Mod Kirk

No matter how one defines personal attacks, there's the problem of enforcing that definition. Does name calling get left up? Undoubtedly. One of the issues is the small number of moderators, and all of them have limited time to devote to moderating. About two months ago I became checked GSc from work and noticed a thread devolving into name calling. I spent more time than my employer would have liked editing and deleting posts, had posters accuse me of "tampering" with their posts, had threads started about why the moderating was happening and finally ended up suspending two posters, one who I have broken bread with and consider a friend. Then I came home and spent more time than my spouse liked explaining it all. I can't do that every day and neither can any of the other mods. The interpretation of what a personal attack is can be somewhat ambiguous. I don't think that will change if we attempt to get more explicit about "the rules".

Suspensions and moderation are not done by vote. Never have been. You were an adult enough to accept your suspension with good grace, now you are enabling someone who can't or won't. I can recall several instances when Bumpy was suspended, once in the recent past. During this latest time he re-registered as "Grumpy". In addition to suspensions Bumpy has received several warnings from me in the recent past to stop the name calling and personal attacks. What's up is that you are not aware of every action that is taken on this board.

When a poster is suspended the moderator is asked to check whether an email should be sent, if "yes", then the template that you copied is sent; the moderator can type in the date and time or put in an additional message. The automated part refers to the suspension coming off automatically without the poster having to ask to be unsuspended or the moderator having to take any further action. It does not preclude communication by the suspended poster.

If you go back and re-read the thread, you'll see that Bumpy started the thread. So what? If he started the thread, then he wasn't banned or suspended at the time he started it. As I stated near the end of that thread, Bumpy, who also posted as "Grumpy", in an attempt to get around an earlier suspension, was asked to choose one handle and that the other would be deleted. His thread gives the impression that he was being kicked off Grease Spot, which was a lie. I'm the one who locked the thread, and I locked it because Bumpy was promulgating a lie about actions taken on this website. The final post came after my remarks but before I locked down the thread. rather than delete the thread, I chose to lock it down and post an explanation, hoping to eliminate the need to start yet another discussion on why an action by a moderator was taken. Now you know. Pawtucket's decision to finally suspend him had nothing to do with my decision to lock down the thread, as far as I know.

In case there is any confusion <_< Bumpy is not being banned, suspended, moderated under either the "Bumpy" handle, or his other screen name "Grumpy". He was asked to pick one and have the other deleted.

Bumpy: Please tell Jonny to try his PM's now. He was supoosed to have access to his PM's. I believe it is fixed now. Oldiesman is not suspended as far as I know.

I have already posted that I did not shut those threads down due to the subject matter, but because of the behavior of several of the participants. I explained in the past how we moderators operate: we do not have a schedule, or a "patrol beat", so if we don't happen to look at certain threads, fights, name calling etc can get by us, unless reported. Rocky started a thread that posted a video from JR's site as well as JR's explanation. The last time I checked the conversation remained civil. The moderators on this site are not a secretive cabal out to stifle free speech and shut down psoters we don't like. Speaking for myself, I am a long-time poster who cares about this site and its mission and am willing to volunteer my time to support it and its owner, pawtucket. Feel free to amuse yourselves by dreaming up motives that aren't there, or suggesting that I am not being truthful. [in the spirit of disclosure, I changed my handle from "moddishwasher" to "Mod Cow" - I just got tired of the old handle, the new one has a story behind it that maybe I'll share when I feel like it]

The thread was not shut down due to the subject matter. It was shut down due to the actions of some of the participants.

Several participants in those threads could not resist engaging in personal attacks, including name calling. Those who weren't engaged in the personal attacks were bemoaning the personal attacks. Two of the biggest mud slingers have been suspended for 30 days. The rules of the site are not void in the Soap Opera Forum.

If we had 20 or 30 more moderators...maybe The small number of moderators have different ways of addressing these issues. I won't attempt to speak for the other mods, but I don't have time to visit every forum on a regular basis, let alone all the threads and certainly not all the posts. I edit or delete things as I see them. Not the most efficient way mebbe, but I'm not paid much <_< I personally have deleted several posts recently where the attacker was anti-TWI and the attackee was waxing nostagic about TWI experiences

Posts regarding Wicca were moved to a new thread in the Open Forum

A discussion of Wicca was beginning to derail the thread about re-evaluating your beliefs in the "About The Way" forum. The posts that relate to Wicca are here:

Right place at the right time. I was about ready to go to bed and but wanted to peak at a thread that I was involved in as my alter-ego and was glad my teenage daughter wasn't in the room when I saw the "animal love" threads. You're welcome.

This thread started out in Friend Finder, but was moved to Open since it became more a commentary on the new guys manners than on actually finding anyone.

Aaaaauuuggghhh! I just had a flashback!

A word of caution regarding using Wikipedia as a definitive source: anyone can contribute material. Anonymous stuff, or wild allegations that are not sourced tend to get deleted, but only if someone is paying attention.

Here's the post that Rascal referred to, it's also cut & pasted into her original post:

The 13th Corps started their "in-residence" training in the fall of 1982, had an "interim" year in 1983-84, and graduated in the summer of '85. Martindale has ascended to the Way Presidency in October 1982. So that's the time frame, anyway.

I already explained some of this to Abigail in a PM, but I thought it bore discussing openly. Abigail's threads were not moved because they were in any way offensive. They were moved mainly because they were part of the recent mass derailing of doctrinal threads. Abigail's threads themselves were an attempt to keep things on track, but in my opinion they were keeping the problem going. I have spent a chunk of my day off editing and deleting offensive posts by Allan, as well as posts by other posters who quoted those offensive remarks. I limited myself to threads that had activity within the last two days, and further kept to the last two pages of each thread. it still was a bear to go through. Although I am a frequent vistor to and participant in the Doctrinal Forum (in my other on-screen identity) - I do not read every thread every day. Other moderators visit the doctrinal forum less fequently than I do. Sometimes a barrage of insults has been launched, responded to and the thread has been re-railed before any moderators catch anything. We try to be fair, but sometimes we're not. Our own opinions get in the way, as do time constraints. We'll try to be more diligent... Allan is currently in moderator queue, so anything that he says will be reviewed by a moderator before it is posted.

Several threads have been moved to the Soap Opera forum. One was accidently deleted. Sorry. While there isn't supposed to be personal attacks anywhere on GS, the Doctrinal forum has gotten really bad lately. Many people have derided the Doctrinal Forum as "the dungeon", but by and large the discussions here, while sometimes dry and scholarly, have stayed on topic, and opinions have been backed up, either by scripture, or by logical thinking. There have been actual discussions here. If you are unwilling or unable to document or at least rationally discuss your position, you're in the wrong forum. This goes for anti-PFAL and anti-Wierwille posters as well as anyone else. If someone makes a comment disparaging of your belief or position, challenge them to back it up. Or present contradictory evidence yourself. All of the moderators are volunteers. We do this because we believe in GS's mission, and we sort of like Pawtucket (he also bribed some of us with a cool blue GS sweatshirt). We don't have the time to constantly babysit, to continually edit and then explain why we edited, and then explain why we didn't edit. There aren't many of us, and we have lost a few to "real life" recently. So please, play nice. The alternative is putting those who don't cooperate on "moderator queue". This means that every post that you painstakingly type in will set there until one of us moderators has the time to release it. Or delete it. Work with us.

thank you mark...you were seconds ahead of me

No posting names of posters unless they choose to do so themselves. To the posters who quoted the offending post...that makes it that much more difficult to clean up Thanks!

Long Gone, what do you want your handle to be?

false dilema :wacko:

From the Wierwille family: Dorothea Wierwille Visitation and Memorial Visitation will be held at: Miller-Long & Folk Funeral Home 314 W. High Street St. Marys Friday, September 9, from 5:00 – 8:00 PM. A memorial service will be held on Saturday, September 10, at 11:00 AM at the Nazarene District Center 272 Jack Oak Point Rd., St. Marys, Ohio, after which a buffet luncheon will be served. (The Nazarene District Center is about 1 mile west of Grand Lake St. Marys State Park entrance off of highway 703.) The facility will open for visitation at 10:00 AM.