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  1. Hello, Greasespotters. Just letting you know that another significant review of Undertow was just published by the International Cultic Studies Association, Inc. By permission, I've republished it here: Book Review of "Undertow," Published by ICSA, Written by Bart Stewart (charleneedge.blogspot.com) Remember, no author vets reviewers. ICSA put out the word about Undertow and this reviewer chose it. Their review is their response to the book, their opinions, their interpretations. Also, keep in mind this reviewer used other sources about The Way besides Undertow in his review. Enjoy! Charlene Edge
    3 points
  2. When a brown metal folding chair seems to be the only kind that feels comfortable so you tell your local Leadership that and act like its a good thing.... You just might be brainwashed. When you can't remember if it's your night to bring the coffee, or the cookies, so you just bring both because you know you'll get reproved if you bring the wrong thing... You just might be brainwashed. When the dial in number goes dead and there's no sound but you just stare at the speaker because you want to report to Leadership what you did and tell them "that's just how faithful" you really are... You just might be brainwashed. If your local Leaders criticizes a local "believer" because they don't give a lot in abundant sharing by saying "I'm glad I don't have to try and live off what they give!" and you don't take the opportunity to tell them what an asshole they really are... You just might be brainwashed. (and yes, they all actually happened)
    3 points
  3. I thought some of you might enjoy this lovely choral music. My choir is singing this piece (and others) at our concert in late March (the main piece is Faure Requiem). I find it hard to get this out of my head. The accompanying video is lots of shots inside various English cathedrals, some of which, or some parts of which, date back around 1000 years. Those with an architectural eye will notice a wide variety of building styles.
    2 points
  4. "If your local Leaders criticizes a local "believer" because they don't give a lot in abundant sharing by saying "I'm glad I don't have to try and live off what they give!" and you don't take the opportunity to tell them what an .... they really are... You just might be brainwashed. " Well, maybe if their believing was in shape, that would be MORE than they needed. It's only a failure of their OWN believing that made it necessary to try to make a living off someone's giving. How about making saddles for a living? I know it's still a current job on the market.
    2 points
  5. Many GSC readers will be familiar with Steven Hassan's name and anti-cult message. This TED talk by Hassan is poignant (and has been for more than 40 years) and is salient today. It's less than 14 minutes long. The concept is far from limited to religion (including fundamentalist groups like twi) or politics. Hassan cites other ways people might be subject to this kind of mental/emotional manipulation. BTW, all humans are subject to being conned. I have been and not only by Victor Wierwille or Loy Martindale.
    2 points
  6. Picking up this thread after a looong search for the best thread pick up, hope I judged correctly enough! I am comparing the structure and teachings/inferences in the Assembly of God church I am now a partner in, w/ those of twi/vpw et al. The irony of vp lauding the early church model of church in the home, i.e a grassroots movement, and condemning later "organized" denominations that met in church buildings, really strikes me. (Especially in light of the current movement of many church-building-churches to emphasize small groups that meet in homes, as well as the large gatherings in the church building on Sunday.) He CLAIMED a decentralized free-flowing Spirit-led movemen t, whi ch it was in some key ways; but ALWAYS, he was to be honored as the Apostle Paul was, (claims to the contrary), and kept an iron grip on the power, money, psyches, and Biblical doctrines of twi. In CONTRAST, the Assembly of God folks (not that I have allegiance towards any particular denom), emphasize small groups, have a lead pastor VERY accountable to a local board, and have a central office somewhere in Indianapolis I assume, and I THINK a US headquarters? The Way Tree myth that elevated Jerusalem got implanted in my cultized brain, I am more fully realizing. The AOG church as a whole is structured much more like the 1st Century church in keyways, than twi ever was!!! Twi HEADQUARTERS WAS THE CHURCH BUILDING/physical location that ppl identified with and flocked to whenever possible, magnified 1000 times! Names like the Biblical Research Center, or WOW Auditorium didn't really change a THING IMO. Yes, human beings tend to ID with and attach to physical locations, especially where their hearts are drawn to God. But the concept that twi was the 1st Century church in the 20th, was PURE FICTION AND DECEPTION. (Sometimes I still long for the free flow of how twi grew, and I do love how the early church was apparently structured and flowed. Apparently the Gospel is moving beautifully in India with Sangat Bain's ministry which is based only on home churches, and has Zero Headquarters.) But right now, I am learning, growing, and worshipping in this local church which BTW, is connecting more and more w/ other churches in our town, YAY!) And am coming out of Cult Fog, and viewing the Evolution of The "Biblically-centered" Church from it's earliest days until now as something to learn from, honor, and feel a part of. Thank you GSC-ers for still being here!!
    2 points
  7. I doubt your conclusions Raf, though I respect your right to voice them.
    2 points
  8. I would agree. Simultaneously he poured water on the fire of the “Groovy Christians of Rye NY” and in both cases placed his goon Way Corps grads leading both West and East Coast arms of the movement - Moynihan was one of them. The only survival of the Jesus movement persisted in the influence of Calvary Chapel which produced a new denomination of Christianity and various other Christian movement changes. The Jesus movement, which was originally one that originated from the fire in the hearts of the masses, was overrun by the weeds of human greed and corporate institutions. “The Way” or “The So-Called Way” or “The Way International” produced a rock star existence for VP and a subservient existence for the lay follower. A stagnant pool of lust for power and bondage.
    2 points
  9. twi is still run by old fogeys who seized power so they could have the money and the power, and won't let go. They're trying to figure out how to interest young people, since without young people, twi's fading into obscurity. It's an old people ministry that hasn't appealed to young folks since the 1980s, and that means, as their population ages out and some drop dead of old age and others leave, they don't have any replacements to pay 10% or more of their income because they are suckers to keep the luxuries coming in for the people at the top. So, twi now has a handful of old farts in power trying to convince young people that twi is actually relevant and meaningful. How are they doing that? They're reviving what worked in the 1970s with the baby boomers, in their own foolish youth. It would be funny if it wasn't sad.
    2 points
  10. I feel that, thanks Waysider. I have more to share but it took 25 years to tell my story. I'm still basking in the relief of letting the first chapter out. It's been a marathon of a life. Thanks for seeing me.
    2 points
  11. Looking at some writings by Aristotle, I came across a method for rhetorical analysis of writings, speeches, texts, etc. https://www.scribbr.com/academic-essay/rhetorical-analysis/ Since we are analyzing the Bible and various other works I thought it might be interesting to introduce this angle of analysis. It leads to such questions as what is the logical appeal? Emotional appeal? Or appeal to authority? This might be also helpful in an analytic discussion.
    1 point
  12. Thank you for posting that beautiful visual and auditory feast of awe. Today's new (to me) book, is AWE: The New Science of Everyday Wonder and How it Can Transform Your Life. There were times in my young adulthood (50 or so years ago) and during my early life in twi, when I experienced everyday wonder. Of course, at that time, I attributed it all to God, as defined by Victor Wierwille. Anyway, in this book, I am encouraged to look for, seek out, awe in my everyday life. Beauty in cultural expression is one place to find it. I was touched with a sense of awe listening to that choir. No doubt, you and your fellow choir members singing that beautiful piece with a deep sense of love and awe will touch all of those who get to hear you.
    1 point
  13. Not that I expect anyone to listen to four hours of debate, but I did want to demonstrate that the subject matter warrants more than a dismissive reference to Melville.
    1 point
  14. I wish we could discuss politics here, respectfully. I'd even pay a monthly fee! LOL
    1 point
  15. Oh, no doubt about it, there have been all KINDS of power etc abuses in just about EVERY denomination or Christian movement, especially those getting attention recently. Twi definitely did not have a special corner on that! However, the length of time vp was able to abuse young women sexually, keep it all a secret, influence twi culture in big ways, and NEVER be held accountable in any effectual way is notable IMO.
    1 point
  16. We don't have the apostles' side of the story, only Paul's and whoever wrote Acts to make Paul's claims fit just right. It seems to me Acts is fan fiction. Does the chronology of Paul's travels in Acts even line up with what Paul himself chronicles in his own letters? I know, I know. There's a glove for that. Don't forget about Tacitus.
    1 point
  17. Yeah and also we have the VPW “new and improved harmony of the gospels 2.0” in the book written by Charlene’s co-workers “Jesus Christ Our Passover”. The lack of harmony produced a gap allowing Metallica to insert a band in there and make their own harmony with “Enter the Sandman” and “Nothing Else Matters”. As an obscure reference, this also won’t translate lol
    1 point
  18. And you have a sarcastic wit like myself which can help or hinder research lol
    1 point
  19. Is this like the quote on how 95% of statistics are made up on the fly including this one? Would it not be more helpful to summarize the scholarly consensus and provide detail like so we all can trace the logic?
    1 point
  20. But, then again, it might simply mean you're "on the ball".
    1 point
  21. If you hear the joke about "millions now smoking" for the 758th time and laugh on cue... You just might be brainwashed.
    1 point
  22. Hey annio! Thanks for sharing. I appreciate hearing about your growth and movement post TWI. It sounds like you have found a comfortable presence of the body of Christ in your area and that’s great! To me some of the difference in views are exactly that - now I can be part of a larger body of Christ as described in scripture where all parts are valued and part of a greater Christian extended family where common grassroots virtues and goals are shared and there is tolerance for differences in the body without an extreme cult-like view. Where all members in Christ are equal and important and not to be treated like rock stars with entourages. Denominations have good and bad aspects including accountability and governance of course flaws creep in to human constructs. There are some cool community churches around too and some concept based churches with no denominational governance. It’s kind of like a huge family worldwide with different languages cultures and ideas can be dysfunctional at times like most families. I like it personally a lot more than the bondage of being a slave to “bring the heart of the BOD to all believers on the field and strive to run classes according to the overseers directed annual schedule”. I like it personally a lot more than the recently trademarked “WOW” phrase that will serve as trademarked justification for the same ongoing for future generations. Want to go in a different philosophical or spiritual direction? I think my faith in God says He is fair enough to see your heart and reward you for your efforts. If people made it more about Him and less about them then maybe there wouldn’t be a ton heading for the hills. Congrats on your continued faith and local family!
    1 point
  23. Will give it a listen, thanks!
    1 point
  24. "In the end the Party would announce that two and two made five, and you would have to believe it. It was inevitable that they should make that claim sooner or later: the logic of their position demanded it ... And what was terrifying was not that they would kill you for thinking otherwise, but that they might be right. For, after all, how do we know that two and two make four? Or that the force of gravity works? Or that the past is unchangeable? If both the past and the external world exist only in the mind, and if the mind itself is controllable…what then?" — 1984, George Orwell
    1 point
  25. Been thinking about why Peter and James didn't squash Paul. Who knows... Maybe because they had received intimate, secret training. Maybe they had been taught to guard the secrets and were warned of others' misunderstanding. Maybe they'd been warned not give too much attention, lest they give credence, to blow hard charlatans who just knew that they knew that they knew.
    1 point
  26. nice script on the water and fire baptism sirguessalot tried so hard for so many years with books and books running out of my ears, like cleaning the outside of the pitcher, while inside is a fuse waiting to be lit, tried it my way then I started listening anyways, always cool to converse with everyone here, open hearts
    1 point
  27. Often, I would say. However, since Oldiesman posts here, and he's currently a Roman Catholic, and this is not an RCC survivor's messageboard, there's no compelling reason to take shots at his denomination. Let's consider posting with a little kindness, instead. (I'm not in complete accord with the RCC myself, but I don't have to just load the old shotgun whenever they're mentioned. Even if I am EX-RCC.)
    1 point
  28. It may also be that the competence of John's baptism strongly involved the seemingly "magic" and "cultic" but actually quite pragmatic medicinal impacts of hygiene, where the competence of Christ's fire was more akin to the kind of medicine that heals when there is no cure, which involves washing in the inner flames of realities like grief, guilt, humiliation and most specifically, shame, and the depth and degrees of our capacities to touch, hold and handle any of this is what keeps us from both eden and paradise. In this light (NOT counting the dead), one might even say that there are currently maybe billions of living souls on Earth drowning tormented in such an inner lake of fire right now. Meanwhile, there are also maybe millions alive walking in the very same fire. Which is perhaps also why "fire" seems to have long been a living metaphor in the contexts of end-of-life care-giving and companionship (in what other field is the harvest so plentious and the laborers so few?), and is firmly rooted in a "healing the healer" approach, or medicine for the "wounded healer." Communities of the devoted to supporting each other in doing their inner work so they cause even less harm. Essential baseline mode of care for anyone wanting to heal (or lead or teach) anyone else. This deeper history of hospitals, nursing and medicine runs through the Gospels. Quite revolutionary in times of mass avoidance and fixers run amuck.
    1 point
  29. That's a very stoic sentiment you put forth, Oldies? My perspective is the bible is all story. Clearly there are still some on this thread who hew to the fundamentalist way of trying to figure out what's going to happen in the future... by looking at concordances and such. BUT... accepting what comes your way in life is a very (emotionally) healthy approach overall anyway. Put another way, as Stoicism writer Ryan Holiday put it, Stillness is the key. Regardless of your believe in or denial of purgatory, I appreciate your Stoic reflection on the subject.
    1 point
  30. Since soap is used for physical cleaning. Soap could figuratively represent spiritual cleaning or purification through God and his Son Jesus Christ. The book of Malachi, the last book of the Old Testament, looks prophetic for Jesus Christ.
    1 point
  31. vpw did indeed play a historically significant part in the Jesus Revolution. By being the person who single-handedly ended the House of Acts, he ended the emerging movement of genuine Christianity and guidance of the Holy Spirit among the young of California, who already were making national headlines. As such, vpw did more to impede the movement of God's Word and replace it with calcifying religion than anyone else that decade. I'm sure the devil was VERY impressed with him.
    1 point
  32. Indeed. It may be, as I suspect, that the grand tour of the Apocalypse is not merely about future events, but rather a illumination of ongoing Processes, including the processes, patterns and stages of inner life, which includes of course how these inner conditions and changes impact the outer world. The book seems more like a user manual than mere list of predictions, although clearer discernment of inner processes and their impacts on the outer world does also lend to seeing clearer trajectories in outer events, increasing our capacity to predict things. These are not one-time events, but rather patterns that repeat as the conditions support them, which is perhaps why folks for millenia who try to apply the symbols and archetypes to specific literal one-time events are constantly mostly wrong. Also, the history of Catholicism is quite full of rich diversity. Often ignored or misunderstood by protestant leaning beliefs are the contemplative and monastic orders and disciplines, such as Franciscan, Cistercian, Benedictine, etc.. These include folks who do not always fit the standard current mainstream Catholic codes in belief or practice about Purgatory or anything else. Purgatory and the Apocalypse also reminds me of these: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bardo_Thodol https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bardo "In some schools of Buddhism, bardo (Classical Tibetan: བར་དོ་ Wylie: bar do) or antarābhava (Sanskrit, Chinese and Japanese: 中有, romanized in Chinese as zhōng yǒu and in Japanese as chū'u)[1] is an intermediate, transitional, or liminal state between death and rebirth. The concept arose soon after Gautama Buddha's death, with a number of earlier Buddhist schools accepting the existence of such an intermediate state, while other schools rejected it. The concept of antarābhava, an intervening state between death and rebirth, was brought into Buddhism from the Vedic-Upanishadic (later Hindu) philosophical tradition.[2][3] Later Buddhism expanded the bardo concept to six or more states of consciousness covering every stage of life and death.[4] In Tibetan Buddhism, bardo is the central theme of the Bardo Thodol (literally Liberation Through Hearing During the Intermediate State), the Tibetan Book of the Dead, a text intended to both guide the recently deceased person through the death bardo to gain a better rebirth and also to help their loved ones with the grieving process.[5]" Wondering about life after death is like the unborn wondering about life after birth. We come out screaming bloody murder because it feels like dying, yet the scope and variety of life after birth is many many magnitudes more than life in the womb (like seed versus tree), and that great cloud of ancestral witnesses are like the nurses, midwives and relatives in the waiting room. And, while the personal ego may not survive death, it may be that other forms of life after death are overwhelmingly MORE (in both scope and variety) than what we are experiencing now. And, as with birth, where there is no guarantee a newborn lives to see its first birthday, or with sprouting seeds, where there is no guarantee it flowers, the newly dead are not immediately done with their growth. The potential of life without end is simply that. Thus, notions like Purgatory and the Bardo.
    1 point
  33. I worked at a WOW Burger tent with Stevie Kay and a recent conversation had me look her up and we had a really nice conversation. But she doesn't seem to want to talk about it and I don't blame her. As for "is it different now?". Probably not enough to make it right. They cling to VPW in an L. Ron Hubbard retro history way. The entire thing is the house the foolish man built upon the sand. It was rotten for so long that being 'different now' is moot. The reason people don't leave is mostly fear based and that's not a good thing. They should make sure there's a bucket of condoms at the Young Adult Rock.
    1 point
  34. yeah, funny how Craig was the one who shut down the roa killed for his own reasons.....thinking back on it I think he was offended and jealous of everyone being there and having a great time. This is part of how he took down twi, part of his plan cause I think he saw how really deceitful and evil some of twi is.
    1 point
  35. Those do look like old photos! brining may be a typo but it kinda fits. I assume they want to invoke memories of events long past, get the old time vibe going. "Better than ever, even better than best!" The age qualification reeks of a generational cleansing. The oldest would be born in 1989. The mid to late 80's saw the first influx of evacuees, post Geer taking a dump on the whole thing in 86. Martindale "resigned" in 2000. Will there be a "Rest for the Aged" event for the elders? A "Senior Acres of Shakers" drum circle? Maybe a virtual "Don't Stop Breathing Or Believing!" cheese and whine pairing event? The original RoA was a night during the Winter Advance of 1971 that was called Rock of Ages. That summer of 1971 was the first R of A gathering. Over the next few years the event went from local fairgrounds to the Way's property in New Knoxville, "the farm". It took on a life of it's own and to a great degree became a social meet up of the Way Corps each year. Early on it became a homecoming event for WOW Ambassadors. People from other countries came as the outreach reached out. I remember the year after Emporia'd been up and running and the RoA meeting when Martindale spoke to the Corps there and crowed on and on about how he had a great realization that hey! we don't just have to get together to have FUN, not that there's anything WRONG with that but hey! he could MEET with Corps, those coming into Emporia, going out, interested in the program, DO SOME WORK, get work done MOVING THE WORD. My wife and I looked at each other and thought the same thing - uh oh, there goes that. He and his leadership clones at Emporia, then staff then all the field leadership all suddenly came to the same "realization" and it became an all day schedule of them trying to figure out reasons to meet because they didn't want everyone having FUN all day. The social side of it was something that was natural and followed the social trends of the youth culture of that era. Both coasts were developing the new formats for concerts and events, Woodstock had occurred, etc. etc. The R of A's generated out of that social atmosphere, with their own twist. VPW had his own ideas of course and he spoke of it being a time for WC to meet each other, kind of an in house Tinder hook up for singles. I am well aware of all the discussions that have exposed the sexual activities over the years but to be honest, whoever was hooping up, from VPW on down, they kept their sexual partnering pretty secret and the edges I saw or heard about weren't common knowledge. In most legal settings what they did would meet the criteria for "lies" and lying, as there was intent to deceive and knowingly defend a false set of statements or facts....but I digress. It was garden variety lying and corrupt behavior imo, redefined by whoever wanted to into whatever they wanted to justify. But as far as it being a social gathering and people of like mind meeting each other - sure. It was plenty of that. If I were them, and I'm not but if I were - and I'm not - I'd take a stepback and get the temperature of the membership, see what's going on and make room for something new and current to develop. Freshen it up. Allow for some spontaneous combustion. Set the stage, make the space, see what can be done. Inclusive, not exclusive. Everyone, at least all their tag bearing members current in their abs dues. And try doing something different than getting together in Ohio in August for God's Sake! which is part of the hottest muckiest periods in Ohio. In todays' world they will not want to play fast and loose or take the position that it's "their place" and they can do what they want. They can't. If they f it up, they'll be toast before you can say "liability". But hey - peace and love! Thanks for the memories Junior!
    1 point
  36. I did a bit of a deep dive into these young people and many of them are the sons and daughters of old Way people. 3rd generation lifers, not new people. Word Wolf makes sense with his comment. I just want a Wow Burger.
    1 point
  37. Seems to me all religions are filled with words that all other religions don't know/care about, but most old religious traditions do include near-equivalents to Purgatory as both a state of being and an actual location associated with the dead. Naraka, Diyu, Tir Na Nog, etc.. As with the ecosystems of Catholicity, each is a living and unique response and expression of human encounters with the many fields and layers of life beyond life. And as with Catholicism, most are old enough to have long been hollowed out and filled with surface ideas and applications nearly utterly divorced from these kinds of roots, providing poor examples of the original ancestral wisdom, leaving us mostly naked, lost and afraid in our mortality, grief and shame. In this, we have mostly replaced living practices and direct experience for mere explanations of distant things. Yet, it seems within each religion there are folks in touch with those deeper strands. fwiw
    1 point
  38. 1 point
  39. You and me (and many others who have survived to become "seniors") both. we[b] boast in the hope of the glory of God. 3 Not only so, but we[c] also glory in our sufferings, because we know that suffering produces perseverance; 4 perseverance, character; and character, hope. 5 And hope does not put us to shame, because God’s love has been poured out into our hearts through the Holy Spirit, who has been given to us. From Romans 5, NIV.
    1 point
  40. I mentioned in my post that I didn't know what the criminal code was in the US. I also took for granted that posters knew I was from Canada. Thanks for clarifying this at the beginning of your post. The terms are specific like you say: abuse, conduct, assault, misconduct and exploitation. The fact that IHOPKC's spokesperson used the words "inappropriate behavior" and "sexual immorality" shows they want to stay away from legal definitions to safeguard themselves. The Advocate Group who represents the victims and includes a lawyer used "clergy sexual abuse" in both of their public statements.
    1 point
  41. Of Bickle: “There are many misrepresentations of my words and actions in these communications including statements that are out of context, greatly exaggerated, or blatantly false,” Bickle said in his statement. He also said he thought his past misdeeds were “dealt with and under the blood of Jesus.” Sounds not unlike "anything done in the love of God is okay," including assaulting other men's wives. Hmph. John 11:35.
    1 point
  42. Good. F this guy and all charlatans like him. Allegations of abuse spanning DECADES from several credible women. Wow. So much sorrow for merely “inappropriate” behavior. Really, his “sin” did it. It’s the sin’s fault. BULLSHONTA!!
    1 point
  43. I find certain characteristics of different cults remind me of TWI. The whole Plaffy witnessing running classes to me reminds me of the JWs and their dogged determination to “witness” meaning putting a watchtower pub in someone's hands or referring someone to JW.org that seems pretty similar. The Mormons have all their positions as voluntary like bishops and Q70 or Q12 but demand the tithe out of followers. That to me is similar to the Way how they handle staffing and money. The Way Corps to me seems a lot like Scientology’s Sea Org. A billion year commitment to making the world “clear”. Using people paying them nothing shuffling them around doing the bidding of LRH or Miscavidge. So to me The Way seems like a blend of a number of cult tactics and characteristics. Like a cult souffle.
    1 point
  44. you havent missed out on anything. I reached out to them in my first 6 months out of TWI, somehow thinking something would be different. And to be clear, they are all different from each other as they have all taken what they liked from TWI and rebranded it with their own additions and spin. But at the end of the day its the same ole trap.
    1 point
  45. “Dr. Edith Eva Eger is my kind of hero. She survived unspeakable horrors and brutality; but rather than let her painful past destroy her, she chose to transform it into a powerful gift—one she uses to help others heal.” —Jeannette Walls, author of The Glass Castle “The Choice is a gift to humanity. One of those rare and eternal stories that you don’t want to end and that leave you forever changed. Dr. Eger’s life reveals our capacity to transcend even the greatest of horrors and to use that suffering for the benefit of others. She has found true freedom and forgiveness and shows us how we can as well.” —Desmond Tutu, Nobel Peace Prize Laureate Eger, Edith. The Choice: Embrace the Possible (p. I). Scribner. Kindle Edition.
    1 point
  46. Here's another relevant link: It’s 1944 and sixteen-year-old ballerina and gymnast Edith Eger is sent to Auschwitz. Separated from her parents on arrival, she endures unimaginable experiences, including being made to dance for the infamous Josef Mengele. When the camp is finally liberated, she is pulled from a pile of bodies, barely alive. The horrors of the Holocaust didn’t break Edith. In fact, they helped her learn to live again with a life-affirming strength and a truly remarkable resilience. The Choice is her unforgettable story. **** Btw, now in her 90s, Edith is still alive "and kicking." Her story is phenomenal.
    1 point
  47. George, maybe it's becaue Mrs. W. couldn't "work" for the Way anymore. Which begs the question, just what does an 8 hour day of Harvey's "work" consist of? What do ANY of them do for "work"? I've been thinking of a quote of Frank Zappa's lately, and reading H.P.'s letter brought it back again. Zappa was being interviewed years ago in Musician magazine, I think it was. In case anyone's not familiar with him, he was a musician, guitarist, composer and depending on who you read he was a hack, a genius, a tad eccentric, whatever...figure anyone who names his kids Dweezil, Amhet and Moon Unit has some issues at the very least. Anyway...he always had some interesting things to say about the music industry. The interviewer was asking him about his tendency to be negative about the music industry as a whole, and he asked Zappa if he deliberately tried to sand bag his own efforts by knocking it all the time. Zappa answered "It's not my job to kiss their a$$". Next question was: "Don't you think you've grown more cynical over the years?" Answer: "No, I just keep getting more evidence to back up my original cynicism". Classic. practice makes perfect sense when it comes to love... (Michael Franks)
    1 point
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