oldiesman

Dooj, I like you. Feel free to PM me if you want.

Waysider I was going to make an attempt to answer some of your questions but I don't think you want answers from me, it looks to me like you already have it all figured out.

The corps believed that God would protect from harm, so no. I don't think twi lied to folks when they claimed that God would protect them, because the bible itself claims that. We believed the bible. Now when bad happens, who do you blame, if anyone/anything? I blame the actual perpetrator, if any. On a spiritual level, I blame the devil. What if, on a twi assignment, you sustain injuries in a natural disaster? Like a hurricane or tornado. Do you blame twi then too, for "putting you in harm's way"? What if you weren't hitchhiking but driving a truck, and fall asleep at the wheel? Do you blame twi for putting you in harm's way? Maybe you do. I do not. Any of these things are possibilities in this world. Harm happens, with or without twi.

Well, if you believe you weren't serving God in twi, then that's a belief and image of your own life. I disagree with it, but you are entitled to think what you want about yourself. But, speak for yourself. You can't speak for others who were serving God. Minimally I think that'd have to be a decision in one's own soul to make.

Golly, here's a thought (food for thought): Let's replace the word "them", with "God." We prayed to God to keep us out of harm's way. We prayed in the name of Jesus Christ. We trusted in God. We believed God was protecting us. But when things went wrong, when harm happened, did you blame God? Do you blame God now? He created the world. He created people, who do harm to other people. Are you just as unmerciful and condemning with God, who failed to protect you, as you are with twi who failed to protect you?

Yeah I think it is. I heard one guy say if I knocked on his door again, he'd kick my a$$. I blame the co-op for putting me in harm's way. I'll stay home next time. Tom, is there a way you can blame twi for the heat outside? :D

You are free to show us how twi could have done it better, Lord Wordwolf. :D

Tom, the way you write, twi could simply have a program and you'd blame them if something goes wrong in the participation of that program because someone was harmed. If it wasn't hitchhiking, it be driving cars and falling asleep, then you'd blame twi. When something goes wrong in twi, blame twi. Do you ever blame the devil, our spiritual adversary, for evil happenings? or does it always have to be twi? Who do you blame today when something does wrong? At least you can't blame twi now, but who knows, maybe you do find a way?

Not only design, but action, is required. twi took action... WOWs took action, Corps took action. Special thumbs up for do-ers. It's not the critic that counts Press On - No matter what they say to you Theodore Roosevelt

George, I see you may need to get out of the house more. I do do it. I just don't witness... but I go door to door in my cooperative when comes time to vote for the BOD. I ask shareholders for their proxies. Got 28 last month, out of 104 units. :)

Assuming then your position is that the program should have been discontinued, yeah, I disagree. Golly, I thought you were going to give advice on how to do it better; not discontinue it.

Doojable, I just think they were following a different path. I think they looked at these incidents as the adversary ripping us off, and saying "we aren't stopping our training program because we do not admit defeat to the adversary." If they stopped hitchhiking, they would be admitting that the adversary won in that situation and stopped the corps from training individuals to abandon their fear of hitchhiking and confidence building ...something that the corps wasn't about. The corps was about pushing the envelope, as you well know. As crazy as that logic and concept may sound today, I don't see any evil in that. It was part of doctrine of twi and we all bought into it at the time. Today I wouldn't do it. Today, I wouldn't go into the special forces of U.S., I wouldn't and couldn't hack it. But at 18 years old, it might have been an exciting adventure.

Wordwolf, your assessment here is pretty good, although I definitely wouldn't say that results (crimes) don't matter. I am curious though, what would be your solution for the next time WOWs were sent out door to door? (this situation seems exciting to me, allowing one to believe God while going door to door, a challenge, no doubt, in any neighborhood)

David, I'm glad you got what you wanted but had it been me making the decision, I would have upheld the requirement to hitchhike for everyone. Or else let everyone drive. Why are you so special? Otherwise, if one is too timid or lazy to hitch, then stay home. The way I see it (and perhaps this was their thinking as well) if folks can't believe to hitch a ride they can't believe to climb rocks. Of course David you proved that you could drive and still climb rocks. I'm glad you had a profitable time.

Waysider, I do equate our men & women of twi who performed exploits like WOW and corps as making selfless sacrifices and having godly conviction. And I give a special thumbs up to those who performed these feats, without whining and b*tching about it. And I do agree, the fact that some were victimized in the process doesn't excuse the victimizers. We just seem to disagree on who those victimizers were at certain times and incidents, which is ok with me.

Tom, I just don't buy the logic. (or illogic). I don't mean to be cold, although I'm sure you'll express it that way, but I believe that if Top didn't want to hitch, she shouldn't have entered the corps. She should have researched her time/investment, found out exactly what was expected before entering. True enough, one does look like a wuss when one is there and tries to back out, so that was a no-no as Top mentioned. Accordingly had TWI stopped folks from hitchhiking and instead had them drive cars & trucks, some posters would assess blame if someone fell asleep at the wheel. TWI will always be wrong in some posters' minds, because some mindsets are to accuse and assess blame at every opportunity. Twi is always wrong, in these posters' hearts and minds. Twi didn't facilitate the crime. Again, I blame those who committed the crime. How about blaming the adversary as you blame twi? Or maybe you don't believe in the devil any more?

Doojable, thanks for your opinions and insight. I will consider them.

I would have felt terrible, but I wouldn't have blamed twi. I would have blamed the perpetrators of the crime. And as Top pointed out, this type of thing could have happened in or out of twi. Twi did not perpetuate this crime... they facilitated Top to strive to be her best in the corps, I believe that was the heart behind the corps.... not her having evils befall her. You say we all need to find compassion and mercy, but you yourself show little if none toward your twi brethren, so who are you to preach? Depends on the facts of the situation.

Turn on defroster? Don't know what you mean. I think the only defroster I own is in the microwave when I defrost meat.

Please don't put words in my mouth, Watered Garden. Drugs are always wrong. I've consistently held the position that those who were narcotized were victims.

Folks who are able to tolerate opinions other than their own have no problem with my posts.

I think the opposite is the case. Some posters have the unrelenting mindset for blaming twi for most everything bad that happened to a participant, while in twi. TWI is always guilty, or nearly always guilty. It is always their fault. Well, I think that mindset is skewed, biased, unmerciful, and unChristian, and I am glad I think differently.

A respectible mission for all of us.

I might offer the same challenge -- see how far your perpetual allegations of alleged crimes at the hands of twi implementing its corps program go in a court of law.