TWI claims they have no mark and avoid policy anymore. I'm sure they probably still teach the same thing about devil spirits. You may get someone to copy their advanced class syllabus for you. Or even better, you could look on ebay to see if someone has one for sale.
TWI doesn't report who their leadership is anymore. However if you called TWI headquarters and told them you were from Tennessee and was interested in attending fellowship, you would most likely get a call from the Limb coordinator, who is their "recruiter" (if that's what you want to call it). There is no way they will release information on who all of their disciples are in Tennessee. You would just have to get involved and hope they have a Limb meeting in order to see some people. I do not suggest you do this though.
What's your affiliation with TWI if any? If you have none, what's your interest in them and their teachings?
By the way, welcome to the cafe. Where is that waitress when you need a cup of coffee?
I'm currently still an "innie". As far as I know Stephen and Patti Fae Roberts are the Limb co-or's of Tennessee.
There are no more mark and avoid teachings or policys. They still teach, in the advance class only, about devil spirits. They focus more on God and what he's done for us overall. It is not prevailant to think that everything is evil and to go looking for the devil spirits in everyone and everything.
Instead there has been a shift to focus more on God, his goodness, healing and deliverance.
Don't get me wrong here - there are still a lot of problems. No apologizes have come forth about the past. It's kind of been swept under the rug like it didn't happen. People are openly hurting and untrusting of anything TWI. The no debt policy is still in effect and is not going anywhere anytime soon. Overall. the sts is really lame but occasionally a really good one goes out.
It depends on what area you live in and the leadership there as to how you are treated and the spiritual climate.
One of the only reasons I'm still in is due to the fact that my local fellowship is really awesome.
I have no personal connection to TWI. However, I'm currently witnessing the isolation of a teenager by his Wayfer mother and Wayfer stepfather. Both of these people are heavily involved in TWI and have been for years. Because of TWI teachings on non-Wayfers, I'm researching what they might teach children about non-Wayfer, ex-spouses (the child's biological parent).
If anyone has information or knows someone that has been successful in showing that TWI is damaging to a child's relationship with the non-Wayfer parent and the non-Wayfer parent was able to use that information in custody litigation, please pass this post on to them.
Whether or not mark and avoid is openly stated it is still in force.
Absolutely.
We are definitely on their mark/avoid list.....the one that twi says doesn't exist.
A close friend came to visit us a couple months ago, and had to cover all bases without breathing a word that he came to see us. Even in conversation, we assured him that we would not breath a word of his visit to any wafers.
Crazy, huh? The bod can openly LIE.....and innies still follow their lead.
While we are certain that the Wayfer mother is attempting to poison the teenager against his non-Wayfer father by teaching about "goats and sheep," "devil spirits," and lying to non-Wayfers being allowable since Wayfers are at war with non-believers, proof of these teachings is needed for the judge. By all appearances the teen is directly being taught to disrespect, disobey, and distrust his father because he is a "goat."
The intolerance TWI teaches against other religions, sexual preference, and certain races is effecting this teen's behavior. Documentation on these teachings would also effect the judge's decision in this case.
Also, when the teen is with his father the mother calls repeatedly to speak with the son and often uses some type of code words. Usually the calls start with the teen responding to her several times with (what sounds like) "Ram, Ram." Have any of you ever heard this phrase? It could be their own code, however I thought I should ask.
I truly thank each of you for taking the time to post answers. I have to say when it comes to this goat v. sheep war, goats climb mountains and fight strong.
I'm currently witnessing the isolation of a teenager by his Wayfer mother and Wayfer stepfather. Both of these people are heavily involved in TWI and have been for years. Because of TWI teachings on non-Wayfers, I'm researching what they might teach children about non-Wayfer, ex-spouses (the child's biological parent).
The only 'proof' you're going to have may be the documentation of actions, since TWI is secretive about some of their teachings, ‘Mark and Avoid’ being one.
Mark and Avoid is taught and practiced. Some of the verses are:
2 Corinthians 6:14 Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers: for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion hath light with darkness?
An unbeliever is anyone that refuses TWI teachings... which they deem 'THE WORD OF GOD'. Thos in the HOUSEHOLD are not to have FULL SHARING with the anyone OUTSIDE.... it would mean they were getting tangled up with the unrighteous darkness, and those WHO HAVE KNOWN THE TRUTH in TWI and LEAVE are WORSE than the average joe who hasn't heard yet.
You are witnessing a child NOT being able to share fully, or FELLOWSHIP, and with their own biological parent?!?!... because the Mother says the Dad is a goat? He's stubborn about TWI? Seems something like that would get laughed out of court.
Gal 6:10 As we have therefore, opportunity, let us do good unto all men, especially unto them who are of the household of faith.
Eph 2:19 Now therefore ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellow citizens with the saints, and of the household of God;
These are some of the verses TWI uses to show there is a DIFFERENCE in 'Christians'. TWI teaches that they are 'THE HOUSEHOLD OF FAITH'... all other people fit into ANOTHER category. (Unbeliever, unbelieving-believer, born of the seed of the serpent...etc)
The 'ousted' spouse situation that you're 'witnessing', this person would be considered an 'unbelieving-believer' if they had been with TWI at some point... one who has been taught the truth, but refuses to believe... this means, by leaving the true household, they would NOT BE BELIEVING...
Those OUTSIDE TWI will NOT 'hear' these GREAT PEARLS OF TRUTH, since these are such DAMNING teachings, reserved for the MATURE BELIEVER... but these are TEACHINGS that are taught along the way, a secret kind of thing... in the household fellowship... I don't think they're committing them to print, BUT YES, THIS IS TAUGHT! Hummm… I do recall hearing this on tape…
Getting current items may be tough, since TWI went underground with the teachings and deny they practice them anymore. It kept getting thrown back in their face in courts around the country.
Having them would be great, but not required.
Keep a journal of all your observations. Date and time - details. Very important.
You need to show that the child is being harmed by what the Mother / Step is doing. Alienation of parental affection is usally a big no-no to judges, irregardless of whether a cult is involved.
If you have your journal in order, when you go to court, insist for a Guardian Ad Lidum (GAL). They're expensive, but if you get a decent one, well worth it. The GAL will interview all involved, including the children. If harm is being done, they will report it to the court. GAL recommendations carry a lot of weight with judges. Depending where you live, it's almost impossible for a judge not to follow the GAL's recomendations.
If you're looking to get an order forbiding the child contact with The Way, that's a lot tougher. The 1st ammendment gets in the way and you have to prove the child has already been harmed by the group before a judge will put a restriction on each parent's 1st ammendment rights.
The non-Way parent rejected TWI years ago and suspects that is the reason his Wayfer wife left and divorced him. They share joint custody and equal time with the child.
Now that the child is a teen the mother's interference with the father's rights and time with the child have increased tremendously to the point that the father insisted that the court order be followed and that the mother abide by a well-known psychologist's recommendation that she let the child enjoy his time with his father without interference from her.
Because of the non-Wayfer father insisting on his court ordered time (full month of July for summer with no interference) and the psychologist insisting that if the Wayfer mother does not stop controlling the child he will not mature properly, the mother filed for full custody and less visitation for the non-Way father.
Even though the father is an extremely intelligent, successful, educated man, the mother has made statements that she "fears" for the child and that he is in "danger." Since the father in no way ever places this child at risk, the only answer that seemed to fit was that the mother "fears" for the child spending equal, undisturbed time with his non-Way father because she must somehow be afraid of TWI or herself losing control of the child's thoughts.
Because of the irratic, irrational behavior of the mother, it has become necessary to examine TWI role in not only the mother's problems but also what effect her mind control and TWI mind control has on the child.
Not to mention, the mother is remarried to someone who supposedly is a disciple in TWI.
Also, when the teen is with his father the mother calls repeatedly to speak with the son and often uses some type of code words. Usually the calls start with the teen responding to her several times with (what sounds like) "Ram, Ram." Have any of you ever heard this phrase? It could be their own code, however I thought I should ask.
I never heard of any "code". I was in TWI for 20 years. I left 2 1/2 years ago. It sounds to me that this mother started off as being strange and her involvement in TWI is making it worse.
The Wayfer mom fears her child is in danger because he has to spend time with an unbelieving father. Common sense completely eludes people who believe doctrines taught like the ones in TWI. I remember having this fear formyself after first leaving. While I was on Staff at TWI Headquarters, we were told that we needed to go places two-by-two in order to have God's protection. Fear came over me because I had left the "Household", and I was no longer in God's protection. I was in a grocery store parking lot late at night all by myself. Once I started thinking logically, the fear left. But had I not left TWI, I would have never been able to come to that logical conclusion.
When someone becomes indoctrinated with TWI, it is a hard thing to shake even when you want to. I'm sure many of us here on GSC still struggle with waybrain ideas. For those still in, you just have to pray for them and trust God that he will prick their heart to see the real truth. My mom and my sister prayed for me 7 years before I left.
This child is in a hard situation having a lunatic wayfer for a mom. She even sounds weird for TWI standards if she is speaking "code" to her child. :blink: I met a few "out there" people while I was in TWI. The doctrines just made them worse.
While we are certain that the Wayfer mother is attempting to poison the teenager against his non-Wayfer father by teaching about "goats and sheep," "devil spirits," and lying to non-Wayfers being allowable since Wayfers are at war with non-believers, proof of these teachings is needed for the judge. By all appearances the teen is directly being taught to disrespect, disobey, and distrust his father because he is a "goat."
I've heard it said in teachings that a "goat" is someone who is hard-headed and rejected the Word. That's probably the reference that you've heard. As far as the "Ram Ram" thing - I have no insight on that phrase. Perhaps it's just some "cutsie" talk between a mother and son - who knows.
This paragraph by edawn spoke volumes:
Because of the non-Wayfer father insisting on his court ordered time (full month of July for summer with no interference) and the psychologist insisting that if the Wayfer mother does not stop controlling the child he will not mature properly, the mother filed for full custody and less visitation for the non-Way father.
How many threads have we had now about how children in TWI were treated? We've got several posters (active posters) here at the Cafe who grew up in TWI - like Lindyhopper - they've shared a lot about it. I'm thankful I'm not raising my kids in that sort of atmosphere! YIKES!
It seemed to me that many of the kids, especially those living with just their moms, were very immature for their age. I remember hearing teachings about how even college students needed to provide their parents and leadership with a daily schedule, broke into hourly increments, to show where they would be during the day.
Parents were told to have daily contact with their kids. College bound kids were strongly urged to live at home and attend college - of course, they couldn't go in debt for student loans, either. I couldn't imagine being 23 years old and still answering to my parents every moment of the day - come on! It seemed like suffocation - over kill - to me. I'm sure none of these policies have changed - I can't see how or why - this info is from just 5 years ago.
The Rock of Ages 95'. The whole week was centered around Corth. and not being unequally yoked with unbelievers. It was pretty indepth and very physco.
There was all kinds of rantings about people, religions, and many diverts to everything being evil. Inculding, 90% of the people in twi - he ranted about teen sex, homos, the catholic church, debt, and definitely have no "full" sharing with anyone outside the minsitry - because like a smaller ox tied with the bigger ox YOU WILL BE BROUGHT DOWN. So, don't get entangled with anyone outside of the ministry because we are God's ONLY true household. I think he also mentioned that there is no protection outside of the household.
Those are not exact quotes but it gives a good place to start for the kind of teachings you are looking for to win the case.
Maybe, someone still has those tapes and can copy or send them to you. With those tapes, the case could possibly be won hands down.
I threw mine away a few years ago after listening to about an hour of it. I was looking for the word that had been taught to back up the debt policy. Of course, I didn't find any and got really ticked off listening to them - hince, that's why they are in the trash. Now, I wish I would have kept them.
I can only but agree with every posting here regarding Wayfer and non-Wayfer parents.
When I went to battle for child custody, a court-ordered psychologist was involved to help determine
whom the "better" parent for my child would be.
This psychologist took this information to the judge"...it would be a deteriment to this child to continue being raised in such a dominating and judgemental religios circle.....".
Based on this information and other things about my affiliation w/TWI is #1, why I left TWI and #2 why I lost custody in court.
The children raised in TWI are under such pressure from Wayfer parent to comply due to the parents
that are dying to comply with *leadership* NOT the Word of God.
This child is in a hard situation having a lunatic wayfer for a mom. She even sounds weird for TWI standards if she is speaking "code" to her child. :blink: I met a few "out there" people while I was in TWI. The doctrines just made them worse.
This seems like the crux of the issue to me. I doubt if you'll get anywhere with the TWI angle on the child custody case. I've seen this tactic fail more than succeed. Not that it isn't relevant, but I think the real arguable issue here is the mother's effort to alienate the son from his non-Way father.
You should also be aware of the fact that twi monitors this website and is probably trying to figure out who you are talking about in order to "counter" your strategies...good luck...these people are real wackos.
Sometimes parents will play the code word with their children in order that they might find out how things are going, it's not uncommon at all in twi, or wasn't when I was hanging out there.
Especially when it's a twi/non twi split. I wouldn't be surprised to find that the non twi dad and the child have some kind of communication when they speak on the phone or in presence of twi folks.
Example: My child is at a friends house and I call to check on her, but don't want the hosting family to feel I'm implying they aren't taking care of my kid or I just want to find out how it's going.
Before hand I tell my kid that if things are well, then say 'a book'. My prearranged question is "did you forget anything?" If things are going not so well she's to say 'my shoes'. Whatever, but there may be a court order that says mom can't ask about things during the visits. The judge can't very well cite her for asking if her child forgot something.
If the kid answers 'a book' then I can go from there. Very common in twi, of course an organization that thrives on secrecy and false fronts. If that's the case here, 'ram, ram' might seem wierd, but it's possible that it's the chosen word for them.
Another of those 'we'll never know for sure' things that twi is.
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Nottawayfer
TWI claims they have no mark and avoid policy anymore. I'm sure they probably still teach the same thing about devil spirits. You may get someone to copy their advanced class syllabus for you. Or even better, you could look on ebay to see if someone has one for sale.
TWI doesn't report who their leadership is anymore. However if you called TWI headquarters and told them you were from Tennessee and was interested in attending fellowship, you would most likely get a call from the Limb coordinator, who is their "recruiter" (if that's what you want to call it). There is no way they will release information on who all of their disciples are in Tennessee. You would just have to get involved and hope they have a Limb meeting in order to see some people. I do not suggest you do this though.
What's your affiliation with TWI if any? If you have none, what's your interest in them and their teachings?
By the way, welcome to the cafe. Where is that waitress when you need a cup of coffee?
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dmiller
Edawn --- welcome to GreaseSpot!
Perhaps Penguin or I love Bagpipes can answer you best, as they just recently got out.
Belle still has contacts in twi, so she could help too.
Good luck!
(PS --- I tried to find out what was happenening here in Minney-soda and when I called twi,
I told them I was *interested in fellowship*, but they told me nothing over the phone.
They did (however), take my name and passed it on to the state *leaders* ---
who in turn got hold of me. What a suspicious bunch -- eh?) :unsure:
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dmiller
Coffee (on the house), for you! :)
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djs
Hi Welcome,
I'm currently still an "innie". As far as I know Stephen and Patti Fae Roberts are the Limb co-or's of Tennessee.
There are no more mark and avoid teachings or policys. They still teach, in the advance class only, about devil spirits. They focus more on God and what he's done for us overall. It is not prevailant to think that everything is evil and to go looking for the devil spirits in everyone and everything.
Instead there has been a shift to focus more on God, his goodness, healing and deliverance.
Don't get me wrong here - there are still a lot of problems. No apologizes have come forth about the past. It's kind of been swept under the rug like it didn't happen. People are openly hurting and untrusting of anything TWI. The no debt policy is still in effect and is not going anywhere anytime soon. Overall. the sts is really lame but occasionally a really good one goes out.
It depends on what area you live in and the leadership there as to how you are treated and the spiritual climate.
One of the only reasons I'm still in is due to the fact that my local fellowship is really awesome.
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Belle
I get the magazine and do stay in touch with a few people who are still involved. PM me if I can be of any help. :)
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edawn
Thanks to all of you for your replies.
I have no personal connection to TWI. However, I'm currently witnessing the isolation of a teenager by his Wayfer mother and Wayfer stepfather. Both of these people are heavily involved in TWI and have been for years. Because of TWI teachings on non-Wayfers, I'm researching what they might teach children about non-Wayfer, ex-spouses (the child's biological parent).
If anyone has information or knows someone that has been successful in showing that TWI is damaging to a child's relationship with the non-Wayfer parent and the non-Wayfer parent was able to use that information in custody litigation, please pass this post on to them.
Again, I thank all of you for your replies.
edawn
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Belle
I think there are a few posters who have been to court regarding custody battles between parents because of the TWIt parent and such.
Does anyone remember who they might be? Perhaps they could help, too.
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dancing
Whether or not mark and avoid is openly stated it is still in force.
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skyrider
Absolutely.
We are definitely on their mark/avoid list.....the one that twi says doesn't exist.
A close friend came to visit us a couple months ago, and had to cover all bases without breathing a word that he came to see us. Even in conversation, we assured him that we would not breath a word of his visit to any wafers.
Crazy, huh? The bod can openly LIE.....and innies still follow their lead.
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WordWolf
IIRC,
they've previously said that people have left,
but on their own volition-
that there was NEVER a "mark and avoid".
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edawn
I appreciate all of the posts.
While we are certain that the Wayfer mother is attempting to poison the teenager against his non-Wayfer father by teaching about "goats and sheep," "devil spirits," and lying to non-Wayfers being allowable since Wayfers are at war with non-believers, proof of these teachings is needed for the judge. By all appearances the teen is directly being taught to disrespect, disobey, and distrust his father because he is a "goat."
The intolerance TWI teaches against other religions, sexual preference, and certain races is effecting this teen's behavior. Documentation on these teachings would also effect the judge's decision in this case.
Also, when the teen is with his father the mother calls repeatedly to speak with the son and often uses some type of code words. Usually the calls start with the teen responding to her several times with (what sounds like) "Ram, Ram." Have any of you ever heard this phrase? It could be their own code, however I thought I should ask.
I truly thank each of you for taking the time to post answers. I have to say when it comes to this goat v. sheep war, goats climb mountains and fight strong.
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GT
There are a few examples of this type of teaching in the Waydale audio section. The ones by Donna Martindale are rather explicit on the subject.
http://www.greasespotcafe.com/waydale/main/real.html
Any judge would be impressed with Craig's rant on homosexuals.
Scan of original letter in PDF: http://www.greasespotcafe.com/waydale/pdf-...homos071294.pdf
How The Way classifies people:
http://www.greasespotcafe.com/waydale/pdf-docs/status.pdf
Dr. John Juedes has a good section on child custody fights involving The Way:
http://www.uia.net/~messiah7/tw_familycustody.htm
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SafariVista
The only 'proof' you're going to have may be the documentation of actions, since TWI is secretive about some of their teachings, ‘Mark and Avoid’ being one.
Mark and Avoid is taught and practiced. Some of the verses are:
2 Corinthians 6:14 Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers: for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion hath light with darkness?
An unbeliever is anyone that refuses TWI teachings... which they deem 'THE WORD OF GOD'. Thos in the HOUSEHOLD are not to have FULL SHARING with the anyone OUTSIDE.... it would mean they were getting tangled up with the unrighteous darkness, and those WHO HAVE KNOWN THE TRUTH in TWI and LEAVE are WORSE than the average joe who hasn't heard yet.
You are witnessing a child NOT being able to share fully, or FELLOWSHIP, and with their own biological parent?!?!... because the Mother says the Dad is a goat? He's stubborn about TWI? Seems something like that would get laughed out of court.
Gal 6:10 As we have therefore, opportunity, let us do good unto all men, especially unto them who are of the household of faith.
Eph 2:19 Now therefore ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellow citizens with the saints, and of the household of God;
These are some of the verses TWI uses to show there is a DIFFERENCE in 'Christians'. TWI teaches that they are 'THE HOUSEHOLD OF FAITH'... all other people fit into ANOTHER category. (Unbeliever, unbelieving-believer, born of the seed of the serpent...etc)
The 'ousted' spouse situation that you're 'witnessing', this person would be considered an 'unbelieving-believer' if they had been with TWI at some point... one who has been taught the truth, but refuses to believe... this means, by leaving the true household, they would NOT BE BELIEVING...
Those OUTSIDE TWI will NOT 'hear' these GREAT PEARLS OF TRUTH, since these are such DAMNING teachings, reserved for the MATURE BELIEVER... but these are TEACHINGS that are taught along the way, a secret kind of thing... in the household fellowship... I don't think they're committing them to print, BUT YES, THIS IS TAUGHT! Hummm… I do recall hearing this on tape…
The proof is plain to see~
GreasyTech seems to have good info for you...
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GT
Getting current items may be tough, since TWI went underground with the teachings and deny they practice them anymore. It kept getting thrown back in their face in courts around the country.
Having them would be great, but not required.
Keep a journal of all your observations. Date and time - details. Very important.
You need to show that the child is being harmed by what the Mother / Step is doing. Alienation of parental affection is usally a big no-no to judges, irregardless of whether a cult is involved.
If you have your journal in order, when you go to court, insist for a Guardian Ad Lidum (GAL). They're expensive, but if you get a decent one, well worth it. The GAL will interview all involved, including the children. If harm is being done, they will report it to the court. GAL recommendations carry a lot of weight with judges. Depending where you live, it's almost impossible for a judge not to follow the GAL's recomendations.
If you're looking to get an order forbiding the child contact with The Way, that's a lot tougher. The 1st ammendment gets in the way and you have to prove the child has already been harmed by the group before a judge will put a restriction on each parent's 1st ammendment rights.
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edawn
The non-Way parent rejected TWI years ago and suspects that is the reason his Wayfer wife left and divorced him. They share joint custody and equal time with the child.
Now that the child is a teen the mother's interference with the father's rights and time with the child have increased tremendously to the point that the father insisted that the court order be followed and that the mother abide by a well-known psychologist's recommendation that she let the child enjoy his time with his father without interference from her.
Because of the non-Wayfer father insisting on his court ordered time (full month of July for summer with no interference) and the psychologist insisting that if the Wayfer mother does not stop controlling the child he will not mature properly, the mother filed for full custody and less visitation for the non-Way father.
Even though the father is an extremely intelligent, successful, educated man, the mother has made statements that she "fears" for the child and that he is in "danger." Since the father in no way ever places this child at risk, the only answer that seemed to fit was that the mother "fears" for the child spending equal, undisturbed time with his non-Way father because she must somehow be afraid of TWI or herself losing control of the child's thoughts.
Because of the irratic, irrational behavior of the mother, it has become necessary to examine TWI role in not only the mother's problems but also what effect her mind control and TWI mind control has on the child.
Not to mention, the mother is remarried to someone who supposedly is a disciple in TWI.
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Nottawayfer
I never heard of any "code". I was in TWI for 20 years. I left 2 1/2 years ago. It sounds to me that this mother started off as being strange and her involvement in TWI is making it worse.
The Wayfer mom fears her child is in danger because he has to spend time with an unbelieving father. Common sense completely eludes people who believe doctrines taught like the ones in TWI. I remember having this fear formyself after first leaving. While I was on Staff at TWI Headquarters, we were told that we needed to go places two-by-two in order to have God's protection. Fear came over me because I had left the "Household", and I was no longer in God's protection. I was in a grocery store parking lot late at night all by myself. Once I started thinking logically, the fear left. But had I not left TWI, I would have never been able to come to that logical conclusion.
When someone becomes indoctrinated with TWI, it is a hard thing to shake even when you want to. I'm sure many of us here on GSC still struggle with waybrain ideas. For those still in, you just have to pray for them and trust God that he will prick their heart to see the real truth. My mom and my sister prayed for me 7 years before I left.
This child is in a hard situation having a lunatic wayfer for a mom. She even sounds weird for TWI standards if she is speaking "code" to her child. :blink: I met a few "out there" people while I was in TWI. The doctrines just made them worse.
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Belle
I have a bit of information that I have provided for previous lawsuits and will contact you privately about how to send that information to you. :)
I also get the current magazine, but have not had time to go through the most recent one yet.
I have a lot of teaching tapes from when I was involved (just under 2 years ago) as well and will see if there is anything useful on those tapes.
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ChasUFarley
This paragraph by edawn spoke volumes:
How many threads have we had now about how children in TWI were treated? We've got several posters (active posters) here at the Cafe who grew up in TWI - like Lindyhopper - they've shared a lot about it. I'm thankful I'm not raising my kids in that sort of atmosphere! YIKES!
It seemed to me that many of the kids, especially those living with just their moms, were very immature for their age. I remember hearing teachings about how even college students needed to provide their parents and leadership with a daily schedule, broke into hourly increments, to show where they would be during the day.
Parents were told to have daily contact with their kids. College bound kids were strongly urged to live at home and attend college - of course, they couldn't go in debt for student loans, either. I couldn't imagine being 23 years old and still answering to my parents every moment of the day - come on! It seemed like suffocation - over kill - to me. I'm sure none of these policies have changed - I can't see how or why - this info is from just 5 years ago.
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djs
The Rock of Ages 95'. The whole week was centered around Corth. and not being unequally yoked with unbelievers. It was pretty indepth and very physco.
There was all kinds of rantings about people, religions, and many diverts to everything being evil. Inculding, 90% of the people in twi - he ranted about teen sex, homos, the catholic church, debt, and definitely have no "full" sharing with anyone outside the minsitry - because like a smaller ox tied with the bigger ox YOU WILL BE BROUGHT DOWN. So, don't get entangled with anyone outside of the ministry because we are God's ONLY true household. I think he also mentioned that there is no protection outside of the household.
Those are not exact quotes but it gives a good place to start for the kind of teachings you are looking for to win the case.
Maybe, someone still has those tapes and can copy or send them to you. With those tapes, the case could possibly be won hands down.
I threw mine away a few years ago after listening to about an hour of it. I was looking for the word that had been taught to back up the debt policy. Of course, I didn't find any and got really ticked off listening to them - hince, that's why they are in the trash. Now, I wish I would have kept them.
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rvrdiver
I can only but agree with every posting here regarding Wayfer and non-Wayfer parents.
When I went to battle for child custody, a court-ordered psychologist was involved to help determine
whom the "better" parent for my child would be.
This psychologist took this information to the judge"...it would be a deteriment to this child to continue being raised in such a dominating and judgemental religios circle.....".
Based on this information and other things about my affiliation w/TWI is #1, why I left TWI and #2 why I lost custody in court.
The children raised in TWI are under such pressure from Wayfer parent to comply due to the parents
that are dying to comply with *leadership* NOT the Word of God.
Adios!
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shortfuse
This seems like the crux of the issue to me. I doubt if you'll get anywhere with the TWI angle on the child custody case. I've seen this tactic fail more than succeed. Not that it isn't relevant, but I think the real arguable issue here is the mother's effort to alienate the son from his non-Way father.
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sogwap51
Maybe the mom was referring to the dad as a goat.....and the kid was responding that he was a "ram":
ram [ram]
n (plural rams)
1. agriculture male sheep: a male sheep
Encarta ® World English Dictionary © & (P) 1998-2004 Microsoft Corporation. All rights reserved.
Just a long-shot.....probably a real long shot but that's what came to mind when I read the word "ram".
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GrouchoMarxJr
You should also be aware of the fact that twi monitors this website and is probably trying to figure out who you are talking about in order to "counter" your strategies...good luck...these people are real wackos.
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Shellon
Sometimes parents will play the code word with their children in order that they might find out how things are going, it's not uncommon at all in twi, or wasn't when I was hanging out there.
Especially when it's a twi/non twi split. I wouldn't be surprised to find that the non twi dad and the child have some kind of communication when they speak on the phone or in presence of twi folks.
Example: My child is at a friends house and I call to check on her, but don't want the hosting family to feel I'm implying they aren't taking care of my kid or I just want to find out how it's going.
Before hand I tell my kid that if things are well, then say 'a book'. My prearranged question is "did you forget anything?" If things are going not so well she's to say 'my shoes'. Whatever, but there may be a court order that says mom can't ask about things during the visits. The judge can't very well cite her for asking if her child forgot something.
If the kid answers 'a book' then I can go from there. Very common in twi, of course an organization that thrives on secrecy and false fronts. If that's the case here, 'ram, ram' might seem wierd, but it's possible that it's the chosen word for them.
Another of those 'we'll never know for sure' things that twi is.
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