waysider

I wonder what covenant we took at "the initiation into the inner sanctum". Was it the covenant of horseradish? Maybe it was to remind us that The Way will forever leave a bad taste in our mouths.....(Give me a little time, I'll find a scripture to back it.)

Well, you could always ask. Of course, that would send the message to him that you are interested in a dialog. It doesn't sound like you are. I know I wouldn't be.

I think it was supposed to be a derogatory reference to Kristen. It's a common acronym, referring to someone who is a "pain in the azz".

What happened with Wierdwille was the result of him being a self-centered pig. A man who is in a position of authority is not supposed to take advantage of the vulnerabilities of those for whom he is responsible. PERIOD.

The covenant of salt has its foundation in ancient history. Its a long standing custom of man, for the most part. But, is it dictated by scripture? Here are the only three occasions I know of that it is mentioned in the Bible: II Chronicles 13:5 (NIV) Don’t you know that the LORD, the God of Israel, has given the kingship of Israel to David and his descendants forever by a covenant of salt? Numbers 18:19 (NIV) 19 Whatever is set aside from the holy offerings the Israelites present to the LORD I give to you and your sons and daughters as your regular share. It is an everlasting covenant of salt before the LORD for both you and your offspring." Leviticus 2:13 (NIV) Season all your grain offerings with salt. Do not leave the salt of the covenant of your God out of your grain offerings; add salt to all your offering ------------- These scriptures are directed at specific individuals and specific groups. There is nothing in the scriptures that indicate it is to be practiced in a wide spread sense. In fact, there is nothing to indicate the specifics of how it should be performed. It's simply a tradition of man... ageless, widespread, and documented in the Bible, perhaps, but not a ritual prescribed by scripture.

You let them off too easy.

In my opinion, it really belongs here as much as it does in doctrinal because it deals with an interpretation of that section of scripture that was somewhat unique to The Way, especially the original sin part that Wierwille said we would just have to take his word on. That, in itself, makes it "About The Way".

Isaiah Chapter 38 38:1In those days was Hezekiah sick unto death. And Isaiah the prophet the son of Amoz came unto him, and said unto him, Thus saith the LORD, Set thine house in order: for thou shalt die, and not live. 38:2Then Hezekiah turned his face toward the wall, and prayed unto the LORD, 38:3And said, Remember now, O LORD, I beseech thee, how I have walked before thee in truth and with a perfect heart, and have done that which is good in thy sight. And Hezekiah wept sore. 38:4Then came the word of the LORD to Isaiah, saying, 38:5Go, and say to Hezekiah, Thus saith the LORD, the God of David thy father, I have heard thy prayer, I have seen thy tears: behold, I will add unto thy days fifteen years. Notice that it doesn't say WHY he turned his face to the wall, only that this is what he did. It doesn't even say that this was customary. Unless there is another section of scripture that gives more insight, I would rank this as speculative, private interpretation. Oh, but wait. Pillai lived in the land where the Bible was written, so, of course, that automatically made him an authority on things that happened 2,000+ years before his lifetime

You might say he is one of the reasons this site exists. http://www.greasespotcafe.com/main2/waydale/waydale-lawsuit/

Everything they do is rooted in either making money or saving money. When I was a fresh graduate of PFAL, I asked someone in leadership (in sincerity) why, if we wanted to reach large masses of people with the message of PFAL, didn't we offer to place the materials in public libraries and offer the class, free of charge. You can imagine the sort of convoluted logic that was given, explaining how I just didn't understand the spiritual aspects involved.

I think, as we age, we all go through a phase where we view the future of humanity as hopeless. My grandparents did, my parents did, I did, and, in time I'm sure our kids will, too. Maybe this is what gave birth to existentialism. But, life goes on, just as it has for eons before us. I wonder what people in "the dark ages" thought about when they wrestled with life's mysteries.

Maybe he rued his choice of sources, wishing he had chosen more obscure, untraceable works.

(See how the color thing works? Just click the little paint brush, Johnny.)

Maybe they don't owe you anything because they're bankrupt. (aside from their $53 million nest egg.)

You should have sent him a bill for career counseling. Your advise was spot on.

"Most things I will not change my stance on but Im not ready to listen and answer questions." Gee, now I'm not sure. That part really DOES sound like him!

A lot of people have disagreed with Mazlow's theory, calling it biased and flawed. Whether it is or isn't, though, is not all that important (IMO) within the context of this discussion. I think we can still use the concepts involved in the individual tiers as a broad means of definition. The fact is, The Way built quite a following, early on, by offering a product that closely resembles the love/belonging tier. Through abuse of the safety and esteem tiers, they stripped people of their self actualization and coerced them into a state that resembled the physiological state. This put people in a state of fear and dependency. We have seen the results. It's not a healthy process no matter whose theory is being modeled.

I agree 100%.

Remember this?...."Justified = Just as if I'd never sinned" Instead of emphasizing the past tense nature of the statement, they placed it on a time continuum that essentially changed the meaning to.... "I can sin because I'm justified."

This kinda reminds me of the little boy whose mother said, "Johnnie, stop pulling the cat's tail." Little Johnnie responded with, "I'm just holding on; the cat's doing all the pulling." They used that hedge of protection/spiritual bubble thing to hide behind a third party. "If you ever leave, you'll be sealing your own fate." See? They controlled you without letting you see it was they who were controlling the situation, not you.

Buy Nothing For April Fool's Day

So, then, what's your point in being involved in discussion other than to push your private agenda? edit: Are you still having trouble figuring out the quote function?

(My opinion) The bless patrol: It was a way of indoctrinating particpants with conspiracy phobia. "They're out to get us, kids!" Now, Wierwille, on the other hand, had just cause to fear retaliation from irate husbands, fathers and the like but, he had his own private "bless patrol" to keep an eye on those matters. The sleep deprivation: Been there, done that, got the tee shirt. It was a way to keep our minds from noticing what was really going on, in the "big picture" sense. What's all that got to do with earning an academic degree? Nothing.... That's my point.

Aye, that's the rub.