Rocky

Very detailed review. I recommend it wholeheartedly. The following clip saliently describes Mr Stewart's conclusion that "his is a book that anyone interested in evangelicalism, Pentecostalism, or aberrant fundamentalist Christianity should read. Maybe everybody should." That paragraph well sums up and crystalizes much of the reason for the abuses of power inherent in many first person records posted on GSC.

I will read that review shortly. However, at the public library in my new home town, I attended my first meeting of a local writers' group. I was given a couple of minutes to introduce myself. I mentioned my intent to write a memoir, noting my interest in politics and my 12 years in a particular Christian fundamentalist cult. I was quickly asked if I was at liberty to say which cult. Of course I am and gladly cited The Way International. Of the dozen or so other attendees, at least three or four indicated awareness of TWI as a cult. Btw, the young airman who self-immolated on Sunday, WaPo noted, had been involved as a child in a "high-demand" religious sect. I cited WaPo in this comment on the cults s3 thread. In case the link I posted in that comment wasn't a gift article link, this one IS.

Reflecting back on these responses, Raf, it seems you could have used emojis to say pretty much the same thing without sounding defensive or resorting to name calling yourself. For example N'est pas?

Notable indeed... especially to us, because we were familiar with this particular cult. I wonder if any academics have compiled credible data about the scope, time, and lack of meaningful accountability. I'd sure be interested in delving into such data. Btw, according to a WaPo story, the Air Force E-4 (who self-immolated on Sunday) had been a part of a: "But how a young man who liked The Lord of the Rings and karaoke became the man ablaze in a camouflage military uniform remains a mystery, even among some of his closest friends. "Bushnell was raised in a religious compound in Orleans, Mass., on Cape Cod, according to Susan Wilkins, 59, who said she was a member of the group from 1970 to 2005. She said that she knew Bushnell and his family on the compound and that he was still a member when she left. Wilkins said she heard through members of Bushnell’s family that he eventually left the group. "Wilkins’s account is consistent with those of multiple others who said Bushnell had told them about his childhood in the religious group or who had heard about his affiliation from his family members. "The group, called the Community of Jesus, has faced allegations of inappropriate behavior, which it has publicly disputed. In a lawsuit against an Ontario school, where many officials were alleged to be members of the U.S.-based religious group, former students called the Community of Jesus a “charismatic sect” and alleged that it “created an environment of control, intimidation and humiliation that fostered and inflicted enduring harms on its students.” Multiple people who said they were former members of the Community of Jesus described their years after leaving the compound as particularly challenging. They said former members, soon after they depart the group, often long for a sense of belonging. “A lot of us that got out are very much into social justice, trying to defend those who don’t or can’t defend themselves, because that is what we went through,” said Bonnie Zampino, 54, who said she was a member of the group for three years in the 1980s. "Wilkins also said it is common for members of the Community of Jesus to join the military, describing the transition as moving from “one high-control group to another high-control group.”" Emphasis mine. Also, the link to their website was mine, and very easy to find. I figure we'll learn more about SrAirman Bushnell in the days to come. However, high-control group is a significant indicator of cults, according to Steven Hassan. There's no indication thus far that Bushnell's decision was based on anything other than his own personal conviction about the war. But it seems obvious he was locked into a cultish mindset. Very sad and tragic, especially for his family. Btw, he apparently was only 25. Meaning Ms. Wilkins would have only known him as a small child.

Easy to do so for anyone familiar with human nature and how challenging accepted orthodoxies can cause massive consternation. I suspect that's not substantially different now than it was two millennia ago.

Oh...

Is that how rational reasoning works?

And we're supposed to take your word for it? I think it would be gracious of you to at least give us a link for where you came up with your claim about "scholarly consensus."

YIKES!

Many GSC readers will be familiar with Steven Hassan's name and anti-cult message. This TED talk by Hassan is poignant (and has been for more than 40 years) and is salient today. It's less than 14 minutes long. The concept is far from limited to religion (including fundamentalist groups like twi) or politics. Hassan cites other ways people might be subject to this kind of mental/emotional manipulation. BTW, all humans are subject to being conned. I have been and not only by Victor Wierwille or Loy Martindale.

Hallelujah!

That's a very stoic sentiment you put forth, Oldies? My perspective is the bible is all story. Clearly there are still some on this thread who hew to the fundamentalist way of trying to figure out what's going to happen in the future... by looking at concordances and such. BUT... accepting what comes your way in life is a very (emotionally) healthy approach overall anyway. Put another way, as Stoicism writer Ryan Holiday put it, Stillness is the key. Regardless of your believe in or denial of purgatory, I appreciate your Stoic reflection on the subject.

It's a different time and a different culture. Literally.

Hmmm... interesting reflection. For safety's sake, you're probably right. As to whether the culture at such an event would be anything we'd expect to imagine? I have no clue.

Great insight there Socks. Of course, you are NOT them. A very salient question for them might be whether they are even capable of taking the temperature of the membership or are they just desperate for ideas (throwing spaghetti against the wall and hoping it will stick)?

Except, I saw it here: https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2024/jan/29/amy-coney-barrett-father-christian-sect-controversy

Hey Rusty Duck, A lot of vets face a lot of crap. I look forward to reading more of your story. Like you, I was a Military WOW Ambassador after becoming involved w/TWI. Unlike you, I never had suicidal ideations. I have had other intense ideations, when dealing with a divorce that was far more painful than it needed to be. One factor for me was the model of family where the man is the head of the woman. Also like you, I have gotten medical care at the US Dept of Veterans Services. I hear stories from fellow vets who are less than pleased with VA medical care. However, I'm tremendously thankful for the care I've received. Maybe sometime I'll be ready to get more personal and vulnerable in what I share about my medical care. For now, I don't want to derail your thread or take away from your story. Your story is very important. I'm very interested in hearing more of it, as much as you can be comfortable sharing.

I would bet it's an archaic remnant of 1970s Jesus Movement rhetoric. Key word being archaic.

I saw that article. SMH!

By definition of subjectivity, that is inherently not a true statement.

Wow!

Was he being blackmailed? I doubt it. Who knows what's in the heart of any human?

Spiritual warfare? Or economic warfare? Gotta protect their "intellectual property" don't ya know?

If you think you're being brave (courageous) and it doesn't involve vulnerability (risk or uncertainty), you're not being brave. According to Dr Brown, the opposite of belonging is FITTING IN. The reason many of us fell under Victor Wierwille's influence was a combination of 1) how we were raised or what we believed as a result of what we were exposed to as children; and 2) that Victor exploited THAT very cultural inheritance we had when we first heard of him, TWI, and PFLAP. TWI embraced us enough (love bombing) at first to draw us in. Then we heard a loud drumbeat of what it would take to please God. Brené Brown | The Most Eye-Opening 14 Minutes Of Your Life And it will NOT cost you $200, or even $40. She's not even trying to sell you a class. Victor Wierwille, from this perspective, was nothing more and nothing less than an entrepreneur. IF he was a con artist. WE were the marks. I was. In October this year, it will have been 50 years since I first hear the pitch. What I have today that I did NOT have 50 years ago is EXPERIENCE. Experience gained through struggle. See Romans 5:3

Highlight is the youngest child rocking with two older girls. 20230428 Crazy Train Song by Ozzy Osbourne (Performed by Petty Rock) at Siam Indy Stage