Hope R.

3Cents wrote: What a perfect description of TWI's "present truth" or "revelation changed" doctrines. That statement is worthy of the GS Gems thread, IMO. And that's what is still happening in TWI today. That's why they haven't changed any of LCM's teachings. It makes so much sense. There's no one there now with the kind of crazy emotional outflow that LCM displayed. Therefore, there's been no change in his doctrines. Oldies said: Well, first of all, because it's good stewardship of the salary paid to the staffer with your ABS. Instead of giving the money to a landlord, the salaried employee is building up equity in his home. Second - what's the difference between being a full time TWI employee and working for the Post Office? Following your logic - my taxes pay Mr. Mailman's salary - why should he OWN a house on my dime? The President doesn't even OWN his house, does he? The nerve of Mr. Mailman! Whether or not their housing allowance is provided by TWI or they pay their own rent doesn't matter. Remember the "need basis" salary includes your rent. The TWI employees still write their checks to the landlord - just like you would with the earnings from your secular job. Third - it's none of anyone's business what I do with my paycheck. TWI, or the Post Office, or Wal Mart have no right to tell me whether I can or can not buy a home. The only people on salary are staffers at HQ's, Region Leaders and some Limb Leaders who have a few hundred people in their state (very few, if any). That leaves any Way Corps who do not get paid by TWI as well as plain old fellowship coordinators (formerly known as twig leaders) who are not allowed to have mortgages. If they do, they lose their responsibilites and can not attend certain classes. Who in their right mind would subject themselves to that???

Oy vey - such responsibility! Hmmmm Okay - Michael Douglas Jewel of the Nile Kathleen Turner

Hate to be a party pooper - but it was Kathleen Turner, not Diane Keaton who was in "Jewel of the Nile" - unless she had a cameo I'm not aware of. Hugh Grant Sense and Sensiblilty Emma Thompson

I've posted it before, so I won't write the whole thing again but... I got peed on... literally. I found it in the archives... Here's the whole lurid tale - the names have been changed to protect the not-so-innocent! It happened sometime in our first week - during orientation classes we had in the chapel. I was sitting on the end of the pew, another guy, (I'll call him Crusty) was to my right and Mr. Pee (no relation to Mr.P-Mosh) was to his right. I felt something wet behind me and asked Crusty if he'd spilled some water or something. He very quietly whispered, "The guy next to me peed in his pants." So I whispered back, "C'mon, really, did you spill something?" He then gritted his teeth and whispered more forcefully, "The guy next to me just peed in his pants! Look!" He shifted his eyes towards his right. I looked over Crusty at Mr. Pee and saw that the front of his WHITE pants was soaked... ugh. I was wearing a coat sweater - remember those? It was GROSS! Since I moved up towards the front of the pew when I first felt wet, the pee had by-passed me and went onto the floor next to me. A small puddle had formed. Before I knew it, LCM had dismissed the class and Mr. Pee was GONE. Then my Waybrain kicked in and I thought that perhaps there was something wrong with this guy. Maybe he was sick or had a bladder infection or something.Maybe I should minister to him!! I went up to him in the lunch line and asked him if he was okay. I told him I'd been sitting near him in the chapel and wanted to know if he needed to be prayed for. He said (and I believe this is a quote), "No, I'm fine. I just didn't want to get up in the middle of Reverand Martindale's teaching." I WANTED TO SCREAM! I told him he'd have to use some of his allowance to get my sweater DRY CLEANED. He really thought I was nuts, that he had done the right thing. How bizarre was THAT??? I should have taken that as a sign, I mean - who gets PEED on the first week of the Corps???? Yikes!!! BTW, he never gave me a nickel towards cleaning it. I think I washed the sweater in Woolite - but I can't recall ever wearing it again.

I have recently heard that not only are they still teaching the no-debt crap - but they are enforcing it more openly. Someone told me there were about 400 people who were not allowed to attend the Advanced Class Special in Dallas because of DEBT! This person suggested that the vast majority of these 400 people had only mortgage debt - not credit cards or car loans. Oh, and these were people who would have gone to this event if they were allowed to go! TWI has been shooting itself in the foot regarding debt for over 10 years now. Why are they surprised they're losing people over this issue. I would bet that TWI has lost more people due to their unreasonable debt-policy more than any other doctrine (other than LCM's sexual misconduct, of course). IMO, it would be so easy for them to change it - blame Craig - say he was wrong - that he was "off the word" at the time it was taught. Heck, they could do that for any doctrine he ever taught that they wanted to change. Sometimes I still marvel at their stupidity.

Never even heard of this film... how old is it? Was it made around the time that Judd Nelson was part of the "Brat Pack"? The only 2 things I remember him in (besides some bad TV shows)are "The Breakfast Club" and "St. Elmo's Fire".

Question: Has anyone ever told their kids not to lie and then later said: "If so-and-so calls, tell them I'm not here" ?? Is that a "white" lie? A fib? Remember the big X and little x in PFAL? I think there are degrees of "sin" - and what we were taught was an intentional lie in order to teach us that committing adultery was no worse than telling a fib.

Dustin Hoffman The Graduate Ann Bancroft Raf - that was the only time I looked - just couldn't remember if it was the same guy on "Deadwood" or not...

I had an aunt who was a pathilogical liar. She lied about things that wouldn't necessarily hurt anyone. Like - "My piano cost $2000", when it probably only cost $500. Or, "My daughter got straight A's on her report card" when I knew damn well she got a B in math. Her lies were intentional, frequent, and usually told to make herself look like she or my cousins were above everyone else. She wouldn't tell lies about anyone else - and they weren't "negative" lies per se (if you get what I mean). But they were lies. That's what I think of when I think of a liar - sorta like the John Lovitz guy without the comedy. My point - TWI told a LOT of that type of lie. I guess you could call them "puffed-up" lies. "We're the only ministry that has the accurate Word of God". ... or snow on the gas pumps I'm not saying that was the only type of lie they told - the things we've read here prove that! But lying isn't always about hurting someone else - sometimes it's an ego trip - like my aunt. Most of the time, you couldn't really prove she was lying - but then again, you couldn't trust a thing she said. Like TWI...

And how fast did Paul get Waydale running after they left HQ's? A month? Two? Basically TWI couldn't have realized the power of the internet or they would have put a site up to nullify Waydale immediately! Technophobia is still rampant in TWI. I spoke to someone who left recently who told me they snuck onto the internet a couple of years ago to check this and other ex-Way sites out. They didn't say this, but I believe these sites planted the seeds to enable them to leave without devastating them too much. Now, TWI has always printed personal stories of deliverance and victory in the "letters" section of the Way Rag. But how many of you honestly believe these letters weren't fabricated - or at least altered to make them more in line with TWI's doctrine? Heck, they didn't even put the writer's NAMES on the letters - only initials. That made them even less believable, IMO. (You guys who worked for the Way Rag - please let me know if my suspicions are correct or not). Even if they weren't fabricated, they were written in WaySpeak - especially in the 90's. Heck - we had to write "thank you" notes to LCM for the WAP class. Every word was checked to make sure it was in line with the "present truth". I'm disgusted just thinking about it... So yes - personal stories ON the internet helped bring TWI to it's knees. Gotta give them some credit for making it so easy to do.

Yeah, Lindy - and every WOW assignment was made spiritually also... uh huh.... dontcha know. Oh - the Veepmeister PERSONALLY made those assignments and got revelation from GAWD hisself as to where to send our young, naive butts. That's how I ended up as a WOW in San Antonio in 1974 with a family coordinator I HATED (the feeling was mutual). Oh - and my interim year in PINE BLUFF, ARKANSAS - which had to be the worst year of my life. That was a real spiffy "spiritual decision" all right. And if you believe that - I know some property along Alligator Alley in S. Florida that would be a wonderful retirement spot....

Got it Raf.... Brad Dourif? The only reason I recognize the name is that he's in "Deadwood" on HBO and does a fabulous job playing the town doctor. I never thought I'd seen him before so I cheated a bit and checked the Internet Movie Data Base (IMDb) site to see what else he was in. Once I saw the movie titles - I was like, duh - of COURSE that was him... Lord of the Rings: The Return of the King (He was Wormtongue!) Orlando Bloom Black Hawk Down (betcha thought I was gonna use the "Pirates... " movie!)

Sky - Paul & Bev M**qu*da didn't skulk out of town. Not at all. They left shortly after he taught the live DTA class on Memorial Day weekend in 2000. Oh, and they were in the Pacific NW - Washington, I believe. There's a document on the GS main site called "How to Extracate Yourself: A Guide to Liberty" (click here) John and I had only met Paul once each at the Advanced Classes in RC sometime in the mid 90's. When he saw John's "Letters to Rosalie" on Waydale - he called us to make sure we were okay. I think he spent 2 hours on the phone with John assuring him he'd made the right decision about writing those letters and leaving TWI for good. I'm sure you could reach him without looking too far. He might even be lurking here. Like I said, I never had too many encounters with him before the "new" AC - and I'm sure there are people out there who may not like him (he was the Family Corps Coor.), but I don't believe he's hiding from anyone - he's probably just busy getting on with his life.

Raf.... huh? Looks okay on my end of the internet! There's Something About Mary Ben Stiller The Royal Tenenbaums

Jon Lovitz The Stepford Wives (2004) Bette Midler

"Classification and Status Designations" dated 2/12/98 - from the Waydale Documents section of Grease Spot. It's a PDF file. Wonder what LCM's status designation is today?

Oldies - Yup - she was the "womens" coordinator. That's probably why you didn't get to know her. She was (and probably still is) very nice. One of the most compassionate women I've ever met. Wish she woulda stayed instead of LCM! Imagine how different things would have turned out (**sigh**). I was told many years later that the reason she got that assignment in Emporia was that VP was trying to match her up with LCM. Talk about oil and water. Catcup - I remember that "shoulder" incident as well. I'll bet the guys who hoisted him up turned out to be the Craig Clones® - and I bet we (and alfakat and geek) can name most of them.

We saw them a few years ago at the USF Sundome. They had a nice-sized orchestra on stage with them. I think I recall someone telling me that they used local orchestras for their concerts - sending them the music well before-hand. I thought that was great. I'm trying to get Green Day tickets for April 18th here in Tampa. My daughter thinks it's hysterical. She's learning Beatles songs on guitar and I'm learning Green Day songs on mine... what's wrong with that picture???

When Harry Met Sally Carrie Fisher Hannah and Her Sisters

The problem with Trancechat is that there was no moderation to speak of. I could sign in as Satori, and Satori could sign in as Radar, etc. (HCW can attest to it - he was a frequent poster there). If you didn't want to use a log-in name at all, it automatically put "No one" on your post. I know that there were people at HQ's signing in as regulars there. Coolwaters can vouch for that one, too - lots of nasty posts were attributed to her that I now doubt she actually wrote. I'm pretty sure that Mr. L*nder contributed to that little mess (hi John - how goes it?). So I don't think your conspiracy theory can be substantiated here at GS. Paw may allow people have plenty of rope to hang themselves with - but I believe he keeps an eye on things carefully enough to know whether the WayGB is posting here or not. And honestly, I don't think people are giving Howard any good or bad advice regarding you, Satori. He's smart enough to figure it out for himself.

The Horse Whisperer Dianne Wiest The Birdcage damn - this can get addicting, can't it?

Bye Bye Birdie Dick Van Dyke Mary Poppins (is that the way it's done? I just got here!)

LCM was put in charge of the Corps starting with the 5th. My3Cents can speak more about it from experience - but I heard stories that they really didn't like him very much. I was in the 6th. It was the first Corps to be in Emporia full time, the first Corps to be away from HQ's, and the first Corps to not have VP around. Craig and S^nny S@nders were the designated Corps Coordinators, but Craig pretty much took charge of things. I remember he turned 27 in November of our first year. TWENTY-SEVEN!!! There were about 350 of us in the 6th - with no "elder" Corps except for a handful of 5th Corps who were there for their interim year. (hmmmm, Ken S., Mike S., Nik M., Debbi H.... who am I forgetting?) The Koomri@n's were there as well - but I don't remember what their official titles were. All I remember is that Mrs. K played a mean organ! Don & Wanda W. were there too - he was in charge of the "college" division at the time. That was it. Most of us worshipped LCM in the beginning. He was the great motivator. I think he more fun and a lot kinder during the first few months we were there. He did funny things - like dressing up in stripped pants and a plaid shirt, putting goggles on and sneaking around behind the chairs at a 5:30 a.m. teaching (usually a tape) with a squirt gun - spritzing anyone who appeared to be nodding off. But then, I think it was in March, S^nny dared to defy his authority and the whole Corps got dismissed. Seems she had gathered together a small group of Corps who were loyal to her. She didn't like Craig - thought he yelled too much - didn't care for his methods. People who got reamed by him would go to her for comfort - and I think she got sick of it. Anyway - she left - we all got dismissed - had to write on the back of a 3x5 card whether or not we wanted to come back - if not - we were to pack our bags and leave the next morning. I think about 50 - 60 people left at that point. After that - LCM was IT! He started getting louder, and tougher, and more "mog-gish". It got worse as the year went on - but it was gradual and by then, we'd all been programmed - we were used to it. Hindsight is always 20/20, isn't it? I probably should have left when Sunny did... would have been spared a lot of grief.

When I was younger in the 70's and in the "programs", I took reproof very personally. It went right to my heart. I accepted the judgements and instructions and did my best to change. It didn't matter how I felt about the situation - I must be wrong! Later in the 80's... as I got older and wiser - I tried to give my point of view, as rationally and calmly as possible. That usually didn't work either. But I'd nod my head in agreement, and make some behavior modifications - enough to show I was trying to change. But I did not take it to heart as much as I did when I was younger. So, fast foward to the 90's. Craig is spitting and screaming about everything from Angels to Y2K. There isn't much to agree with and when John or I were reproved (mostly by Bub Moneyhands), we would nod in agreement and do whatever we wanted to anyway. I used to consider myself a "Stepford" believer. Smiling sweetly and saying all the right ministry lines - while inside I was seething and anxious to get the hell outta Dodge!

Sure, I was hurt by people in TWI - but not as badly as others who have posted here. My hurt involved my self-worth and I still feel the effects of some of the opinions that "leadership" had about me. But now, even more than that, I think what hurts me the most is finding out about the people I love who have been abused and demeaned more than I can imagine. My heart just breaks when I hear some of the things they were put through in TWI. Compared to many of them, my "bad things" were a mere picnic.