We could always call it CFRJ ministries. "Can't find a real job" ministries.
JAL has been doing fine with his test prep courses. I believe he has expanded them. I also think that's one of the reasons why the org didn't feel too bad jettisoning him as he was self-supporting. What I don't think they get is that he was supporting them as well, even when he wasn't around because they were still acting like he was.
Like it or not, JAL was an attractor to STF-I and not nearly the detractor that the BOD has made him out to be. I think they may find that out the hard way. I say I "think" because there's no one left that has ever really admitted a mistake. They talk about it, but a true heartfelt "I screwed up" isn't in them.
When the whole TWI thing blew up in 1986-87, it was largely due to JAL's efforts along with RD that people left. JAL spent hours on the phone every day and every night. You can talk (speculate) all you want about his motives, he's the one who put in the time, worked the rooms, and traveled the country. There wasn't another person around that was willing to put in the face/phone time. Pretty much everyone else was along for the ride - and I don't think the current "leadership" really gets how important that is in growing an organization of active supporters.
JAL has been doing fine with his test prep courses. I believe he has expanded them.
Why can't he just be HAPPY? I mean, he makes a difference in life, SOMEWHERE..
kids would likely better remember him as the fellow who helped them get into a better university, than the *One* who spent most of his later years trying to resurrect da way it was..
He is not the only one with this pathetic mind set.. I've seen others abandon a *real* calling to go back to staff an offshoot.
I think stf wants to distance its organization from the twi stuff.
It wants to distance itself from the bad publicity. It might even want to redo a bit of the theology, but the basic premise of TWI (a "research" ministry with a lock on the "truth") is alive and thriving in the organization. You don't have to read or listen to much of what they preach to see those 2 things at work.
they want to be a ministry without the negative baggage twi brings their group.
They aren't all that into TWI comparisons. It's a non-issue - well except for JAL and he's not there anymore. They believe they have moved past the shadow of TWI retaining all that was "good" about it. I'm not speculating about that.
But that isnt all of it, the crap with PP , momentuos and their own leaders suing one another isnt from twi that is in their own mess of baggage.
The notion is (probably - I'm speculating here) that with Mark and JAL gone that the ugly times are behind them. I'm not a gambler, but I would be willing to put money on the accuracy of that sentence.
Both Johns have spent enough time researching to be able to teach well.
Time spent "researching" is no guarantee of ability to teach. I have spent a considerable amount of time around both of them and JAL is a better presenter/teacher than he was a ever a researcher. JWS is pretty decent at being able to make scripture say whatever he wants, but he's no teacher. Neither one of them are particularly relevant.
but I think today people want more, the net provides many ministries and resources for bible study.
I would tend to agree - see above comment.
Why can't he just be HAPPY? I mean, he makes a difference in life, SOMEWHERE..
kids would likely better remember him as the fellow who helped them get into a better university, than the *One* who spent most of his later years trying to resurrect da way it was..
He is not the only one with this pathetic mind set.. I've seen others abandon a *real* calling to go back to staff an offshoot.
I don't know. I just think he believes he's truly destined for "greatness". He's got the personality and drive. It will be interesting to see who he uses as support staff and "wise council."
’m very sorry that those who went had to endure such a painful experience of seeing people they love pitted against one another. It made me very sad to think that on that Saturday, the 38th anniversary of my ordination, while I was enthusiastically teaching the Word in Washington, D.C. to God’s precious people, my longtime friend and fellow laborer John Schoenheit was dishonestly degrading me.
those really don't sound like jl's words..
probably from his "wise counsel"..
the "session" probably went more like this..
"so, should I strike out on my own, start another stiffi?"
"John, John, John.. you've been at this, what.. 38 years. And what do you have to show for it? Your organization is divided, God's precious people are getting hurt, and your longtime friends can't even stand you anymore.. all you seem to know how to do is to run your mouth in front of a microphone. You've been defrocked twice, once by your own organization. Maybe you should find something else to do.."
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batcave
How about the STFI Necks? ( thank you, thank you, I was up til 3am last night)
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waysider
The Incredible Shrinking Clan
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nyunknown
The Incredible shrinking cult sounds better.
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RumRunner
I'm kinda going for "Rot in He[[ A$$hole"
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geisha779
Catchy, it rolls right off the tongue. . . . gets my vote.
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mstar1
that seems to be the main message...
Im sorta partial to Fly By Night Ministries or How to be approaching 70, still whining and still clueless--
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Ham
and its motto:
what's in YOUR wallet..
It is going to take more than blood and sweat to build a new *avenue* for jl you know..
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chockfull
We could always call it CFRJ ministries. "Can't find a real job" ministries.
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Tzaia
JAL has been doing fine with his test prep courses. I believe he has expanded them. I also think that's one of the reasons why the org didn't feel too bad jettisoning him as he was self-supporting. What I don't think they get is that he was supporting them as well, even when he wasn't around because they were still acting like he was.
Like it or not, JAL was an attractor to STF-I and not nearly the detractor that the BOD has made him out to be. I think they may find that out the hard way. I say I "think" because there's no one left that has ever really admitted a mistake. They talk about it, but a true heartfelt "I screwed up" isn't in them.
When the whole TWI thing blew up in 1986-87, it was largely due to JAL's efforts along with RD that people left. JAL spent hours on the phone every day and every night. You can talk (speculate) all you want about his motives, he's the one who put in the time, worked the rooms, and traveled the country. There wasn't another person around that was willing to put in the face/phone time. Pretty much everyone else was along for the ride - and I don't think the current "leadership" really gets how important that is in growing an organization of active supporters.
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pond
yes twi folks are trained to give money, abs was huge in twi.
So jal found the need and kept the ball rolling. it worked enough to hire the others.
I think stf wants to distance its organization from the twi stuff.
they want to be a ministry without the negative baggage twi brings their group.
but no other group of folks will be as shall I say (loyal) as twi people in givng money.
a problem.
But that isnt all of it, the crap with PP , momentuos and their own leaders suing one another isnt from twi that is in their own mess of baggage.
Jal is a smart man he knows how to make money.... and entertain people.
Both Johns have spent enough time researching to be able to teach well.
but I think today people want more, the net provides many ministries and resources for bible study.
the competition is huge for religous organizations and 'research". no one has to travel to ohio to get the remedy anymore if you know what I mean.
Mark and Jal both wanted a more people thing.
Well good luck to all involved.
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Ham
Why can't he just be HAPPY? I mean, he makes a difference in life, SOMEWHERE..
kids would likely better remember him as the fellow who helped them get into a better university, than the *One* who spent most of his later years trying to resurrect da way it was..
He is not the only one with this pathetic mind set.. I've seen others abandon a *real* calling to go back to staff an offshoot.
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Tzaia
It wants to distance itself from the bad publicity. It might even want to redo a bit of the theology, but the basic premise of TWI (a "research" ministry with a lock on the "truth") is alive and thriving in the organization. You don't have to read or listen to much of what they preach to see those 2 things at work.
They aren't all that into TWI comparisons. It's a non-issue - well except for JAL and he's not there anymore. They believe they have moved past the shadow of TWI retaining all that was "good" about it. I'm not speculating about that.
The notion is (probably - I'm speculating here) that with Mark and JAL gone that the ugly times are behind them. I'm not a gambler, but I would be willing to put money on the accuracy of that sentence.
Time spent "researching" is no guarantee of ability to teach. I have spent a considerable amount of time around both of them and JAL is a better presenter/teacher than he was a ever a researcher. JWS is pretty decent at being able to make scripture say whatever he wants, but he's no teacher. Neither one of them are particularly relevant.
I would tend to agree - see above comment.
I don't know. I just think he believes he's truly destined for "greatness". He's got the personality and drive. It will be interesting to see who he uses as support staff and "wise council."
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Ham
those really don't sound like jl's words..
probably from his "wise counsel"..
the "session" probably went more like this..
"so, should I strike out on my own, start another stiffi?"
"John, John, John.. you've been at this, what.. 38 years. And what do you have to show for it? Your organization is divided, God's precious people are getting hurt, and your longtime friends can't even stand you anymore.. all you seem to know how to do is to run your mouth in front of a microphone. You've been defrocked twice, once by your own organization. Maybe you should find something else to do.."
"hmm. I take that as a yes.."
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Ham
This is probably pretty close to the truth..
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