Well, Paul and Timothy had a relationship like that. It is biblical.
I know Simon in Kenya, a Kenyan, has a relationship with Bill, an American, like that. Too much to elaborate on. Simon calls Bill, his dad in the Word. Absolutely no history there with twi. I know many more relationships like that.
And I gotta tell ya, my best and dearest friend of 33 years is a mother and big sister to me in the Word. I seek out her guidance and wisdom. Father, mother, brother, sister in the Word is not exclusive to twi.
I heard someone else use it at church recently -- wigged me out a bit
I'm operating under the assumption that you mean to ask
"Is it Biblically correct to call someone your 'father in The Word'?"
and am answering accordingly.
================
Matthew 23:1-11. (KJV)
1Then spake Jesus to the multitude, and to his disciples,
2Saying The scribes and the Pharisees sit in Moses' seat:
3All therefore whatsoever they bid you observe, that observe and do; but do not ye after their works: for they say, and do not.
4For they bind heavy burdens and grievous to be borne, and lay them on men's shoulders; but they themselves will not move them with one of their fingers.
5But all their works they do for to be seen of men: they make broad their phylacteries, and enlarge the borders of their garments,
6And love the uppermost rooms at feasts, and the chief seats in the synagogues,
7And greetings in the markets, and to be called of men, Rabbi, Rabbi.
8But be not ye called Rabbi: for one is your Master, even Christ; and all ye are brethren.
9And call no man your father upon the earth: for one is your Father, which is in heaven.
10Neither be ye called masters: for one is your Master, even Christ.
11But he that is greatest among you shall be your servant.
==================
Matthew 23:1-11 (NASB)
1Then Jesus spoke to the crowds and to His disciples,
2saying: "The scribes and the Pharisees have seated themselves in the chair of Moses;
3therefore all that they tell you, do and observe, but do not do according to their deeds; for they say things and do not do them.
4"They tie up heavy burdens and lay them on men's shoulders, but they themselves are unwilling to move them with so much as a finger.
5"But they do all their deeds to be noticed by men; for they broaden their phylacteries and lengthen the tassels of their garments.
6"They love the place of honor at banquets and the chief seats in the synagogues,
7and respectful greetings in the market places, and being called Rabbi by men.
8"But do not be called Rabbi; for One is your Teacher, and you are all brothers.
9"Do not call anyone on earth your father; for One is your Father, He who is in heaven.
10"Do not be called leaders; for One is your Leader, that is, Christ.
==============
According to Jesus.
it is WRONG to give titles from one Christian to another.
Jesus specifies the following titles as wrong:
Master (leader)
father
rabbi (and thus, teacher)
So, "father" is wrong, and so it "Teacher", especially "THE Teacher",
because JESUS is THE Teacher, and anyone else robs him of his title.
Calling another "father" robs God of HIS proper title.
Not that I think much of it now - or the whole freaking Bible for that matter - but I always thought the "father in the Word" monicker referred to I Cor.
"For though ye have ten thousand instructors in Christ, yet [have ye] not many fathers: for in Christ Jesus I have begotten you through the gospel." I Cor. 4:15
Not that I think much of it now - or the whole freaking Bible for that matter - but I always thought the "father in the Word" monicker referred to I Cor.
"For though ye have ten thousand instructors in Christ, yet [have ye] not many fathers: for in Christ Jesus I have begotten you through the gospel." I Cor. 4:15
Yes, no?
It also comes up in I Timothy and II Timothy.
================
1 Timothy 1:2
Unto Timothy, my own son in the faith: Grace, mercy, and peace, from God our Father and Jesus Christ our Lord.
1 Timothy 1:18
This charge I commit unto thee, son Timothy, according to the prophecies which went before on thee, that thou by them mightest war a good warfare;
2 Timothy 1:2
To Timothy, my dearly beloved son: Grace, mercy, and peace, from God the Father and Christ Jesus our Lord.
================
I note it doesn't say Timothy called Paul "father", which may be all the distinction needs.
I'm also convinced that the verse you cited was completely misconstrued in twi.
It turned from Paul saying Timothy had many instructors, but Paul (PERSONALLY) fathered him in the good news-
into "the guy who teaches that class and we may meet in passing or not at all 'fathered' everyone who took
that class" instead of him being one of the 10,000 instructors.
Furthermore, I still haven't seen any verses say anything about Paul having any special privileges with
Now the confusion may lie in Paul’s relationship with Timothy. But again PAUL is the one who recognized TIMOTHY as his “son” in the faith. Not the other way around, plus this did not happen often. It was very infrequent.
How many times did these peoople refer to themselves as father in the word?
Plus what happened in this church was a woman referred to the "guest pastor" as her father in the word
Now the confusion may lie in Paul’s relationship with Timothy. But again PAUL is the one who recognized TIMOTHY as his “son” in the faith. Not the other way around, plus this did not happen often. It was very infrequent.
I'm thinking those are the 2 differences.
1) It wasn't the other way around.
2) It referred SPECIFICALLY to the 2 men who worked together for long blocks of time, in a sort of
apprentice-journeyman sense, not an "I took his class" sense.
How many times did these peoople refer to themselves as father in the word?
At most, the one time by Paul, AFAIK.
Plus what happened in this church was a woman referred to the "guest pastor" as her father in the word
I can't speak for anyone modern, especially if I wasn't there.
First of all, the Lord was speaking specifics that pertained only to those at that moment. Sometimes, folks confuse what Father God or the Lord said to a specific people means it is for all.
There is numerous scripture where we are to follow the example of Godly men and women. For crying out loud Father God knows our heart and intent (duh, ya think just a teenie weenie bit) if we love a member of The Body of Christ, an imitator of Him, to love them like a Father or a leader. Well, whooptie doo if we call them our father, mother, sister or pain in the butt in the Word. Do ya think the Almighty and the Lord is big enough to know the heart and intent?
But Kim what if the intent of the heart is wrong and people use scripture to hold others in spiritual servtitude by becoming "their spiritual father"
I want to know if it is biblically based for very real reasons (that which I posted is not the whole story).
You can call anyone YOU want "Father in the Word" or "mother" or worship a pancake with the likeness of Christ. :) that is your choice but I want to know IF SCRIPTURE supports the "father in the word" being used.
The way of a fool is right in his own eyes: but he that hearkeneth unto counsel is wise.
Judges 17:5-13 (KJV)
5And the man Micah had an house of gods, and made an ephod, and teraphim, and consecrated one of his sons, who became his priest.
6In those days there was no king in Israel, but every man did that which was right in his own eyes.
7And there was a young man out of Bethlehem-judah of the family of Judah, who was a Levite, and he sojourned there.
8And the man departed out of the city from Bethlehem-judah to sojourn where he could find a place: and he came to mount Ephraim to the house of Micah, as he journeyed.
9And Micah said unto him, Whence comest thou? And he said unto him, I am a Levite of Bethlehem-judah, and I go to sojourn where I may find a place.
10And Micah said unto him, Dwell with me, and be unto me a father and a priest, and I will give thee ten shekels of silver by the year, and a suit of apparel, and thy victuals. So the Levite went in.
11And the Levite was content to dwell with the man; and the young man was unto him as one of his sons.
12And Micah consecrated the Levite; and the young man became his priest, and was in the house of Micah.
13Then said Micah, Now know I that the LORD will do me good, seeing I have a Levite to my priest.
I don't really have a sure answer for you--I know how TWI used it and where that came from--George Aar is right on that one. But, here is somethings to consider while looking into this.
When Paul was addressing the Corinthians he was addressing a church that had serious practical error. It was in their lifestyle as well as worship--he had to ADMONISH and correct them--using disciplinary tones. Just as a father would. In 1st Thessalonians--a model church--He uses the term mother and father to relate himself to them. He also calls himself a brother and fool.
It wasn't meant to Lord it over God's heritage, but an example to the flock--one they could relate to and were in need of.
With Timothy---We know that Timothy was pretty young and that his biological father wasn't a Christian. Paul seemed to fill that "Father" void in Timothy's life--They had a "Father/Son type relationship. These were people like us.
It is easy to forget sometimes that they too were emotional beings with real needs and feelings. Paul was Timothy's father in faith so to speak. Timothy grew under the nuturing care of Paul as a substitute father figure.
We are to teach our children-to raise them in the nuture and admonition of the Lord.
Given Timothy's youth--it does not seem odd to me--that Paul would raise Timothy and nurture him in the admonition of the Lord--thus becoming his "Father in the Word". It was a unique and specific relationship--which filled a need for both Timothy and Paul. I don't think it was meant to be a term "Coined" to control--or as a honorary title. Or as replacement for Jesus.
Just some thoughts--it does give us a lovely example of a Christian "Father-Son" relationship--and how to raise our sons.
The other thing I was thinking about--as Wordwolf makes a really good point--- is--when Jesus was talking about calling no man "Father" was he saying---never call anyone father, EVER. What about an earthly father. I think he was using hyperbole to make a point about the pharisees. Titles mean something--or at least they should. When we call someone our "best friend" that means something.
Those who set themselves up as a replacment for our true father--like the pharisees. . . . it would be bad to call them father and mean it. The point of this text is not what titles may be legitimately used in addressing those in authority, but that titles are not to be used to confer privilege or status. Jesus used characteristically semitic hyperbolic rhetoric to make His point.
In TWI--that is what we did. Our "Father in the Word" was considered teacher-father-and basically Lord. So, . . . . . . a bad use of the term father.
Catholics go to a priest to confess their sins and have them forgiven--priests are called "Father". Something to consider--
The other thing I was thinking about--as WordWolf makes a really good point--- is--when Jesus was talking about calling no man "Father" was he saying---never call anyone father, EVER. What about an earthly father. I think he was using hyperbole to make a point about the pharisees. Titles mean something--or at least they should. When we call someone our "best friend" that means something.
Those who set themselves up as a replacment for our true father--like the pharisees. . . . it would be bad to call them father and mean it. The point of this text is not what titles may be legitimately used in addressing those in authority, but that titles are not to be used to confer privilege or status. Jesus used characteristically semitic hyperbolic rhetoric to make His point.
In TWI--that is what we did. Our "Father in the Word" was considered teacher-father-and basically Lord. So, . . . . . . a bad use of the term father.
Catholics go to a priest to confess their sins and have them forgiven--priests are called "Father". Something to consider--
Just some thoughts
I thought it was obvious Jesus was using hyberbole. NEVER use the term "teacher"?
The terms "teacher", "leader"/"master", and "father" have legitimate, technical uses.
However, each term can be easily abused-used to confer inappropriate levels of authority or power upon
someone, robbing others of their rightful places, and robbing THAT person of theirs-
giving them a mantle they can't possibly live up to, even if they think they can....
In the case of what we once did, yes, it WAS up to us to look coldly and say "you're asking for more than your
rightful place" or "you're giving him a position reserved for Jesus, and robbing Jesus of his due,"-
but those who orchestrated things, who knew better (or should have, for all their claims to understand
Scripture) and perpetuated things God said not to do.
I thought it was obvious Jesus was using hyberbole. NEVER use the term "teacher"?
The terms "teacher", "leader"/"master", and "father" have legitimate, technical uses.
However, each term can be easily abused-used to confer inappropriate levels of authority or power upon
someone, robbing others of their rightful places, and robbing THAT person of theirs-
giving them a mantle they can't possibly live up to, even if they think they can....
In the case of what we once did, yes, it WAS up to us to look coldly and say "you're asking for more than your
rightful place" or "you're giving him a position reserved for Jesus, and robbing Jesus of his due,"-
but those who orchestrated things, who knew better (or should have, for all their claims to understand
Scripture) and perpetuated things God said not to do.
Yeah, I knew what you were saying. It was such a good point--I just said it again!! :) Also, (The bolded above) good point. Those in a position of authority--abused these terms--
I hear over and again how WE should have known better--(Not you-other posters) and yes, I guess on one level that is true. But, given the whole picture--a really poor way to excuse these men of their sins--IMHO
God is not stupid. He sees the whole picture.
WW--I was agreeing with your good point--sorry if it looked like I was correcting it--I was just expounding a bit--it was obvious what you meant.
The various schools that the prominent Rabbi's held, it was common and for the most part expected that the students called their Rabbi's "Father", which is what Jesus was referring to, and for that matter it was almost a form of idolatry. The students followed their Rabbi reverently and imitated him precisely. It probably looked rather comical at times, like children who deliberately imitate everything that you do and mime a person. The Lord Jesus was always warning to not do what the Pharisees, Saduccees and Scribes were doing, because it would act as leaven and eventually you would also do the same thing. This is why we are exhorted to imitate God and no one else.
Whether the Lord Jesus was commanding on a wholesale basis that no one was to use the term of Father, Master or Teacher, or perhaps because of the sickening way that the Rabbinical schools doted on their Rabbi's, sometimes only context can tell.
I like what Word Wolf had to say on the matter, of a long term Master/Apprentice relationship where indeed you would learn from the Master just as a son/daughter learns from their parents.
Indeed, we only have one Father, Master and Teacher. Amen.
And I do think in some circles it is misused today.
The term seems to connote a special place - perhaps a place of reverence you hold for that person. Not always wrong as Geshia pointed out "best friend" but something does change when it is "Father IN THE WORD"
Especially in relation to TWI, many came to it already Christians from who knows where, but got better "instruction" via PFAL than they had had in their churches. They weren't "fathered" by VPW, more like "adopted." Unless you allow for the Master/Apprentice relationship that is referred to above like Paul/Timothy.
For those that fancy being "fathers in the Word", please note the following:
Eph 6:4
And, ye fathers, provoke not your children to wrath: but bring them up in the nurture and admonition of the Lord.
Col 3:21
Fathers, provoke not your children to anger, lest they be discouraged.
Would you agree that the self-appointed Father in the Word had discouraged one or two of his "children"?
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kimberly
Well, Paul and Timothy had a relationship like that. It is biblical.
I know Simon in Kenya, a Kenyan, has a relationship with Bill, an American, like that. Too much to elaborate on. Simon calls Bill, his dad in the Word. Absolutely no history there with twi. I know many more relationships like that.
And I gotta tell ya, my best and dearest friend of 33 years is a mother and big sister to me in the Word. I seek out her guidance and wisdom. Father, mother, brother, sister in the Word is not exclusive to twi.
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WordWolf
I'm operating under the assumption that you mean to ask
"Is it Biblically correct to call someone your 'father in The Word'?"
and am answering accordingly.
================
Matthew 23:1-11. (KJV)
1Then spake Jesus to the multitude, and to his disciples,
2Saying The scribes and the Pharisees sit in Moses' seat:
3All therefore whatsoever they bid you observe, that observe and do; but do not ye after their works: for they say, and do not.
4For they bind heavy burdens and grievous to be borne, and lay them on men's shoulders; but they themselves will not move them with one of their fingers.
5But all their works they do for to be seen of men: they make broad their phylacteries, and enlarge the borders of their garments,
6And love the uppermost rooms at feasts, and the chief seats in the synagogues,
7And greetings in the markets, and to be called of men, Rabbi, Rabbi.
8But be not ye called Rabbi: for one is your Master, even Christ; and all ye are brethren.
9And call no man your father upon the earth: for one is your Father, which is in heaven.
10Neither be ye called masters: for one is your Master, even Christ.
11But he that is greatest among you shall be your servant.
==================
Matthew 23:1-11 (NASB)
1Then Jesus spoke to the crowds and to His disciples,
2saying: "The scribes and the Pharisees have seated themselves in the chair of Moses;
3therefore all that they tell you, do and observe, but do not do according to their deeds; for they say things and do not do them.
4"They tie up heavy burdens and lay them on men's shoulders, but they themselves are unwilling to move them with so much as a finger.
5"But they do all their deeds to be noticed by men; for they broaden their phylacteries and lengthen the tassels of their garments.
6"They love the place of honor at banquets and the chief seats in the synagogues,
7and respectful greetings in the market places, and being called Rabbi by men.
8"But do not be called Rabbi; for One is your Teacher, and you are all brothers.
9"Do not call anyone on earth your father; for One is your Father, He who is in heaven.
10"Do not be called leaders; for One is your Leader, that is, Christ.
==============
According to Jesus.
it is WRONG to give titles from one Christian to another.
Jesus specifies the following titles as wrong:
Master (leader)
father
rabbi (and thus, teacher)
So, "father" is wrong, and so it "Teacher", especially "THE Teacher",
because JESUS is THE Teacher, and anyone else robs him of his title.
Calling another "father" robs God of HIS proper title.
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George Aar
Not that I think much of it now - or the whole freaking Bible for that matter - but I always thought the "father in the Word" monicker referred to I Cor.
"For though ye have ten thousand instructors in Christ, yet [have ye] not many fathers: for in Christ Jesus I have begotten you through the gospel." I Cor. 4:15
Yes, no?
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WordWolf
It also comes up in I Timothy and II Timothy.
================
1 Timothy 1:2
Unto Timothy, my own son in the faith: Grace, mercy, and peace, from God our Father and Jesus Christ our Lord.
1 Timothy 1:18
This charge I commit unto thee, son Timothy, according to the prophecies which went before on thee, that thou by them mightest war a good warfare;
2 Timothy 1:2
To Timothy, my dearly beloved son: Grace, mercy, and peace, from God the Father and Christ Jesus our Lord.
================
I note it doesn't say Timothy called Paul "father", which may be all the distinction needs.
I'm also convinced that the verse you cited was completely misconstrued in twi.
It turned from Paul saying Timothy had many instructors, but Paul (PERSONALLY) fathered him in the good news-
into "the guy who teaches that class and we may meet in passing or not at all 'fathered' everyone who took
that class" instead of him being one of the 10,000 instructors.
Furthermore, I still haven't seen any verses say anything about Paul having any special privileges with
Timothy, let alone anyone else.
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Dot Matrix
Am I wrong here -
Now the confusion may lie in Paul’s relationship with Timothy. But again PAUL is the one who recognized TIMOTHY as his “son” in the faith. Not the other way around, plus this did not happen often. It was very infrequent.
How many times did these peoople refer to themselves as father in the word?
Plus what happened in this church was a woman referred to the "guest pastor" as her father in the word
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WordWolf
I'm thinking those are the 2 differences.
1) It wasn't the other way around.
2) It referred SPECIFICALLY to the 2 men who worked together for long blocks of time, in a sort of
apprentice-journeyman sense, not an "I took his class" sense.
At most, the one time by Paul, AFAIK.
I can't speak for anyone modern, especially if I wasn't there.
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kimberly
First of all, the Lord was speaking specifics that pertained only to those at that moment. Sometimes, folks confuse what Father God or the Lord said to a specific people means it is for all.
There is numerous scripture where we are to follow the example of Godly men and women. For crying out loud Father God knows our heart and intent (duh, ya think just a teenie weenie bit) if we love a member of The Body of Christ, an imitator of Him, to love them like a Father or a leader. Well, whooptie doo if we call them our father, mother, sister or pain in the butt in the Word. Do ya think the Almighty and the Lord is big enough to know the heart and intent?
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Dot Matrix
But Kim what if the intent of the heart is wrong and people use scripture to hold others in spiritual servtitude by becoming "their spiritual father"
I want to know if it is biblically based for very real reasons (that which I posted is not the whole story).
You can call anyone YOU want "Father in the Word" or "mother" or worship a pancake with the likeness of Christ. :) that is your choice but I want to know IF SCRIPTURE supports the "father in the word" being used.
Thanks Word Wolf and George.
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WordWolf
Proverbs 12:15 (KJV)
The way of a fool is right in his own eyes: but he that hearkeneth unto counsel is wise.
Judges 17:5-13 (KJV)
5And the man Micah had an house of gods, and made an ephod, and teraphim, and consecrated one of his sons, who became his priest.
6In those days there was no king in Israel, but every man did that which was right in his own eyes.
7And there was a young man out of Bethlehem-judah of the family of Judah, who was a Levite, and he sojourned there.
8And the man departed out of the city from Bethlehem-judah to sojourn where he could find a place: and he came to mount Ephraim to the house of Micah, as he journeyed.
9And Micah said unto him, Whence comest thou? And he said unto him, I am a Levite of Bethlehem-judah, and I go to sojourn where I may find a place.
10And Micah said unto him, Dwell with me, and be unto me a father and a priest, and I will give thee ten shekels of silver by the year, and a suit of apparel, and thy victuals. So the Levite went in.
11And the Levite was content to dwell with the man; and the young man was unto him as one of his sons.
12And Micah consecrated the Levite; and the young man became his priest, and was in the house of Micah.
13Then said Micah, Now know I that the LORD will do me good, seeing I have a Levite to my priest.
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geisha779
Hi Dot,
I don't really have a sure answer for you--I know how TWI used it and where that came from--George Aar is right on that one. But, here is somethings to consider while looking into this.
When Paul was addressing the Corinthians he was addressing a church that had serious practical error. It was in their lifestyle as well as worship--he had to ADMONISH and correct them--using disciplinary tones. Just as a father would. In 1st Thessalonians--a model church--He uses the term mother and father to relate himself to them. He also calls himself a brother and fool.
It wasn't meant to Lord it over God's heritage, but an example to the flock--one they could relate to and were in need of.
With Timothy---We know that Timothy was pretty young and that his biological father wasn't a Christian. Paul seemed to fill that "Father" void in Timothy's life--They had a "Father/Son type relationship. These were people like us.
It is easy to forget sometimes that they too were emotional beings with real needs and feelings. Paul was Timothy's father in faith so to speak. Timothy grew under the nuturing care of Paul as a substitute father figure.
We are to teach our children-to raise them in the nuture and admonition of the Lord.
Given Timothy's youth--it does not seem odd to me--that Paul would raise Timothy and nurture him in the admonition of the Lord--thus becoming his "Father in the Word". It was a unique and specific relationship--which filled a need for both Timothy and Paul. I don't think it was meant to be a term "Coined" to control--or as a honorary title. Or as replacement for Jesus.
Just some thoughts--it does give us a lovely example of a Christian "Father-Son" relationship--and how to raise our sons.
The other thing I was thinking about--as Wordwolf makes a really good point--- is--when Jesus was talking about calling no man "Father" was he saying---never call anyone father, EVER. What about an earthly father. I think he was using hyperbole to make a point about the pharisees. Titles mean something--or at least they should. When we call someone our "best friend" that means something.
Those who set themselves up as a replacment for our true father--like the pharisees. . . . it would be bad to call them father and mean it. The point of this text is not what titles may be legitimately used in addressing those in authority, but that titles are not to be used to confer privilege or status. Jesus used characteristically semitic hyperbolic rhetoric to make His point.
In TWI--that is what we did. Our "Father in the Word" was considered teacher-father-and basically Lord. So, . . . . . . a bad use of the term father.
Catholics go to a priest to confess their sins and have them forgiven--priests are called "Father". Something to consider--
Just some thoughts
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WordWolf
I thought it was obvious Jesus was using hyberbole. NEVER use the term "teacher"?
The terms "teacher", "leader"/"master", and "father" have legitimate, technical uses.
However, each term can be easily abused-used to confer inappropriate levels of authority or power upon
someone, robbing others of their rightful places, and robbing THAT person of theirs-
giving them a mantle they can't possibly live up to, even if they think they can....
In the case of what we once did, yes, it WAS up to us to look coldly and say "you're asking for more than your
rightful place" or "you're giving him a position reserved for Jesus, and robbing Jesus of his due,"-
but those who orchestrated things, who knew better (or should have, for all their claims to understand
Scripture) and perpetuated things God said not to do.
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geisha779
Yeah, I knew what you were saying. It was such a good point--I just said it again!! :) Also, (The bolded above) good point. Those in a position of authority--abused these terms--
I hear over and again how WE should have known better--(Not you-other posters) and yes, I guess on one level that is true. But, given the whole picture--a really poor way to excuse these men of their sins--IMHO
God is not stupid. He sees the whole picture.
WW--I was agreeing with your good point--sorry if it looked like I was correcting it--I was just expounding a bit--it was obvious what you meant.
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brideofjc
The various schools that the prominent Rabbi's held, it was common and for the most part expected that the students called their Rabbi's "Father", which is what Jesus was referring to, and for that matter it was almost a form of idolatry. The students followed their Rabbi reverently and imitated him precisely. It probably looked rather comical at times, like children who deliberately imitate everything that you do and mime a person. The Lord Jesus was always warning to not do what the Pharisees, Saduccees and Scribes were doing, because it would act as leaven and eventually you would also do the same thing. This is why we are exhorted to imitate God and no one else.
Whether the Lord Jesus was commanding on a wholesale basis that no one was to use the term of Father, Master or Teacher, or perhaps because of the sickening way that the Rabbinical schools doted on their Rabbi's, sometimes only context can tell.
I like what Word Wolf had to say on the matter, of a long term Master/Apprentice relationship where indeed you would learn from the Master just as a son/daughter learns from their parents.
Indeed, we only have one Father, Master and Teacher. Amen.
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Dot Matrix
I surely feel it was over used in TWI
And I do think in some circles it is misused today.
The term seems to connote a special place - perhaps a place of reverence you hold for that person. Not always wrong as Geshia pointed out "best friend" but something does change when it is "Father IN THE WORD"
I think we are instructed to avoid that.
What great replies!! thank you!!!
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Twinky
An interesting topic, Dot.
Especially in relation to TWI, many came to it already Christians from who knows where, but got better "instruction" via PFAL than they had had in their churches. They weren't "fathered" by VPW, more like "adopted." Unless you allow for the Master/Apprentice relationship that is referred to above like Paul/Timothy.
For those that fancy being "fathers in the Word", please note the following:
Eph 6:4
And, ye fathers, provoke not your children to wrath: but bring them up in the nurture and admonition of the Lord.
Col 3:21
Fathers, provoke not your children to anger, lest they be discouraged.
Would you agree that the self-appointed Father in the Word had discouraged one or two of his "children"?
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HAPe4me
I dunno
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