Bowtwi - what an amazing, sick thing you went through. I hope many people still in can read this and have their eyes opened. Thank you for sharing. How are you doing after all of this, and how is your son - hopefully no adverse effects.
But we know false accusations are from the adversary - this tells the real story about those in charge. To go after and slander innocent people who love God.
I rarely read such long posts, but I did read yours this am...and it has me in tears.
I hope you are well now, and getting the support you need even still.
I can't even imagine the torment you must have felt, but, as I was reading, my skin was crawling and my eyes were tearing.
I had a relatively fun time in twi, so rarely speak bad of it...but...
This situation you speak is really making me see how EVIL and VILE twi is...CRUEL...MEAN...
My god is a gentle god...my god is a god of love...Can this truly be the same twi that I thought was teaching me the goodness of god? Holy Moly...how blind was I?
If there's anything I can do for you, and, I don't have much, please let me know.
I love you girl, thankyou for having the guts to open your heart, and expose the vile evilness of twi.
What they did to you and your dear, sweet son is abominable, how horribly cruel.
I hope those cowardly mother f------s .......suposed leaders.....that didn`t even have the guts to even face you honestly, fry in hell.
How truly sick and depraved they are, to destroy a sweet believers heart and life.
I hope there is some special form of excruciatingly painfull, and long lasting punishment, being held in store for those who perpetrate such horrific cruelty on one of God`s beloved children.
I understand the horror of false accusation, from those in whom you have placed your trust. I understand the humiliation, and the desperation to try to make them understand,that it must have all been a big mistake.
Unfortunatly, it happened alot in twi. Having been falsly accused myself once, of being possessed, and knowing at least 3 other dear ladies who were slandered and cast out, for being suposed lesbians(incidently..all of whom are happily married, with up to 6 children each rofl)
Twi leadership were/are abiding in such deep darkness.
They couldn`t POSSIBLY recieve much less recognise a message from God. What monsters they are, hiding behind the bible to perpetrate their evil on poor unsuspecting believers, whose biggest sin, is wanting to be of service to the God they love.
Sunesis and Wacky Funster - thank you for your comments. We are very well and thankful for the good we did get from our time with twi. It wasn't all bad.
I have written my story several times over the years, but never posted it before, as I didn't see any profit. Today, I felt different and let my breakfast get cold while I typed it out again. I was inspired by Hope's poll asking when people got out.
At first, my son was angry with God for letting this happen to us. He pretty much had no use for God or anything that reminded him of God. It didn't help that my ex-husband blamed the ministry for my divorcing him.
I tried to find a church, but of course never succeeded with my waybrain still in full force. I didn't push the issue with my son until a year or two after the M&A,when I discovered a tumor in my abdominal wall. It was BENIGN, but before we found that out, I made my son tell me whether or not he believed GOD, not twi, but GOD. He admitted he did and was a wonderful prayer partner.
I continue to believe the verse in Proverbs (2:6 maybe?) FC at the Indiana Campus taught so well about training a child up in the Word and when they are old they will not depart from it. I also still believe most of what I learned while studying with twi. In the area I lived in Wisconsin, it really was the Word of God we were into. It really was the lifestyle of believers that we endeavored to live.
I had heard of some of the rumors about vpw and lcm, but somehow I just didn't believe them. The Word was hot and moving where we were and that other stuff just didn't seem possible to me. Even with the POP - I was sponsoring a family that was in res at that time - they told us they stood with lcm, so I didn't even read it til I saw it on Waydale. I remember my twig coordinator at the time went to a SNS at HQ and before he left he said he was going to see what was going on over there. When he came back, he said he stood with the ministry. I respected his "walk" and if he stood with lcm then so did I. Besides, if Mrs. Wierwille was "with lcm," that said it all to me.
I am proud to say that my son knows what God thinks of him. He is self-supporting (drives a 2002 Mitsubishi Gallant with leather interior and takes his mom for rides in it!!!). He is very clear-minded and faithful to his family.
What I didn't mention above is that I now also have a 5-year-old daughter. My son is a fabulous brother to her. She went camping with him and his girlfriend two weeks ago and they had a ball! Had I stayed with the ministry, I would never have known this joy! God has done a lot more than merely "spit in my direction!"
We were never abused to the degree that many were by twi - I thank God for that. I no longer let others'opinions make my decisions, tho. On the rare occasion that the subject comes up between us, my son and I get a chuckle out of them accusing US of being homos. We do wonder what threat we were to them, but it no longer matters to us. We are living more than abundant lives and we know that God never M&A'd us. I say all this to show that even though twi "dumped" us, we know that God never did.
I'm sorry that they couldn't be honest and say that they didn't like us or whatever the truth was at the time, but I sure feel like I got a lot of good out of my time with twi, in spite of what they were doing behind the scenes. I'm also glad that I only have to answer for MY life, not theirs when the time comes.
Steve, I don't think you insensitive - I've asked that same question over 100 times - no clear answer comes to mind. People have told me that since I divorced my husband, I no longer had access to his money for abs. I don't know.
I was a wow that year (93-94) and one of my wow sisters didn't like that I could handle drinking only 2 beers in a 24 hour period or that I could get in bed by midnight every night yet up by 7. She had trouble finding a job, keeping a job, taking care of her two very young children... It goes on and on.
She had a brother who was a Corps grad. At that ROA (94), her brother approached me while I was walking to meet with the cabinet member I mentioned in my original post. He got right up in my face, yelling and swearing at me (sound familiar?) for not being nicer to his sister on the field and on the ride back to HQ from the field. He told me I had failed God by not supporting his sister better!
I had the only car in our wow team. I had to provide this woman and her kids a ride back with no help from her. When we stopped to eat one morning, she got herself something for breakfast, but nothing for her kids. I shared mine with them after discovering that fact, as she had already eaten all of hers and what should have been theirs and we were on the road before I realized they had nothing to eat. Partway through our ride to HQ, our ride coordinator told her to keep her mouth shut the rest of the way, to keep her bible open on her lap and stop bothering me. (I drove the entire way from Santa Fe, NM to HQ in 3 days, as I recall.)
I don't really know how SHE would have this kind of power, unless there was something else going on that I wasn't aware of (sex now comes to mind, but I accuse no-one of anything). If she was jealous of ME, she was really jealous of our team coordinator. She is the only one I ever knew of that had any evil thoughts of me and further of our team coordinator.
I don't know. Stranger things have happened with twi. If anyone is in a position to answer that question, I would appreciate hearing it. My email address is bowtwi@aol.com
This coordinator is now out of TWI himself..Has he ever thought to apologize for all of that horror? It amazes me that these people carelessly throw innocent lives away by lying like that! Unbelieveable! I am so looking forward to seeing what kind of "rewards" God has stored up for these exceedingly great and mighty, most perfectly perfected and flawlessly flawless men of Satan - I betcha they're gonna feel all warm and toasty!
I just don't know what to say, I'm speechless (and for me that's unusual!)
I was WOW *93-94* and remember hearing all this crap spewed out from the HQ podium.
Glad to hear you and yours seem to be doing fine! There was also a gal from Il, or at least that is where she went back to after a short stay in the WC. Never heard her side of the story; or any story really. Just noticed some whispering going on in certain circles.
What a thing to do to a child and a family that were only trying to do their best to support and move a ministry that could do this to them!
... that I can imagine for this malevolent, flesh-tearing hostility toward homosexuals, to the degree that even unfounded accusations are sufficient cause to purge TWI's own ranks of men, women, and even children with such cruel vehemence is...
that...
...their formerly fearless former leader is a closet-dwelling, self-hating "homo."
Said it before, I'll say it again. That boy has wickedly serious, serious sexual issues, and he's probably not the only one who might have been creeping around Ohio's corn fields feeling things he shouldn't. I hate to scare anybody, but maybe anybody who's had "contact" with him should get tested for AIDS. How much of that MOG-sex on demand was unprotected? Most if not all, I understand.
This predator has been trying to prove his dubious "manhood" for a long, long time. What would be his motive? Who needs to prove something so badly he hurts people without any regard? Someone living a lie, maybe?
Was he abused sexually as a child? Anybody who knew him from "back home" ever hint about it? Unresolved, issues like that will turn some people into the meanest species of freak. We may have here a case in point. Whatever the cause, and we may never know, there's no missing the telling symptoms and vicious, hateful behavior.
**
What about it, "Luke?" Was it long, long ago in a (Ford) Galaxy far, far away? Did some inbred, Okie hillbilly ever make you squeal? Maybe it was done by a cult-leader in his traveling lust bus. Maybe that same cult leader ordered YOU to show your "meekness?" What gave you the rabies for "homos" anyway? (Don't tell us it's either "spiritual anger" or the love of God, either, you knuckle-dragging, mouth-breathing, foam-drooling freak-o.)
You're no man of "God." If you'd been present when a legion of swine stampeded over a Galilean cliff, YOU would have led their charge. Soooooo-eeeeeeeee... SPLASH!!! Or maybe He might have healed you. You have to WANT to be healed though. Isn't that the way it goes?
**
bowtwi - that was an awful thing you experienced. It's may be too long ago now, but I think you have excellent grounds for a lawsuit. Let's see, slander (against you AND your son) might work, especially considering your son's age at the time.
It might be too much heartache to re-live. And whatever you do, don't do it for anyone but you and your son. You are not a "mascot," for the Way, or ex-Way's here at Grease Spot either. I would only hope you might find some closure, and compensation, if you chose to go forward with it.
Regards...
[This message was edited by satori on June 21, 2002 at 10:38.]
I'm so sorry for what happened to you and your son. How could they make those accusations and not back them up?Judge, Jury and Executioner. You were all alone!!! I'm so unbelievably angry (trying to keep it clean here)
The corps coordinator must have been P M****da or W C**pp. Have they apologized to you or tried to make up for this? They are supposed to be so wonderful for leaving TWI. What are they doing?
I am so ashamed for being part of this thing. This is war.
It must be painful for you to recount that part of your life even now after so many years.
I too remember when "he who must not be named" came to WI. At that time, he reinforced in my mind what a Man of God ought to be. Part of what spurred us to go in residence. I considered him a friend right up until the day we were M&A'd. that's when I saw his true colors. On that day, he just turned hs back on us and let us sink.
You tugged my heart inside out when I read what you were forced to endure.
Glad you and your son are out and that you still have your right mind.
This kind of stuff makes me so angry, even now. I am so sorry that you had to go through this. You and so many others.
One of the reasons I left TWI because I saw this kind of stuff comming. Even in the 70's an 80's I saw folks getting reamed for stuff that they did not do. It is a good thing I left, because I would most likely have kicked some serious butt and gotten my self kicked out pretty quick anyway.
But, sometimes I wish I would have stayed longer and could have helped others to see what I saw happpening early on.
These chicken $hit leaders count on folks being intimidated while they hide behind their ordinations or leadership postions.
It's too bad that it was mostly the heartless, spineless jerks, cowards, and LCM wannabes that got promoted the "more important" leadership positions in TWI, suck-ups who wouldn't know God if he appeared in person. They make me sick.
TWI and it's cowardly leaders are an absolute disgrace to God and to Christianity. How anyone can continue to support them is beyond me.
I'm sorry that you and your son had to go through all the garbage. Remember that you are loved. Twi has accused alot of people of things that they didn't do (so does the devil). Thank God that you are out and FREE! I will remember to pray for God to bless you bigtime!
I am overwhelmed by all the responses to my post. Extremely thankful and humbled, but overwhelmed. I apologize for stirring up all that anger on one hand, yet appreciate it on the other (maybe the Gemini in me? tee hee). Each response feels like those great hugs we used to share. I remember those brotherly & sisterly hugs & kisses and how wonderful it felt to know that we knew that we were all God's kids and that HE was smiling as he looked at us.
I remember being in that "top security - prove you're spritually mature enough to be here by showing you wear the proper nametag" meeting that lcm called that night at ROA '94. He went so far about homos that I started to wonder about his past too. I never spoke the words out loud, but considered that he must have had homosexual thoughts or actions somewhere along the line that he was ashamed of. At the very least, I was embarrassed that "our" MOG was taking such a stand. After all, homos were people too, and wasn't it most effective to love people into doing the Word? I remember wincing countless times during the SNS teachings when he went on and on attacking homos. We were in Santa Fe, of all places - trying to show people the love of God!
RB - if you and your wife are who I think you are, hearing you're out is worth what it took to write all that. It sends shivers up and down my spine to think that you wonderful, wonderful people had to endure M&A by that same person. If he looked at you or spoke to either of you the way he did me - it makes me weak in my stomach to even consider it. I have heard that he is out and does apologize to whomever he can. Personally, I don't think it would help ME any - maybe it would benefit him. I'd just as soon never see or even hear his voice again.
I admire the folks that have sued twi. I don't see myself even looking into any action I might be legally entitled to take. Besides, I believe that the best revenge really IS living well. And I'm living well.
I just don't want to be behind certain people when they stand at the bema. I feel sure that once born again - always born again, so I think lcm will stand before God one day. Once upon a time I would have liked to see him get his rewards. Now it would be the adult equivalent of being a kid in the same room while my brother got a whooping... No thanks - I'd rather not be a witness to THAT.
Lcm did not mention us by name on that SNS tape, as I recall. Even if he did, it was over 7 years ago. Besides, I'm not one to be the center of attention - used to love it when I was teaching the Word, but in a courtroom - the thought of it creeps me out.
WW - I feel deeply for you having been on that end of what that man could do. I trust it's been years for you and that you're healing too. Maybe you would or have already posted your "story?" Yes, I feel certain that my daughter is a direct gift from God. How could I have become bitter and hard-hearted with such a delightful sweetie melting my heart continually? Couldn't possibly happen.
Another thought - while it was a horrible blow at the time, I had my son to be strong for. I didn't have time to feel sorry for myself - I had to make us a living. My only regret is that I didn't punch that wimp right in the nose when he said those things about my son. Sure, he was the family corps coordinator, but my son was my son. I admit that I was brainwashed - it wasn't until my nonway friend told me he had said I was a lesbian that I even HEARD THAT part. That was a mistake on twi's part. I knew that only God knows our hearts, so I could consider (momentarily) that my son could maybe have possibly had a homo experience during that short time he was out of my sight at the campus the night before. But there was NO DOUBT in my mind about my "sexuality." They blew it there!
I will tell my son about this post. When I first started lurking on Waydale and then GS, he was opposed to the idea. He felt it was dangerous to my heart. About a year ago, our former twig coordinators came to Tampa and invited us to visit with them. My son even brought his girlfriend along. We picked right up where we had left off several years ago. They were still the same and so were we. It was so good for us to see them. I don't know if my son will read this right away, so I have printed it out (whew!) for him. I will definitely tell him about it tomorrow. He's a great young man and may need a bit of time to digest that I have spoken about "it."
God bless the Greasespotcafe and all who honestly share our hearts here. I love you all. bowtwi
BOWTWI to hear what you went through. I am fairly new to gs but have read many of the posts. I can sympathize wtih all you went through. They really treated the children the worst. In one sense they say you're the best, then they tear them down for being kids.
Sick, sick, sick.
love,
Lorna
[This message was edited by LornaDoone on June 25, 2002 at 20:38.]
I have been very busy so, I printed your original post so that I could read it when I got a chance.
I am sorry for what you and your son had to go through. What a bunch of nasty people.
I was amazed at the fact that you wanted to go back. It was so honest and so heart wrenching. I remember feeling that way about TWI once. I thought it was the best thing in the world.
The *93-94* WOW year was possibly the worst year in the history of the program. While LCM was seeing everything he *touched* turn to sh!t, (the diametrically opposed touch to the *Midas* touch ) He presented the *theory* the devil was getting better at defeating the Word and therefore had to have new and fresh approaches to defeat him! Hence the *Present truth* became ever so more dominant because we poor followers had to have Loy to defeat that bird in our lives; he had gotten so good at messing with us.
The program had been historically rigid and often applied in legalistic ways; but LCM took that program and went off the deep end with more legalism than ever! What he did was to place a strangle hold on the spirit of God and replace it with all his present truth!
Knowing that he was MOG and that all failures surely had to be a result of contamination in the ranks; he turned his *wolves* loose on the *fold*! He had single-handedly destroyed any good in that program and filled it with his overly legalistic WC, so failure had to come from the inside!
In the case of bowtwi and her son, some one had to introduce this false accusations to Loy to justify what he believed to be true, contamination in the WOW program and on the field! My guess is that this WOW-sis with the WC bro got this info to Loy and in the process managed to *repay* these folks for their horrible year! I am sure that the WC had convinced himself that all this was true; seeing by association his sister had to be more spiritually clean!
The program failed miserably that year and it wasn't Loy's fault; nor that of the people he had placed in charge and had trained in legalism to the point they couldn't live and enjoy life. It reminds of the OT where they would take some innocent goat and lay all the sins of Israel on it and send it out into the dessert to die.
Another thing to keep in mind is that while these *witch-hunts* were executed, many saw the chance to prove they were more spiritual and used things as this to climb the corporate ladder of TWI. Like delivering the head of an enemy to the king; only Loy just thought he was a king and many wanted to serve him for their own gain.
While hearing all these stories about these false accusations, I remember thinking that it was extremely strange that a young teen could possibly sexually abuse any smaller children for a period and not get caught while it was still going on. Now I believe that what really happened was LCM was looking to place the failure of that WOW year somewhere and some one delivered him an innocent family to be sacrificed and feed the beast Loy was.
Funny, I just realized that Grizzy (and who knows who else) probably knows more than I do about what our supposed crimes were! I was told that there were 25 federal counts over a 5 state area of some kind of "homo rape" against my son. I was told almost nothing by the corps coordinator. I was so stunned to even hear him talking that way that I'm sure I don't remember all of what he said. I had just been invited to eat breakfast at the head table! They sat and broke bread with me, putting on loving faces and then WHAMMO! When I got called to the president's parlor, I was treated like I was WORSE THAN JUDAS!
It wasn't until I spoke with the trunk coordinator on the phone that I remember hearing anything about the accusations. He said that a child had drawn some picture of him and my son in some kind of homo rape scene and that was their evidence.
I wasn't allowed to know WHO the accuser was, or WHAT specifically we were accused of altho we were living in America at the time. We were definitely guilty with no opportunity to face the accuser or even prove ourselves innocent.
Never had anyone ever spoken to me prior to that about any alleged homo activity out of either my son or me. It always seemed to me that if they believed those accusations themselves, and if they believed that I was Corps material, as they convinced me that they did, then the Godly, the loving thing to do would have been to help us with our supposed problem. Instead, the very first thing I heard of this at all was "go away - we're NOT going to help YOU!" Took me years to really digest all that!
On the second half of our wow year, the powers that were sent 3 adults and 3 children from our team "home." My personal opinion was that we were just really hitting our stride and about to really establish some strong fellowships that would stand after our year ended. The remaining wows from the other family moved into the house my son and I were living in. The limb coordinator told me that this one lady (the one with the 2 young kids) might still be sent off the field, but that "we" were giving her the benefit of the doubt. He blew me away with that statement. The 2 ladies from my family that they sent home were actually living the wow program to the best of their abilities. I know - I was their family coordinator.
This lady with the 2 kids told me that she hadn't been raising her kids by herself - that her parents did everything for her since her divorce and she really didn't have to do much for herself "back home." She told me she went wow because her brother thought it was what she needed. She also confided several things to me about what a rotten sister she had been to her brother as they grew up, but that he was so good he never saw it that way.
She said things like she wanted to be able to be more like me and our team coordinator, but she just really couldn't do all of the wow commitment every day! She made it clear to me that she was just getting through each day til the end when she would return to her parents' home...
I might be wrong on this next exact detail, but as my memory goes, it seems to me that when school let out, she somehow convinced us that she couldn't afford to pay a real babysitter anymore on her fast food wages, so my 13 year old son would have to babysit for her kids.
He did it, but wasn't thrilled about it. He was not the very nicest babysitter, but a rapist, NO WAY! I don't even recall how long he babysat for her (and I'm not going to ask him).
When I came to the high school from the campus after being told to "go away," I asked him to tell me about the sex he had been having. He was a 13 year old boy - a NORMAL 13 year old boy. I won't go into our entire discussion here, but the closet thing to anything that could possibly have occurred on the wowfield was that one day he peeked in on the 3 year old girl when she was napping and saw her lying there with no panties on. THAT'S IT. Nobody touched anyone. He pulled her covers up over her. Nothing to do with a boy there!
What this lady might have said to her brother and who he then might have said what to is still beyond my imagination. I just remember her telling me stories about how horribly she treated her brother when they were kids, even doing things like after he would do his chores, she would sneak behind him and mess things up so when their parents checked on his work, they thought he was lying to them and even sent him for psychiatric help. She told me she still thought that was funny. If she could do that to her own flesh and blood, there was no limit to what she would do to me, who she considered a "goody goody" that made her look bad by comparison. I definitely was her enemy by the time we got to the ROA.
I just know that I went from a welcomed home WOW who was convinced by twi leadership that my son and I belonged in THAT corps to the worst scum that ever tried to slither into the outfit in less than 2 weeks!
When her brother attacked me at the ROA, I was beyond stunned. I was on my way to meeting with a cabinet member, to discuss whether or not I spent the next three years training to be WayCorps or not, and so it was particularly bad timing.
Also at the ROA, 2 pair of my son's Levis shorts and my camera with all the photos from the trip disappeared out of our tent. That she had borrowed those red and black shorts from my son before, as they wore the same size made me suspect I knew what happened to our stuff.
She, like lcm and all the rest will answer someday for all they have done.
If I am wrong, I apologize, but I have to say if it waddles like a duck and quacks, I have to call it a duck!
I especially loved that comment from Steve describing lcm.
"He doesn't think, he only thinks that he thinks. He doesn't have a head, his neck's just blowing bubbles."
I think I'll take you up on that cup of coffee, AC, I could use it right about now. Please pass the butter pecan-flavored cream
Thanks to you all for your kind support. Anything I can do to help any of you?
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Sunesis
Bowtwi - what an amazing, sick thing you went through. I hope many people still in can read this and have their eyes opened. Thank you for sharing. How are you doing after all of this, and how is your son - hopefully no adverse effects.
But we know false accusations are from the adversary - this tells the real story about those in charge. To go after and slander innocent people who love God.
I hope you're doing well.
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Wacky Funster
Bowtwi...
I rarely read such long posts, but I did read yours this am...and it has me in tears.
I hope you are well now, and getting the support you need even still.
I can't even imagine the torment you must have felt, but, as I was reading, my skin was crawling and my eyes were tearing.
I had a relatively fun time in twi, so rarely speak bad of it...but...
This situation you speak is really making me see how EVIL and VILE twi is...CRUEL...MEAN...
My god is a gentle god...my god is a god of love...Can this truly be the same twi that I thought was teaching me the goodness of god? Holy Moly...how blind was I?
If there's anything I can do for you, and, I don't have much, please let me know.
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Steve!
Would I be considered insensitive if I asked:
BetterOff, Did you do something to make them single you out? What I mean is, did you reject someone's advances?
Or was it completely out of the blue?
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rascal
I love you girl, thankyou for having the guts to open your heart, and expose the vile evilness of twi.
What they did to you and your dear, sweet son is abominable, how horribly cruel.
I hope those cowardly mother f------s .......suposed leaders.....that didn`t even have the guts to even face you honestly, fry in hell.
How truly sick and depraved they are, to destroy a sweet believers heart and life.
I hope there is some special form of excruciatingly painfull, and long lasting punishment, being held in store for those who perpetrate such horrific cruelty on one of God`s beloved children.
I understand the horror of false accusation, from those in whom you have placed your trust. I understand the humiliation, and the desperation to try to make them understand,that it must have all been a big mistake.
Unfortunatly, it happened alot in twi. Having been falsly accused myself once, of being possessed, and knowing at least 3 other dear ladies who were slandered and cast out, for being suposed lesbians(incidently..all of whom are happily married, with up to 6 children each rofl)
Twi leadership were/are abiding in such deep darkness.
They couldn`t POSSIBLY recieve much less recognise a message from God. What monsters they are, hiding behind the bible to perpetrate their evil on poor unsuspecting believers, whose biggest sin, is wanting to be of service to the God they love.
grrrrrrrrrr CathyWs12
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bowtwi
Sunesis and Wacky Funster - thank you for your comments. We are very well and thankful for the good we did get from our time with twi. It wasn't all bad.
I have written my story several times over the years, but never posted it before, as I didn't see any profit. Today, I felt different and let my breakfast get cold while I typed it out again. I was inspired by Hope's poll asking when people got out.
At first, my son was angry with God for letting this happen to us. He pretty much had no use for God or anything that reminded him of God. It didn't help that my ex-husband blamed the ministry for my divorcing him.
I tried to find a church, but of course never succeeded with my waybrain still in full force. I didn't push the issue with my son until a year or two after the M&A,when I discovered a tumor in my abdominal wall. It was BENIGN, but before we found that out, I made my son tell me whether or not he believed GOD, not twi, but GOD. He admitted he did and was a wonderful prayer partner.
I continue to believe the verse in Proverbs (2:6 maybe?) FC at the Indiana Campus taught so well about training a child up in the Word and when they are old they will not depart from it. I also still believe most of what I learned while studying with twi. In the area I lived in Wisconsin, it really was the Word of God we were into. It really was the lifestyle of believers that we endeavored to live.
I had heard of some of the rumors about vpw and lcm, but somehow I just didn't believe them. The Word was hot and moving where we were and that other stuff just didn't seem possible to me. Even with the POP - I was sponsoring a family that was in res at that time - they told us they stood with lcm, so I didn't even read it til I saw it on Waydale. I remember my twig coordinator at the time went to a SNS at HQ and before he left he said he was going to see what was going on over there. When he came back, he said he stood with the ministry. I respected his "walk" and if he stood with lcm then so did I. Besides, if Mrs. Wierwille was "with lcm," that said it all to me.
I am proud to say that my son knows what God thinks of him. He is self-supporting (drives a 2002 Mitsubishi Gallant with leather interior and takes his mom for rides in it!!!). He is very clear-minded and faithful to his family.
What I didn't mention above is that I now also have a 5-year-old daughter. My son is a fabulous brother to her. She went camping with him and his girlfriend two weeks ago and they had a ball! Had I stayed with the ministry, I would never have known this joy! God has done a lot more than merely "spit in my direction!"
We were never abused to the degree that many were by twi - I thank God for that. I no longer let others'opinions make my decisions, tho. On the rare occasion that the subject comes up between us, my son and I get a chuckle out of them accusing US of being homos. We do wonder what threat we were to them, but it no longer matters to us. We are living more than abundant lives and we know that God never M&A'd us. I say all this to show that even though twi "dumped" us, we know that God never did.
I'm sorry that they couldn't be honest and say that they didn't like us or whatever the truth was at the time, but I sure feel like I got a lot of good out of my time with twi, in spite of what they were doing behind the scenes. I'm also glad that I only have to answer for MY life, not theirs when the time comes.
bowtwi
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CoolWaters
Just another hug for you and your son.
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bowtwi
Steve, I don't think you insensitive - I've asked that same question over 100 times - no clear answer comes to mind. People have told me that since I divorced my husband, I no longer had access to his money for abs. I don't know.
I was a wow that year (93-94) and one of my wow sisters didn't like that I could handle drinking only 2 beers in a 24 hour period or that I could get in bed by midnight every night yet up by 7. She had trouble finding a job, keeping a job, taking care of her two very young children... It goes on and on.
She had a brother who was a Corps grad. At that ROA (94), her brother approached me while I was walking to meet with the cabinet member I mentioned in my original post. He got right up in my face, yelling and swearing at me (sound familiar?) for not being nicer to his sister on the field and on the ride back to HQ from the field. He told me I had failed God by not supporting his sister better!
I had the only car in our wow team. I had to provide this woman and her kids a ride back with no help from her. When we stopped to eat one morning, she got herself something for breakfast, but nothing for her kids. I shared mine with them after discovering that fact, as she had already eaten all of hers and what should have been theirs and we were on the road before I realized they had nothing to eat. Partway through our ride to HQ, our ride coordinator told her to keep her mouth shut the rest of the way, to keep her bible open on her lap and stop bothering me. (I drove the entire way from Santa Fe, NM to HQ in 3 days, as I recall.)
I don't really know how SHE would have this kind of power, unless there was something else going on that I wasn't aware of (sex now comes to mind, but I accuse no-one of anything). If she was jealous of ME, she was really jealous of our team coordinator. She is the only one I ever knew of that had any evil thoughts of me and further of our team coordinator.
I don't know. Stranger things have happened with twi. If anyone is in a position to answer that question, I would appreciate hearing it. My email address is bowtwi@aol.com
I remain convinced that I am bowtwi.
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Watered Garden
...you and your son went through that.
This coordinator is now out of TWI himself..Has he ever thought to apologize for all of that horror? It amazes me that these people carelessly throw innocent lives away by lying like that! Unbelieveable! I am so looking forward to seeing what kind of "rewards" God has stored up for these exceedingly great and mighty, most perfectly perfected and flawlessly flawless men of Satan - I betcha they're gonna feel all warm and toasty!
I just don't know what to say, I'm speechless (and for me that's unusual!)
WG
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Grizzy
I was WOW *93-94* and remember hearing all this crap spewed out from the HQ podium.
Glad to hear you and yours seem to be doing fine! There was also a gal from Il, or at least that is where she went back to after a short stay in the WC. Never heard her side of the story; or any story really. Just noticed some whispering going on in certain circles.
What a thing to do to a child and a family that were only trying to do their best to support and move a ministry that could do this to them!
Grizzy COLOR>SIZE>
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satori
... that I can imagine for this malevolent, flesh-tearing hostility toward homosexuals, to the degree that even unfounded accusations are sufficient cause to purge TWI's own ranks of men, women, and even children with such cruel vehemence is...
that...
...their formerly fearless former leader is a closet-dwelling, self-hating "homo."
Said it before, I'll say it again. That boy has wickedly serious, serious sexual issues, and he's probably not the only one who might have been creeping around Ohio's corn fields feeling things he shouldn't. I hate to scare anybody, but maybe anybody who's had "contact" with him should get tested for AIDS. How much of that MOG-sex on demand was unprotected? Most if not all, I understand.
This predator has been trying to prove his dubious "manhood" for a long, long time. What would be his motive? Who needs to prove something so badly he hurts people without any regard? Someone living a lie, maybe?
Was he abused sexually as a child? Anybody who knew him from "back home" ever hint about it? Unresolved, issues like that will turn some people into the meanest species of freak. We may have here a case in point. Whatever the cause, and we may never know, there's no missing the telling symptoms and vicious, hateful behavior.
**
What about it, "Luke?" Was it long, long ago in a (Ford) Galaxy far, far away? Did some inbred, Okie hillbilly ever make you squeal? Maybe it was done by a cult-leader in his traveling lust bus. Maybe that same cult leader ordered YOU to show your "meekness?" What gave you the rabies for "homos" anyway? (Don't tell us it's either "spiritual anger" or the love of God, either, you knuckle-dragging, mouth-breathing, foam-drooling freak-o.)
You're no man of "God." If you'd been present when a legion of swine stampeded over a Galilean cliff, YOU would have led their charge. Soooooo-eeeeeeeee... SPLASH!!! Or maybe He might have healed you. You have to WANT to be healed though. Isn't that the way it goes?
**
bowtwi - that was an awful thing you experienced. It's may be too long ago now, but I think you have excellent grounds for a lawsuit. Let's see, slander (against you AND your son) might work, especially considering your son's age at the time.
It might be too much heartache to re-live. And whatever you do, don't do it for anyone but you and your son. You are not a "mascot," for the Way, or ex-Way's here at Grease Spot either. I would only hope you might find some closure, and compensation, if you chose to go forward with it.
Regards...
[This message was edited by satori on June 21, 2002 at 10:38.]
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Linda Z
What a chilling description of the behavior of a bunch of people who have deluded themselves into thinking they speak for God.
I'm glad you and your son are doing well. God is truly bigger than all the small-minded, paranoid would-be bigshots out there, that's for sure!
Linda Z
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Steve!
BetterOff, you said that you were mentioned on that SNS tape - was it by name?
If so, that can be used as evidence.
Regarding loyboy, let's say about him what he's said many hundreds of times:
He doesn't think, he only thinks that he thinks. He doesn't have a head, his neck's just blowing bubbles.
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washingtonweather
Joel 2:25 (I think-dont have it in front ofme)
"THe Lord will restore that which the Locusts have eaten..."
That same corpsco. messed our lives pretty bad too. In or out...by their fruit you shall know them!
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excathedra
such a heartbreaking account of how evil and mean people can be (never mind in the name of God)
dear bowtwi, are you going to let your wonderful son read this thread?
either way, i really want you both to know how sorry i am and how much i admire your strength and your loving magnificent hearts
(((((((bowtwi and bowtwi jr.)))))))
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grasshopper
I'm so sorry for what happened to you and your son. How could they make those accusations and not back them up?Judge, Jury and Executioner. You were all alone!!! I'm so unbelievably angry (trying to keep it clean here)
The corps coordinator must have been P M****da or W C**pp. Have they apologized to you or tried to make up for this? They are supposed to be so wonderful for leaving TWI. What are they doing?
I am so ashamed for being part of this thing. This is war.
BASTARDS!!!!!
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Righteous Brother
It must be painful for you to recount that part of your life even now after so many years.
I too remember when "he who must not be named" came to WI. At that time, he reinforced in my mind what a Man of God ought to be. Part of what spurred us to go in residence. I considered him a friend right up until the day we were M&A'd. that's when I saw his true colors. On that day, he just turned hs back on us and let us sink.
You tugged my heart inside out when I read what you were forced to endure.
Glad you and your son are out and that you still have your right mind.
((((((((((((((((( bowtwi ))))))))))))))))))
RB
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TheSongRemainsTheSame
bowtwi...
I have read your thread and am thankful you and your son remember LAUGHTER!!!!!!!
Rok On!!!!!!!
Song
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Goey
Bowtwi,
This kind of stuff makes me so angry, even now. I am so sorry that you had to go through this. You and so many others.
One of the reasons I left TWI because I saw this kind of stuff comming. Even in the 70's an 80's I saw folks getting reamed for stuff that they did not do. It is a good thing I left, because I would most likely have kicked some serious butt and gotten my self kicked out pretty quick anyway.
But, sometimes I wish I would have stayed longer and could have helped others to see what I saw happpening early on.
These chicken $hit leaders count on folks being intimidated while they hide behind their ordinations or leadership postions.
It's too bad that it was mostly the heartless, spineless jerks, cowards, and LCM wannabes that got promoted the "more important" leadership positions in TWI, suck-ups who wouldn't know God if he appeared in person. They make me sick.
TWI and it's cowardly leaders are an absolute disgrace to God and to Christianity. How anyone can continue to support them is beyond me.
Goey
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gladtobeout
I'm sorry that you and your son had to go through all the garbage. Remember that you are loved. Twi has accused alot of people of things that they didn't do (so does the devil). Thank God that you are out and FREE! I will remember to pray for God to bless you bigtime!
gladtobeout
gladtobeout
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bowtwi
I am overwhelmed by all the responses to my post. Extremely thankful and humbled, but overwhelmed. I apologize for stirring up all that anger on one hand, yet appreciate it on the other (maybe the Gemini in me? tee hee). Each response feels like those great hugs we used to share. I remember those brotherly & sisterly hugs & kisses and how wonderful it felt to know that we knew that we were all God's kids and that HE was smiling as he looked at us.
I remember being in that "top security - prove you're spritually mature enough to be here by showing you wear the proper nametag" meeting that lcm called that night at ROA '94. He went so far about homos that I started to wonder about his past too. I never spoke the words out loud, but considered that he must have had homosexual thoughts or actions somewhere along the line that he was ashamed of. At the very least, I was embarrassed that "our" MOG was taking such a stand. After all, homos were people too, and wasn't it most effective to love people into doing the Word? I remember wincing countless times during the SNS teachings when he went on and on attacking homos. We were in Santa Fe, of all places - trying to show people the love of God!
RB - if you and your wife are who I think you are, hearing you're out is worth what it took to write all that. It sends shivers up and down my spine to think that you wonderful, wonderful people had to endure M&A by that same person. If he looked at you or spoke to either of you the way he did me - it makes me weak in my stomach to even consider it. I have heard that he is out and does apologize to whomever he can. Personally, I don't think it would help ME any - maybe it would benefit him. I'd just as soon never see or even hear his voice again.
I admire the folks that have sued twi. I don't see myself even looking into any action I might be legally entitled to take. Besides, I believe that the best revenge really IS living well. And I'm living well.
I just don't want to be behind certain people when they stand at the bema. I feel sure that once born again - always born again, so I think lcm will stand before God one day. Once upon a time I would have liked to see him get his rewards. Now it would be the adult equivalent of being a kid in the same room while my brother got a whooping... No thanks - I'd rather not be a witness to THAT.
Lcm did not mention us by name on that SNS tape, as I recall. Even if he did, it was over 7 years ago. Besides, I'm not one to be the center of attention - used to love it when I was teaching the Word, but in a courtroom - the thought of it creeps me out.
WW - I feel deeply for you having been on that end of what that man could do. I trust it's been years for you and that you're healing too. Maybe you would or have already posted your "story?" Yes, I feel certain that my daughter is a direct gift from God. How could I have become bitter and hard-hearted with such a delightful sweetie melting my heart continually? Couldn't possibly happen.
Another thought - while it was a horrible blow at the time, I had my son to be strong for. I didn't have time to feel sorry for myself - I had to make us a living. My only regret is that I didn't punch that wimp right in the nose when he said those things about my son. Sure, he was the family corps coordinator, but my son was my son. I admit that I was brainwashed - it wasn't until my nonway friend told me he had said I was a lesbian that I even HEARD THAT part. That was a mistake on twi's part. I knew that only God knows our hearts, so I could consider (momentarily) that my son could maybe have possibly had a homo experience during that short time he was out of my sight at the campus the night before. But there was NO DOUBT in my mind about my "sexuality." They blew it there!
I will tell my son about this post. When I first started lurking on Waydale and then GS, he was opposed to the idea. He felt it was dangerous to my heart. About a year ago, our former twig coordinators came to Tampa and invited us to visit with them. My son even brought his girlfriend along. We picked right up where we had left off several years ago. They were still the same and so were we. It was so good for us to see them. I don't know if my son will read this right away, so I have printed it out (whew!) for him. I will definitely tell him about it tomorrow. He's a great young man and may need a bit of time to digest that I have spoken about "it."
God bless the Greasespotcafe and all who honestly share our hearts here. I love you all. bowtwi
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LornaDoone
BOWTWI to hear what you went through. I am fairly new to gs but have read many of the posts. I can sympathize wtih all you went through. They really treated the children the worst. In one sense they say you're the best, then they tear them down for being kids.
Sick, sick, sick.
love,
Lorna
[This message was edited by LornaDoone on June 25, 2002 at 20:38.]
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AdiosMiCorazon
I have been very busy so, I printed your original post so that I could read it when I got a chance.
I am sorry for what you and your son had to go through. What a bunch of nasty people.
I was amazed at the fact that you wanted to go back. It was so honest and so heart wrenching. I remember feeling that way about TWI once. I thought it was the best thing in the world.
I am glad to hear that you are living well now.
Welcome to GS. Can I buy you some coffee?
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Grizzy
The *93-94* WOW year was possibly the worst year in the history of the program. While LCM was seeing everything he *touched* turn to sh!t, (the diametrically opposed touch to the *Midas* touch ) He presented the *theory* the devil was getting better at defeating the Word and therefore had to have new and fresh approaches to defeat him! Hence the *Present truth* became ever so more dominant because we poor followers had to have Loy to defeat that bird in our lives; he had gotten so good at messing with us.
The program had been historically rigid and often applied in legalistic ways; but LCM took that program and went off the deep end with more legalism than ever! What he did was to place a strangle hold on the spirit of God and replace it with all his present truth!
Knowing that he was MOG and that all failures surely had to be a result of contamination in the ranks; he turned his *wolves* loose on the *fold*! He had single-handedly destroyed any good in that program and filled it with his overly legalistic WC, so failure had to come from the inside!
In the case of bowtwi and her son, some one had to introduce this false accusations to Loy to justify what he believed to be true, contamination in the WOW program and on the field! My guess is that this WOW-sis with the WC bro got this info to Loy and in the process managed to *repay* these folks for their horrible year! I am sure that the WC had convinced himself that all this was true; seeing by association his sister had to be more spiritually clean!
The program failed miserably that year and it wasn't Loy's fault; nor that of the people he had placed in charge and had trained in legalism to the point they couldn't live and enjoy life. It reminds of the OT where they would take some innocent goat and lay all the sins of Israel on it and send it out into the dessert to die.
Another thing to keep in mind is that while these *witch-hunts* were executed, many saw the chance to prove they were more spiritual and used things as this to climb the corporate ladder of TWI. Like delivering the head of an enemy to the king; only Loy just thought he was a king and many wanted to serve him for their own gain.
While hearing all these stories about these false accusations, I remember thinking that it was extremely strange that a young teen could possibly sexually abuse any smaller children for a period and not get caught while it was still going on. Now I believe that what really happened was LCM was looking to place the failure of that WOW year somewhere and some one delivered him an innocent family to be sacrificed and feed the beast Loy was.
Grizzy COLOR>SIZE>
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bowtwi
Funny, I just realized that Grizzy (and who knows who else) probably knows more than I do about what our supposed crimes were! I was told that there were 25 federal counts over a 5 state area of some kind of "homo rape" against my son. I was told almost nothing by the corps coordinator. I was so stunned to even hear him talking that way that I'm sure I don't remember all of what he said. I had just been invited to eat breakfast at the head table! They sat and broke bread with me, putting on loving faces and then WHAMMO! When I got called to the president's parlor, I was treated like I was WORSE THAN JUDAS!
It wasn't until I spoke with the trunk coordinator on the phone that I remember hearing anything about the accusations. He said that a child had drawn some picture of him and my son in some kind of homo rape scene and that was their evidence.
I wasn't allowed to know WHO the accuser was, or WHAT specifically we were accused of altho we were living in America at the time. We were definitely guilty with no opportunity to face the accuser or even prove ourselves innocent.
Never had anyone ever spoken to me prior to that about any alleged homo activity out of either my son or me. It always seemed to me that if they believed those accusations themselves, and if they believed that I was Corps material, as they convinced me that they did, then the Godly, the loving thing to do would have been to help us with our supposed problem. Instead, the very first thing I heard of this at all was "go away - we're NOT going to help YOU!" Took me years to really digest all that!
On the second half of our wow year, the powers that were sent 3 adults and 3 children from our team "home." My personal opinion was that we were just really hitting our stride and about to really establish some strong fellowships that would stand after our year ended. The remaining wows from the other family moved into the house my son and I were living in. The limb coordinator told me that this one lady (the one with the 2 young kids) might still be sent off the field, but that "we" were giving her the benefit of the doubt. He blew me away with that statement. The 2 ladies from my family that they sent home were actually living the wow program to the best of their abilities. I know - I was their family coordinator.
This lady with the 2 kids told me that she hadn't been raising her kids by herself - that her parents did everything for her since her divorce and she really didn't have to do much for herself "back home." She told me she went wow because her brother thought it was what she needed. She also confided several things to me about what a rotten sister she had been to her brother as they grew up, but that he was so good he never saw it that way.
She said things like she wanted to be able to be more like me and our team coordinator, but she just really couldn't do all of the wow commitment every day! She made it clear to me that she was just getting through each day til the end when she would return to her parents' home...
I might be wrong on this next exact detail, but as my memory goes, it seems to me that when school let out, she somehow convinced us that she couldn't afford to pay a real babysitter anymore on her fast food wages, so my 13 year old son would have to babysit for her kids.
He did it, but wasn't thrilled about it. He was not the very nicest babysitter, but a rapist, NO WAY! I don't even recall how long he babysat for her (and I'm not going to ask him).
When I came to the high school from the campus after being told to "go away," I asked him to tell me about the sex he had been having. He was a 13 year old boy - a NORMAL 13 year old boy. I won't go into our entire discussion here, but the closet thing to anything that could possibly have occurred on the wowfield was that one day he peeked in on the 3 year old girl when she was napping and saw her lying there with no panties on. THAT'S IT. Nobody touched anyone. He pulled her covers up over her. Nothing to do with a boy there!
What this lady might have said to her brother and who he then might have said what to is still beyond my imagination. I just remember her telling me stories about how horribly she treated her brother when they were kids, even doing things like after he would do his chores, she would sneak behind him and mess things up so when their parents checked on his work, they thought he was lying to them and even sent him for psychiatric help. She told me she still thought that was funny. If she could do that to her own flesh and blood, there was no limit to what she would do to me, who she considered a "goody goody" that made her look bad by comparison. I definitely was her enemy by the time we got to the ROA.
I just know that I went from a welcomed home WOW who was convinced by twi leadership that my son and I belonged in THAT corps to the worst scum that ever tried to slither into the outfit in less than 2 weeks!
When her brother attacked me at the ROA, I was beyond stunned. I was on my way to meeting with a cabinet member, to discuss whether or not I spent the next three years training to be WayCorps or not, and so it was particularly bad timing.
Also at the ROA, 2 pair of my son's Levis shorts and my camera with all the photos from the trip disappeared out of our tent. That she had borrowed those red and black shorts from my son before, as they wore the same size made me suspect I knew what happened to our stuff.
She, like lcm and all the rest will answer someday for all they have done.
If I am wrong, I apologize, but I have to say if it waddles like a duck and quacks, I have to call it a duck!
I especially loved that comment from Steve describing lcm.
"He doesn't think, he only thinks that he thinks. He doesn't have a head, his neck's just blowing bubbles."
I think I'll take you up on that cup of coffee, AC, I could use it right about now. Please pass the butter pecan-flavored cream
Thanks to you all for your kind support. Anything I can do to help any of you?
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