Twinky

Such a frikkin ego trip, to say that. Though I don't remember it as "the ministry would fail" but more along the lines that "the word of God would be lost" or some such nonsense. Too long ago to be sure. When I heard whatever it was, it was a "Whaaaattttt?" moment - a red flag, really, but one of many I ignored. Immediately forgot about. But then, I had decent, giving, Christian parents as role models. My parents weren't denominational - dad went to the Anglican church, mum to the Methodist (when she could manage to). I couldn't see either of them losing their faith or their love for God. And dad didn't, to the end of his life; and Mum now 91 just gets stronger in her faith. r

The "1942 promise" didn't fail. No, not at all. Because there was no 1942 promise to fail.

That wouldn't take up much space, then.

You are entirely right that God works in small settings. Early commandments and instructions to the fledgling people of Israel include this: Deut 7:7 7The LORD did not set His affection on you and choose you because you were more numerous than the other peoples, for you were the fewest of all peoples and if you read the early chapters of Deuteronomy (it's well worth the re-read), it's all about staying pure and close to the heart of God, rejecting falsehoods, and taking care of those who can't look after themselves. This tiny nation was to be an example to the rest of the world and to draw people by that example into knowing God, the God of love and not the god of hate, or of human sacrifice, or of nature or animal worship (or whatever else, you name it). We are all part of at least one community; we can impact that community. We don't have to make a big name for ourselves, but people will notice that "there's something different" about us. Many will have read Betsie ten Boom's works; whilst in a Nazi prison camp, she led people into Christian love and worship and even, at one point, thanked God for the fleas that infested their hut - because it kept the guards from harassing them (the guards were terrified of the fleas and the typhus they spread). That attitude of gratitude, and of service, makes for stand-out behaviour that can demonstrate God's love to others. It was the kindness and gentleness of my church, and its outward face to serve the local community, that drew me to it. It's helped and healed me from my TWI wounds. It helps and heals so many from debt, addiction, poverty - just by being there and offering help and solace. Right now, there's a lot of emphasis on giving out food parcels to needy people injured by CoVid restrictions on work or ability to go out. In school time, there's homework clubs - a quiet place where schoolkids can study, not in noisy households or on the end of the bed in a room shared with another child. We have action days when we organise skips to take away bulky refuse within the area around my church - a poorer community, with more than its share of single parent families and cheap social housing. we have social events that are free: Needles and Natter; a lunch club (donations welcome) that anyone can attend; Mums & Toddlers, where (often single) mums can go for a coffee and cake after dropping older kids off at school. We do lots to help. And we sing and offer services, easy "classes" and the like, where people can come and learn more about God, Jesus, and living in love. We have a big impact, for a little congregation!

Most of us here know about that weird and confusing thing and especially the bit about relating to others in a religious way. But you can use that to challenge those who are more conformist. Do enjoy some - interesting! - discussions. (In fact, some of those discussions might even be here in the Cafe!) Anyway, sit down for a while and have something to eat and drink.

Hey, T-Bone, I said "almost" - d'ya know, I don't care about them enough to even want to bother razzing them up a bit.

Hey, they even have a "Contact Us" form on one of their pages. Almost worth giving it a try (with false information and a temp email address) to see what the outcomes might be.

I liked this quote from the blurb: And therein is the challenge.

Agreed, your conclusion re Weirwille. Haven't read Kierkegaard, but have heard from some of my church leaders of him, and they like his challenge to live authentically.

What's usually said is that whatever weather the (eastern) US gets, we in the UK get two weeks later. We don't often get whirlwinds or tornados (though there was one last week, great waterspouts photo'd), but we can get very heavy rain after the long travel of high winds over the Atlantic. The Gulf Stream comes up from the Caribbean, drifts through the ocean, and kisses the west coast of Ireland and of England and Scotland. So much so, would you believe, that there are tropical gardens in Scotland because of the warmth carried by this ocean current (not to mention the abundance of rains that also come over).

That's it exactly, T-Bone. Having worked as a matrimonial lawyer for some years (not my fave bit of law) - I have to say that the no.1 reason for marriage breakdown is lack of communication between the parties. Not being able to say how you feel/think/want about something (whether nice or a potential difficulty) and/or not listening when your spouse tries to talk to you. Parties need to say honestly what they want to say and not leave it to the other person to guess/mind read/know by intuition or revelation; and the listener needs to listen and hear what's said, not just the words used. On "The Marriage Course" I think it's said that if you have a row with your spouse, do it holding hands. Reminds you that you are tied together and you need to pay attention to the other party.

Well, we're having a blustery time of it. Storm Ellen on Sunday or was it Monday, and Storm Francis today. Probably not as bad as you suffer in the southern US, but dangerous in the coastal areas, tall lorries (trucks) blown over, and the Severn roadbridge closed to all traffic (the Severn estuary is a notorious windfunnel). No rain yet (in my area); my mum had flooding under her front door (lives 130 miles away). Apparently just been upgraded to "danger to life" status. A storm last week caused a landslip in Scotland which unfortunately a train ran into, derailed all parts of the train (only 6 carriages) and the motor unit burst into flames, 3 people killed, others injured - happily only 9 people aboard the train at the time.

It's an interesting point you raise, JJ. There is a place for "tough love" and sometimes it can be loving to leave someone to take the consequences of wrong actions. BUT in TWI it was constant "tough love," constant "vigilance" for "spiritual errors" in the fantasy world that was HQ. Doncha love the way that you could get a face-melting from - well, I got several from LCM, who was a master at it (the manipulative b@st@rd) - and then, shortly afterwards, you'd get a visit from a Corps bro or sis, who was sent lovingly to see that you were all right. In reality, I think this checker-upper person was probably a spy to see that you weren't "harbouring a grudge" or preparing to do anything that might reflect badly on TWI, like mouthing off to other Corps members or to friends and family. TWI was very keen on spying on the in-rez Corps. Just keeping a spiritual check on them, no doubt they'd say. No. Frikkin' spying.

PATIENT Quick to find fault KIND Aggressive DOES NOT ENVY Always trying to do one better, esp better than Christian churches DOES NOT BOAST Knows the WoG as it hasn’t been known since the 1st century IS NOT PROUD Never does anything wrong NOT RUDE Foul-mouthed NOT SELF SEEKING Always self-promoting NOT EASILY ANGERED Angry at the slightest mistake; sustained slow-burn rage KEEPS NO RECORD OF WRONGS. Has a file of all sorts of supposed misdemeanours DOES NOT DELIGHT IT EVIL, Full of “spiritual suspicion” BUT REJOICES WITH THE TRUTH Slanders its own followers

Welcome, Full of Hope. Tell us a little about yourself (if you like) in New Members.

A day of celebration in the UK and commonwealth, of the end of hostilities in the east. It's not a public holiday, but there are always commemorations, parades, and the laying of wreaths. There are different celebrations in the US. Extract from Wikipedia about VJ Day Victory over Japan Day (also known as V-J Day, Victory in the Pacific Day, or V-P Day[1]) is the day on which Imperial Japan surrendered in World War II, in effect bringing the war to an end. The term has been applied to both of the days on which the initial announcement of Japan's surrender was made – August 15, 1945, in Japan, and because of time zone differences, August 14, 1945 (when it was announced in the United States and the rest of the Americas and Eastern Pacific Islands) – as well as to September 2, 1945, when the surrender document was signed, officially ending World War II. August 15 is the official V-J Day for the United Kingdom, while the official US commemoration is September 2.[2] The name, V-J Day, had been selected by the Allies after they named V-E Day for the victory in Europe. On September 2, 1945, a formal surrender ceremony was performed in Tokyo Bay, Japan, aboard the battleship USS Missouri. In Japan, August 15 usually is known as the "memorial day for the end of the war" Extract from Wikipedia about "Victory Day" (USA) Victory Day is a holiday observed in the United States state of Rhode Island with state offices closed on the second Monday of August. Furthermore, in 2017, WPRI-TV claimed that Arkansas and Rhode Island were the only two states to ever celebrate the holiday, though Arkansas's name for the holiday was "World War II Memorial Day."[1] Originally, the official name was "Victory over Japan Day" and "V-J Day", as proclaimed by then President Harry S. Truman and was officially observed on September 2 nationwide. At some point, the name was changed to "Victory Day" in light of the modern post-war Japan emerging in economic importance. Further name changes were attempted later, but were unsuccessful, at which point, the name "Victory Day" remained the official name. The holiday celebrates the conclusion of World War II and is related to Victory over Japan Day in the United Kingdom. Rhode Island retains the holiday in tribute to the disproportionate number of sailors it sent and lost in the Pacific front.[3] In 2015, the Space and Rocket Center in Huntsville, Alabama honored 500 veterans on the 70th anniversary of the end of the war.[4 Whatever day you choose, do remember the "Forgotten Army" and the huge cost in lives for the men who were captured and held in the east, notably Burma (Bridge over river Kwai country), where conditions were worse than atrocious. It's 75 years ago now, before most (all?) of us were born. We still benefit from what they did. And remember the families of men lost, killed, maimed or otherwise damaged, are still around: women who lost spouses, children who lost fathers. War is a horrible thing.

That's funny, Outie. Good for your bro and SiL.

You don't have pantomime season in the US? It's mad, bizarre, crazy, and completely over the top. Let your inhibitions go, and enjoy a laugh at theatre in the insane. The season is December-January, sometimes early Feb (at least, it used to be, prior to CoVid-19) (who knows what'll happen to live entertainment now). If we have a panto season this year, though, I'm sure there'll be lots of topical references to coronavirus - maybe that'll be the "it's behind you!" lurker. Yep, the panto nasty, felled by the pantomime dame (a male in female dress-up) or the principal boy (a youngish female in male attire). Hmm, yes. I can see it now. Panto best undertaken with a small child or two. And possibly a comfortable quantity of alcohol (please drink responsibly).

Oh no it isn't! Oh no it isn't! Watch out! It's behind youuuuu! (Okay. So it is a bit early for panto season. Just practisin')

Maybe they think they've "won at life," with having ripped off believers worldwide for lots of dosh, amassed to their own comfort and never distributed for what the donors thought it would be used for. Nice places to live, nice campuses, nice grounds for personal use, vehicles (such a shame they had to lose the private jet), swimming pools, quiet location, army of slaves - sorry, staff on minimum wage - to service grounds, vehicles, buildings - and that's without the other aspects of "servicing" that we know about. Law of thieving more than law of believing. So, yeah! they've won at life. If you count that, as winning.

What's this "How to win at life"? Life isn't a game where one wins and everyone else loses. Life's more about being successful (perhaps "content" would be a better word) in "being oneself" and "being a valued member of the community." "Godliness with contentment is great gain." 1 Tim 6:6-11. Here's what "winning" is: righteousness, godliness, faith, love, endurance and gentleness.

Oh yeah. "Spiritual probation." Forgot about that. (Chapter and verse, please?? )

Here's some things that scripture says: Is 1:18 - “Come now, let us reason together,” says the LORD. Prov 11:4 and 24:6 both tell us that there is "safety in a multitude of counsellors" And we can consider the lives of prophets and evangelisers as set out in the Bible. Some talked/consulted with others; some others just went their own way - and maybe got into trouble. I think there's a time for "first thought" - for example, in extreme danger - but mostly, almost always, there's considered thought and discussion with others whose views can be respected. Those others may or may not be Christians; if so, may or may not be Christian leadership. God gave us brains to think with, "common sense" to help us, and gave us other people that we can talk ("reason") with; and where there is no-one else to talk to, he gave a book full of examples of "how to do" and "how not to do," to help guide our thinking. And, of course, TWI squashed any kind of "first thought" by compelling obedience to leaders in all capacities - even one's unqualified twig leader, who of course had to defer upwards, and so on. If you didn't follow your twig leader's pronouncement and things went pear-shaped, it was your fault for doing your own thing and not listening to God. If you didn't follow your twig leader's pronouncement and things went well, there was no "credit" anywhere. I think this got worse as TWI got more erratic. In the LCM era, it was a real lockstep approach.

As a former lawyer, and occasionally I did a bit of work in matrimonial matters, I never really "got" abusive couple relationships and why one would keep returning to the abusive partner time after time. I knew the "theory" (if you like); but I didn't understand the gradual erosion of boundaries. "If he keeps hitting you like that - just leave!" Later, processing my experiences post-Way, ah! then I "got" it. Emotionally. Whole different picture then.

They go well on a woodburner or bonfire, too!