Naten00

Thanks for the help... I am sure we will get into some lovely conversation

Never being in "The Way" I can't really comment on their SIT thing... I just become very cautious when we starting telling God what He can and cannot do... Being apart of the Assemblies of God I do believe in it but not in the typical form the AG does it nor in the way my wife describes that way it was done in TWI. I think it is very clear that there was an unknown language in scripture but I think most people today babble saying the say thing over and over again... I have seen God do miracles before my eye's and too me like my moms heart being healed by the laying on of hands (she couldn't walk her heart was pumping so low and the docs said the scars on her heart would not heal) and more that many wouldn't believe... I think the errors where more doctrinally in their tongues than anything else... LIke its tie in with Salvation or the spiritual sign it gave or anything like that.

I will be meeting up with some people from The Way coming up soon... Is there anything new happening in TWI that I should know about?

I don't necessarily agree with everything written... I think there is a fundamental mistake when we take the "made in image of God" and look at it as something as we are valuable when it is God who declares our value. Scripture is repetitive in declaring what is at the heart of man. Jesus even said what is in the heart of man is evil and Romans 1-3 gives a great detailed report about what the natural condition of man is.... If man is good why would Jesus tell Nicodemous that man needs to be born again? A new spirit given to man fulfilled prophecy from Ezekiel 23... It just does not make any since. You said what makes us more than animals is our godlike possibilities... We are made in his image any other possibility comes from the forbidden fruit. The knowledge of good and evil... Again It is hard for me to see this not as pride. I think the way to think about it is that we are at our hearts evil but God sees his image on us and desires us to be restored but he needs to do convert from Windows to Mac in order to do the Job... (lets be honest there is a lot of debate on what the image is) Here is my short research I have done in the past with the whole Rob Bell thing The word aionos you are defining as "age-lasting" I think you need to look at all uses of the word αιωνος Lets put your definition in other uses of the word Romans 2:7 " "patience in well-doing seek for glory and honor and immortality he will give eternal life" ESV αφθαπσιαν ζητουσιν ζωην αιωνιον immortality seek life age-lasting (your definition) Your definition does not work there... 1 Peter 5:10a "And after you have suffered a little while, the God of all grace, who has called you to his eternal glory in Christ," αιωνιον αυτου δοξαν εν Χριστω age-lasting him glory in Christ (your definition) Please forgive non of the accent marks I am not good with those but I swear the definitions are good. I rechecked the words I don't know. I think you get the point because there are a lot more verses like that... the word αιων is best used as eternal or forever when compared to other scriptures... If you are talking about verses like 2:Thessalonians 1:9 by Paul who wrote Romans using the same word in Romans 2:7 to that of "They will suffer the punishment of eternal destruction, away from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of his might" The word Eternal is the same word in Romans 2:7 αιωνιον... I think it is good to realize that God sees value in us but it is also misleading for us to take away that to quote Paul "No one does good no not one" Rom 3. Thanks for the challenge God Bless

I do enjoy a good laugh every now and then :)

I sometimes think we don't really know the extent of WWWD in TWI.

Did he really say... " I researched the bible so you don't have too" If that is so... It isn't funny anymore it's just sad anyone would go along with it... It is like handing your keys to a stranger and he says I will take care of your family and house so you don't have too.... With an evil grin.

http://www.theway.org/available.php?page=waydisc&lang=en MAIN PARAGRAPH "Available to our Advanced Class graduates, the Disciples of the Way Outreach Program is for committed followers of our Lord Jesus Christ who are sent forth to boldly proclaim the accuracy and logic of God’s prevailing Word." I just found it funny that they use the word "logic".... It seems to me logic is one of the least criteria in the way international... Just thought I would share...

Scenario, I would be praying and end a prayer in Jesus name... The people in the way would end it for me by saying Christ... My wife explained to me that she has been taught that you must use Christ when saying Jesus because you would be talking to another Jesus... Can someone explain this to me?

Is there a page on here with all of the stolen quotes and original sources.... Where VPW obviously claims them as his own...

I think that is one of those... "Do as I say not as I do" type things... every corporate leader does this.... Expect anything more?

I think when you go outside of "cults" you can say that change of belief happens in every belief system... Most of the people I know who have "walked away from the faith " I guess you could call it. Has not been abandoned or black listed like a cult performs... The same thing happens when a person who grew up in a non-religious family (Atheist) to a religious belief system (Christian,Muslim,Jew,Hindu..ect). Relationships will change because of the core of the beliefs that someone has effects on many areas of their life. Unlike The Way in other Christian circles in my experience people are not "black listed". I would say the similarity is only what the person feels because their world view of life has changed and so now they will naturally relate differently to those who used to be apart of the faith they possess. Unlike in The Way it is not only the feeling of separation just because of a new difference of belief but also those in the group (his old friends) are taught not to associate with the person who committed apostasy. Something that at least all of the churches I have known do not do and should not do.

If you don't have the right definition you won't get the right meaning.... Common since here but here is a convo with someone I know in STFI I was having with someone about Jesus being eternal and my issue isn't his belief about Jesus not being eternal its his use of words John 17:5 5 And now, Father, glorify me in your own presence with the glory that I had with you before the world existed It was over some video he posted that was giving the two previous verses or something like that to show that Jesus didn't pre-exist. I was asking why did they leave this verse out and what do you think of this verse... SO it got down to looking kinda like this... Me: So... you don't take verse 5 literal then? Him: Yes I do take it literal it is literal because this didn't really mean what it is saying. (He gave some explanation) Me: That is not what literal is... That means you are taking it figuratively Him: I mean literal as in (defines literal) and then misuses it again... Me: (I am getting no where.... I just want to understand your logic) A good guy but I just see this common type of error in groups like TWI interpreting scripture... Not really trying to argue him to my side I was just trying to understand. If we can't agree on the definitions of terms in scripture or the tools we use to interpret the meaning of the text it is all wash. FYI: If anyone disagrees or wants to discuss Jesus pre-existance please message me privately I don't want to disrupt the thread. The point is the use of the word Logic.

I have a feeling if they did have someone... It would be someone unqualified to do such a task...

Possibly they should have never "considered" the person who introduced them into The Way..... wa wa waaaa

I don't think VPW hated that structure as long as he was at the top... He seemed almost jealous of others that where... I find that funny about the way they redefine the definition of religion and are the very definition of what they claim to be against.

WOW That is one big pill to swallow

I hear references a lot to seed boys. What is a seed boy?

I was watching the speech Ravi Zacharias gave to the LDS church. As he was asked to give by the Mormon church. Last christian preacher since Moody to speak there... Why won't the Way invite such people to speak at the Headquarters? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pvrQ6yAjuOw

I am looking for a Master Degree program in biblical studies and it is expensive.. What is the difference between paying a university for biblical education and paying TWI for "biblical" education?

I can kinda see it... God will always be involved in ministry... So therefore you can't separate it... The problem is that they twist the definition of ministry to fit their own goal... Ministry involves many things most of which to me seems to be absent from "The Way".

One word... WOW... All I can say right now... WOW

Do any of you guys remember being that way?.... Is it apart of the brainwashing that goes on? What were the ques that you were being that way and what got out of being a pompous jerk?

If someone grew up in TWI... How would you recomend them to start to explore the world outside... What adivse do you have for them? What books would you recomend them reading? Ant- Way books and also other Christian doctrinal books What churches would you recomend them go too? Would you recomend mentoring? How would you lead them out of it? Just some pondering my head has been doing... I would imagine if you grew up in a closed group enviroment what would be the first steps... what are the middle and what is/are the last steps when you can say I am free...

I am curious how are they taught to be like that? I think when we understand the why we become not so one sided..