Are you kidding? EVERYONE knows that the proper etiquette requires that Malt liquor be drunk from a Mason jar. Sheesh.. do I have to tell you guys everything???
It goes way beyond the typical "black and white" conflict that goes on here in the USA.
It's what drives the Suni/Shiite conflict in Iraq.
It's what drives the Israeli/ Palestinian conflict---and on and on.
It's basic human nature not to like everybody(especially those who are perceived to be some sort of threat.)
That's the point at which a person must decide whether or not they want to rise above their emotion and make a conscious effort to treat everyone with fairness and respect.
As to the MLK festivities, the day was never set aside as a day to have sales on radial tires or throw parties. It was originally intended to be a day to dwell on the principles he advocated.
Would it be a correct assumption to say that all the students involved in the mlk spoof were white?
How would a play written, produced and performed by the college's international students go over if it stereotypically portrays Americans as unilingual and ignorant of other cultures while arrogantly assuming what is best for them, greedy, drowning in debt, blindly paying allegiance to their nations symbols while eschewing the founding principles that give them meaning, and holding life sacred as long as it is in the womb but declaring open season on it once born.
Re:"...if it stereotypically portrays Americans as unilingual and ignorant of other cultures while arrogantly assuming what is best for them, greedy, drowning in debt, blindly paying allegiance to their nations symbols while eschewing the founding principles that give them meaning.."
Hey! You're talking about Boss Hog and the Dukes of Hazzard aren't 'ya?? But its OK to make fun of Southerners today. Make 'em out to be big stupid Jethro Bodines and ignorant Jed Clampetts and everybody howls with laughter. Stereotyping is just fine for them. But make fun of "protected" groups and you get labeled a bigot, right?
Naw, I didn't have any of 'dem boys in mind, Hoss. There is enough inspiration here on the shore of Lake Michigan actually. From one good ol' boy to another I never liked the Dukes because of its portrayal of our kind as knuckle dragging, cigar chomping evolutionary laggards.
Now about Beverly Hillbillies. Didn't you catch how the homespun smarts of Jed was always a few steps ahead of his urbane counterparts and reels in his nephew during his errant forays into sophistication.
But its OK to make fun of Southerners today. Make 'em out to be big stupid Jethro Bodines and ignorant Jed Clampetts and everybody howls with laughter. Stereotyping is just fine for them. But make fun of "protected" groups and you get labeled a bigot, right?
sudo
Good point! I hadn't thought of that...I guess I wasn't aware that Southerners were sensitive about that stereotype (not being a Southerner).
I do get so tired of political correctness but at the same time, when I see a past or current example of actual cruelty based on bigotry, it's very upsetting every time.
Oenophile
Didn't you catch how the homespun smarts of Jed was always a few steps ahead of his urbane counterparts and reels in his nephew during his errant forays into sophistication.
Now that's the stereotype I'm familiar with! Ha ha. That one and the dumbbell one. :P So they balance each other out!
For what it's worth --- coupla years ago, a lady was found in Minneapolis (I forget her name),
who had been involved in a bank burglary (and a murdered guard), in California, back in the 1970's.
She had led an exemplary life (after the fact), so the general *hue and cry* up here,
after she was found out was --- "Let her go!!. (but she was STILL complicit to a murder).
Same year -- a 70 or so year old guy some where down south,
gets caught for a 40 year old *hate crime*, where two young black men were murdered.
Everyone is yelling -- HANG HIM.
Interesting fact -- I was talking with my mom on the phone, when all of this was going on.
She and I can be oil and water, when it comes to situations like this,
and she asked me point blank (about the Mpls. woman) --
"But she did good with the rest of her life! Doesn't that count for something?"
To which I replied -- "But that guy down south did the same.
You want to see him exonerated for his past deeds too?"
For once Mom shut up, and had no more to say.
To me -- this is racism in reverse. :(
FALSE analogy Mr. Miller.
While Sara Jane whatshername REPUDIATED her former lifestyle, the KKK member/former law enforcement officer in MISSISSIPPI did NOT repudiate HIS former acts.
Now, clearly both have had to face the music for their misdeeds, but your portrayal of the dichotomy left out important nuances which made the situations subject to the different public outcries.
And I'm NOT suggesting the gal -- who participated in bank robberies in the 1970s and was involved in situations in which law enforcement officer(s) were killed -- be let off the hook.
I just believe I there are tangible reasons for the different public reactions.
P.S. -- when will racism end?
When HE11 freezes over... in fact, a great deal (but not all) of the consternation in our contemporary time over illegal immigration can be attributed to racism.
When HE11 freezes over... in fact, a great deal (but not all) of the consternation in our contemporary time over illegal immigration can be attributed to racism
Very true and it cuts both ways
The person of any color who feels that they are more entitled or better than the person next to them
It can be the white guy who sees all Hispanics as illiterate field hands here illegally
It can be the Black woman who is convinced that every word that comes out of a white persons mouth has some hidden racially offensive meaning
The Mexican immigrant who feels that it would be much better if the El Savaldorians in his neighborhood and the blacks would just leave
The Japanese who feels that the Okinawans down the street are a disgrace
The Muslim woman afraid to go to the store alone for fear
And the list goes on and on
Racism is more that just the attitudes we bring to the table
It is the attitudes we are perceived as bringing to the table by others
Maybe there would be less racism if we all stopped jumping to conclusions
Saw "Crash" (the movie) and I was impressed with the light on the concept of racism it shined.
I personally think racism is best addressed and eliminated on a personal level, with the personal determination to do the right thing, irregardless of the external circumstances and response.
The Bible, in Ephesians, gives the people of God direction on social decorum which is not governed by external circumstances but only on our trust and confidence in the Lord and His power to protect and deliver us in all situations.
This is an interesting thread...imagine being a white guy in Africa surrounded by "Africans" in South Africa, the crime capitol of the world and you want to raise a subject like this!, just before they are about to cut your balls off? Go read the SA press but be prepared for a wake up call! I leave for my next Bumpytour for one month next week to SA. Seriously check out some RSS leads and you will realize "intellectual" approaches to your American experience is irrelevant. Trust me, racism is inherent in all cultures and people. The politically correct hypocrites will talk their liberal crap, but when push comes to shove in an open parking place, that guy standing next to your car is trouble!
This is an interesting thread...imagine being a white guy in Africa surrounded by "Africans" in South Africa, the crime capitol of the world and you want to raise a subject like this!, just before they are about to cut your balls off?
Bumpy,
Without excusing the imagined behavior of the scenario that you present, it does beg a question. How did such ill will come to be? I am sure you have your thoughts on the matter which most likely differ from someone who has emerged from under the boot of Apartheid a mere decade ago.
Clever Question, but I think Rev. Tutu answered it by saying how the country has "lost it's way" since the removal of white rule. You can find his press releases for yourself. This for me is not just a post apartheid question of victimization, but the brutal question of how to solve a crime problem out of control. It is not a question of turning the table on the Whitie, because most of the bloodshed is due to social, tribal, economic, drug, carjackings...you name it, involving blacks, browns and immigrants. Again, go to a SA news website and find out for yourself. You be the judge, then you might like to visit Krueger?
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Sudo
Coolchef,
Are you kidding? EVERYONE knows that the proper etiquette requires that Malt liquor be drunk from a Mason jar. Sheesh.. do I have to tell you guys everything???
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coolchef
lol!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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waysider
"Will racism ever end?"
Honestly, I don't think it will.
It goes way beyond the typical "black and white" conflict that goes on here in the USA.
It's what drives the Suni/Shiite conflict in Iraq.
It's what drives the Israeli/ Palestinian conflict---and on and on.
It's basic human nature not to like everybody(especially those who are perceived to be some sort of threat.)
That's the point at which a person must decide whether or not they want to rise above their emotion and make a conscious effort to treat everyone with fairness and respect.
As to the MLK festivities, the day was never set aside as a day to have sales on radial tires or throw parties. It was originally intended to be a day to dwell on the principles he advocated.
(Says he, as he steps down from his soapbox.)
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oenophile
Would it be a correct assumption to say that all the students involved in the mlk spoof were white?
How would a play written, produced and performed by the college's international students go over if it stereotypically portrays Americans as unilingual and ignorant of other cultures while arrogantly assuming what is best for them, greedy, drowning in debt, blindly paying allegiance to their nations symbols while eschewing the founding principles that give them meaning, and holding life sacred as long as it is in the womb but declaring open season on it once born.
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Sudo
Oenophile,
Re:"...if it stereotypically portrays Americans as unilingual and ignorant of other cultures while arrogantly assuming what is best for them, greedy, drowning in debt, blindly paying allegiance to their nations symbols while eschewing the founding principles that give them meaning.."
Hey! You're talking about Boss Hog and the Dukes of Hazzard aren't 'ya?? But its OK to make fun of Southerners today. Make 'em out to be big stupid Jethro Bodines and ignorant Jed Clampetts and everybody howls with laughter. Stereotyping is just fine for them. But make fun of "protected" groups and you get labeled a bigot, right?
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oenophile
Sudo,
Naw, I didn't have any of 'dem boys in mind, Hoss. There is enough inspiration here on the shore of Lake Michigan actually. From one good ol' boy to another I never liked the Dukes because of its portrayal of our kind as knuckle dragging, cigar chomping evolutionary laggards.
Now about Beverly Hillbillies. Didn't you catch how the homespun smarts of Jed was always a few steps ahead of his urbane counterparts and reels in his nephew during his errant forays into sophistication.
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Siouxzahn
Sudo
Good point! I hadn't thought of that...I guess I wasn't aware that Southerners were sensitive about that stereotype (not being a Southerner).I do get so tired of political correctness but at the same time, when I see a past or current example of actual cruelty based on bigotry, it's very upsetting every time.
Oenophile
Now that's the stereotype I'm familiar with! Ha ha. That one and the dumbbell one. :P So they balance each other out!
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dmiller
For what it's worth --- coupla years ago, a lady was found in Minneapolis (I forget her name),
who had been involved in a bank burglary (and a murdered guard), in California, back in the 1970's.
She had led an exemplary life (after the fact), so the general *hue and cry* up here,
after she was found out was --- "Let her go!!. (but she was STILL complicit to a murder).
Same year -- a 70 or so year old guy some where down south,
gets caught for a 40 year old *hate crime*, where two young black men were murdered.
Everyone is yelling -- HANG HIM.
Interesting fact -- I was talking with my mom on the phone, when all of this was going on.
She and I can be oil and water, when it comes to situations like this,
and she asked me point blank (about the Mpls. woman) --
"But she did good with the rest of her life! Doesn't that count for something?"
To which I replied -- "But that guy down south did the same.
You want to see him exonerated for his past deeds too?"
For once Mom shut up, and had no more to say.
To me -- this is racism in reverse. :(
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Rocky
FALSE analogy Mr. Miller.
While Sara Jane whatshername REPUDIATED her former lifestyle, the KKK member/former law enforcement officer in MISSISSIPPI did NOT repudiate HIS former acts.
Now, clearly both have had to face the music for their misdeeds, but your portrayal of the dichotomy left out important nuances which made the situations subject to the different public outcries.
And I'm NOT suggesting the gal -- who participated in bank robberies in the 1970s and was involved in situations in which law enforcement officer(s) were killed -- be let off the hook.
I just believe I there are tangible reasons for the different public reactions.
P.S. -- when will racism end?
When HE11 freezes over... in fact, a great deal (but not all) of the consternation in our contemporary time over illegal immigration can be attributed to racism.
And I'm NOT accusing any GSers of racism.
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dmiller
Sarah Jane -- thanks Rocky -- I didn't remember that.
Regardless -- I don't see it as a false analogy.
Two folks did crimes many years ago.
They got caught, some (how ever many), years later.
I really don't give a ratzz ^^^ as to how they lived their lives, in the aftermath.
The point I was trying to make to my mom on the phone,
(as she was willing to forgive one, and condemn the other), was simply this:
"Do the crime --Pay the time.
BOTH OF THESE TWO WERE GUILTY OF MURDER.
Someone pulled back the sheets of the bed they were laying in some 40 years later.
Both of them were caught with pants down.
But one (Sarah Jane) -- seems to get a ticket to freedom,
whereas the other does not -- he's castigated as a racist, murderer of black men,
while this *poor white woman* merely helped murder a bank guard.
So -- that's what I meant by REVERSE discrimination. It happens all the time.
I'm not going to accuse you of having bought into it too ---
but it sure looks like it.
For what it's worth -- I'd like to see BOTH of them get the death penalty -- even all these years later.
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templelady
Very true and it cuts both ways
The person of any color who feels that they are more entitled or better than the person next to them
It can be the white guy who sees all Hispanics as illiterate field hands here illegally
It can be the Black woman who is convinced that every word that comes out of a white persons mouth has some hidden racially offensive meaning
The Mexican immigrant who feels that it would be much better if the El Savaldorians in his neighborhood and the blacks would just leave
The Japanese who feels that the Okinawans down the street are a disgrace
The Muslim woman afraid to go to the store alone for fear
And the list goes on and on
Racism is more that just the attitudes we bring to the table
It is the attitudes we are perceived as bringing to the table by others
Maybe there would be less racism if we all stopped jumping to conclusions
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Sushi
But Mo, this is the only exercise some people get.
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Kit Sober
Saw "Crash" (the movie) and I was impressed with the light on the concept of racism it shined.
I personally think racism is best addressed and eliminated on a personal level, with the personal determination to do the right thing, irregardless of the external circumstances and response.
The Bible, in Ephesians, gives the people of God direction on social decorum which is not governed by external circumstances but only on our trust and confidence in the Lord and His power to protect and deliver us in all situations.
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Bumpy
This is an interesting thread...imagine being a white guy in Africa surrounded by "Africans" in South Africa, the crime capitol of the world and you want to raise a subject like this!, just before they are about to cut your balls off? Go read the SA press but be prepared for a wake up call! I leave for my next Bumpytour for one month next week to SA. Seriously check out some RSS leads and you will realize "intellectual" approaches to your American experience is irrelevant. Trust me, racism is inherent in all cultures and people. The politically correct hypocrites will talk their liberal crap, but when push comes to shove in an open parking place, that guy standing next to your car is trouble!
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oenophile
Bumpy,
Without excusing the imagined behavior of the scenario that you present, it does beg a question. How did such ill will come to be? I am sure you have your thoughts on the matter which most likely differ from someone who has emerged from under the boot of Apartheid a mere decade ago.
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Bumpy
Clever Question, but I think Rev. Tutu answered it by saying how the country has "lost it's way" since the removal of white rule. You can find his press releases for yourself. This for me is not just a post apartheid question of victimization, but the brutal question of how to solve a crime problem out of control. It is not a question of turning the table on the Whitie, because most of the bloodshed is due to social, tribal, economic, drug, carjackings...you name it, involving blacks, browns and immigrants. Again, go to a SA news website and find out for yourself. You be the judge, then you might like to visit Krueger?
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