JayDee

33 minutes ago, OldSkool said:

He wants money for a website that can be put together for next to mothinh. Ive made and ran seversl sites over the years. Besides hosting costs and maybe a template or two theres not much to it. He should givevof his own resources for something so small in the scheme of things. My opinion anyway.

He pulled the same move Lynn n others did. Position paper, split ftom group, take followers. New boss same as old boss.

Kind of a pattern there OldSkool. “Modus Operandi”. 

57 minutes ago, Taxidev said:

Either way, it's still a bit disappointing.  I mean, what has he done so far that would even inspire anyone to donate money to him?  Besides drawing up that incredibly long paper on salvation, which some might say is cause to NOT give him money, what has he done?  His web site isn't even functional, we can't even see what his foundational principles are, we can't even watch/listen to some good teachings.

I see this as the perfect example of what DWBH says about these offshoot folks.

They’re all (offshoots) cut from the same rotten fabric of vp’s stolen, phoney “ministry”. Including “revival and restoration”. At the core of what they want to do is get back to the “good ol’ days” of the way. 

Jesus Christ has no place in their lives except at  the closing of a prayer. He’s absent, ‘cause they took his place. 

I’ve known most of them for decades. 1st hand experience. They’ve done irreparable damage to countless numbers of men, women, and children. Blasphemed God and the Body of Christ. Shameful, despicable, false teachers. 

Time is running out for repentance. I pray they do. 

13 minutes ago, Taxidev said:

His web site isn't functional yet.  There is nothing to click.

OldSkool gave me the answer.

You’re right. Sorry. I was on the Facebook page which allows the click and donate. Or not. 

1 hour ago, Taxidev said:

Where did you see this?  I just went to his web site and it isn't even functional yet.

“Lean On Jesus” is the new website. Just click on donate. The amounts are suggested for you. I passed. 

He did, that’s for sure. 

So sorry for your loss skyrider. 

33 minutes ago, Taxidev said:

I'm guessing you are referring to the life Paul lived afterward.  But aren't these R&R folks at about the point Paul was at shortly after having the crust removed from his eyes?

It's a given that I have no idea what it was like in the past with these people (I have only known a few of them for a short time), but Paul sent people to prison and had people killed.  Surely that would be considered evil beyond evil.  And if any of these R&R folks did anything even close to that - if God forgave Paul then He can forgive them.

You and I are certainly not the searcher of hearts, and I am not trying to pretend to know exactly what they are doing nor their intentions.  I only know what I've seen and heard so far.  So, you could be exactly correct in your opinion of them, but you could also be exactly incorrect.  I'm sure it's easier for me than it is for you to have a wait and see attitude, but that is the position I have taken.  And so far I have seen and heard nothing that suggests they are doing what several of you here have projected on them.  They have never once, since May last year, asked for money.  They have never once, since last May, told us what we should be doing.

I am waiting to see them grow further in their understanding, just as Paul did.  And if I am incorrect, that will show itself soon enough.

What they have done for decades is worship veepee at the altar of pfal. Minus Jesus Christ. And they want anyone that will follow them back in time to what they think are the good ol’ days.

They’re not asking for money ‘cause they don’t need it. But they’ll take it if anyone gives it.

Forgiveness from God? Maybe. Maybe not. Depends on their willingness to repent IMO. 

Just a couple thoughts. 

2 hours ago, Taxidev said:

I thought they were excellent replies, and I won't be contacting them further about these issues.  But if any others reply I will summarize theirs for you also.
 

Did they answer any of your questions? Looks to me like you presented direct questions and expressed honest concerns and what you got in reply was bs, not “excellent replies”. No offense, please Taxidev. 

He’s been posting on Facebook regarding his differences with $Choenhei7 regarding “Once Saved Always Saved”. He produced a 114 page document supporting his position which is “Continue In Faith”. 

He said it’s written in their bylaws that if there’s a disagreement among board members over doctrine that the disagreeable member MUST resign. So that’s what he did. 19 years on the job. 

Laughable. 

1 hour ago, T-Bone said:

I think he was extricating himself from the confines of his old Pharisee mindset.

I agree T-Bone. Unless proven otherwise of course. 

31 minutes ago, waysider said:

Some of them have been doing this stuff for almost 50 years. Realistically, what are the chances they will have a sudden realization they've been hoodwinked??

That’s their problem. They think they’re right and everybody else is wrong. Same old nonsense. They talk about getting back to veepee’s original teachings/doctrine. They don’t realize that’s what got them in trouble to begin with. 

I know most of us here would love to see them repent according to the standard Jesus Christ spoke of. Sorry to say I don’t see it happening. I’d like to be wrong. I’m not holding my breath. 

5 hours ago, Twinky said:

I don't know that it would be a Jewish tradition - more like a Roman one.

Where, JayDee, have you read "both sides of the discussion"?  And, "both" sides?  What have you read?

Yes, HE'S COMING BACK. 

But what means "the napkin folded [or rolled] together by itself in a separate place"?  Must have been included for a reason.  It's a seemingly unimportant detail in a big narrative - where "big details" are often missing.  So it must have some special significance.

https://bibleforums.org/showthread.php/207403-The-Folded-Napkin

https://www.truthorfiction.com/folded-napkin/

https://www.gotquestions.org/folded-napkin.html

http://isitinthebible.com/nt/napkin.htm

2 hours ago, Twinky said:

John 20:7

 

 

 

 

 

Some versions say "wrapped together by itself," some "rolled together" etc

I heard a very interesting comment made about this verse in church this morning.  I’ve never heard anything else taught about it; nor can I see anything in a commentary.

 

 

This, the young stand-in minister said, denoted a custom at the time.  When a master had eaten his fill of a meal, he’d get up, toss his napkin down and walk off.  This signified that any leftover food would be available for servants and slaves.

 

 

If, however, the master just got up, intending to return (perhaps he had to answer a call of nature; perhaps deal with some other household issue or a visitor), he would fold (or roll) up his napkin and leave it.  This signified to servants and slaves that he intended to return and finish his meal.

 

 

The minister’s thought was that the head napkin that had been bound about Jesus’s head being folded neatly signified his imminent return.

 

 

I wonder if anyone here has ever thought about this or read anything.  Most commentaries are written by academicians a very long time ago who may never have travelled far from their home countries and never visited any part of the middle-east.  It’s the kind of thing that one might think ought to be considered in “Manners & Customs” or “Light through an Eastern Window,” but there’s nothing.  M&C merely suggests it was a “handkerchief used to tie the chin up,” without further commentary. 

I’ve read both sides of the discussion. Some say there is no Jewish tradition of folding the napkin or not. Others say there is. Personally, I don’t care. IMO He’s coming back. 

3 hours ago, Twinky said:

And if parts in the middle offend thee...

1 hour ago, Rocky said:

Honestly, this thread was started before the GSC ban on political topics/discussion.

The topic IS distasteful AND political.

You called it Rocky. That song pi$$es me off. It’s offensive on so many levels. 

2 hours ago, chockfull said:

I have far from reached my destination in Christology in view or practice.  Thx for the references.

Me too. At this point in my life I at least have some understanding of the Trinity. I think it’s important to understand it, if you’re going to agree or disagree. TWI’s narrow view and opposition were my own for years. Not anymore. Thankfully. 

4 hours ago, Mike said:

6 hours ago, chockfull said:

 

It was NOT a molestation, only a proposition, and she was and AC grad. You assumed the worst because you wanted to.

Yes? And your point is? Was she more or less qualified to receive “only” a proposition because she was an AC grad?

Do you hear yourself? Do you read what you write? Seems to me you might consider some professional help regarding your thought/logic process. 

18 minutes ago, DontWorryBeHappy said:

I for one, really wish the good-hearted GSCers here trying to dialogue reasonably with you would simply stop doing so. Go down to Doctrinal and pontificate your “ancient”, “overlooked” garbage there.

There’s some really good advice Mike. Hopefully you’ll heed the plea. 

2 hours ago, T-Bone said:

That’s what genuine honest teachers do - they expand one’s horizon by presenting various works/viewpoints and let students hone their thinking skills.

Yes T-Bone. With the keys words in this comment being “genuine honest”. Neither of which “The Teacher” was. 

3 hours ago, waysider said:

Nothing you have said here excuses the unethical, illegal plagiarism that Wierwille exercised

THAT’S EXACTLY RIGHT! And the point that Mike consistently denies. What VeePee wrote in an obscure book has nothing to do with blatant plagiarism. 

41 minutes ago, waysider said:

This is the level of incompetence you might expect to see on a middle school term paper, not from someone who held himself out to be an authority on a subject..

Or called himself “Dr.”.

36 minutes ago, So_crates said:

“God gave VPW permission to use the revelations”

Says who?

Very sorry to hear this sad news. He was a very humble man. 

The internet is the enemy of twi and those like twi. Grateful for GSC. That’s for sure. 

Courageous post Less Than. Welcome to GreaseSpot. Breathe!