JayDee

5 hours ago, chockfull said:

It's really good, and provides an important piece of HIStory regarding Biblical research and its practices in the Way International especially in its formative years.  This research is the "truth" that the modern Way is based upon.  They have abandoned further pursuit of ongoing Biblical research and resolved themselves doggedly to the materials founded upon what you read about in this book.

I think it is better and more accurate than the HIStory they used to sell in the Way  "The Way Living in Love" by Elena Whiteside.  That book presents the only recorded folklore behind the snow on the gas pumps story which is the reason why they don't research any more.  Coincidentally, similar thinking to the Mormons.   With automatic writing from the angel Moroni, who needs research?

Anyways, although Charlene and Elena were both hippie children in the same era, Charlene was much more practically grounded and worked in the research department.  She's funny too and sounds logical not like a flower child. Those are my impressions reading both works.  

Mrs. VPW's account stops short of the timeline presented in both of these works.

5 stars.  Highly recommended.

My wife and I both read Charlene’s book in one day. Too compelling to put down. Excellent read. 

51 minutes ago, sastian said:

http://eternallyblessed.org/archive/snt-0214-selling-plurality-216

 

What a bunch of egotistical nonsense that teaching is. Total. Unequivocal. Nonsense. 

Welcome annio!

Welcome, Stillconfused. 

2 hours ago, Taxidev said:

Yes, he was fired, but says he doesn't know why.  Here is a direct quote from his letter to believers, dated March 30, 1988:

"On April 1, 1987, I was fired by the Board of Trustees from my position as Limb Coordinator of The Way of Washington, D.C. Why? That's a good question, and one I asked Howard Allen that day. He refused to give me a reason."

He knows EXACTLY why he was fired. He played the “victim” with his response. 

31 minutes ago, Grace Valerie Claire said:

I noticed that I only have 3 total reputation points. That is about the lowest of anybody here. Why?

Just curious rrobs. Why is that a concern? Keeping score?

7 minutes ago, Twinky said:

Do the last few posts here need shifting to the Trinity thread?

 

As to Billy Graham (to keep this on track) - regardless of his faults (and who hasn't got faults?), he caused many people to want to know Christ, and to make commitments to learn, find out more.  I do not know that he bullied people into submission, but he presented the gospel in a way that was exciting, fresh, interesting, and whet people's appetites to know more.  At his rallies, he had people from local churches come and assist, so that they could take new committers under their wings.  I don't know that he got people "born again" - I don't know who can say this for true.  I do know that he started many people on a path where they could become born again, be saved, become Christians - put it how you will.  Some, he may have offered a "faith revival" and that encouraged them to "return to the faith." 

He had a big, positive, impact on people's lives, likely more than any poster here, and certainly more than TWI ever did.

I see his ministry in this regard too Twinky. Thanks again for your insight regarding BG. 

14 minutes ago, Twinky said:

Yep, JayDee.

I have met many awesome Christians (trinis) who live out their faith and their love for the Lord.

I have met some non-trinis, far fewer in number, who live out their faith and their love for the Lord.

It's not an issue for most people.  They just get on with living out their  faith and getting on with the tasks that have been assigned to us as Christians.  I tend to take the view that it's not an issue for Jesus, or for his (and our) Father.  There's been 2,000 years since Jesus was murdered, and since he was raised from the dead.  It's been 1700 years since the Council of Nicea presented us with the "creed" and the doctrine of the trinity (which clearly had been around for far longer than that).

So, in 2000 years, give or take a century, either (1) there is no God, and possibly no Jesus; or (2) neither God nor Jesus gets excited about this doctrine, as clearly they've done nothing to correct it one way or the other.

If it doesn't matter to them, it's inappropriate that it should be such a big deal for Christians now.  There's a very great amount that we have been commanded to do, and it would be more appropriate to concentrate on that.

Very well said Twinky. Your last paragraph in particular,  is taken to heart. Thanks!

1 hour ago, GoldStar said:

But which Christ?

1) The true Jesus Christ, who stated his Father is the only true God ~ John 17:3

2) Or the false christ, who is 1of the mythical 3-gods-in-1 false trinity god invented out of thin air by the Roman Catholic church in 325 A.D. (documented historical fact)

Yes, Billy taught # 2, as stated in his 'What We Believe' list:

"We believe that there is one God, eternally existent in three persons: Father, Son, and Holy Spirit"

https://billygraham.org/about/what-we-believe

He also says that his wife is already in heaven in the video titled ABC on his website:

 

But on his 'What We Believe' page, it says:

"We believe in the resurrection of both the saved and the lost; the saved unto the resurrection of eternal life"

So the holes in his most basic and important doctrinal beliefs are so big, you could throw an mature adult elephant through them.

Evangelist?  Yes

Christian Evangelist for the only true God?

Only in a parallel universe where all the laws of logic, language, physics, math, and everything else can be twisted into all kinds of LSD induced Alice in Wonderland shapes and colors

And none of this has anything to do with salvation. They’re “non-issues”. Whenever we come “face to face” with Jesus Christ, he’s not going to ask “ Did you believe in the Trinity, 4 crucified, are the dead alive now, dispensations, the bema, etc.” He’s gonna ask if we love him. Just as he did with Peter. Every knee will bow, whether a Trinitarian or not.

In my experience most people don’t have even a little bit of understanding about the Trinity. Why it even came into existence. And it had nothing to do with “debil spurts” or “doctrines of debils”. More twi nonsense. 

Scholars, real scholars have taught for centuries Trinitarian doctrine. The vast majority of Christianity believe in Trinity. Are they ALL wrong? Only the narrow minded view of twi and other similar organizations have a problem with it and that’s the main reason in my view that vp pushed it so hard and why so many of his followers accepted his poorly researched and written JCING. Arrogant, egotistical, division of the body of Christ. 

I for one refuse to debate the subject. I can’t say it more emphatically...IT DOESN’T MATTER.

As to Billy Graham’s ministry, like anyone else’s, I ask “where’s the fruit”? Countless thousands came to Jesus Christ. Jesus saves. Not Billy Graham or vp or any other minister. Call BG names, disparage him in any way. He’ll say “Yes” when Jesus asks “Do you love me”?

By the way...I’m not a Trinitarian. And again, I’m not debating. 

At the name of Jesus, every knee shall bow. 

1 minute ago, GoldStar said:

I appreciate your interest Jaydee but it's not ready for prime time!

Cool. 

20 minutes ago, GoldStar said:

I have also, but not way-related :)

Doesn’t matter to me. What’s the title if you don’t mind?

14 minutes ago, waysider said:

That quote was made by Penworks.

 

Sorry. My misinterpretation. I thought GoldStar had written a book. I have Penworks book. 

25 minutes ago, GoldStar said:

Also, I've published a book using my real name so stating my real identity here is no big deal to me. My own website, too, is public."

If you don’t mind me asking GoldStar, what book?

If you go looking for a fight you will surely find one. 

Welcome GoldStar

The kindness I was shown. It was genuine. 

Sorry for the triple post mods. Don’t know what I did wrong and don’t know how to delete 2 of them. Help?

1 hour ago, Mike said:

 

1 hour ago, Mike said:

 

1 hour ago, Mike said:

I see benefits in an absent Christ.

Of course you do. Your hero did too. It brought HIM the attention. Just like you so desperately crave. Sell your brand of snake oil to someone else will ya’?

3 minutes ago, Mike said:

I like looking closely at the ideas in print in the collaterals.  I don't think that much about him

I wonder how you can separate the man from his faulty logic and his deliberate mishandling of scripture? Let alone leaving Jesus Christ out of the picture as “absent”. Come on man!

26 minutes ago, Galen said:

 

There are believers in our local fellowship, who have been 'faithful' for over 30 years, that have no idea of any of the things that happened during the court cases. They swallow what is told to them from leadership, and they willfully ignore all else. When I have let slip mentions of the court cases, they have been shocked and ultimately in denial.

 

Wow. 

10 minutes ago, Mike said:

Brave people don't get their dandruff up over being falsely called a coward.

I don’t call it “Brave” defending an unconvicted serial rapist. 

And yes, I am a veteran. But that’s not what helps me recognize you as a coward. Your words in defense of veepee, and continuing to dodge answering direct questions do that pretty well. Why are you so afraid to admit you’re wrong? 

7 minutes ago, Mike said:

 

Now, if you’d be as detailed in your response to Twinky and others who’ve confronted you with legitimate questions...

Cherrypicker

And yes, I have confronted “real bad guys in person”. That’s why I don’t have any problem whatsoever calling you out. 

Keep typing in red