Stop believing what TWI taught you about "spiritual sight" and go make an appt. with a licensed physician. I don't mean to be harsh ... but I am concerned. That kind of thing is not normal. I want you to be well.
thanks man,i allready did 7 yrs of it,my concern is for those who can't afford it,why are we here anyway,to make jokes i can do that on my space. their are still ALOT OF PEOPLE just surfacing and need to hear this. peace man..
I'm not going to agree or disagree with what OK City said he saw, but TWI is not the only group that talks about spiritual sight, or revelation or visions. And I will always remember somthing that happened to me along these lines.
I left TWI in about '77 and when I begain looking at the Bible again, around '98, I remembered with fondness TWI, not knowing any of the things that had happened since '77. Not having a phone number or any other means of getting a hold of them I drove with a group of Bible loving friends to Headquaters. I was amazed and appaled at the new Auditorium because it seemed to be the opposite of what I thought they stood for. Then suddenly, before I got out of the car I literally saw a tree that was dying from the roots up. Then when I went inside and sat down in the Auditorium I looked around and "saw" parts of the wall come down like falling plaster and worms crawling through the walls behind.
I would say that is a pretty good indication of what I found TWI to be when I begain working with them again for a few months. I didn't stay long, but I wish I had paid attention to what I saw and left immediatly.
I was brand new in The Word, had not taken the class, and had spoken in tongues for the first time only a day or two before this happened. I knew almost nothing about TWI or VPW.
My twig leader gave me a "lift list" and told me to "lift" the people on it.
The first one on the list was VPW.
I had seen a picture of him in Way Ragazine.
As I tried to visualize him, I saw this image of him, wearing one of those scarf ties that I later discovered he liked to wear.
He looked straight at me, smirked and flipped me the bird!!
It was not a dream, I wasn't asleep.
It was not a hallucination because I knew it was not real.
(and I wasn't stoned.)
I don't know how else to describe it but it was very vivid and intense.
It never happened to me again.
For years, I felt guilty that I had let my mind think this of such a great Man of God.(cough)
I have no idea if it was revelation or "bad chicken" or what it was but I can tell you that it really did happen.
For a long time, every time I would "lift" VPW, I would have to force myself to forget that experience.
I know that at one time I "ate the brown acid" but... I've never had anything like that happen... and I was there at Emporia when you "saw" that... I guess I missed it all...
I was never a part of any ministry or cult that resembled anything like that which was described in the first post, and I was with The Way from 75 till 91.
I do remember the SNS tape "The Current Psychological Hoax", and listened to it while I was in Oregon. And I remember being appalled that anyone would think that The Way was anything like Jim Jones's cult. I do remember the impact that the news had on my twig though. I had a whole family coming to my twig, a retarded child and all, who, after hearing the news about the "colt" as they put it, ceased to come to fellowship anymore, and I was really pi$$ed about that. I was doing nothing more than teaching that family about Jesus Christ our Lord, and then wham! The "Oregonian" got to them and it was all over. Hacked me off big time.
Jim Jones was way whack and was a murderer, and The Way ministry I was involved with, warts and all, was NOTHING like The People's Temple that Jim Jones was the leader of.
DUDE, I think that your "vision" is way off base. I don't know what to tell you to do about it, but, it was/is way off base...
I know that at one time I "ate the brown acid" but... I've never had anything like that happen... and I was there at Emporia when you "saw" that... I guess I missed it all...
hey i was their too. the flashback(if you want to call it that )happens years,decades after the fact.
I was never a part of any ministry or cult that resembled anything like that which was described in the first post, and I was with The Way from 75 till 91.
I do remember the SNS tape "The Current Psychological Hoax", and listened to it while I was in Oregon. And I remember being appalled that anyone would think that The Way was anything like Jim Jones's cult. I do remember the impact that the news had on my twig though. I had a whole family coming to my twig, a retarded child and all, who, after hearing the news about the "colt" as they put it, ceased to come to fellowship anymore, and I was really pi$$ed about that. I was doing nothing more than teaching that family about Jesus Christ our Lord, and then wham! The "Oregonian" got to them and it was all over. Hacked me off big time.
Jim Jones was way whack and was a murderer, and The Way ministry I was involved with, warts and all, was NOTHING like The People's Temple that Jim Jones was the leader of.
DUDE, I think that your "vision" is way off base. I don't know what to tell you to do about it, but, it was/is way off base...
I'm not posting this as some sort of slam on TWI or to discredit the legitimate work that was done by many caring individuals who were part of the organization.
I'm simply stating that this incident happened to me.
No one else was involved.
Call it revelation, call it psychic premonition, call it spirit guides, call it yo' Mama, call it what ever you like.
The point is, it happened on an individual level.
It's not like an entire congregation seeing a vision simultaneously.
There were some key elements that I personally found interesting.
1. I knew very little about The Way at that time, much less the terrible things I would come to discover decades later.
(In fact, I think there were very,very few who did know anything about the dark side of TWI in 1972.)
2. I knew almost nothing about VPW.
I had seen one picture in the way magazine that had him posing behind a podium or something like that.
3. I had no idea that he wore those scarf ties until some time later.
(Might have been CF&S in 1974.)
4. I presented this to the local leader who discounted it as a case of "unrenewed mind".
Man, can you imagine how unrenewed your mind would have to be to see a burning bush or hear a donkey talking?
If it was God talking to me, I don't think He was telling me to shout it from the mountain top.
I think He was trying to warn me as an individual.
The whole thing kind of reminds me of some guy who sees a bright light in the sky and notifies authorities.
Next thing you know, some reporter is holding a microphone in front of him saying, "Soooo, Mr. Smith, do you believe this proves there is life on other planets?"
To which Mr. Smith replies, "Heck if I know. I just know I saw a bright light in the sky."
so i'm not saying lingo that you in your own little world weren't helping people (and i mean that)
just don't dismiss everyone, ok ?
Why thank you "cathedra". But I do dismiss people who allude to some "fact" that The Way was anything like Jim Jones's suicidal cult. I know that your life is miserable because of your involvement with The Way, because you have stated it over and again, and, I wish you Godspeed and deliverance. But you must admit that we Ex-Wayfers have, by enlarge, fared far better than those 900 people who died at "Jonestown", ya know what I mean? At least we are still living and breathing, ya know? Count yer blessings girl, and breath a sigh of relief. Peace be unto you Excie...
sometimes I think we get what we REALLY ask for. "what kinda organization am I really involved with.." I think.. no matter where you are at any one particular time.. things are really screwed up.
but don't ask.. "what's REALLY in us.." unless you are fireproof..
:)
I asked that once..
made the brown acid look like a little walk in the park.
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coolchef
surley you say this in jest!!??
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man
Stop believing what TWI taught you about "spiritual sight" and go make an appt. with a licensed physician. I don't mean to be harsh ... but I am concerned. That kind of thing is not normal. I want you to be well.
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cheranne
thanks man,i allready did 7 yrs of it,my concern is for those who can't afford it,why are we here anyway,to make jokes i can do that on my space. their are still ALOT OF PEOPLE just surfacing and need to hear this. peace man..
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Keith
I'm not going to agree or disagree with what OK City said he saw, but TWI is not the only group that talks about spiritual sight, or revelation or visions. And I will always remember somthing that happened to me along these lines.
I left TWI in about '77 and when I begain looking at the Bible again, around '98, I remembered with fondness TWI, not knowing any of the things that had happened since '77. Not having a phone number or any other means of getting a hold of them I drove with a group of Bible loving friends to Headquaters. I was amazed and appaled at the new Auditorium because it seemed to be the opposite of what I thought they stood for. Then suddenly, before I got out of the car I literally saw a tree that was dying from the roots up. Then when I went inside and sat down in the Auditorium I looked around and "saw" parts of the wall come down like falling plaster and worms crawling through the walls behind.
I would say that is a pretty good indication of what I found TWI to be when I begain working with them again for a few months. I didn't stay long, but I wish I had paid attention to what I saw and left immediatly.
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waysider
Yup
Had a somewhat similar experience in 1972.
I was brand new in The Word, had not taken the class, and had spoken in tongues for the first time only a day or two before this happened. I knew almost nothing about TWI or VPW.
My twig leader gave me a "lift list" and told me to "lift" the people on it.
The first one on the list was VPW.
I had seen a picture of him in Way Ragazine.
As I tried to visualize him, I saw this image of him, wearing one of those scarf ties that I later discovered he liked to wear.
He looked straight at me, smirked and flipped me the bird!!
It was not a dream, I wasn't asleep.
It was not a hallucination because I knew it was not real.
(and I wasn't stoned.)
I don't know how else to describe it but it was very vivid and intense.
It never happened to me again.
For years, I felt guilty that I had let my mind think this of such a great Man of God.(cough)
I have no idea if it was revelation or "bad chicken" or what it was but I can tell you that it really did happen.
For a long time, every time I would "lift" VPW, I would have to force myself to forget that experience.
It's wacky, I know, but you asked so I told you.
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Tom Strange
I know that at one time I "ate the brown acid" but... I've never had anything like that happen... and I was there at Emporia when you "saw" that... I guess I missed it all...
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WhiteDove
Is this the CES thread?> Will more spiders appear soon?
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J0nny Ling0
I was never a part of any ministry or cult that resembled anything like that which was described in the first post, and I was with The Way from 75 till 91.
I do remember the SNS tape "The Current Psychological Hoax", and listened to it while I was in Oregon. And I remember being appalled that anyone would think that The Way was anything like Jim Jones's cult. I do remember the impact that the news had on my twig though. I had a whole family coming to my twig, a retarded child and all, who, after hearing the news about the "colt" as they put it, ceased to come to fellowship anymore, and I was really pi$$ed about that. I was doing nothing more than teaching that family about Jesus Christ our Lord, and then wham! The "Oregonian" got to them and it was all over. Hacked me off big time.
Jim Jones was way whack and was a murderer, and The Way ministry I was involved with, warts and all, was NOTHING like The People's Temple that Jim Jones was the leader of.
DUDE, I think that your "vision" is way off base. I don't know what to tell you to do about it, but, it was/is way off base...
Cheers!
JL
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excathedra
ok
haven't read the thread yet, but i didn't see anytihing awful about the opening post
thank you
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cheranne
hey i was their too. the flashback(if you want to call it that )happens years,decades after the fact.
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excathedra
ok i want to thank keith and waysider
now i'll go read lingo's post
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cheranne
in time...time will tell
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excathedra
--
ok read that
--
how does anyone KNOW what evil one sees or what "revelation" someone gets
i happen to believe people
so i'm not saying lingo that you in your own little world weren't helping people (and i mean that)
just don't dismiss everyone, ok ?
--
and whitedove, the spider comment is not relevant
--
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cheranne
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excathedra
never thought it was in jest
and lingo, the part about "a retarded child and all" was really silly (sorry)
thanks OCW for you honesty
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excathedra
ps. waysider (i respect that poster a lot) mentioned 1972
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excathedra
okay here's a really CRAZY scary idea
we might all be wrong
ohmyfrikkingod !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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sirguessalot
oddly enough, i think your crazy scary idea might be right, e
i suspect that in one sense...all of humanity is quite broken, disturbed and out of its mind
the GSC is just a cozy corner culture of all our beautiful madness
i think its safe to say that strange visionary experiences are common
and have been throughout all history...all races...all cultures
the nature and variety of states and stages of consciousness experienced by humanity is as exotic as any wilderness
though that is not to say they cannot be studied and explored and catalogued like any naturalist would study the wild
i think its important to note that how we interpret the meanings and causes of those experiences vary just as wildly
and of course, how we interpret the same experience may change as we change (if we change)
and by "how we interpret a visionary experience," i dont just mean "what i say it means," but the process of interpretation
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waysider
Yes, we might all be wrong.
But I don't think so.
That's just my opinion.
I'm not posting this as some sort of slam on TWI or to discredit the legitimate work that was done by many caring individuals who were part of the organization.
I'm simply stating that this incident happened to me.
No one else was involved.
Call it revelation, call it psychic premonition, call it spirit guides, call it yo' Mama, call it what ever you like.
The point is, it happened on an individual level.
It's not like an entire congregation seeing a vision simultaneously.
There were some key elements that I personally found interesting.
1. I knew very little about The Way at that time, much less the terrible things I would come to discover decades later.
(In fact, I think there were very,very few who did know anything about the dark side of TWI in 1972.)
2. I knew almost nothing about VPW.
I had seen one picture in the way magazine that had him posing behind a podium or something like that.
3. I had no idea that he wore those scarf ties until some time later.
(Might have been CF&S in 1974.)
4. I presented this to the local leader who discounted it as a case of "unrenewed mind".
Man, can you imagine how unrenewed your mind would have to be to see a burning bush or hear a donkey talking?
If it was God talking to me, I don't think He was telling me to shout it from the mountain top.
I think He was trying to warn me as an individual.
The whole thing kind of reminds me of some guy who sees a bright light in the sky and notifies authorities.
Next thing you know, some reporter is holding a microphone in front of him saying, "Soooo, Mr. Smith, do you believe this proves there is life on other planets?"
To which Mr. Smith replies, "Heck if I know. I just know I saw a bright light in the sky."
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excathedra
thank you waysider
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J0nny Ling0
i
Why thank you "cathedra". But I do dismiss people who allude to some "fact" that The Way was anything like Jim Jones's suicidal cult. I know that your life is miserable because of your involvement with The Way, because you have stated it over and again, and, I wish you Godspeed and deliverance. But you must admit that we Ex-Wayfers have, by enlarge, fared far better than those 900 people who died at "Jonestown", ya know what I mean? At least we are still living and breathing, ya know? Count yer blessings girl, and breath a sigh of relief. Peace be unto you Excie...
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WhiteDove
Flashback visions, personal spiders, seems to relate to each other Sounds like it all comes from the same source to me.
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Ham
sometimes I think we get what we REALLY ask for. "what kinda organization am I really involved with.." I think.. no matter where you are at any one particular time.. things are really screwed up.
but don't ask.. "what's REALLY in us.." unless you are fireproof..
:)
I asked that once..
made the brown acid look like a little walk in the park.
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cheranne
a cult is a cult i don't care HOW you wrap it.made in china or the usa or little old new knoxville ohio.
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