Rocky

Which suggests that WW was reasonable to surmise that susieV's post was simply an advertisement.

I'm friends with OE on FB. I'll message him to see if he has any insight on a possible connection.

In 2009, GSC member Onion Eater started this thread in the Open forum. When I searched (DuckDuckGo) for EB Stowe, one of the results on the first page was a link to that thread in Open. That's probably where susieV learned about this website.

I'm guessing that Mr Stowe didn't have any such connection.

It would be selfish of me, Mike, to say we've missed you. If you don't have time to be involved here at GSC, so be it. However, two things. One is that Vic's words on his plagiarism HAVE been cited at GSC. Repeatedly. Two, that your source regarding your interpretation of BGL's relationship with Vic, and what BGL may have said to a sixth corpse clergy member is dubious at best. I highly doubt that you'll "verify" anything that was told to you by such a source. One of the characteristics of the cult of VPW was the prevalence of dubious narcissistic myths. Someone would start a conversation (rumor) and it would get passed along with ZERO critical analysis as if it was god's honest truth. Very quickly, it would become the unquestioned God-breathed Word. That's the social model your claim seems to fit. If it's not YOUR first hand observation, it's likely BS.

Parental alienation is very real. I figure you've already discovered that and have read some on the issue. I went through it and it devastated me for all of my daughter's teen years. I am most thankful that when she turned 20 (and happened to be pregnant by the young man she eventually married), my daughter initiated reconciliation with me. I now have two wonderful grandchildren who I adore. Even though I know the pain such alienation causes, I'd be encouraged that your grandson still has affection for your son. This article spells out some of the issues. The last paragraph has crucial guidance. During the years I suffered great emotional pain, I was convinced my ex-wife did have borderline personality disorder. If she did, she seems to have grown out of it.

That would seem to be the same BG Leonard.

So, it's okay for YOU to do what you condemn as long as you weren't the first one?

Of course you don't engage in name calling. You're a highly trained psychiatrist, right? Isn't that why you diagnosed mental illness in someone you claim to have never met? Shift this also said: "right on ! speak nicely ! dont call people names or put them down."

Translated into English: I drank the kool-aid and I became addicted to it. Further, claims that the cult Wierwille founded teaches "rightly-divided word of GOD" are nothing more and nothing less than an illusion.

Karl's doing well... living an adventurous life... trying to sorta reinvent himself as a comedy writer.

No, that's not what I was getting at. The Mormon church is obsessed with taking care of the social and economic needs of its members... unlike TWI. Is that clear enough? Thanks for asking for clarification.

I don't know about the swagger, but the video may hold some clues as to how or why the Mormon church is far more successful that the small time cult based in New Knoxville, OH. Not that I'm interested in the Mormons either.

Very good point. I wonder how many of us understand what makes a successful alpha male?

A critical thought. An interesting reflection, for sure. At least partly true/factual. The fact is, we ALL (even setting aside having been sucked into TWI) are subject to and have been conned.

You've never been conned? Surely you jest. Even setting aside anything TWI and our involvement therein, we've ALL been conned. It's a part of life. Not a pleasant part, but it's there anyway. Do you have any idea how contradictory your statements above are? Critical thinking isn't necessary to just listen to their teachings? That's all you do? Really? You just absorb them without a thought as to whether they are reasonable, relate to anything you've ever heard before, or could possibly be the truth? Oh, yeah, you said you might go over them to "see if what I see in the Word agrees..." But critical thinking and analysis is SO unnecessary.

Critical thinking skills are crucial for people who want to avoid the very human condition of being subject to con games. Wierwille was a con artist. Martindale, though he exercised misdirection more often by way of bullying, was still a con artist. TWI splinter groups are con games. The truth isn't hidden now for people who actually are interested in it. For those who are not, they often resort to calling critical thinking and analysis "speculation." Your analogy about "evil persons" changing and then invoking Saul of Tarsus is a logical fallacy and unrelated to the discussion on this thread. But you'd know that if you weren't actively avoiding critical analysis.

It's UNusual for a group to NOT ask. Like I said to our not so curious and surprisingly trusting (in the R&R group) taxi friend... If they don't want to build their group, that's no skin off my nose... they'll just all fade away.

1) reading YOUR words and 2) it's awfully presumptuous of you to think that your private interpretation -- no matter how "skilled" you might be in biblical research -- is "thus saith the Lord." Oh, and besides presumptuous, it also comes off as extremely arrogant. Especially when you don't even demonstrate reasonable levels of curiosity about organizational concepts and principles.

How quaint that whenever anyone challenges YOUR preconceived notions, they are speculating, but when your R&R friends make a declaration (apparently) of thus saith the Lord, you take them at their word. The issue is not whether they eventually start asking for money, but whether or not they decide to build their new splinter group. One possibility is that they could just defer to Rico, who already has a structure to facilitate collection of moo-lah for "obedience to the household of faith."

We've been through this. It's not speculation. It's decades of experience, pattern recognition and human nature. If they have no ambition other than working for the next few decades (when they're octogenarians), then they are either independently wealthy (as TLC suggested) or they're trying to gin up a new splinter group. Now your lack of curiosity seems to have retreated into denialism.

And they will... unless Rico goes too heavy on his obedience to the household bull$hit.

A suggestion probably best if it had been made privately, if at all. GSC is about 18 years old now. I trust that Pawtucket has properly evaluated his options. I'm thankful for this service he has provided. I made a meager donation, wish I could afford more.

I heard the same $hit from Wierwille in the mid-1970s. T-bone is right, it was just marketing bull$hit.

That's certainly a big part of it. Perhaps another major reason was the sense of belonging we had as a part of what the cult labeled the "household of God." For many years before and during my time in TWI, I couldn't figure out why people stayed in denominational Christian churches that had glaring major flaws. They often overlooked those flaws because of their "tribe." They had people they felt comfortable with, they felt they belonged.