All Activity

"Perhaps. However.... in the meantime... in between time, ain't we got fun?" (Emo Phillips.)

Nothing lasts forever 'cept, well, you know, the earth and sky.

Dust in the wind. You're all dying. It's depressing. Countdown clock on your head. You're a day closer to dead than you were yesterday.

Take a step back. You'll see I'm being reasonable. I HATE PLAYING PILE ON. I HATE PICKING ON THE EASY TARGET. I HATE CHECKING POPULAR OPINION AND THEN MAKING CERTAIN I'M ON THE SAME SIDE AS ANY POWERFUL MAJORITY. Actually, If I feel pressure to condemn someone for some reason I don't know, I'm probably going to go against the majority Fine, some of you had your trial. VP was found guilty and subject to posthumous shaming. Fine. No problem. As you said, I wasn't around for that trial. Don't expect me to to simply repeat your findings. Nobody gets beaten into submission on a message board. I'll gladly listen. I appreciate all the effort you've put into catching me up. I haven't heard any defense or counterarguments other than my own. I'll reach the same conclusions as you when it happens or maybe I'll never reach the same conclusions? Bong is packed, anyone want to talk about Jesus?

Statistically valid? 95%

You wished me 'goodbye' or something like that in your last post to me. Better if you stuck with that.

It's exceptionally without distinction.

Is "extremely without joy" a figger of speech? Or is it a Lamsaism? Either one is without joy or one is not. What are these gradations of without?

Do you know enough atheists to come to a statistically valid conclusion that they are without joy? But extremely without joy...

It's been decades, and people defending vpw can still spring a few surprises. You're DECADES LATE to the discussion. The trial began. The prosecutors laid out the charges. The witnesses were called forth. The defense called the women liars and insinuated they were sluts and whores. All sorts of defenses were offered of him. By all BIBLICAL standards, and by enough to secure a conviction in a US court of law, vpw was found guilty of molestation, rape, and all sorts of things. We've slowly assembled his biography, piece by piece, from vpw himself, from twi sources, from eyewitnesses (interviewed by a man who idolized vpw). Court was adjourned, everyone went home. The seasons changed. Years passed. Then he arrives and announces that the trial hasn't even begun. No, you missed EVERYTHING.

I think he was letting me know with who/what I was trying to reason. Knowing that is important, and adds important context to the discussion.

You're entitled to have an opinion. That does NOT mean it's at all credible.

I think we're stumped and I haven't got any more clues. The Thin Red Line As I was watching it the other day I noted the cast. A lot of names but the movie was dirt, not enough plot for me. I can't even fathom what the line read line was. Good thing it didn't win any Academy Awards. FREE POST

Kodachrome (Not the first line) My grandfather and me Around Nassau town we did roam Drinkin' all night Got into a fight Well, I feel so broke up I wanna go home George

I think he was trying to say we can't prove Wierwille was an atheist. He's right. I clearly called it a suspicion and asked whether others think it fits the facts.

Does this post have any meaning at all?????

This may be a great post in a thread called "VPW was Elmer Gantry". (and I liked both men...VPW and Burt Lancaster.) LOL

I'm an atheist. I have lots of joy. I also exhibit the fruit of the spirit in much of my life and have been commended many times for doing "God's Work" (to which I respond: "I have to; He won't). "Atheists are extremely without joy" is a statement of staggering ignorance and bigotry. I trust that is outside your character. Might be best to stick with a subject about which you actually know something

That's really big brush you're painting with there.

A couple moments before work. When the prosecutor lays out the charges that's when the trial begins. Until then, all you've heard are charges. Sometimes atheists are like people describing a bong. Whose is it? Where'd you get it? What color is it? What's it made out of? Idk, idk, idk. I just love hitting the bong. I might like to learn some of that but the color of the bong doesn't change my experience if it. Atheists are extremely without joy, IMO. It's cool to talk about the extremities. Just, while you're doing that, would you pass me that bong?

And that applies to his henchmen and other enablers, too. Including LCM.

Well, remember he taught us to disregard the ten commandments, saying they were "the law" and the law didn't apply any more. The law? The ten commandments are rules for living together socially. Decent behaviour. Respect for God, and respect for fellow human beings. The Ten Commandments are a set of biblical principles that guide ethical behavior and worship. They are as follows: You shall have no other gods before Me. You shall not make for yourself a carved image. You shall not take the name of the Lord your God in vain. Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy. Honor your father and your mother. You shall not murder. You shall not commit adultery. You shall not steal. You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor. You shall not covet. These commandments were given by God to Moses on Mount Sinai and can be found in the Bible in Exodus 20:2-17 and Deuteronomy 5:6-21 You'll have to look hard before you find one that he didn't break. His God was money. His carved image was TWI. He mocked God. He respected no time of rest (quite the opposite, he pushed people to breaking point). He disregarded his parents. (Interestingly, this is "the first commandment of promise" - “Honor your father and your mother, that your days may be long in the land that the Lord your God is giving you." And we know he died earlier than might be expected for a man in his circumstances) He didn't physically kill anyone, but he killed their reputations, their confidence, their lives. He killed their genuine Godly ministries, too. Adultery - how many women did he rape and otherwise assault? (some have posted their stories here) Steal? He obtained money and other assets by fraud. He even stole his famous PFAL class and the follow-on classes! Bear false witness? The lies and slander he spread, about anyone he disliked and especially about departing Corps, are legendary. Covet? He sought the fame that genuine ministers had. As the Bible tells us: “Even a child is known by his deeds” (Proverbs 20:11) conveys the timeless lesson that a person’s actions-from childhood onward-reflect character. The verse serves as a reminder that moral responsibility begins early. Wordwolf has clearly set out the deeds of the child, teenager, young adult that was VPW. No surprise what the older adult VPW turned out to be.

I've been going over his entire life story, as much as we have. twi told quite a bit, and vpw LOVED to talk about himself. so there's little lack of some things, if only from his perspective. When looking at the whole picture, I realized, relatively recently, that it makes a consistent picture. His childhood was one of irreverence with a lack of piety or even dedication. His adolescence was even moreso. His neighbors considered him a bully, a showoff, and a braggart. A number of them remember him riding his motorcycle around, pulling stunts, trying to get notice and adulation. We know that much because a man who virtually worships vpw, a man who said he was "overgifted", and that "when he walked, the earth shook", and so on, that man went around and questioned the neighbors. The only thing he ever did that even suggested ministry was him making a comment to a traveling preacher, and vpw himself made it sound like he was just 'fibbing' when he said it. Before he made the decision to begin ministry study, he himself told the Corps, many times, that he had considered business, music, and ministry, but eventually decided on ministry. twi's own accounts, from vpw's mouth, mention that his decision was met with disbelief. His own father said that he hadn't even learned to work hard on the farm, and suggested ministry was harder. His neighbors were in disbelief as well. (Same source as before.) We know that his areas of study were the lightest he could find. No "history" or "languages". His academic focus was "homiletics", or "how to write and deliver a sermon." We also know that he cut corners, reusing his Master's Thesis for his Doctorate Thesis, a big no-no. We suspect he plagiarized a lot, but we can't prove much of that without his records or people who caught him doing it in school. we do know that he worked as an editor and proofreader for a magazine where preachers wrote articles. That provides the opportunity to plagiarize and not get caught- but isn't proof he did. We know his Doctorate was acquired at a degree mill, and the place was unaccredited. In the words of Al Franken, "They have as much authority to issue a Doctorate as Schlotski's Deli!" vpw himself spoke a lot about his first year or so of pastoring. He said he considered giving up twice early on, once per year, for the first two years. He also complained that giving weekly sermons at his first posting made him actually go to the Bible each week and write a sermon. Never a word about the lives of the people, never a word about the responsibility, just complaints he had to do the work. So far, I can't find any piety, any godly dedication. That's a man who's working for his paycheck, and trying to do the least amount of work for the most amount of paycheck. Then comes 1942. Much later, vpw spread a claim that we've referred to as "the 1942 Promise." Supposedly, God Almighty told vpw that He (God Almighty) would teach him (victor paul wierwille) God's Word like it hadn't been known since the 1st century, if he (vpw) would teach it to others. This was a lie, a fabrication, from when he first began to tell it (over a decade after it happened, he said nothing when it allegedly happened, not even to his own wife. We've discussed this alleged promise in detail, and it's beyond any REASONABLE doubt that this was a lie, and not a very convincing one. https://www.greasespotcafe.com/ipb/topic/24980-concerning-the-failure-of-the-1942-promise/ Still can't find the piety. A possible argument can be made after he spent time with Leonard and Stiles, in 1953. His brother claimed that he seemed more clean-cut after that, but from his birth through his education and his first DECADE as a minister, no evidence he had even an AVERAGE level of piety for a parishioner, let alone a minister. But how "godly" was he even in 1953? That was when he plagiarized Leonard's class and Stiles' book, and told everyone "I did this, this is my work." So, I don't think a strong argument can be made that he got right with God. That's decades in, and I still can't find godliness. In the 60s, he continued with incremental gains by hawking Leonard's class and Stiles' book, and modifying them by adding stuff from Bullinger. At the end of the 60s, vpw went to impress the hippies and recruit them. He seemed to appreciate the "free love" aspect of the hippies, and didn't like that the Christian ones weren't into that. He was unable to get anywhere with trying to suggest orgies were cool with God Almighty, and he seemed to drop the subject after it went over like a lead zeppelin. In the 70s, we have everything I mentioned in a previous post. It takes a lot of work to set up an excellent operation to molest people, and vpw set up a VERY successful one. We also have more direct eyewitness accounts more often, so at this point, we start to hear about his OTHER vices. vpw was a chain-smoker and an alcoholic. The man drank so much that when he visited a location for a weekend, a local was tasked with getting him bottleS (plural, for the weekend) of Drambuie. We know he drank Drambuie. How many of you know what your casual acquaintances drink? I've known one poster here face to face for years. I think we could probably say of each other. Of the rest of the board, no idea. (Oh, one ex-poster who made his own moonshine, I'm fairly confident he drank that, but that's a very special case.) He smoked cigars and Kool shorties. Again, we know what brand and type of cigarette he smoked. (IIRC, people were sent to get his smokes when he traveled, also, but I'm not 100% sure of that.) As for the 80s, that's when the man died of cancer. The man drank for decades, weakening his liver. The man smoked cigars and cigarettes for decades, exposing himself to carcinogens for decades. The man died of cancer. Allegedly, the reason he got the cancer was that he was exposed to bright studio lights for 2 weeks while filming pfal decades before. Some people still believe that. Studio lights do NOT cause cancer. On Broadway in NYC, on the West End in London, and so on, every night there are live shows with bright studio lights, not counting the matinee. Performers work looking into those lights for months or years at a time, some of them going directly to another show for months. So far, no outcry that they're dropping like flies because they're all getting cancer from bright studio lights. So, which is more consistent with the man, when we look at ALL the man, and not just the image he portrayed? Is it consistent that this man was indeed dedicated to God at some point, then gave up? we can't find any time of significant piety. Is it consistent that this man took ministry as a job, and worked as a performer, an actor, and faked it all, plagiarizing all the substance? The evidence matches. We can trace all of his successes to whom he plagiarized. The only thing left is the obvious objection "Well, if he was a fake all the time, what about when he manifested?" All of that could be faked, and it looks like it was faked. If you want to get into "Is it possible or impossible to fake the manifestations", then a new thread in Doctrinal would be where to have that discussion.

they give us those nice bright colours They give us the greens of summers Makes you think all the world's a sunny day, oh yeah