I don't know about other religions but I can tell you this.. the astronauts in training have these near death experiences when they go into that centrifuge thingee. I saw a report on it on 20/20 I think it was.
As long as there is death there will be near death experiences everywhere. I never was all that interested in it so I dont know exactly what they see except what I over hear from time to time or hear on some cheesy Tv show on...It seems to be everything from loved ones to a bright light to warmth to nothing to whatever God of choice they have ....and yes -- a very serious and disciplined Buddhist meditator once told me in conversation that she saw Ganesha when she was deathly ill then was able to recover. but she made no big deal out of it.
Ive seen plenty of Oriental looking depictions of Christ as well as any other culture or color christ--although I have no clue what he actually looked like nor does anyone else as far as i know
My late mother use to tell me about how my great grandmother suffered a heart attack and collapsed on the kitchen floor. This was sometime in the 1930s. Relatives on the scene massaged her chest and got her heart beating again. When she gained consciousness, she was angry with them for having removed her from the beautiful garden where she had been, filled with brilliant flowers and trees.
In-a-gadda-da-vida.
My late parents just as well had been "raptured". Death came to them "in the twinkling of an eye" amidst their usual business; here one second, departed the next, released from their old fleshly garments.
NDEs have been documented in just about every culture, and it usually involves either someone from the person's life they loved, or an icon from their religion.
When the brain realizes that the body is dying and can't be stopped, it begins to shut things down. It stops registering pain, releases endorphins and other items to help put the mind at ease. Given this, it's not a stretch to think that a part of the brain would play out some fantasy the person had been dreaming about for years about meeting so and so when they die.
The point is, the brain knows about death, does everything to delay it, but knows when it's over and nothing can be done. Rather than going out in agony, it does what it can to go out peacefully.
Interested in knowing if people of Asian or Middle Eastern persuasion have records of this 'phenomena' and if they did/do does an Oriental looking Jesus appear to them (for example) or do they have mention of a Confuscious or Mohammed telling them to "go back, it's not your time yet" ??
I do not believe that Confucians deify Confucius, it's a non-theistic religion, Muslim believe that Mohammed was ascended into heaven (on a white horse I believe)
Yeah, I would reiterate that Confuscious is not really in the "God" or "man/God" mold that most of the other religious icons are. In fact Confuscionism is much more pragmatic and concerned with the here-and-now than any religions I can think of. It can be downright Machiavellian at times.
I find it odd that you think the responses are "curiouser and curiouser" though. To me they're pretty straightforward explanations. I would think "rational and more rational" would be closer to the mark.
I don`t know if you really wanted an answere or not allan, I knew a woman once who died.
Her account of being discovered alive hours later in the morgue was backed up by many people.
Anyway, if you care....after her meeting with *the board* she was returned. I don`t believe that it was a hallucination because after it had been determined that she was to return....she was given an diet and herbs that would (and did) cure the cancer that had killed her.
The ingredients are becoming well known today for their anti oxident capabilities but were unknown at the time.
I read a pretty neat book recently a true story about a minister that died in a car wreck ... he was prayed for by another minister 90 miniutes later at the scene while they were waiting for the mortuary vehicle. (That much is documented)
The story is about his 90 miniutes in heaven and how it impacted his life when he came back.
It is written by Don Piper if you are interested.
Probably will be difficult because the information in the book and my friends experience are at odds with your understanding.
Just my two cents worth, on the chance that you were genuinely interested.
Thanks for that rascal, I am interested and will google in your references. A lot of Christians think Jesus visited the imprisoned spirits whilst in the 'grave' when there is really no record of him going anywhere or doing anything whilst dead. I thought surely if there is such a thing as nde's, surely Jesus would have mentioned something ??
Muhammad himself had something like a near-death experience at an early age. From the book Muhammad, the Messenger of God, p9...
""Halima and her husband ran to Muhammad and found him standing up, his face livid. They held him close and got out of him what was the matter. He said, "Two men in white rainment came and threw me down and opened up my belly and searched inside for I don't know what."
The foster father said, "The child has had a stroke."
Thanks for that rascal, I am interested and will google in your references. A lot of Christians think Jesus visited the imprisoned spirits whilst in the 'grave' when there is really no record of him going anywhere or doing anything whilst dead. I thought surely if there is such a thing as nde's, surely Jesus would have mentioned something ??
isnt that in Peter somewhere?
Yeah, I Peter 3:18-20. It was taught in TWI, in fact its in JCOP, but TWI says he preached to them after the resurrection.
so is a "near-death experience" like an administrative screw-up, like when a hotel loses your reservation? i don't get it--who's in charge? and doesn't the whole "it's not your time" thing mean that our death is scheduled in advance?
I dunno, with my friend it was *unfinished business*.
The beings at her meeting apparently don`t magically heal your body, because she still had the cancer when she awoke in the morgue, but they gave her a diet, a list of things that would make her strong enough to over come the cancer....
She was a staunch Christian her entire life. She knew a stunning amount about herbs and vitamins. Much of what she shared with me at the time though was unacceptible because I was still so way brained that I couldn`t accept anything outside of the doctrinal realm of pfal.
Some of the things she taught me...only made complete sense years after she was gone and I had grown in other areas to the point that I could understand.
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Sudo
I don't know about other religions but I can tell you this.. the astronauts in training have these near death experiences when they go into that centrifuge thingee. I saw a report on it on 20/20 I think it was.
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allan w.
did I 'touch a nerve' ??
Interesting Sudo, thanks.
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mstar1
As long as there is death there will be near death experiences everywhere. I never was all that interested in it so I dont know exactly what they see except what I over hear from time to time or hear on some cheesy Tv show on...It seems to be everything from loved ones to a bright light to warmth to nothing to whatever God of choice they have ....and yes -- a very serious and disciplined Buddhist meditator once told me in conversation that she saw Ganesha when she was deathly ill then was able to recover. but she made no big deal out of it.
Ive seen plenty of Oriental looking depictions of Christ as well as any other culture or color christ--although I have no clue what he actually looked like nor does anyone else as far as i know
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TheInvisibleDan
Mstar, that's a cool picture.
My late mother use to tell me about how my great grandmother suffered a heart attack and collapsed on the kitchen floor. This was sometime in the 1930s. Relatives on the scene massaged her chest and got her heart beating again. When she gained consciousness, she was angry with them for having removed her from the beautiful garden where she had been, filled with brilliant flowers and trees.
In-a-gadda-da-vida.
My late parents just as well had been "raptured". Death came to them "in the twinkling of an eye" amidst their usual business; here one second, departed the next, released from their old fleshly garments.
Danny
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GT
NDEs have been documented in just about every culture, and it usually involves either someone from the person's life they loved, or an icon from their religion.
When the brain realizes that the body is dying and can't be stopped, it begins to shut things down. It stops registering pain, releases endorphins and other items to help put the mind at ease. Given this, it's not a stretch to think that a part of the brain would play out some fantasy the person had been dreaming about for years about meeting so and so when they die.
The point is, the brain knows about death, does everything to delay it, but knows when it's over and nothing can be done. Rather than going out in agony, it does what it can to go out peacefully.
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allan w.
curiouser and curiouser !
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WordWolf
I've heard that "raptures of the deep", also known as "nitrogen narcosis",
has produced hallucinations as well. I think most of us have heard something to that effect, actually.
I was unable to find documentation of this in a quick search,
but this is what I DID find.
http://www.wikiscuba.com/wiki/index.php/Nitrogen_narcosis
I think it may prove useful when discussing what astronauts experience,
since there may be similarities.
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Oakspear
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George Aar
Yeah, I would reiterate that Confuscious is not really in the "God" or "man/God" mold that most of the other religious icons are. In fact Confuscionism is much more pragmatic and concerned with the here-and-now than any religions I can think of. It can be downright Machiavellian at times.
I find it odd that you think the responses are "curiouser and curiouser" though. To me they're pretty straightforward explanations. I would think "rational and more rational" would be closer to the mark.
Anyway, then there's this:
http://skepdic.com/nde.html
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allan w.
No, I wouldn't think the way the mind/brain works could be described as rational (as we define rational) at all. Not by a long shot !
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excathedra
i'm sorry for my post that got deleted
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allan w.
I'm sorry for deleting it !!
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rascal
I don`t know if you really wanted an answere or not allan, I knew a woman once who died.
Her account of being discovered alive hours later in the morgue was backed up by many people.
Anyway, if you care....after her meeting with *the board* she was returned. I don`t believe that it was a hallucination because after it had been determined that she was to return....she was given an diet and herbs that would (and did) cure the cancer that had killed her.
The ingredients are becoming well known today for their anti oxident capabilities but were unknown at the time.
I read a pretty neat book recently a true story about a minister that died in a car wreck ... he was prayed for by another minister 90 miniutes later at the scene while they were waiting for the mortuary vehicle. (That much is documented)
The story is about his 90 miniutes in heaven and how it impacted his life when he came back.
It is written by Don Piper if you are interested.
Probably will be difficult because the information in the book and my friends experience are at odds with your understanding.
Just my two cents worth, on the chance that you were genuinely interested.
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allan w.
Thanks for that rascal, I am interested and will google in your references. A lot of Christians think Jesus visited the imprisoned spirits whilst in the 'grave' when there is really no record of him going anywhere or doing anything whilst dead. I thought surely if there is such a thing as nde's, surely Jesus would have mentioned something ??
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mstar1
isnt that in Peter somewhere?
anyway-thats up to you
If you want---- HERE are interviews some guy did with about 40 or 50 of these people.
HERE is his main page
If you google near death experience there are quite a few sites that catalog just about any avenue that you might have questions about
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rascal
I don`t know Allan, could there be scriptural reference and we just don`t recognise them because we were taught that when you are dead your dead?
The book I was referring to was called *90 miniutes in heaven* I found my copy at walmart (do they have those in australia?)
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dmiller
Hmmmmm. I thought *90 minutes in Heaven* was talking about shopping at
Walmart!
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Jim
Muhammad himself had something like a near-death experience at an early age. From the book Muhammad, the Messenger of God, p9...
""Halima and her husband ran to Muhammad and found him standing up, his face livid. They held him close and got out of him what was the matter. He said, "Two men in white rainment came and threw me down and opened up my belly and searched inside for I don't know what."
The foster father said, "The child has had a stroke."
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VeganXTC
Yeah, I Peter 3:18-20. It was taught in TWI, in fact its in JCOP, but TWI says he preached to them after the resurrection.
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SafariVista
:blink: .... that would be Hell in the Walmart over here...
okay, sorry....
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sprawled out
so is a "near-death experience" like an administrative screw-up, like when a hotel loses your reservation? i don't get it--who's in charge? and doesn't the whole "it's not your time" thing mean that our death is scheduled in advance?
so who do i call about cancelling my reservation?
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mstar1
sorry, no early arrivals, no cancellations, no exchanges, all reservations are non tranferable.
per policy of the management.
We apologize for any inconvenience
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rascal
I dunno, with my friend it was *unfinished business*.
The beings at her meeting apparently don`t magically heal your body, because she still had the cancer when she awoke in the morgue, but they gave her a diet, a list of things that would make her strong enough to over come the cancer....
She was a staunch Christian her entire life. She knew a stunning amount about herbs and vitamins. Much of what she shared with me at the time though was unacceptible because I was still so way brained that I couldn`t accept anything outside of the doctrinal realm of pfal.
Some of the things she taught me...only made complete sense years after she was gone and I had grown in other areas to the point that I could understand.
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