Twinky

He's gorgeous. She's gorgeous. You're - a dad! Congratulations!!

From the Wikipedia entry This isn't quite true. It may have been when they were introduced to the general believers but they were designated on an earlier occasion. It took place in the Auditorium during some big Ministry event - maybe it was Corps Week the previous year? (I was present at the event, and very enthusiastic for the new designation for these fine upstanding members of the Way old-timers, but I had been banished by 1995.) Any offers on the date? Othewise, Mark, maybe you can change that in Wiki too?

Thanks, both. Twinkle was a real "bendy toy". You really could position her more or less how you liked on your lap or chest and she'd sort of sigh and relax into the position, purring loudly. She had a lovely low purr but also a very high purr, like the one a very pleased cat has. And that's how she was purring in her last days. So we know she was happy. Crypto looks very like Twinkle, same dense black color with a little white mark on the chest, and slightly fluffy as opposed to very sleek. I have vision for Crypto to end up like Twinkle. It won't be any time soon. :(

Oh, and I learned to ski. Not very well. And sometimes my skis and I do not take exactly the same route... But I can get down a slope without too much disgrace or damage to other people; I have fun; I feel a sense of achievement.

Interesting thread, Jeff. Another thing that you might want to consider: On the cross Jesus gave special responsibility for the care of his mother to one of his disciples. As the oldest son he (and his wife) would be responsible culturally to care for his mother (that's one of the reasons the first born son gets a "double portion" - to take care of his extended family responsibilities). (Aside: interesting also that he gave care of his mother to one of his disciples - not to the second eldest brother, as one might expect.) At marriage a husband is supposed to leave his mother and father and cleave to his wife. Obviously that doesn't mean he abandons his parents (since that would not be honoring them) - rather, it means his focus, his first attention, is not to his parents' wishes but to his wife's wishes. Jesus gives no commandment concerning Mary M at the cross. He does not commit her [and any children] to the care of his disciples. Recall also the record and responsibilities of brothers to marry childless widows - a topic about which Jesus himself is confronted by scribes and Pharisees trying to trick him. Mary M seems to have spent a lot of time in the company of Jesus, but that doesn't mean she wasn't perhaps married to one of his disciples (perhaps one of the 12, perhaps another disciple). In fact, that might make some sense. As a married woman, she would be accompanying her husband in his pursuit of Jesus, and it would not necessarily be very remarkable. A single Jewish woman probably would be remarkable, in those days. We know very little of the disciples' or apostles' wives; only that Peter had a wife who once had a fever. Other than that - we know nothing of their private lives.

Mark, you may not be familiar with the Holman version. It seems pretty good, better than, for instance, NKJV, which seriously promotes a trinitarian viewpoint. No version is perfect. I like switching around and must have 20 versions. I read the Message for its brisk breeziness and besides, it makes me laugh. When did a Bible (KJV, lol) ever do that? Often I've read in Holman and thought, this seems new, is that what it's getting at? and then I read again the familiar in KJV or look at another version, and there it is, clear as day, instead of obscured by archaic language. You can check out your favorite bits on Crosswalk.com and run a parallel between Holman and whatever study version you prefer.

Interesting, Mark, and I look forward to more to come. What are you using to refer to and research "the" holy "the" spirit (or not) - are you checking in an interlinear, or are you using some other source(s)?

Potato - "Face metling over trivialities." Exactly. All in the guise of telling us to be "meek" to God. Actually, that abuses God even more than it abuses us. We simply wouldn't have put up with this garbage elsewhere. If any church minister behaved in this manner now, would we put up with it? If TWI know-it-alls could have distanced themselves from their own egos, they would have seen that the specks of dust in our lives were just that, specks of dust; and not seen so very close up through their own egos so that dust was magnified into planks. Even then, the hurts wouldn't be there still so painfully if there were open and honest exposure, apology and rectification.

Whereas, Mike-of-God-for-our-Day-and-Time (MOGFODAT), your only rule for faith and practice is "PFAL is perfect with no errors whatsoever." I don't see mention of "the Hope" in that succinct definition either; nor of healing; nor of any promises. ANY promises. You've chosen to pick on me. Well, let me tell you that knowing God is light and in him there is no darkness also encompasses his willingness to heal, to deliver, his compassion, his kindness, that he never leaves nor forsakes us, and a whole lot more. Just like for you PFAL isn't just the PFAL book but all the other VPW books. Don't presume to tell me what I believe. You simply don't want to listen, you want to put words in my mouth - and in the mouths of other posters here. I know that since I have stopped being bogged down in the miry clay of PFAL, my life has been a whole lot better. I embrace God and see his tender mercies to me daily. I learned some principles from PFAL; I am learning a lot of other stuff from tender-hearted Christians who have also seen his tender mercies to them daily. Now get off your soap box, pulpit, or whatever you want to call it, before it sinks in the miry clay forever.

Yes, people might well have got hurt some other way. But they didn't have to get hurt by someone masquerading as a Teacher, a minister, a man of God, somebody who would help them and not hurt them, someone from whom they could have reasonable expectations of behavior. Everyone knows that this world has many people who are out to trick them, to dupe them, to harm them in some way or other. There are also many great people (and those people may or may not be Christians) who are open, generous, and would never hurt anyone. In worldly terms, we learn to be wary of others and to consider their motives. Even so, we may get fooled often enough. And hurt, in the process. From reading posts here at the Cafe, it seems there were quite a number of young and vulnerable people, especially women, who thought they had found safety and help - and perhaps they did, initially, at the lower levels of TWI. In the Christian area, we tend to be more trusting. We look to ministers to - well, minister, serve, us - not minister to themselves. We do not expect to get hurt in the Christian area. And if we are, we expect quick repentance and making up. Yes, people might well have got hurt. But probably not by church leaders, not so many people, not over such a long period. Nor would they expect to be abused and hurt by those close to the said offending minister(s) who had trained other minister(s) to hurt and abuse the congregation. Especially the vulnerable congregants who had specifically sought out help. Or had been forced by various means to expose their vulnerabilities. It's a mean thought by someone who hasn't learned compassion. And that's all I'm saying, before I get too riled up.

Mike, VPW introduced a significant amount of "spiritual darkness" into the lives of TWI followers. He pushed people into "greater spiritual darkness" and took away what light (understanding) they had. "The Word of God so living and real"? But it wasn't good enough for he himself to practice it, was it? You consistently negate the effect of his behavior yet it is his behavior that has introduced so much darkness: his behavior in his debauched lifestyle (nothing like that he compelled rank-and-file believers to practice) and his behavior in his debauched teachings (doctrine), which has driven people away from the living God. Therefore, his rule for faith and practice wasn't something that guided his own behavior - so why should it guide anyone else's?

Play a musical instrument. As of one week ago, someone gave me a 61 key wotchamacallit with 100 voices and 1000 stored tunes. Or some such. So no excuse for not learning something about playing a keyboard instrument. Especially when a close friend is a retired piano teacher...! Not that I can play yet, you understand, but I have found out how to turn it on.

It's arrived?!! :) Pikky please pleeeaaase! Congratulations to you and mum and all the best to the new arrival.

Any possibility you could scan it and post it here? Was that your first year in rez, or the second year? I only got to Gunnison in the summer, for the Family camps. No doubt a whole different place in the winter!

Yes. For those still with cult-induced fear of other Christian groups - any haven is worth having.

Mark, that kinda backs what I was posting at the same time. You want to know what specific signs concerning VPW were evident to people . I want to know what specific works concerning PFAL Mike has performed. There should be something, visible, evident to all, documentable. Mike??

Mike, let’s hear it from you. You have lots of words to say. You preach PFAL. Now I’d just like to know about the power that you have. Jesus says that you can do greater works than Jesus Christ. He raised the dead; made the blind to see; healed sick men and women of many types of disease; he calmed the weather; he enabled thousands upon thousands of people to eat; he turned water into wine; he walked on water; he enabled others to prosper in their businesses by catching megahauls of fish. All of these works are purely in the physical, in the here and now; there are visible results, benefits, profit for the people round about. He also cast out devil spirits. In addition to that, he confronted the elders of the established church. Now, you are happy to confront the patrons of the Café, all of whom at one time have professed to be Christians though some now profess that they are not. Jesus did not spend much of his time confronting believers; he confronted leadership. Dealing with devil spirits/demons was considered earlier in this thread (specifically in relation to you) and it may be better if we don’t discuss that side again. Please, would you tell us about how many of the works like those of Jesus YOU have performed? When, where, upon whom? Let’s see your POWER in manifestation, in this physical world, right now. Show us when and how, by using the special powers of PFAL, YOU yourself have performed a selection of the real, physical, documentable types of works that Jesus Christ himself performed. Otherwise: And your faith in PFAL is just words. Just dead words.

IN MEMORIAM Twinkle Twinkle, the family cat, has finally passed on, aged at least 16 years. She was found dead in her kennel this morning. Twinkle was a self-rescue cat. She was abandoned or did not travel with neighbours who moved out from down the road from my Mum, at least ten years ago. The cat wandered around for some months, scrounging what she could. Mum took pity and made a “nest” in a safe covered area. Gradually, the cat found her way into the house and onto laps. Mum did not want the tie of an animal and when she moved to a new house, left the cat with me. When I moved to my present city, the cat remained with Mum in her new home until I was settled. She never left her new home. Twinkle went missing last summer for several weeks (there’s a thread where people prayed for her safe return). She turned up, with her collar round her leg and neck, and with large open sores. The vet pronounced her generally healthy, and the sores would recover; but she was found to have a growth round her tummy which was inoperable. The vet said she would eventually be unable to pass food. Twinkle was a very affectionate cat. When she first came, she was aggressive and earned the name “Slasher” for her adeptness at hitting at people and animals. With kindness, however, she became a most dear and gentle pet. She was very purry and loved to be fondled. I called her a “bendy toy,” as she could be positioned however anyone chose. She enjoyed meeting visitors and sat on everyone’s lap when Mum’s house group came round last Wednesday. Twinkle slowed down, ceasing jumping and wanting to go out about a month ago. She stopped eating significantly about two weeks ago and has been looking for quiet dark hiding places. She did not eat or drink for the last three days and was found curled up in a normal sleeping posture this morning. She has been buried in her favourite spot in the garden. She will be greatly missed.

Sort of like this? There seems to be a nice arial sticking out of the side.

(looks on enviously, as she puts on another sweater and looks at the snow gently settling on the ice on the fish pond)

Hey Cheranne, how about also posting your Pumpkin Biscuits recipe on a thread Pumpkin Pie (and other pumpkin recipes) which is currently halfway down page 1 in In the Kitchen? (Easy to spot, for some reason this thread has acquired 4 (grease?)spots by it.)

Where is it you live, Leafy? Must be warm; those are summer things, not very early spring things. What do you plant in the summer?

No, Leafy, I meant the big stripey one that looks suspiciously like a ... tiger !!! Anyway, back to gardens... Just to show you what a great gardener I am, how timely, how absolutely ready... ... I've only just planted my daffodils and a few tulips. They should have been in the ground in October, latest November. But the weather was wet, cold and generally abysmal. That's my excuse, anyway. Right now, everyone else's daffs are showing 2-4" of leaf. On going to my shed to find the bulbs, what do you know but they have given up on waiting for me and started without me! There are nice little shoots appearing. So I've shoved them in - and some may produce flowers, a little late. They'll do better in the ground than they would in the shed, anyways. And they've certainly had their cold/chill period - well, actually, they're still having it but outdoors now; my fish pond has frozen over again this afternoon and the forecast is for very cold be very cold all this week.

Thanks, yes, there's lots of stuff out there, in booklets and online. Just wondering if people have found them helpful, and not (as prophesied by VPW) that they let you down. If people find them helpful in overcoming or rebutting TWI doctrines. If people found they were enabled to deal with things in their lives, walk closer with God.

Well, it took some of us a looooong time, years, to come to our senses, depending on how long we'd been in and what "level" we had achieved. We have to give him a loooooooooooooong time to come to his senses and then maybe he'll begin to realize, really realize, what he's done. Then, if he tried to go back to TWI (would he?), he'd be on spiritual probation for a further jolly loooooooooong time, supervised by RFR - who is too ambitious and too comfortable to ever give up the Prez-ship. Shedloads of WC did go out and simply start up new fellowships, from scratch, new people they witnessed to. It must be years since LCM "witnessed" to any new person. I reckon he would have tried. Then wondered why nobody wanted to listen to him. Especially if he got into his private interpretation of some of the most basic scriptures that churchy Christians know. Thanks for bringing this thread to Cafe attention again, WW.