waysider

.....Beware of P.T. Barnum impersonators and Harold Hill wannabe's.

I don't think anyone is really disputing the need to cover business expenses. What has come into question is the motivation involved. Let me state it another way. When I see all these offshoots springing up and offering new material, I don't see someone saying, "I need to charge for my classes". What I see is someone saying, "I need to have classes I can charge for".

It could never happen.....'cause they'd get rebellation...... Cookies would fall out of the great cookie jar in the sky.....There would be so many cookies, the sky would turn back and cover the gas pumps.

Geeze! If you really want to "learn" something about T.I.P., just use the danged search engine on GSC. And, if you choose to subscribe, we'd even entertain/discuss any questions you might have.

On-line excellor sessions!! HERE

The whole premise of Power For Abundant Living is that it supposedly contains information that will make you a better Christian. I don't think you have to look too far beyond the title, itself, to understand that concept. Not entirely a bad concept. But, it didn't stop there. No, it was made clear that one could not expect to see these results as an individual, without becoming an active member of the group.....stay within the household...don't fellowship with unbelievers, etc. And, what was the primary focus of the group's activity? Simple, bring people into the PFAL class and make sure they continue on a class-centric path. If you need proof, please refer to page 2 of Witnessing and Undershepherding. "The basic reason we witness is to help people into the classes on Power For Abundant Living..." (All of which comes with a price tag.)

Twinky You're trying to apply logical thinking to something that defies logic. There is no way anyone can be sure how the scenario might have played out. One thing I know, though, is that when someone points a gun at you, you have to assume it is loaded and there is a possibility they will use it.

The whole household thing was about being "better" than the unwashed masses of mainstream Christianity. The corps was about being the "best" of the household. edit: I'm not sure how patterning one's life after misinformation in an error riddled class can improve the quality of one's personal, Christian walk. Maybe someone could enlighten me with specific examples of how this is possible.

".....bum-rushed off twi property in the middle of the night by a security guard with a 9mm firearm". Oh, so THAT'S what they meant by "all 9 all the time".

Buzz-words....yeah...I see people talking on face book and find myself wondering if they would actually be able to communicate without all the "way speak", or have a simple conversation that doesn't have PFAL related material at its center.

He probably just needs to speak in tongues a little more and get a clearer focus on the situation.

I love the smell of rhetoric in the morning.

Hmmmm.... Did Reynolds take the advanced class? Did he confront Wierwille or report him to authorities?

Grad school??? His aforementioned rambling seems to be more on the level of a high school sophomore. (Am I being too kind?) edit ...spelling

Why on earth does anyone still believe these nut-cases in New Knockwurst have the slightest clue about real life?

Devil spirits!! Yeah, if only they'd had the greatest class the world has ever known since rocks were invented, they would have exercised the revelation manifestations and averted the whole scenario. "I cannot imagine that someone displaying this behavior around believers and true friends would have gone unconfronted. Not to mention being delivered as he sat in a teaching or sharing of God's Word by someone being energized by God's spirit." Hmmm.... I guess he's forgotten that 1,000's of piffle grads sat through the advanced class, listening to the ramblings of a man who, by his own definition, must have been RIDDLED with those pesky, little rascals. Do I really need to cite the advanced class silly-bus on this? (pages 20 & 21, if you're interested.) So, if this stuff is real, how come nobody got "revelation" about Wierdwilly? .............................................. I love this part, too: "He dropped out of medical school a month ago. Hello! These things telegraph that something very unusual and probably important, not to mention, devilish, is going on to anyone who cares about this man." Yep, any time someone drops out of medical school, it's an obvious sign something spiritual is going on..... Hello! Med school is a tough row to hoe...boogie man or no boogie man. ................................................ "I listen to Bill O'Riley on Fox regularly." Oh, OK, now I think I see the problem.

Might make nice accessories for a Halloween costume.

PFAL......... "Promotes harmony in the home" :o

Many people have a misconception of what constitutes harassment. It is NOT against the law to "harass" an employee, in the dictionary, semantic sense of the word. It can only be legally classified as harassment if it violates specific laws, like those that prohibit discrimination against a protected class or persons who expose unsafe and/or illegal activities. Compounding the issue, in all 50 of the United States, an employer can terminate you at any time, for any reason, so long as they don't overstep any legal restrictions (protected class, whistleblower, etc.). In fact, they really don't even need to have any reason at all. They could, theoretically, simply say, "I don't like you, you're fired" and there is nothing you can do about it, short of invoking some sort of pre-employment contract or something of that nature. That is why employers insist you sign an "at will" agreement before they will employ you. What does any of this have to do with the topic at hand? Well, we live in a culture where this sort of atmosphere has become the norm for many workplaces and organizations. People know that if they blow the whistle or simply speak up, retaliation is an almost certainty. The system discourages speaking out for what you know is right, especially if you are not 100% certain that your suspicions are accurate. The linked article details a study that showed it to be virtually useless to confront the bully, go to their superior, go to HR, etc. Businesses and organizations are simply not going to change because "it's the right thing to do". Until there are laws with some teeth in them, this attitude is going to fester in our culture and facilitate all sorts of heinous acts without recourse. We need to get to the very core of the issue and create an environment where people know they can do the right thing without being penalized. ............................................... From the article that started this thread: "The challenge of civilizations has been to set up institutional arrangements that take into account the human condition and channel it in ways that encourage the good and place a check on evil. What this means is that in our universities, in our churches, and in our political systems – in virtually every human institution – we need checks and balances."

"If you see someone bullied in your workplace, what do you do?" Unfortunately, in the U.S., there is not really much of anything you CAN do. Unlike the U.K.,it's perfectly legal here UNLESS you can prove that it's being driven by a bias against a protected class of worker or as retaliation against a whistleblower.. And, the burden of proof is on you, as the one being bullied. It's deeply entrenched in the American workplace, often encouraged by upper levels of management if it translates into (perceived) higher production levels or (perceived) profit increases. HERE is a link to a site that elaborates on the problem. This post may seem off topic but I really don't think it is. Fear of retaliation is often what drives people to turn a blind eye. Without laws to hold retaliation in check, this sort of thing will never stop. We saw what happened in TWI when there was no protocol in place to deal with such things.

I've mentioned this before but, when I first got in the word in, 1972, people weren't talking yet about getting heavenly rewards or crowns or bonus coupons or rebates or buy-one-get-one's or whatever else. Then, one day, in about 1974 or 1975, a group of corps stopped by the limb HQ as they were passing through the area. (I was in fellowlaborers at the time.) I happened to be on bucket duty, mopping down the BRC. One of them asked me if I was blessed to be mopping the floor. My response was that I didn't care for mopping but it felt good knowing it would make life more enjoyable for the other participants. He scoffed at that and said I really didn't understand how the process worked. Then, they started talking about some new revelations they'd just been exposed to regarding crowns and jewels, etc. Their conversation was very competitive in nature, each one trying to convince the other he had earned more rewards than the other...... The whole thing really creeped me out.

*Divine rewards for selling PLAF (The Wonder Class).* I'm not sure if I'm supposed to laugh at that or cuss.

I'm glad I didn't see it in the original.

What you and I do to promote God's Truth and Love is the only thing that will count for us at the Judgment Seat of Christ when Jesus asks each of us something like: "What did you do with what you knew?" ...................................................... Wow! I must have missed that scripture.