Twinky

"Study to show yourself approved unto God" should have the emphasis on making (our walk) acceptable to God. He has predestined us to good works (Ephesians). We are to work out, figure out, how to do those good works. The study isn't poring over books because we are in mid-course for our BA or some other tests. The study is learning to walk the walk, which is by understanding the heart of the scriptures and following the example set by trusted leaders. It includes exercising the sword of the spirit to rightly divide the word, ie, our walk, into what we are doing senses-wise and what we are doing from the heart.

Granted, PFAL did not have time to go into the history of "how we got the Bible" other than some cursory half-sentence some place. However, later classes might have covered it. Certainly it should have been a part of Corps training if we are looking at Christian leadership (which is what the WC was "sold" as). History of how we got the Bible was perhaps studied or at least touched on in early Corps but post-PoP was also post-everyone who could have given any half-way considered history. That's if anyone still had a mind to ask questions like that. We might also consider that there must have been many other documents both in OT and NT times which are not included in the Bible. Paul was a prolific writer who kept in touch with his budding "church plants" around the Med area. Were those letters not "God breathed"? The congregations who sought his advice would have expected them to be! One letter from the church in Jerusalem is recorded in Acts; does that mean that none of the elders there ever wrote anything else? No letters back to Galilee, for example, to any "church plants" they may have made there (if any)? "Scripture" means that which is in script, ie, written. "All" scripture? So straight away we have the PFAL definition, "all without exception or all with distinction." Hey, I didn't write the book and I didn't choose the contents of the book. I'm just saying that not everything that has ever been written especially within the context of the new Christian church of Acts, the first century etc, is included within "scripture" and there's "wiggle room." So where within the PFAL definition us "scripture" defined?

Groucho - your last words made me laugh loudly and startle my cats. What to do with the ABS...huh, that's all they care about? Jeff - they moved your wife and babe out and nobody not even your wife let you know????? Copenhagen - hard when the whole family is still stuck in the rut. Try tucking the wrappers from GSC's Fairtrade coffee amongst their belongings. Give the spies something to condemn them for (as if they need an excuse!)

I gave some skincare products to a woman who works with a homeless project. I wondered if she used Freecycle to locate items that the homeless might need (clothes?) - especially if they are trying to help them back to more normal living (with furniture). Belle, it is nice to choose the recipient (if you get more than one taker), and the pleasure in giving and meeting a need really is enjoyable in itself. Having finally got rid of my lawn today, what do you know but someone is freecycling a load of topsoil. Just exactly what I need so it is now in bags on the remains of my garden path.

Adultery Bedside manners? Is that ABs? "The benefits of adultery..." (LOL) Dunno about you, but I don't want to do anything that would make VPW "proud" of me (shudder). But I really do want to do a lot that will make JC and my Father "proud" of me. Like, "listen," and "do" (or not do as the case may be). (tongue in cheek) Did I not read some place (like Exodus): "Thou shalt not commit adultery"?

Wow, same-old, same-old but more vicious. Some of the last words are really vicious. THW, Oakspear - you had some presence of mind, good for you! You seem to have escaped without too much wallowing in self-condemnation. Lindy - the usual rubbish WG - bizarre, I think on top of the teaching (?) you mentioned that's the weirdest thing I've heard Shellon - not putting you on a guilt trip, then. Did they offer to drive the motor car that ran the kids over? mstar1 - interrogated to go to twig? (Freely availing oneself of fellowship, then...) Worst of it is, some of us were so Waybrained we believed this rot, or at least didn't dare to disbelieve.

Jen-o, you will find yourself on moderation for just a little while, till you get the hang of it. They want people to share, not just take (fair enough). Sometimes you come across "dealers" who collect stuff they seem to intend to sell at a garage sale or market stall. Those people aren't very popular and it is against the ethos of the site, although really no harm done, the "seller" gets rid of something they don't want and the "taker" keeps it from being landfill. My lawn looks nice in its new location a couple of miles away, well at least the half that's gone looks nice; the rest will go tomorrow. Tonight I disposed of an old mirror that must have been in an old wardrobe door. The silvering is a little crazed and there is quite a bit of discoloration there. The taker is really pleased with it. No idea what he intends to use it for.

On another thread someone said they could still remember the words that were said to them when they left. It was along the lines of God's hedge of protection being removed from you or some such similar garbage. What was said to you (if you care to remember and care to say it)? From one strong but kindly (?) male I got: "Be careful" in a sort of ominously threatening tone. Subtext was, we're kicking you out and you will be outside God's protection. From a higher-up I got: "You need a rest from us. Well, we need a rest from you. Call us in 6 months if you're still interested in moving God's Word." Like a fool I did... I got screamed at violently: "Get away from her, you lesbian!" (this was because my WoW sister and I had hugged on greeting. As we had done for the whole WoW year. The first put me in terror of doing anything in case "the Adversary" got me. Frozen like a rabbit in the headlights. The second put me in serious condemnation. The third shocked me beyond measure, I think because of the utter venom in the spoken words, which were completely untrue and he knew it (having spent months not-so-subtly undercutting me and turning my fiance against me).

One day we will look back on all this and laugh about it...how silly we all were, to get sucked in. Till then, there is still a lot of pain and heartache to be eased. What a great follow-up to RD's interview it would be if Paw could get an interview with John Sch-heit.

Belle tells it like it is. Insidious. Pernicious. Corrosive of thinking ability. You think you're thinking; you even enjoy thinking a little differently (very spiritual, you know). All the time you're alienating yourself from the rest of the world, your friends, your family. No, no. It's not brainwashing. It's washing the worldly thoughts from your brain. Nobody decides to join a cult; but one day you look round, and there you are.

Well just for fun... I am now Freecycling (out) ... my LAWN. I must have had a dozen replies and two or three people want to come and help me lift it. Then I will be Freecycling (in) some hoss muck. For the vege garden, y'know.

Linda, I'm laughing. But probably wouldn't be if that had happened to me. Dot... why'd'ya put this idea in my head? You know what? Went to my church house group last night, locked the door, dropped off at home... and no keys. Had to go round the back and get the spare (needed to use the bathroom, couldn't stand outside half the night!). Once inside I rummaged through my pocket book again and finally found the keys in a place I had looked six times already.

Psalmie, the more I read on this the more it seems that he ought to stay with you. The stuff you posted about your friends not wanting to be there when you were in need because they didn't know what to do is worrying. What your son can learn from YOU, in compassion and looking out for people, will open doors for him in the workplace that education cannot. (Not that I'm saying an education isn't important.) There are lots of other educational opportunities for homeschooled kids that regular schooling cannot cover and they could give him a unique perspective/skills list if suitably tailored. And Dads'n'Lads time or therapy/mediation is a good idea too. What are Dad's unique or special skills to teach his son?

I can't add much but two things occur: firstly, sooner or later he is going to have to leave home and in a carefully controlled environment with known and trusted support would be easier than leaving to go to college. Secondly, what does he really want? You've said he is a mature lad and can make up his own mind. Perhaps now is the time, if you haven't already done so, to sit down with him and discuss his long-term goals (if any) and how he would like to achieve them. He is definitely old enough to be involved in this sort of decision and his future education does need his maximum participation. If he is unhappy with your friends his education will not thrive and neither will he; but to thrive he may need to be out of the "home" box and may be ready to stretch out. Over the summer vacation period - would it be helpful if he went and stayed with your friends for a couple of weeks? You would both have an opportunity for a "free look" at him being away. It's a difficult decision - but only death is completely irreversible. You can change your mind in six months if you make the wrong decision now.

Okay, Linda, where's lockout #2? Yeah, I've locked myself in too. But I know where the spare key is/should be, in the house. I keep thinking I'll just put my hand in my pocket and hey presto! But not so far... ZShot - true, but my garden is 80' long and has two lawns, a shrubbery, a rockery, a fish pond, various flower borders, a patio, a parking spot, a solid wall (no hiding there), two or three rickety fences (potential hiding place there), lots of "things" just lying or stacked around, and all sorts of hiding places. Neither is the garden overlooked. If a burglar wanted to spend a couple of weeks hunting in the garden they might find a key. They will not find much inside that is worth the risk. However, if a burglar were so good at finding keys, he might also find himself a job - locating my missing two sets of keys...

Funny now but bloody annoying at the time. Oh, I asked in every shop in the street where I usually shop too. Even though I had no recollection of going out to the shops on the fateful Friday. Felt like the proverbial woman with the silver coin, sweeping the house out. But she got what she sought. Dot, hide a key in your garden. You must have a hole or crevice or similar unless your yard is concrete and nothing else. Under the mat and under a plant pot are not good ideas. Where did I put that application form for the Alzheimer's Society...

Hey this is my party trick! So I keep a spare key hidden on the property in a place it would take some ill-intentioned person quite a while to find. And it is not the key for the nearest door (the back door) but for the front door which actually means a hike of several minutes round a couple of other streets - can't go round the side of the property as there is no side. Now my latest party trick: Thursday: I went out in my car, brought something in through the front door, drove the car to its parking spot round the back, locked it, and entered the house. Friday. I left the house and deadlocked the back door. Went to work on my bicycle (not worthwhile driving). Came home from work late and had no house keys. Couldn't be bothered to go to the office to look for the house keys so used the secret spare. Saturday: went to the office, turned it upside down, no keys. No car keys either (separate bunch). Next two weeks: sorted through my trash. Sorted through all the office trash. Sorted through my compost bin. Not to mention every drawer, every pocket, every item of clothing (boy, do I have some clothes...), under every piece of furniture... I was not exactly ROFLMAO. To this day I have found neither the house keys nor the (only) car key. Can I STRONGLY suggest that if you have only one car key you make a note of its number or get another cut. Man, the inconvenience of getting a replacement. Had to get the radio code as well as the interior light (cunningly left on...) had drained the battery. A brain transplant is quite useful too.

Spare a thought for those of us who were just jumping into the water at that time. Course, in the 51st state we were a bit more autonomous (well anyway it was well before Loy's intense control freakery of the 90s) and in the mid-80s everyone was enthusiastic for setting up Gartmore and that's where energies were focused. Was PoP in 86? (Thought it was later.) Not a word of it hit the streets where I was.

Aw, Paw, you're just fishing for compliments. Well, hey, why not, this site is a good thing that has helped many. Me, I thought it needed shooting down as being a wicked and offensive place when I first happened across it. Fancy saying such things about that great ministry! And its dynamic leader, LCM! But as you know - I stuck around. And finally got healed. Not so much scales falling from my eyes as completely new eyes. This site still reaches out to new visitors to the Cafe and to lurkers. So build the extension and employ a few more busboys. Long may the Cafe continue to thrive. And its visitors thrive with it. Drinks all round, folks.

Yeah, lots of baby/small kid stuff - clothing, toys - the stuff that's only needed for a few months and then it's outgrown. Great idea to Freecycle your garage sale leftovers.

He needs a special huge chair? Handmade? They don't have chairs in the cities he's visiting? Does the fancy model come complete with string for correctly arranging the adjacent rows of chairs and kneelers mentioned in the article? Back on topic - I think he's a bit skinnier than VPW. And he has two working eyes.

You forgot the question, What sex are you? =Male or female or don't know or don't care

Just in case some of you are not aware, there is a group/organization called FREECYCLE where you can get, or get rid of, just about anything – free. It is arranged in individual cities or areas and if you googled Freecycle and the name of your city or area that would bring up local groups. www.freecycle.org I have benefited so much from Freecycle – mostly getting stuff (having just bought a house) but also getting rid of clutter and stuff I've beenable to upgrade. Only stipulations are that everything has to be free and cannot be animals (pets). It can range from cars, household furniture, plants, egg boxes, surplus homegrown veges – even a dozen odd socks were offered which were gone within a couple of hours (suggested use was as glove puppets). It's useful to get rid of ends of materials – little bits of plaster board or ½ tin of paint for example. Some people even donate their services. Also I have asked for things on loan for a week or two and have asked for advice about one or two things and folk have emailed with responses or pointed me to websites that answer the question. In the last couple of months, I have among other things received: 2 carpets (one of excellent quality and only a few months old) 2 rugs (one made of silk, looks old and valuable) A trio of hands-free telephones (a big need, that one) 2 complete computers PLUS boundless computer support by the man who made up one complete internet-ready computer for me from old but serviceable parts A pedal cycle 1/3 cubic metre of gravel (to re-lay garden path) Service for my sewing machine 2 complete stereo sets Plants for my garden ...plus loads more stuff For friends I have located: Pianos Beds Household furniture Weird stuff I have given away: Clay from my garden An assortment of plastic boxes (for storage purposes) Garden plants/seeds including one tree And everyone I have met has been a really nice person and usually very helpful. If you are short of funds yourself, help out disadvantaged people, need something unusual, or just need to get rid of something that still has usable time left in it – give it a try. If you're already a member of Freecycle, what are your success stories? If you haven't tried it yet - sort out your old junk and see what you can get rid of.

Well, BoJ, you've obviously got your view and don't wish to consider any other. I only floated it to see what people might think - for a bit of a discussion. Don't think this is going anywhere so this is my parting shot. Jen-o, Freecycle is good, yes, glad you found it helpful. Think I'll start a topic in Open so perhaps see you there.

At least he met some of the victims of the sexual abuse and apologized to them. Very late in the piece but better late than never. It seems to have helped some of the victims who were interviewed afterwards. Damage control (cynical)? Trying to appear better in the world's eyes? Was it really heartfelt? (the victims I heard interviewed seemed to think so). If it helped them it's got to be good. Most of us went through too much pain and still await acknowledgment of that.