sky4it

Geo: 2life: i agree with your comment about gravity your comment: OTOH, when I quit believing in gravity, I was rudely awakened to the fact that it did, indeed, still function quite well... Its ok with me too geo, if you dont want to believe in gravity, because that too in fact is the truth. Gravity exists in different proportions in different planets and in fact in some places it may not exist at all cause we dont know. Even the laws of physics may one day cease to exists we dont know. An investment in the laws of physics, may not be all that productive because we dont know what God created or will create beyond that. There are for sure three things that are eternal. Faith, hope and love. The truth that God made love the ruling charicteristic for all eternity is reassuring. The fact that faith is eternal, in my view tells us we may not be able to ever know all there is to know about creation. His character, however, is unwavering in that what ever he does will be done with love. Therefore we always have hope. Love isnt always warm and giggly, sometimes its a swift kick in the you know what. Thats kinda reassuring also isnt it? For who would want or could believe in a God who was just a bunch of warm fuzzies with an ever diminishing feeling that that isnt love at all. Love, I think is the most misabused word ever. We know what the porn stars think it is, we know what divorcing spouses think it is, and yes we know what evil lords of religion think it is who abuse people in the name of love. Personally, I think God himself is the only one who has a handle on it, because we are all capable of abusing one another. God's essence: Uncomprimising love, no matter what we "think is right." You know Geo, I always have to try and stir your drink.

year 2027: thanks i appreciate that, may God bless you also. I have noticed from your writings that you are decidedly Catholic. Over the past several years I attended Basketball games with my son when they were playing against Catholic schools. I got to meet some warm wonderful Christian Catholics. We had a wonderful time in the Lord. Interesting how God has planted so very many of his people in different denominations, and yet the love of God in them transcends the religion. Again , God bless.

song: your comment: S4, is the small wonder the all is sheep and goat? I guess I really aint sure what your asking. Can a sheep become a goat? I dont think so. Can a goat get rid of his goatyness (strange word), yea I think they can otherwise the sacrafice of a goat in the OT wouldnt have been an acceptable sacrifice. Interesting OT stuff about animals, particularily that birds are the most manogoumous animal with estimates differing for different species.

Interesting analogy: Sheep provide clothing for people. (Wool) Goats eat the clothing off of people. The OT speaks of not uncovering your brother or sister and other such relatives "nakedness" Goats wanna have your wife take off her clothes and use her sexually Sheep wanna provide wool for your wife if she is so inclined Goats wanna get all the mud on yah and gossip and uncover your nakedness Sheep wanna put bandaids and wool on all your hurting Lazarus sores. Small wonder why the Lord is gonna seperate the sheep from the goats.

geo: your comment: The truth is that which, when you quit believing in it, doesn't go away... Amen brother, preach it, because the contradiction is if it doesnt go away , you still believe it. You cant run away from the truth. One can only hide or decieve himself as to its existence.

Dan: your comment: Shoot, I even regard my own agnostic brother a better and truer "Christian" than myself (and other self-proclaimed "Christians" I've seen over the years) from the manner in which he goes out his way to help others less fortunate than himself. Interesting comment Dan. I know this Doctor, who has a astronomical IQ. He is a Christian Scientist who has problems with the concept of "original sin" and other more mainstream Christian doctrines. Yet, I have never known a person, who walks and lives according to the gospel more than this guy. This man is worry free, because intellectully, he feels that worry or obsessing over problems has no possible benefit, so he doesnt do it. If that aint faith in God, I dont know what is. Interesting that the Apostle Paul, said God judges those who dont know the law or the gospel with there conscience. (The law that is given by birth in a persons heart) I also am amazed at the many whose deeds speak nothing as to what they say and know by doctrines, and those whose deeds speak volumes of what they don't need to know. Proving yet again, that hearing "the truth", doesnt have to be all that "perfect in doctrinal form." Thank you.

song : yeah, i am talking bible.

hey abby: your comment: Chewster, thank you for reminding me of why it was I chose Judaism over Christianity. you know we like you all the same................ :)-->

Danny: your comment I disagree. That phrase, within the Way context, tended to produce as many if not more Bible-worshippers and doctrine cops, than actual Christians. It's hardly a phrase which sheds any discernment or enlightenment concerning the heart of God. And like twi - it leaves Christ out of the equation. Salvation now becomes determined by a supposed perfect book - not a spiritual Saviour. Nope. I no longer even agree with twi on that. once again, I absolutely agree with you. Interesting, that even Biblically, the term will of God and an event is only referenced to "santification" and abstainence from fornication, and being in control of ones own body or soul. Moreover, the control is relegated to the person himself, not some cheesy doctrine. How refreshing.

dmiller: with respect to the Word of God is the Will of God, it was the most absolute statement, which one could not reasonably disagree with. The problem still remained , what was the word of God? Words which only VPW could "rightly divide" became the logical conclusion. And thus this oxymoron, became the proverb for closing off ones mind to God. Furthermore, truth is emodied in a person, Jesus Christ. You cannot illustrate through simple paradigms of speech, all the reactions any person can have to any event. Why? Because there are billions of situations all with differing circumstances. Therefore the Word of God, or truth must be applicational, not rubber stamped. Interesting that the Word of God is exactly that. Words which can be applied in varying degrees and emphasis to literally billions of situations.

raf: your comment: Money doesn't win the World Series: a good team does. But yah gotta admit raf, it sure helps :)-->

Raf and Mstar I'm a Yankee hater. Dem and the cowboys. We Yankee haters must always point out that you stole all your players with bucks. Doesnt this somewhat diminish the great Yankee mystique? Go Red Sox. By the way Mstar, if you live around Boston, it is pretty impressive the way the Patriots have played the last few years considering free agency. The Patriot organization is the closest thing to a dynasty in football since free agency happened in the NFL, no small feat.

I can't help but see the analogy or parable of the life of Job and that of God. Was God trying to tell us that seeing people suffer under sin was akin to loosing his family and all his goods like Job? Jesus when oppressed by the religious for his "Son of God" status repeated the Psalms "Have I not said ye are all God's,children of the most high." This clearly was the problem in the heavenlies for Satan and his pals didnt just want some goods, they in fact wanted to be God. The scary thing is this. Would God abandon his creator and Godhood status if his children left him? In fact, he did just that. It is my view that this caused him this amount of pain, to allow the sacrifice of his own son. Think about it for yourselves, could you do it? Could you sacrifice your own son? We tend to think of these things in terms that don't fit ourselves, like God would raise him up so whats the difference. Still, God has promised to raise us up also so what is the difference? The fact of the matter is that God has limited himself to righteousness or holiness, which are overextended words for simple cleanliness. The skinny is this. I think we need to let God know that we appreciate him as his role as God. I think this is the essence of what worship is, (not screaming and yelling fanatically) Worship is admiration. Worship is appreciation. In religiousity, I think we have lost this concept. Worship of God is done more by deeds than words. At least this was Jesus view in the sermon on the mount.

mstar: Sorry my twinks could'nt knock off the Yankees. Gardenhire really muffed his chances. In the 2 extra inning games he really blew it. Then he started a rookie at the DH who had only about 80 major league at bats. In a critical situation he swung at 2 pitches over his head. (Runners on 2nd and 3rd, one out) Anyway good luck to the Red Sox. With Schilling and Pedro, I think you guys can win. Later

song: glad you brought it up. tough one to understand. tackling that one, one might have to do some specualating, which always causes more speculating. I think it speaks to things not yet revealed.

Danny: Once again an outstanding hisorical perspective. Tough issue. I once heard some Assemblies explain it away as "the female" bieng a type of the soul and "male" a type of the spirit, within an organization whose heirarchial order were preachers who were predominately women. Personally, I dont think this view flies either. Bill Gothard (you may have heard of him) takes the strictist view that it is literal (Women should not speak in the church) Oddly, the churches who he supports by sending people who attend his conferences (Basic Institute of youth Conflicts), widely disapprove of his view. Evangelical, Protestants, charismatics etc. Joyce Meyers, a charismatic TV preacher, preaches consistently on TV. Yet her messages are more emblematic and resemble more story telling and encourage talk to what looks to be a predominately female audience, than the resembence of a church. To me its kinda like a really cute puppet show. (I salute Joyce Meyers) Pauls view was " I suffer not a woman to speak or usurp authority in the church." He, "Paul" would not suffer it. There must of been some unbearable thing about it that happened to him in his life. Personally, I can see that tack also. There are times when awoman talk so much it is impossible to get in a word edgewise. To listen to it over and over and over and over again, is just plain suffering. (no abby I am not talking about you) My own personal view I can only illustrate with a story. As a kid in a Lutheran church, my mother and about 10 other women were in this rather archaic church with an old time litergy order. The pastor was very intellectual and appealed mainly to about half the congregation who were also intellectuals and not Biblical purists. These 10 or so women, never preached from the pulpit yet they ran that church. They ran it with there deeds. I suppose you could argue "lousy doctrine" but you know what, I never seen any women or men like these women were. You know how Jesus said take heed that you do not your deeds before men. This is what these women did. If the 10 of them had left together, that place would have folded like a tent and died. God listened and performed all those womens prayers. The skinny of the matter: You can rule a joint without ruling a pulpit. My personal view: If men were more active with God and a leadership role the was approbriate (instead of thinking Christianity is sissy) , it would be a non-issue. The "leadership vaccuum" will always exist when men are not taking God seriously, and force upon woman more authorative leadership roles of which many are perhaps uncomfortable.

Abby: Terrific topic, I salute you. One that long needs to be addressed well too I think. Your comment: "Yes, G-d relegated Eve to a lesser social status I don't know about that Abby. Afterall, women are still the fairer sex, and more appealing to look upon. From that standpoint you could say they are the life of the social party. The homosexual movement has long made the arguement, that when the Apostle Paul talked about women covering there heads, this is proof that some Biblical things are out of date, thus there "movement" is ok with God. I Corinthians 11:16 "But if any man seem to be contentious, we have no such custom, niether the churches of God." Paul said, unequivocally, that the was no custom "or rule or law" that said the woman had to have her head covered. It would be my arguement that there is a terrific application of this scripture. Personally, I can see a beuutiful woman wearing a small hat with a little vail over her head, on rare occasion, (like once a month or two or once a year) as a signal to other men, look hands off, my body and beauty are for my husband or husband to be only. You know men are very visual. A woman that dresses to provoke men visually is doing a diservice to herself. It can be a signal to men also, look at me I'm cheap. As a man, if my wife is dressed in a sexually provacative way in public, it certainly makes me feel a little insecure, especially if she is beautiful. This is certainly one aspect of what the apostle was getting at. I suppose for the present time you can hardly fault women for dressing the way they do. Most men have indicated to woman this is what they want. So women try and take advantage of there beauty in this manner. If men had more self control with there eyes and lusts, I think women would dress more approbriately

Hey Paw: could i make up my own slogan? How about "Needs his Teddy Bear"

song: Your Comment: AND i am not sure what you meant, ~~~ "...and I am always kinda greatful my Ma didn't have to go thru it." Mainly that, speaking in tongues is no guarantee for spiritual sanity, and that I am happy my mother didn't have to endure the mayhem of the Jesus movement, and feel condemned for not speaking in tongues. With respect to Babtism, I was dunked in the Assemblies. My mother, a lifetime lutheran has never been dunked and she's about as filled with the spirit as anyone I have ever known. I thought it was amusing, Song, to have you say "I might cover that base just as well, - meaning babtism" I remember thats precisely what I was thinking when I took the plunge.

Well my Twins beat the Mighty Yanks last nite. With a little luck this might go 5 games. The Yanks have gotta go down.

song: I read yah man. Especially the part about "strange brew", although i am not sure what you meant by that. My mother, a lifetime Christian and now 80 years old, to this day is mystified by those who speak in tongues. I always told her" I can't explain it either Ma, but just cause you dont that dont make you a junior to their religion, which I think she felt like. I think she felt better when I said that, and I am always kinda greatful my Ma didn't have to go thru it.

Song: You might find it interesting, that in the Assemblies of God, the prophesies I heard were along the same parallel. I did have one experience tho, that was very different. On a couple of occasions I had some one lay hands on me and prophecy. On one particular occasion, what the person said was so direct and so precise about what I was experiencing, they could not have known it otherwise. I think the scripture tells us to judge the prophecies. It also says that it convicts and people should be convinced that there hearts secrets are revealed. God gave gifts unto men. The gifts are without repentance. I think it also says they were given to the rebellious. Therefore they are capable of being polluted or weak also. I find it interesting in the Assemblies or otherwise that the parameters given for speaking in tongues are not followed. Especially the part "will they not say you are mad?" Sometimes I wonder if tongues outload wasnt for the express purpose of communicating to people whose language we dont know. In that particular context, God could choose to speak to whomever he willed.

they both promise to do different things, but they both do the same thing..... nothing. Makes them the same party right? Hey who put the knows the menu to well next to my name, paw are you trying to say I talk to much?

God bless yah for your efforts Abby, sounds like you have had a tough road. Someday I think we will understand it more fully. :)--> your comment: I always wondered what they thought when LCM would go on his rants about the Holocaust being fake and the 13th Tribe stuff. I never knew how extensive anti-Semitism was in our country until I attended a Big Ten School. I was in a class one day and a guy on the right made a sick comment about my hair. I didn't take it that badly but it was kind of sarcastic. Later that day, the guy who was sitting on the other side of me approached me in the cafeteria and wanted to talk. He explained to me this guy had insulted me because he was a Jew and therefore thought he was better than me. He pointed out to me several woman sitting in the caferia that he "knew were Jews" because of the way they dressed. I remember thinking after he left what he was saying was way in excess to what I had experienced. One of the gals I was sitting with one day, and I explained to her she should be careful, there were people who actually didnt like her(because of her ethnic background). (I guess i was trying to warn her of this guy) I think she took it offensively.

If Jesus knew everything and was all knowing as some asert why then did he say that he had to have faith to accomplish what he did? I think we sometimes think that at the cross, Jesus knew he would be raised from the dead like some kind of pop-tart. The truth was, I don't think he had any guarantee other than his faith and that God led him to believe so. To him, it had to be a risk. For him to accept death for us, was the ultimate sacrafice, for he was not deserving of it. Certainly he must have had doubts about it also, otherwise to avoid the cross wouldnt have been such a temptation to him. Jesus, made just exactly like us in all respects except one, he was without blame.