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So many newbies, so many still blinded by vp...


tonto
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I don't feel like an outsider, Larry. Really, we who are trying to "keep the baby" while throwing out the bathwater (that's my clique, and proud of it. "You are welcome at the Clique") seem quite welcome here. Sure, those who are really intent on exposing moral and/or doctrinal shortcomings of the Way and VP may get intense, and it may seem to you that they are invalidating your experience or POV (granted, some do in fact do that!) but working it out is a very helpful side benefit to "telling the other side of the story." The title of this thread is provocative. It's what they do around here, sometimes.

I don't feel like an outsider, but I do feel like a guest. My goal is not the same as GS. I happen to think that GS's goal is a worthy one, if it's done responsibly, and sometimes it is and sometimes it isn't, IMO. But it's not my goal to tell "the other side of the story." It's also not my goal to sugarcoat or be in denial to the problems that existed in TWI. My goals are not incompatible with GS's, but I do feel like a guest here, and for me, I think it requires of me the courtesy one gives a host in his own home.

As a fellow newbie, I've had to deal with some of the stuff you're expressing. Sometimes I've been downright offended, so I empathize. But overall, I think you'd have to agree that there are some wonderful folks around here, and some oldtimers that can teach us newbies a thing or two.

Dan, you make some good points. No doubt. I didn't mean to make a blanket statement that everyone who is a member of GS falls within one set. Like in any community there are subsets. Certainly there are some who, even though they have an aversion towards TWI, are able to accept those who don't. It's not that difficult to discern which subset (some members) of the set (total membership) are which.

The only thing I might disagree with you about is: "I think you'd have to agree that there are some wonderful folks around here." I think they're all wonderful people. Just because I don't agree with their point of view doesn't make them bad people or (unwonderful -- not sure that's a word).

So, I suppose, if it makes some people uncomfortable to be referred to as being part of a clique -- then I'll refrain from using the term again. It's okay with me if some want to label me as being part of the clique of "newbies". :)

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I'm sure you all have various interests, views and purposes but here at GS you have one common bond -- a deep aversion towards TWI and that is your primary focus. Anyone who doesn't share that aversion is an outsider. Unfortunately, some people would like nothing better than to see us go away. At least that's the sense I get when I see topics such as this started. And it really is difficult to stay when you feel you're not really welcomed. I personally, never was much for popularity contests. If you like me fine. If you don't -- well I won't lose any sleep over it.

Awwww ... Larry... You mean all those biscuits and gravy didn't help make you feel more welcomed? Shoot, and I was gonna make some huevos rancheros too...

Why do we need a popularity contest? Just be who you are. Everyone gets breakfast as long as they get their little butts up to the counter and sit long enough to order and eat.

Topics like these come and go a lot here. I've been here just shy of two years and I've plenty of them. This thread was obviously started out of frustration. Sometimes a thread like this is started by a newbie who really wants to stir up some chit. Sometimes the thread dies quickly, other times it lasts...

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Awwww ... Larry... You mean all those biscuits and gravy didn't help make you feel more welcomed? Shoot, and I was gonna make some huevos rancheros too...

Gosh darn it dooj! You must be one of those who believe -- the way to a man's heart is through his stomach. ;)

Why do we need a popularity contest? Just be who you are. Everyone gets breakfast as long as they get their little butts up to the counter and sit long enough to order and eat.
Some people have a "need" to be accepted. That's what I mean by "popularity contest". You (not you personally) can accept me or reject me as I am. I'm not going to change who I am just to make you feel comfortable.
Topics like these come and go a lot here. I've been here just shy of two years and I've plenty of them. This thread was obviously started out of frustration. Sometimes a thread like this is started by a newbie who really wants to stir up some chit. Sometimes the thread dies quickly, other times it lasts...

I realized (from the start) that this topic was started out of frustration. It was obvious. Sometimes there's a time to keep still when someone speaks out of frustration -- sometimes it's time to address it. I think if everyone just agreed with Tonto (was it Tonto -- I forget) then perhaps she would feel anytime she feels the slightest bit frustrated -- then go ahead and "slam" whoever she's feeling frustrated with. Now maybe she'll give a little more time to consider how that might come off before she hits that "Add" topic button.

It's all good! Peace!

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I see your point about not wanting to validate a temper tantrum. (If I'm putting the wrong words in your mouth, I apologize.)

I don't share your opinion. That's fine.

And I don't think that the way to a man's heart has anything to do with food, but I do think that offering someone a meal helps make them feel more welcomed.

Need a warm-up on that coffee? ;)

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I see your point about not wanting to validate a temper tantrum. (If I'm putting the wrong words in your mouth, I apologize.)

I don't share your opinion. That's fine.

Fair enuf. I can live with that.

And I don't think that the way to a man's heart has anything to do with food, but I do think that offering someone a meal helps make them feel more welcomed.
Dooj, I was joking.
Need a warm-up on that coffee? ;)

Thanks, but I had my limit for the day. :)

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I dunno. On the one hand, I get the "tired of the same old conversations and debates" thing - really!!!

On the other hand, we were all newbies at some point in time, no?

Abi, I wasn't clear enough. I get tired of the same ole arguments with the same ole people who have been here a long time. I've learned over the years that there are a few people I will never agree with, on just about any topic. Yet, some of my favorite posters here are those who have vastly differing perspectives than I do. I like the sense of balance that having differing experiences and opinions brings. I just don't like to be preached at. :yawn1:

And Larry, you are welcome at my house anytime. In fact, we are having a little gathering here in November, something involving BBQ, I'm told. :wave: Consider yourself having a personal invitation, along with everyone else who frequents this little haven in cyberspace. My husband and I are hosting, Dooj is cooking. The conversation will be brilliant, the weather delightful (hopefully), and the food well, a culinary masterpiece, and the Best of TX.

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And Larry, you are welcome at my house anytime. In fact, we are having a little gathering here in November, something involving BBQ, I'm told. :wave: Consider yourself having a personal invitation, along with everyone else who frequents this little haven in cyberspace. My husband and I are hosting, Dooj is cooking. The conversation will be brilliant, the weather delightful (hopefully), and the food well, a culinary masterpiece, and the Best of TX.

Yummy! I didn't know you could barbecue biscuits. :) Thanks Ex10!

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For some reason this thread really got to me. I had to take some time off to get a better perspective on it. I'm not sure what sparked the thread, since I'm fairly new here and just learning my way around. I really like what AnotherDan had to say about being a guest here. I remember a teaching I heard once about how when you're a guest you don't come in and start moving furniture around (different context but applicable, I believe) so I won't try to move any furniture. If I do, I'm sure someone will let me know, okay?

I think it's the use of the expression TWIt-head that bothered me the most. To me it's not the same as calling someone a Trekkie because most trekkies that I know like being called a trekkie. But I can't imagine anyone not being insulted by being called a twit.

Here's the wikipedia definition of a twit.

A British slang referring to a silly, annoying, ineffectual, and/or imbecilic person.

An insignificant or bothersome person.

I've seen that term thrown around quite a bit here, and it was used against someone near and dear to me on his first thread that he started. Funny thing, was that he was presenting a doctrine that was different than what VP taught and the people who called him twittish were arguing for what was taught in PFAL. Seems to me that it can be applied to anyone who disagrees with what someone else says. It's too bad, because he no longer posts here and that is Greasespot's loss. I wonder how many other great people decide not to participate.

On a lighter note, here's a funny Monty Python twit skit. On second thought, maybe that was him in the suit.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OMSic0V-Xww

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Larry...That's a valid question...I no longer consider YOU a guest, that's for sure... :biglaugh:

I think that when a person first enters, they are welcomed and shown around the cafe. Once they decide to "engage", they enter the arena where the "reideer games" are played...sometime shortly after that, they are no longerguests, but "members!

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Not really a "black sheep"...more like one that's stuck in the quicksand and needs to be pulled out... :biglaugh:

:) Did ya know that that's a myth? People can quite easily extradite themselves from quicksand. But it's nice to know someone thinks I need to be rescued.

Help me!!!!!! I've fallen and I can't get up!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ;)

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I am a newbie. Not real new I have been here almost a year. I mostly read.

I am so grateful that there is a GreaseSpot Cafe. I won't go into details but I will say that reading here

has helped so very much. I like the people here. The ones I agree with and even the ones I don't.

Funny some of you are. I didn't expect to laugh so much when I first found here. :) Someone you don't think you know you may or they may know someone you do know or once knew. It is a small world.

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