, I just tell myself that God loves me, and he is not there just waiting for me to make a mistake so that he can "get me". How devilish TWI doctrine can be when you examine it in the true light of God's love.

outintexas - oh my God, I can so relate. I have been out now a little over 4 years and am just now discovering how much TWI mentality had a hold on me. It is almost like at first, when I got marked and avoided, I just had such conflicting emotions. I felt wonderfully free, but at the same token, scared about being a "greasespot by midnight." Especially for my children. It is almost like I just shut my mind off to it and now I am realizing how much of my present thinking was still dominated by "Way thought". Some of my deep rooted beliefs were still those that had been instilled in me by the "WAY". I went from like the total freedom to like total fear and lately I have been thinking, it is OKAY to THINK. We had been so limited to what TWI wanted us to think and we had to be obedient to think etc. etc. etc. I am allowed now to think beyond the BOX and consider other's research or book-writing and not think I am going to be struck dead or become possessed because I dare to THINK or CONSIDER other avenues of thought. I hadn't realized I had carried it over for so many years. I am always very leery about telling others I was in a TWI. It is just recently after being with my husband for 4 years that I have been able to tell him some of the things that had gone on. I was very embarrassed to admit I had been "had" by a grifter or "cult" as I tend to pride myself on my discerning of good and bad. But, I too went to where I wanted to be a teenager again, having been in the WAY for the majority of my adult life. I took the class in 1975 and left the Way permanently in 2000. That line of thought has been my thought pattern for the majority of my adulthood. I am 48 now. Great topic Belle.................

Okay, Okay, those Pentecost Sundays were a killer. Come on, how many can you go to and hear the same thing over and over and over? Then you get to see all the pics of all the years gone by and you do all the appropriate oohs and aahs over the wonderful pics of Docvic (Praise be his name)and how the ministry grew and grew (ad nauseum) because of Docvic (praise be his name) and on and on and on.............

Okay Okay, NASCAR is also a big deal at our house, so one of us eventually wanders to the bedroom or living room, but we always do try to catch the last 50 laps. Thats when it gets good. Go Jimmie Johnson.

It is funny that someone brought up the 250 mile radius. I was thinking of starting a thread on it. We lived 15 minutes away so we were ALWAYS ALWAYS ALWAYS required to attend. I hated it. And it was just like going to church every Sunday. The choir sang, announcements, bs, bs, bs and then the teaching, usually always by LCM. I always felt sorry for those who had to come a long distance. You could usually see them arriving at the OSC ? building, with suits and clothes on hangers, rushing to find a place to dress and then dress all their kids. Then you had to drop your kids off at children's fellowship (in the warehouse) --> and then walk over to the auditorium, and be walked across the street by "bless patrol". Afterwards, you walk back over, pick the kiddies up and then go to the lunch room and fellership with likeminded believers. Right smack in the middle of your Sundays. If per chance they are running some kind of class in the area, you would have to do that from 9am-12 noon, go home, get changed and drive back for the 3:00 service. Oh my God, I can't even believe I did that. I am lucky to get off the couch on Sundays now (my time to watch lifetime movies now). Anyways, yes there was a 250 mile radius. I remember calling the coordinator once and telling him my youngest was sick. He somehow convinced (guilted) me into going anyway, that she would be healed by my faithfulness blah blah blah. So I went, I had just made it in the auditorium by 3 and it wasn't 15 minutes later someone came from children's fellowship and told me I had to come and get my daughter, she was sick. DUH!! My point as HER MOTHER to begin with, she was sick!!! God it goes on and on and on...................

It's March and it is still 20 degrees or colder with two inches of snow coming. The roads are snow and ice covered -->

...meets together in private homes for supervised fellowship........... RED FLAG RED FLAG RED FLAG

Exactly Belle. "I believe the "best of the best" saw through it all at some point and have left or been asked to leave 'uh I mean run off by the bless patrol, err, uh the WAYGB". I never wanted to go into the corps because of the control of the "whole boot camp lifestyle". I knew I was too much of a rebel to be able to go through that kind of a program, (just asked my husband - shoot thats a whole 'nother thread because I tend to fight any kind of control. That is why I admire those who did, and in some ways felt they were more commited than I. I know better than that now, because since I have been out of TWI, my relationship with God has grown much closer. It truly is a walk between HE and I, without a bunch of mediators in between. And I respect all of the "corps" who are out and STILL reaching out to people on these forums to help them. It is as if they have taken responsibility for heping those still in, see the truth. I think that is admirable. That tells me that they still care and have a "heart for people". As someone said before, some are still the same people (their pure heart to serve God) as when they entered the Way Corps. diazbro - I understand what you are saying. That latter corps could be a real trip. TWI2 was all messed up. One night in 2000 when I was at a STS and had brought a brand new person, a corps guy called me aside after the service. He said that he noticed that she was using a notepad that had cherubs on it. (This was more important than the fact the woman was taking notes). He wanted me to tell her not to bring it any more because "it gave off devilish vibes" in the auditorium. RED FLAG The first time this gal was at a fellowship she was reproved by the fellowship leader's wife for closing her bible before "the teacher" her husband closed his. RED FLAG I could go on and on, but it was never my heart to make this a corp-bashing thread, as I am sure that is NOT what your are doing. You are merely expressing your experiences as you experienced them. I totally understand the bad taste in your mouth. Your truth is your truth. I just wanted to say thanks to those of you who had the courage to stand up. I believe you "way corps" have also had a lot to do with others leaving, maybe because you didn't want folks to go through what you had to go through, when you saw it for what it was. Many of you saw it before me. outofdafog

...rumoreth hasitith that there is neweth "offshoot" neareth the farm. I am only 15 minutes away....going to drive by so husband (who was never in TWI-and is telling me stuff that a guy at work is telling him - the guy lives right near the farm and always has) can see. I shall take my digital camera and gets some current pics and post (if I can figure out how to post them). outofdafog turned sleuth (not slothful)

Since my time with the ministry spanned from 1975-1999 I guess I got to see both the earlier corps and the later corps. There was a definite difference. But as someone said the atmosphere between TWI1 and TWI2 were significantly different. Yet there were many TWI2 corps who were absolutely as commited as the TIW1 - and for the most part have left the ministry. That tells me their hearts saw the corruption amongst the leadership and chose or were asked to leave. (Asked to leave because they dared question the almighty BOD). Anyways, you guys still rock..........

yet rascal............ Think of all the people that you did bless.

I haven't really posted lately, just mainly been reading the threads. So many of you have shared so much of your lives here at GSC and I am truly impressed by the commitment of many of you to help others see "THEir WAY OUT". I really started thinking about all of this when I was reading the thread about the "Lead Accident". It made me think of how much some of you went through to be in the Way Corps. How much that must have meant to you. And then to have so many of your lives shattered by an organization that really and truly did not care about you as an individual. Although I went WOW and went to all the "ROCKS" and all the classes and all the fellowships etc. etc. I am only now truly appreciating what you the "WAY CORPS" did. The endless hours of service to others, the lack of physical comfort and the endless hours of sitting in meetings. I know that the Way is a cult NOW. And even though we were all part of this cult, that does not take away the fact that you guys had the "HEART" to serve God in an unbelieveably commited way. You believed you were serving God and God knows your heart. That is what is really important. He knows your heart and what it was that you felt that you had commited your life to. And you lived your lives in service and it "blessed" alot of people. I was riveted by the story of that Lead Accident. I read every single entry and every single page. I never had that kind of courage to make that kind of commitment. (Especially the earlier corps) I worked a 9-5 job and had access to alot of the outside world. The rest of my time was taken up with the "WAY" though, every night weekends etc etc etc. I guess I wrote this because I don't want any of you "corps" to think your life during that time was wasted. You blessed many people and I am one of them. outofdafog (getting close)

Gosh, don't they know how "cultish" and "pharisee-like" they sound?? -->

Yes the end result of divorce and dissoulution are the same. The proceedings are different however. In a dissoulution, the two parties MUST AGREE on absolutely everything. If there is one item that the two cannot agree on, you must file for a divorce. Dissoulutions are more like "no fault" divorces.

Very true Belle I heard it was like $35,000 Must still have to work for the final install payment :P-->

Jesse Jackson was being paid out of Kerry's campaign fund to stump for him.....must still be getting a paycheck..........only reason I can figure he would still be interested in the outcome....

I have to agree with Roy, those are all very good points that he makes. If they have a problem with you following those 7 points, then I would question any further involvement with them. You are always "Welcome at the Vay" until you refuse to give them money, all your time and your total devotion to the leadership. As long as you want to continue to be a "free-thinker" and not go along with the "borg mentality", she will be told to drop you and your friendship like a hot potato or her standing will be brought into question, and if she refuses she can be marked and avoided herself. Sounds bizarre huh? but true...........

"non-mastering grads" Mike, hahahahaha hahahahahahahaha hahahahahahahaha hahahahahaha hahaahhahahahaha hahahahahahahaha hahahahahahahaha hahahahahahahahah feel like I am back at TWI hahahahahahahaha hahahahahahaha hahahahahhahaha hahhahahhahaha hhahhahahahahha hahahahahahahhahahahah get a life Mike!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Believing = NO FEAR. Period. Just living and believing.

Something very strange happened to me when I moved back to the town where I was involved in TWI2 before I was marked and avoided. Now mind you, once I was marked and avoided I was like Mad Cow Disease for any faithful TWI groupie. I started working at the restaurant managed by my brother and my old Household Fellowship Coordinator came in one morning about 6:00 and he couldn't have been nicer to me. Oh my god, sugar and spice rolled off his tongue. At that same restaurant about two weeks earlier, another couple had come in and recognized me and acted like I was "Velcome at the Vay", yet neither one of them ever came back. These were the same folks who treated me and my two daughters like we had leprosy when Micha*l and Kris*en Reev*s decided we were no longer good enough for TWI2 in an Ohio branch Very VERY close to HQ. (am I being too obvious). Oh well if the shoe fits......) I think we were accused of allowing my brother to live with us while he got back on his feet, and this being a "bad" thing because my brother saw through their B.S. and wouldn't take their class. Exactly why I was marked and avoided. I had the nerve to help someone get back on their feet after some hard times. (a family member to boot) Shame on me! I refused to kick him out as they wanted even though he was doing great and really recovering from his life's choices. What a bad Christian I was. Now all of a sudden they couldn't be nicer. Is this the kinder and gentler TWI that I hear about? Still haven't been invited back (Thank God). Just pondering..................

"and with much speaking in tongues" HAHAHAHAHAHAHAH HAHAHAHAHAHAHAH too freakin' much

The light from the glaring computer screen late into the night causes Lindy to have to rub his eyes repeatedly. The words GREASESPOT CAFE blur before his eyes, long after midnight. I just don't get it, Loy said that they would all be greasespots by midnight, and look they are all still on line, talking about prosperous things. Someone getting ready to open yet another cafe where truth is served. It's just like the grinch who stole christmas. No matter what he stole from the who's, old Loy Boy couldn't steal that firm determination in their hearts to still celebrate life. Lindy starts to sweat profusely, because a whole complete thought just went through his mind. Not a thought implanted by the great "MOG BORG". but a real thought and reasoning all his own. Lindy's face starts to turn all red and swell. Fear overtakes his composure. I think he might explode....... Feel "free" to continue................