Ham

Honestly.. I think "these kind" of people, and not limited to der vey, view us as cattle to be herded and bartered.. I am beginning to think it is ALL a form of "brainwashing", of one form or another, one severity or another. I think they prey on man's baser instincts. In "the old days", to be outside of the group meant basically death. I think we have vestiges of this fear, wired in. When you were "in", what was the GREATEST fear? I think for most, to be put out.

hey, he would cause less damage. Especially if he stays where he "belongs"

You know, that kind of statement may be proof positive that it indeed did..

I'll bring the ouija board..

Why not accuse them? how is it that those of a different religion are as convinced about their product as you are on yours? They say God is red, you say he's green.. and they can show with apparent logic why their take on the almighty is correct, and yours is wrong.. you would think that a well thought through, logical decision would result in the same opinion. Somebody has to be "wrong".. at least I would think. There must be a reason why people are so convinced. Some are convinced enough to kill for their belief.

One thing I can say for fiction, it doesn't try to deceive a person. No promises of guaranteed results. At the end of the day, a person may find that it is only something somebody made up..

I dunno. Could the opposite be true? Could fictional movie and art images be similar to people's memories, and not the other way around? I used to think "fiction" was a bad word, but now sometimes I feel that fiction allows us to explore the nature of our true selves.

Well Johnny, that is kinda neat. Just wonder, how many details do you remember? Time of day, weather, etc? I often dream that I'm levitating as I'm moving around. I can direct the direction I'm going mentally in the dream. It is kinda neat when I KNOW I am dreaming. But it is always a night scene. Maybe I'm a "creature of da night" There is a whole lot of "junk" DNA they have not idea what it does.. and the pattern is passed on. Personally, I think we are all connected, somehow. All part of some greater whole. Jung talks about archetypical images. They seem to be wired in somewhere.. common to people across cultures.

hmm. mstar, if there is some kind of genetic memory, I wonder if there is also a sort of genetic consciousness.. Johnny, that is kinda strange.. maybe you're regressing to a time at the dentist when you were on laughting gas..

Well.. I'll add a little strangeness The picture I had of old radios from the 1930's or so, were the insides of them, before I had ever seen one in real life.. at least that I can remember. Later, when I was still young, I kinda knew how radios worked, and took them apart. just didn't have the manual dexterity to really do anything as far as putting them back together..

Seems there is something, somewhere, just can't remember. General George Patton believed in it, and I think he went to church too.. thought he was some kind of commander in a previous life.. I can't exactly poo-poo people's beliefs either. I do find strict rigid fundamentalism distasteful, but if that's somebody's choice.. so be it. Here's a list of some of the more famous people in history who believed in reincarnation, and I wouldn't exactly go about beating them with a bible.. or with my understanding of it, anyway.. Benjamin Franklin Jack London Napoleon Mark Twain Leo Tolstoy Henry Ford Johann Wolfgang von Goethe Freidrich Nietzsche Mahatma Ghandi Ralph Waldo Emerson General George S. Patton Albert Schweitzer Walt Whitman William Wordsworth Jalalu Rumi (Islamic Poet of the 13th century) Carl Jung Henry David Thoreau Socrates Voltaire Josephus (most well known Jewish historian from the time of Jesus) Honore Balzac (French writer) Arthur Schopenhauer (Philosopher) Paul Gauguin (French post-impressionist painter) George Harrison Pythagoras If you want to see quotes, some guy on another board assembled them: http://freespirits.chosenones.net/showthread.php?t=2885

Yeah, well, at least I didn't put this in doctrinal.. :) I have slowly come to grips with the whistling though. Breath in, whistle, breath out, whistle.. Since leaving der vey, I have gotten a lot more comfortable with the concept of not understanding everything, or being able to explain it with a mathmatical exactness and such. After a while, I started remembering some of these impressions or dreams in my early years. Could be real, could be not.. maybe my dad fed me ramps or something before putting me to bed..

OK. I'll go first, but I have the feeling I may be the last.. Moderators, if appropriate, please move to silly. 1. I can remember two past lives. One, I died in battle.. the other, I was a radio repairman who was a shyster. 2. I remember a meeting with "them" before I came back last time. They said I'd better get it right this time.. 3. Yeah, I DID have some kinda regression where I went back to when either I was born, or conceived.. These were dreams, images, or impressions when I was very young. It seemed pretty realistic.. either it was real, or some hippy slipped a little too much LSD in my halloween candy.. Oh. I can also whistle, fairly well at that, exhaling AND inhaling.

hmm. Don't take this as an insult, but If the high point of my day consisted of shooting stray cats.. unless I got a real kick out of it, I'd really consider doing something else.. don't worry about the "sanctity" of headquarters, they'll be just fine. Believe me.. they can find a replacement for you fella..

In 82, they showed a video about a guy who supposedly hypnotized people and enabled them to walk barefoot on broken glass unharmed. It was such an.. informercial. A sixth grader could see it was staged.. but the guy up front was blathering on about spurts and such.. I thought at the time, "what an idiot.." then I just "renewed the mind.."

The only thing I could add is if it is REALLY love, the response makes no difference, whether they are grateful or not, if they reciprocate or not. Or even if they are trying to scam you, and you see it coming a mile away. Or even if they believe differently. I kinda feel like the love thing- you're on a mission..

I think some of the "biblical" expectations in marriage set people up for failure. There is a small problem giving the power of mog to one of the parties.. what if the guy isn't QUALIFIED to make the decision in question? Ah, but he's sure he's right.. from what I've seen in practice, God doesn't just "bless" somebody for going along with it..

I think that little note was about the McMullen trespassing incident. Got him barred from even thinking about aproaching twi grounds.. Funny she calls it "victory" after the martindale fiasco.. "we have PREVAILED!!!!"

Happy birthday friend!

A little less Pavlovian in practice perhaps.. what is it about control that is so attractive to them.. they have their followers conditioned- when to applaud, when to pray, when to study, what to study.. all they have to do is ring the right bell, and they'll run to the mall slobbering on people.. Then blame them when they don't get "results". Huh? Personally, I think this kind of "conditioning" is rather unethical, being applied to human beings.. I know people who were conditioned to the extent they experienced something like an electric shock when the phone rang. No joke.

Yep. And the paycheck would probably be better somewhere else. If you REALLY like what you do, why not take a couple of classes. I hear they can't find enough people in law enforcement/security in Arizona.. better climate, gotta be better conditions, and lots more interesting than chasing a few encroachers off of vey property..

Bolshevik, I think fair use is in order here though. Those are my honest impressions. You'd think they'd want some feedback. I think that considering this is probably the only place on the internet, or anywhere in the world for that matter, where they'll get any kiind of honest criticism, they'd be shooting themselves in the foot to bother anybody.. If they can copyright the words "contact us" or "write to:" I guess I'd be in some trouble.. :) But I think it is an honest question. Why "advertise" when they are not selling? I mean, the average guy who perchance never has heard of der vey, stumbles on their website.. sees the classes, the programs.. gets out his credit card, looks for the little "we accept payment by pay-pal" or something to that effect.. it's not there. Next, he looks for an email address.. nope, none.. then, "write us"? I think it is a reasonable assumption and conjecture that they are not there to sell. They have an essentially unmarketable product, using unreasonable restraints to restrict it's export to individuals who's qualifications God only knows.. That's my opinion.. anyway, even setting old "prejudices" against them aside. So what's the motive? I still think it is the country club arrogance. Have to jump through hoops just to get their attention. What's wrong with a little stinking email? If they are supposed to be a "research" organization, where are the materials? Other groups like them offer links to nice, modern biblical lookup type stuff. What is stopping them from "getting with it"? In my opinion, I think they are making the same mistake that the Betamax people did, that Apple did in the past, with the closed corporation mentality. No development.. All I say is, go ahead. Make it a country club.. you're gonna go the way of Betamax.. "good luck"

Naw, I like mix it in my espresso..

The Dead Sea is dead, because it has an inlet, and micro-manages all of it's outlets..

I agree. Not that they COULD have practiced love, not unlike NORMAL (whatever that is) human beings. "Religion" seems to bring out the worst in God's "elect". I vote arrogance. I think we got a strange brew of christian mysticism, mixed with pavlovian abuse. i.e., "Christian" motivational techniques. all "for your own good". I believe that is where arrogance lifted it's ugly head.