When I saw this kind of thing in my former splinter group I considered it leadership stroking them with one hand in order to beat them down with the other.
I think my particular false Apostle balanced stroking them enough so that he could beat them into submission but still have them willing to be thankful for it.
A Corps person could marry a non-Corps person and initially that was okay.
Later it became that the non-Corps person was encouraged to participate in Corps training. The Corps partner might be on staff, and the non-Corps spouse participated in the program.
Then, both had to go in residence together, with the older Corps spouse required to participate fully. No special privileges, no proper job (to the extent that staff jobs were proper jobs). It became a requirement. If both didn't participate, obviously neither was really cut out to be Corps.
It was all about re-training, beating down further, to fit into the Martindale model. Can't have older Corps out there who might still be able to think!!
Like all things twi.....more hoops were continually added to the "training" process.
Take pfal....then intermediate....and later, the advanced class to be "fully instructed." THEN.....you really need to take other "advanced studies" classes ie The Renewed Mind, Witnessing and Undershepherding, The Way Tree, Keys to Biblical Research, Dealing with the Adversary, etc.
Go WOW.....grow 10 years in 1 year. You've got to go, to know.
Go WOW again....this time, do it better. Do it right.
Go Corps....spiritual training for God's best twig coordinators. Upon graduation, go forth to serve.
BUT......many 3rd, 4th and 5th corps were "invited" back for another inresidence block.
The first and second corps were also brought back in for another year of indoctrination.
The first and second corps were also brought back in for another year of indoctrination.
Thanks, penworks.....you would certainly know.
By 1972, the 55-year old wierwille had every intention of keeping "his corps kids" on A SHORT LEASH. Wierwille knew how to manipulate and how to stroke the egos of his leaders followers. He kept a watchful eye on his corps and pulled them back to hdqtrs after a few short years.
Years ago.....I started a thread entitled Twi's Corporate Secret or something like that. The premise of the thread was to expose that field corps will rarely be counted faithful to twi for a lifetime. In every sense of the word "faithful".....one must go faithfully to twigs/branch/limb meetings, witness regularly, teach often, abs 15% and speak twi's doctrine a lifetime. And, even longtime staffers are sent packing if health problems arise or draw unnecessary attention (blame) to twi.
In looking at my 1985 Twi-Clergy List..........my oh my, of the 385 clergy listed, the ranks have dwindled drastically (90-92% ??)
That, in itself, doesn't seem to speak too favorably about the initial training.
No, waysider......they had to be INDOCTRINATED BACK INTO WIERWILLE'S WAY.
There's something about being away from daily indoctrination and oppression that allows one's own conscience, concerns and choices to move to the forefront.
No, waysider......they had to be INDOCTRINATED BACK INTO WIERWILLE'S WAY.
There's something about being away from daily indoctrination and oppression that allows one's own conscience, concerns and choices to move to the forefront.
I've been out of residence for over 30 years and I still have a recurring nightmare of having to go back in-residence. Always crying, that I just can't do it.
Like all things twi.....more hoops were continually added to the "training" process.
Take pfal....then intermediate....and later, the advanced class to be "fully instructed." THEN.....you really need to take other "advanced studies" classes ie The Renewed Mind, Witnessing and Undershepherding, The Way Tree, Keys to Biblical Research, Dealing with the Adversary, etc.
Go WOW.....grow 10 years in 1 year. You've got to go, to know.
Go WOW again....this time, do it better. Do it right.
Go Corps....spiritual training for God's best twig coordinators. Upon graduation, go forth to serve.
BUT......many 3rd, 4th and 5th corps were "invited" back for another inresidence block. Wierwille wanted these selected corps grads to take part in all inresidence activities....to be zealous for all things twi. Yet, on several occasions, wierwille expressed disgust and contempt towards certain individual corps grads......who, according to him, were slothful and unappreciative of this "invite."
Years later.....martindale expected ALL CORPS GRADS to sit thru weekly corps meetings, submit reports and attend all branch/limb meetings, etc. If one didn't jump thru all the hoops......the corps grad status was withdrawn and one was labeled "corps alumni."
Even as early as 1978, wierwille had to strong-arm some corps grads to "stay committed to his directives." He was clearly not happy with some corps/clergy that were "spreading their wings and flying away." IMO.....it had everything to do with REALITIES OF LIFE......marriage, kids, career, home mortgage, career advancements, neighbors, community, etc......and wierwille could no longer CONTROL their decisions.
Let us not forget the year we "broke VP's heart" when so many left after Corps Week but prior to the Rock of Ages. "If you can stand with me at the Rock of Ages, don't bother coming to Corps Week either". (Some said, "Okay, I won't!")
A Corps person could marry a non-Corps person and initially that was okay.
Later it became that the non-Corps person was encouraged to participate in Corps training. The Corps partner might be on staff, and the non-Corps spouse participated in the program.
Then, both had to go in residence together, with the older Corps spouse required to participate fully. No special privileges, no proper job (to the extent that staff jobs were proper jobs). It became a requirement. If both didn't participate, obviously neither was really cut out to be Corps.
It was all about re-training, beating down further, to fit into the Martindale model. Can't have older Corps out there who might still be able to think!!
That is interesting.. When I married the Hubby (he was 9th Corps) It was allowed but we were told point blank that I would need to go into the Corps in a year or two or we would both have to go into the Family Corps.. (We flaked out before this happened)Oh we married at the end of 81 and flaked at the beginning of 83.
Field Corps were expected to expect an assignment on staff every few years. To keep them fresh on the Word. We're not talking a one-year assignment, either.
Not enough to listen to Corps Night over hookups, on tape, or however, nor to be involved with twigs, branches, limbs on a constant basis.
Most "church" leaders will go away on retreat/to synod/to conference/to some other type of clergy meeting, for maybe a week max, Monday to Friday. But only for a week. They don't need to go back to their training institution for prolonged re-training.
That is interesting.. When I married the Hubby (he was 9th Corps) It was allowed but we were told point blank that I would need to go into the Corps in a year or two or we would both have to go into the Family Corps.. (We flaked out before this happened)Oh we married at the end of 81 and flaked at the beginning of 83.
LOL tazia at the time we felt like we were flaking out and really until I found Grease spot it felt like we had quit on God's Word.. We truly left before so much of what you all left about happened.. not that it wasn't going on but since we were in the more remote and less populated areas we really didn't know most of this stuff.. We just knew we were not happy ... Well he was not happy, I was beginning to really question and One night I told him how much sometimes I wished we were not twig coordinators and that it was difficult to be watched by all of the people in your twig who were just waiting for you to make a mistake, (we were running a twig near the Limb)
and he said what if we left. and I said you mean Idaho and he said no I mean the Way. Would you come with me.. and I said with out a moment of hesitation of course I would come with you I love you why wouldn't I... Two nights later we left in the middle of the night Minus much of our belongings.. we took only what we could carry in our back packs... We felt like we were failures, we were struggling with making enough money to be financially stable and had been for over a year. and Hubby had been reamed out several times... We left the state and began our lives anew and it took a long time to feel like we had made the right decision... in fact it wasn't until sometime in 88 that I ran into a TWI believer and got invited to twig that I realized I would never go back... That gut feeling when something is dangerous that you get sometimes when know something is wrong but not what exactly.
Well for me it wasn't until I came on here that I knew why I got that feeling. Now I know.
What a bizarre way to feel you needed to act on that decision.
Thanks Twinky..((Hugs Right Back At you)))
I never understood why my husband did not feel able to leave TWI in the light of day but now after I came here I finally understand why and what a horrible pressure he felt not just for our twig life but the decision to marry me and how that must have added ten fold times more pressure. If we had stayed would our marriage have survived intact.. I doubt it.
We made the dead on Right decision to leave. Our lives have been so blessed since then...But it was not until I came here that I truly understood how right that decision to leave was. And even more important that the decision to not go back, was also the correct one.
I never understood why my husband did not feel able to leave TWI in the light of day but now after I came here I finally understand why...
leafy.....even former Trunk/Region coordinators, the L@llys, split from TWI in the middle of the night. Apparently, they too didn't want to face the confrontation of twi leadership which spoke volumes.....since the L@llys seemed quite capable of standing their ground.
Some found the easiest way to "step aside" was........get a home mortgage.
leafy.....even former Trunk/Region coordinators, the L@llys, split from TWI in the middle of the night. Apparently, they too didn't want to face the confrontation of twi leadership which spoke volumes.....since the L@llys seemed quite capable of standing their ground.
Some found the easiest way to "step aside" was........get a home mortgage.
:)
When you're under their authority there is that "spell" TWI leaders have on you - it reminds me of that stupid "Athletes" video where there are the stately and powerful spirits and how they walk and act. That's the perfect depiction of TWI leaders throwing their weight around or their self-deluded image of their positions of importance. But it makes you afraid while you accept the authority they have as genuine.
Once you get out from under it you realize that all that is an illusion. Their authority is not genuine. It is not God-given. It is climbed up to through political means just as in any corporate entity in the business world. Nowhere in the New Testament do you find 8 layers of leadership between a believer or Christian and the "Chairman of the Board". It's all a hierarchical man-made construct that delivers fear and compliance. And they certainly play mind games with all of that too - that's imminently clear. Their authority is a complete illusion. When Jesus Christ comes back that will be made abundantly clear how they abused that and set themselves up where God did not. They are just a bunch of 2-bit second-rate idiots who couldn't even climb to a middle management spot in the secular realm.
Then you start asking yourself "Why?" a lot. Why did I listen? Why didn't I laugh in their face? Why didn't I file a lawsuit like I could have? Why didn't I get out sooner?
There's no clear answers other than we did the best we could when we woke up. And you start to see why they close ranks so fast and shun people when they leave. They don't want anyone else waking up.
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JeffSjo
When I saw this kind of thing in my former splinter group I considered it leadership stroking them with one hand in order to beat them down with the other.
I think my particular false Apostle balanced stroking them enough so that he could beat them into submission but still have them willing to be thankful for it.
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Twinky
A Corps person could marry a non-Corps person and initially that was okay.
Later it became that the non-Corps person was encouraged to participate in Corps training. The Corps partner might be on staff, and the non-Corps spouse participated in the program.
Then, both had to go in residence together, with the older Corps spouse required to participate fully. No special privileges, no proper job (to the extent that staff jobs were proper jobs). It became a requirement. If both didn't participate, obviously neither was really cut out to be Corps.
It was all about re-training, beating down further, to fit into the Martindale model. Can't have older Corps out there who might still be able to think!!
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penworks
The first and second corps were also brought back in for another year of indoctrination.
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skyrider
Thanks, penworks.....you would certainly know.
By 1972, the 55-year old wierwille had every intention of keeping "his corps kids" on A SHORT LEASH. Wierwille knew how to manipulate and how to stroke the egos of his leaders followers. He kept a watchful eye on his corps and pulled them back to hdqtrs after a few short years.
Years ago.....I started a thread entitled Twi's Corporate Secret or something like that. The premise of the thread was to expose that field corps will rarely be counted faithful to twi for a lifetime. In every sense of the word "faithful".....one must go faithfully to twigs/branch/limb meetings, witness regularly, teach often, abs 15% and speak twi's doctrine a lifetime. And, even longtime staffers are sent packing if health problems arise or draw unnecessary attention (blame) to twi.
In looking at my 1985 Twi-Clergy List..........my oh my, of the 385 clergy listed, the ranks have dwindled drastically (90-92% ??)
:blink:
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waysider
Sooooo------They had to be "retrained".
That, in itself, doesn't seem to speak too favorably about the initial training.
After graduating from Fellow Laborers, I went back in, of my own choosing, in a slightly different capacity.
I can tell you from experience that this concept of "re-indoctrination" makes a good deal of sense to me personally.
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skyrider
No, waysider......they had to be INDOCTRINATED BACK INTO WIERWILLE'S WAY.
There's something about being away from daily indoctrination and oppression that allows one's own conscience, concerns and choices to move to the forefront.
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waysider
Yes, I was being facetious.
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taxicab
I've been out of residence for over 30 years and I still have a recurring nightmare of having to go back in-residence. Always crying, that I just can't do it.
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Broken Arrow
Let us not forget the year we "broke VP's heart" when so many left after Corps Week but prior to the Rock of Ages. "If you can stand with me at the Rock of Ages, don't bother coming to Corps Week either". (Some said, "Okay, I won't!")
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leafytwiglet
That is interesting.. When I married the Hubby (he was 9th Corps) It was allowed but we were told point blank that I would need to go into the Corps in a year or two or we would both have to go into the Family Corps.. (We flaked out before this happened)Oh we married at the end of 81 and flaked at the beginning of 83.
(Such a narrow escape)
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Twinky
Field Corps were expected to expect an assignment on staff every few years. To keep them fresh on the Word. We're not talking a one-year assignment, either.
Not enough to listen to Corps Night over hookups, on tape, or however, nor to be involved with twigs, branches, limbs on a constant basis.
Most "church" leaders will go away on retreat/to synod/to conference/to some other type of clergy meeting, for maybe a week max, Monday to Friday. But only for a week. They don't need to go back to their training institution for prolonged re-training.
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Tzaia
Correction: You did NOT flake out. You wised up.
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leafytwiglet
LOL tazia at the time we felt like we were flaking out and really until I found Grease spot it felt like we had quit on God's Word.. We truly left before so much of what you all left about happened.. not that it wasn't going on but since we were in the more remote and less populated areas we really didn't know most of this stuff.. We just knew we were not happy ... Well he was not happy, I was beginning to really question and One night I told him how much sometimes I wished we were not twig coordinators and that it was difficult to be watched by all of the people in your twig who were just waiting for you to make a mistake, (we were running a twig near the Limb)
and he said what if we left. and I said you mean Idaho and he said no I mean the Way. Would you come with me.. and I said with out a moment of hesitation of course I would come with you I love you why wouldn't I... Two nights later we left in the middle of the night Minus much of our belongings.. we took only what we could carry in our back packs... We felt like we were failures, we were struggling with making enough money to be financially stable and had been for over a year. and Hubby had been reamed out several times... We left the state and began our lives anew and it took a long time to feel like we had made the right decision... in fact it wasn't until sometime in 88 that I ran into a TWI believer and got invited to twig that I realized I would never go back... That gut feeling when something is dangerous that you get sometimes when know something is wrong but not what exactly.
Well for me it wasn't until I came on here that I knew why I got that feeling. Now I know.
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Twinky
(((((Leafy))))) sneaking out like that...
You made the right decision.
What a bizarre way to feel you needed to act on that decision.
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leafytwiglet
Thanks Twinky..((Hugs Right Back At you)))
I never understood why my husband did not feel able to leave TWI in the light of day but now after I came here I finally understand why and what a horrible pressure he felt not just for our twig life but the decision to marry me and how that must have added ten fold times more pressure. If we had stayed would our marriage have survived intact.. I doubt it.
We made the dead on Right decision to leave. Our lives have been so blessed since then...But it was not until I came here that I truly understood how right that decision to leave was. And even more important that the decision to not go back, was also the correct one.
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skyrider
leafy.....even former Trunk/Region coordinators, the L@llys, split from TWI in the middle of the night. Apparently, they too didn't want to face the confrontation of twi leadership which spoke volumes.....since the L@llys seemed quite capable of standing their ground.
Some found the easiest way to "step aside" was........get a home mortgage.
:)
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chockfull
When you're under their authority there is that "spell" TWI leaders have on you - it reminds me of that stupid "Athletes" video where there are the stately and powerful spirits and how they walk and act. That's the perfect depiction of TWI leaders throwing their weight around or their self-deluded image of their positions of importance. But it makes you afraid while you accept the authority they have as genuine.
Once you get out from under it you realize that all that is an illusion. Their authority is not genuine. It is not God-given. It is climbed up to through political means just as in any corporate entity in the business world. Nowhere in the New Testament do you find 8 layers of leadership between a believer or Christian and the "Chairman of the Board". It's all a hierarchical man-made construct that delivers fear and compliance. And they certainly play mind games with all of that too - that's imminently clear. Their authority is a complete illusion. When Jesus Christ comes back that will be made abundantly clear how they abused that and set themselves up where God did not. They are just a bunch of 2-bit second-rate idiots who couldn't even climb to a middle management spot in the secular realm.
Then you start asking yourself "Why?" a lot. Why did I listen? Why didn't I laugh in their face? Why didn't I file a lawsuit like I could have? Why didn't I get out sooner?
There's no clear answers other than we did the best we could when we woke up. And you start to see why they close ranks so fast and shun people when they leave. They don't want anyone else waking up.
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