Jump to content
GreaseSpot Cafe
skyrider

Phasing in a Splinter

Recommended Posts

The Way, Inc. [1957] was a splinter group. 

Mrs. Wierwille's book documents that her husband was "thrilled" to sit in Rev. B.G. Leonard's foundational class, The Gifts of the Spirit, in 1953.  Months later, wierwille (again), with two carloads of students made the trek to Calgary, Alberta to take this class in June/July of 1953.  And then after wierwille's 2nd class sit-thru, he drives home to Van Wert with visions of a class-based teaching ministry dancing in his head.  By October, 1953.....wierwille is off and running "his own class."

Phasing in a Splinter:

  1. Acquire the Mantle of "Teaching the Word".........*weekly sustenance of what you teach needs faithful attendance and adherence.
  2. Establish a Hierarchy of Leadership and Spiritual System for others to climb.......*spiritual elites are not accountable to followers.
  3. Secure a Central Headquarters.......harnessing the one point of allegiance from which teachings, outreach and service emanate.

The R&R group is off to a running start with teaching a vast amount of twi's foundation........but will take strategic steps to tweak the things that twi got wrong!!  Sound familiar?  It should:  that's exactly what wierwille did.  They will teach 90% (??) of what wierwille established.......and avoid like the plague issues like wierwille's plagiarism, drunkenness, sexual predation, complicity to spiritual abuse, hoarding of abs, etc.  So, they will endeavor to re-create the good ole days in the early 70s with wierwille.......dismissing all the red flags that caused men like Heefner, Doop, Wade, to exit over 40 years ago.

Phase #1 is the easy step.

Phase #2 is going to be much more challenging.  With peers in this party, who is going to rise up and take on the mantle of alpha-male?  Without a system of classes, camps, central location, money collection, goals, agenda............where is this railroad going?  Teaching is NOT enough to sustain the headwinds of inertia.  People WILL fade away......into family life, careers, interests, health issues and death.  If there is no overwhelming agreement on hierarchy, lots of these corps will head for the exit doors.  And besides, if they don't capture the youth's idealism and zealous support......this new splinter will be little more than your local book club supporters.

Phase #3 of Securing a Central Headquarters [BRC/Church].....like CFF, Finnegan's group, Hendricks group, etc......is essential.  Maybe Dottie Moynihan will open up her family wealth's checkbook and give a hefty donation.....or one of the others.  But....just to be having weekly teachings on Facebook is going to fizzle.......soon.  Teachings going out into the ethereal of humanity will NOT alone sustain the human spirit.  I highly suspect that MANY of these self-appointed corps have been planning these phases already!!!  These guys and gals are not stupid, misguided yes, but not stupid.  They will need a location in the next two years, maximum.

As this Revival and Restoration group casts off the yoke of bondage from mothercult.......it will be very interesting to see how many want to get their butts back into chairs for leaders' meetings, classes, camps and night owls.  LOL.  

My money is on the Horneys taking the mantle...............:spy:

 

 

.

 

Edited by skyrider
  • Like 2
  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
13 minutes ago, skyrider said:

(SNIP)...Phase #3 of Securing a Central Headquarters [BRC/Church].....like CFF, Finnegan's group, Hendricks group, etc......is essential.  Maybe Dottie Moynihan will open up her family wealth's checkbook and give a hefty donation.....or one of the others.  But....just to be having weekly teachings on Facebook is going to fizzle.......soon.  Teachings going out into the ethereal of humanity will NOT alone sustain the human spirit.  I highly suspect that MANY of these self-appointed corps have been planning these phases already!!!  These guys and gals are not stupid, misguided yes, but not stupid.  They will need a location in the next two years, maximum.

As this Revival and Restoration group casts off the yoke of bondage from mothercult.......it will be very interesting to see how many want to get their butts back into chairs for leaders' meetings, classes, camps and night owls.  LOL.  

My money is on the Horneys taking the mantle...............:spy:

 

great post Skyrider !

yeah - I can see the Horneys as being "a good fit"...she was a real ball-breaker during my LEAD session...I remember saying several times in an aside to my wife "I think she's trying to kill me by exhaustion." ...but praise the gosh by golly I made it through...I'm corps dammit !  :biglaugh:

Edited by T-Bone
clarity
  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
42 minutes ago, skyrider said:

Phasing in a Splinter:

  1. Acquire the Mantle of "Teaching the Word".........*weekly sustenance of what you teach needs faithful attendance and adherence.
  2. Establish a Hierarchy of Leadership and Spiritual System for others to climb.......*spiritual elites are not accountable to followers.
  3. Secure a Central Headquarters.......harnessing the one point of allegiance from which teachings, outreach and service emanate.

 

** Spiritual System ** .........most likely class-based [foundational, intermediate, advanced], but of course R&R will tweak the designation.  Perhaps, they will be color-coded like ski slopes or whatever.....

Churches had "retreats."  Twi had "advances."  Perhaps, R&R will have "wierwille-seances."  :anim-smile:

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, skyrider said:

** Spiritual System ** .........most likely class-based [foundational, intermediate, advanced], but of course R&R will tweak the designation.  Perhaps, they will be color-coded like ski slopes or whatever.....

Churches had "retreats."  Twi had "advances."  Perhaps, R&R will have "wierwille-seances."  :anim-smile:

IF the R&R group has established itself as the OIKEOS Christian Network, the group has indeed set its sights on being a new splinter group. I copied excerpts and pasted them in the R&R thread with commentary. They do seem intent on running classes.

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 hours ago, skyrider said:

The Way, Inc. [1957] was a splinter group. 

Mrs. Wierwille's book documents that her husband was "thrilled" to sit in Rev. B.G. Leonard's foundational class, The Gifts of the Spirit, in 1953.  Months later, wierwille (again), with two carloads of students made the trek to Calgary, Alberta to take this class in June/July of 1953.  And then after wierwille's 2nd class sit-thru, he drives home to Van Wert with visions of a class-based teaching ministry dancing in his head.  By October, 1953.....wierwille is off and running "his own class."

Phasing in a Splinter:

  1. Acquire the Mantle of "Teaching the Word".........*weekly sustenance of what you teach needs faithful attendance and adherence.
  2. Establish a Hierarchy of Leadership and Spiritual System for others to climb.......*spiritual elites are not accountable to followers.
  3. Secure a Central Headquarters.......harnessing the one point of allegiance from which teachings, outreach and service emanate.

The R&R group is off to a running start with teaching a vast amount of twi's foundation........but will take strategic steps to tweak the things that twi got wrong!!  Sound familiar?  It should:  that's exactly what wierwille did.  They will teach 90% (??) of what wierwille established.......and avoid like the plague issues like wierwille's plagiarism, drunkenness, sexual predation, complicity to spiritual abuse, hoarding of abs, etc.  So, they will endeavor to re-create the good ole days in the early 70s with wierwille.......dismissing all the red flags that caused men like Heefner, Doop, Wade, to exit over 40 years ago.

Phase #1 is the easy step.

Phase #2 is going to be much more challenging.  With peers in this party, who is going to rise up and take on the mantle of alpha-male?  Without a system of classes, camps, central location, money collection, goals, agenda............where is this railroad going?  Teaching is NOT enough to sustain the headwinds of inertia.  People WILL fade away......into family life, careers, interests, health issues and death.  If there is no overwhelming agreement on hierarchy, lots of these corps will head for the exit doors.  And besides, if they don't capture the youth's idealism and zealous support......this new splinter will be little more than your local book club supporters.

Phase #3 of Securing a Central Headquarters [BRC/Church].....like CFF, Finnegan's group, Hendricks group, etc......is essential.  Maybe Dottie Moynihan will open up her family wealth's checkbook and give a hefty donation.....or one of the others.  But....just to be having weekly teachings on Facebook is going to fizzle.......soon.  Teachings going out into the ethereal of humanity will NOT alone sustain the human spirit.  I highly suspect that MANY of these self-appointed corps have been planning these phases already!!!  These guys and gals are not stupid, misguided yes, but not stupid.  They will need a location in the next two years, maximum.

As this Revival and Restoration group casts off the yoke of bondage from mothercult.......it will be very interesting to see how many want to get their butts back into chairs for leaders' meetings, classes, camps and night owls.  LOL.  

My money is on the Horneys taking the mantle...............:spy:

 

 

.

 

Sky, I wonder how many years this group will last before, they devour each other.  

  • Upvote 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 hours ago, skyrider said:

** Spiritual System ** .........most likely class-based [foundational, intermediate, advanced], but of course R&R will tweak the designation.  Perhaps, they will be color-coded like ski slopes or whatever.....

Churches had "retreats."  Twi had "advances."  Perhaps, R&R will have "wierwille-seances."  :anim-smile:

Sky, LMAO off at your last remark!!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Rocky said:

IF the R&R group has established itself as the OIKEOS Christian Network, the group has indeed set its sights on being a new splinter group. I copied excerpts and pasted them in the R&R thread with commentary. They do seem intent on running classes.

Rocky, I remember those damn classes, and not fondly!  There was a lot of pressure on people in the Twigs, to get others to take those mind-numbing things, and the metal chairs we used were uncomfortable.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, Grace Valerie Claire said:

Sky, I wonder how many years this group will last before, they devour each other.  

Yeah.........right now, this group has "too many corps and not enough followers."

Wait till they start delving into salaried positions, travel expenses, company car, room rentals, petty cash reimbursements, financial transparency and long-term investment into a "central headquarters."  Just how committed are these folks when it comes to their pocketbook? 

To grow.......they've got to be committed.

To grow.......they've got to have outreach.

Who is going to go door-to-door witnessing?  :wink2:

Plus, on the horizon.......they will be prompted to discuss, determine and restate their stance on the holy spirit field, namely the nine manifestations.  Demonstration of the power of God........ie signs, miracles and wonders.  Back in twi's heyday, THAT was what separated "the groovy Christians" from the church Christians.  If this R&R group is going to have any longevity, it has to be more than just having butts in seats......and another weekend of listening to a teaching series. 

 

  • Upvote 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

From thread:  Revival and Restoration.....page 21

 

9 hours ago, Taxidev said:

BTW: there was a conference in Florida over the Labor Day weekend.  In case you're interested in hearing what they were teaching, here is a free link to all of it.  Just click the little speaker icon and it will open a new window with the whole weekend of recordings.

https://oikeos.org/sermon/opening-of-the-hope-conference-r-magnelli/

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Oikeos Courses

Wonder if/when they are going to delve into the holy spirit field?

Wasn't PFAL Sessions 9-12 all about the operation of manifestations?

Is this R&R group going to STAND.........or sit?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

According to their calendar, lots of activity in Florida......

Will the R&R leadership seek to establish a "central headquarters" in Florida?

The salaried positions will try to rally the troops..........to give, to witness, and attend meetings.

Decisions, decisions...........and the less committed will start heading for the exits.

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
28 minutes ago, skyrider said:

Will the R&R leadership seek to establish a "central headquarters" in Florida?

Oikeos isn't R&R, it's all Rico.  He participates with R&R sometimes, but this site is definitely all him.  He wants to be in charge, so now he is.

From all the discussion from R&R I gather they don't want a central headquarters, and that would be a good thing.  We'll see.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, Rocky said:

IF the R&R group has established itself as the OIKEOS Christian Network, the group has indeed set its sights on being a new splinter group. I copied excerpts and pasted them in the R&R thread with commentary. They do seem intent on running classes.

Taking a series of classes is...........sequential followship and, possibly, indoctrination.

It becomes the process that enables the succession of faithful obedience

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, Taxidev said:

Oikeos isn't R&R, it's all Rico.  He participates with R&R sometimes, but this site is definitely all him.  He wants to be in charge, so now he is.

From all the discussion from R&R I gather they don't want a central headquarters, and that would be a good thing.  We'll see.

.........and so it begins (again).

.........in 3 years, there will be a central, office-headquarters.

.........just too many egos, too many chiefs.

.........I hate to be Debbie-downer, but this thing will keep splintering.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, skyrider said:

I hate to be Debbie-downer, but this thing will keep splintering.

I don't need to strain my imagination to see this happening.

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, skyrider said:

According to their calendar, lots of activity in Florida......

Will the R&R leadership seek to establish a "central headquarters" in Florida?

The salaried positions will try to rally the troops..........to give, to witness, and attend meetings.

Decisions, decisions...........and the less committed will start heading for the exits.

Sky, who could blame them??  Forget about that witnessing, giving, and meeting Bullsheet!!  I think many of the most committed people in TWI, ended up getting hurt the most.  Ten years in TWI, was more than enough for me.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
26 minutes ago, skyrider said:

.........and so it begins (again).

.........in 3 years, there will be a central, office-headquarters.

.........just too many egos, too many chiefs.

.........I hate to be Debbie-downer, but this thing will keep splintering.

Sky, I know this is off-track, but does anyone know how that splinter group of the young VPW, is doing down in Mississippi??  I haven't heard anything about him recently.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
43 minutes ago, Taxidev said:

Oikeos isn't R&R, it's all Rico.  He participates with R&R sometimes, but this site is definitely all him.  He wants to be in charge, so now he is.

From all the discussion from R&R I gather they don't want a central headquarters, and that would be a good thing.  We'll see.

Thanks Taxidev......

If I remember correctly.......Rico exited twi 2-3 years ago, right?

Then, in May 2017.....lots of these R&R corps got labeled m/a.

TWO NEW SPLINTERS:

  1. Rico and Robin Magnelli.......Oikeos Christian Network
  2. R&R Group.......Moynihans, Horneys, Forts, Sheldons, Knupps, etc.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, skyrider said:

TWO NEW SPLINTERS:

  1. Rico and Robin Magnelli.......Oikeos Christian Network
  2. R&R Group

Yup.  I didn't quote the R&R participants because I don't know the full list.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
25 minutes ago, Taxidev said:

Yup.  I didn't quote the R&R participants because I don't know the full list.

 

Well.......here is their declaration letter and signatures that provoked twi's board of directors to shun many of them.

Note their grievances.......and let's just see if this group, in the next few years, heeds this standard or falls in the ditch.

 

Quote

March 2017

Dear beloved Way Corps ministers,

God’s abundant blessings, mercy, and peace be unto you. As Way Corps ministers, we have been and continue to be deeply concerned with the direction our beloved ministry has taken. This is why we persist in sounding the alarm.

We wholeheartedly desire revival and restoration for our ministry of Biblical research, teaching, and fellowship. The entire Way Corps household should realize the need to restore this ministry back to the heart and Biblical truths as initiated by our Founder, Dr. Victor Paul Wierwille. He earned respect many times over by teaching the greatness of God’s Word, leading from the front, and cultivating individual believer’s long suits. He did not ask others to do what he had not done many times himself. This respect cannot simply be transferred. Those succeeding in the same position must earn respect themselves. This involves leading from the front rather than pushing from behind.

We remain firm in our requests to bring our ministry back to "It Is Written," so the Word of the Lord may have free course and be glorified, starting with:

  1. Lift the non-Biblical “no debt” policy that excludes classes and service to those in debt. Rather, continue to teach God’s will of living within our means, working heartily as unto the Lord, and sharing of our abundance.

  2. Eliminate the “absolute” power of the current self-appointed board. Replace it with a larger elected board with established term limits and input from the entire Way Corps household.

  3. Bring The Way Corps meetings back to their roots to include spiritually energized, in-depth teachings of God’s Word with an emphasis on scope and a word-by-word study of the scripture.

  4. Redesign Sunday Teaching Services with an energized service and teachers that motivate and inspire believing. Stream the teachings—we have the fiber optic cable already in place to do so. “Spiritual weakness and inability is caused by improper diet and neglect of the Word.” --VPW

  5. Rethink how Way Corps assignments and placements are handled. Post open positions. Way Corps assignments should be in conjunction with each Way Corps minister, ensuring these decisions really are “best for the individual” and then the ministry by having open discussions and transparent motives.

  6. Reestablish the Word living within a base of youth to lead us into the next generation, or the ministry will not survive. Reenergize their participation by respecting their needs for “Hot Bible,” musical alternatives, listening for and seeking their input, and honoring their desire for fellowship with one another.

  7. Reestablish a research team. This is vital to restore the foundation of our ministry to the integrity of the Word.

  8. Reach out to re-engage Way Corps ministers who have been dropped or have discontinued their Way Corps service due to their conscience based on the Word, family needs, health or other issues.

We know this is not an exhaustive list, but only several of the basics. You will likely have other concerns you would like to see addressed.

Our Lord Jesus Christ showed us how to best evaluate leadership by his simple statement: “By their fruits ye shall know them.” In Matthew 7:15-20, he warned as follows:

Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.

Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?

Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit.

A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.

Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.

Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.

 

The fruit of our current leadership for the past decade has become increasingly apparent.

 

  1. In the past 10 years we have lost over 150 Way Corps ministers. Combined with continuing small in-residence Corps classes, the overall Way Corps numbers are in a sharp decline.

  2. The number of new graduates who stand following completion of classes is dropping. Because qualified Advanced Class candidate numbers have dropped so low, there is no longer a need to do a class every year.

  3. There has been a steady decrease in the number of believers seeking employment at The Way International and there is a high turnover rate.

  4. Attendance at Sunday Teaching Services at The Way International Headquarters and at on-the-field phone hookups is consistently low.

  5. The Way International has a book value of all assets over $68 million, however believers often pay a facility fee to meet as a State or Branch, or they meet in only “budget” or “free” spaces.  There are less and less full time ministers on the field and in many Regions only one full time couple in the entire Region. This inequality is non-Biblical and begs the question of how the abundant sharing is utilized. There is no transparency. (II Corinthians 8:14)

  6. There is continued mistreatment of long-standing, faithful believers and leadership. Without dialogue and nothing resembling I Timothy 5:19-21, numerous ministers—including seasoned Officers, Region coordinators, State coordinators, Branch coordinators, and others on Headquarters Staff—have been abruptly removed, mishandled, and in several cases barred from fellowship. This is inexcusable.

  7. The Board of Directors have refused to dialogue regarding the Biblical confrontation for which they were rebuked on August 12, 2016. The attached letters were sent asking for representatives to meet with the Board of Directors and later to attend the Region coordinator’s meetings so concerns could be effectually represented. The only option given was meeting with one couple at a time, not in a suggested Acts 15-type leadership meeting. The Board of Directors continue to move ahead unrepentant.

 

These are factual indications of their fruit. Additional questions need to be asked: Do we have the same laughter, joy, and wholehearted goodwill and love for one another that we once knew and loved in our beloved ministry? Why have we not had any nationwide Way Corps face-to-face meetings where we can fully share and learn from one another in an open manner? Why is the labor for and loyalty to a few select individuals exalted above commitment and devotion to our heavenly Father? These things have thwarted the purposes of God.

The future of our ministry is in peril. This information is intended as a call to action. We have not undertaken this mission lightly, but rather with prayer and a multitude of counselors working together. We recognize our first letter was “loud” in that it addressed issues openly. It is now essential to “yell long” as the Way Corps continue to arise, allowing God to bare His mighty arm. It is time to boldly speak up; we stand approved before God, not men. We will no longer cover for the Board of Directors.

Your one-accord voice is needed. As stated in Acts 4:20, after being commanded by the chief priests and elders not to speak at all, nor teach in the name of Jesus, they simply replied, “We cannot but speak the things which we have seen and heard.” They went to their “own company” and reported all that the chief priests and elders had said unto them, Acts 4:23. As a result, in verse 24, they lifted up their voice to God with one accord. Boldness to speak the Word, signs and wonders, and a multitude of believers with one heart and soul was the fruit. Great grace was upon them all.

Many of us have informed our “own company” of our Biblical confrontation and why it was done. We have encouraged the believers to pray for our ministry and live the Word. The results have been a greater commitment to “It is Written,” relief that their concerns are being addressed, and a thankfulness that the Word of God is the foundation of our lives. It has been an answer of peace. We encourage you to do the same as God works in your heart.

It must be the Word, the Word, and nothing but the Word.

The numbers that support a change at the Board of Director level are consistently growing. You can contact us at: revivalandrestoration@outlook.com and/or contact us personally with any questions or comments.

Lovingly in Christ,

Ray and Sandy Beets, Ted and Ramona Bidon, Paul and Connie Brooks, Brett and Dale Byers,

Kevin and Melody Carter, Todd and Michelle Cencich, Michael and Cindy Fort,

Gary and Patricia Frederick, Scott and Kristina Froelich, Matthew and Laurie Harmon,

Ed and Jacque Horney, Mark and Terri Ladwig, Aaron and Kelly Lapp, Darrell La Salle,

Rhett Major, Bob and Dottie Moynihan, Rich and Vera O’Neal,

Buddy and Donna Pressler, Stephen and Patty Fay Roberts, David and Cecilia Rowe, Jon and Lisa Ryan,

Michael and Billi-Jo Sanders, Phil and Sue Shelton, Rick and Marian Schilling, Jeffrey and Chrissy Skeltis,

Gene and Sherry Slavit, Sean and Mary Strickland, Walter and Christina Uyehara…plus dozens more

 

Edited by skyrider

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Adding the Knupps, Longleys and other corps grads........lots have found the exit doors in the past two years.

Maybe, that's another reason why Bill and Marcia Greene were called in to headquarters.......to repair the storm-torn sails.

Man, it must really suck to sit in that "prevailing auditorium at hq"..........and see deadness all around.  :spy:

 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, skyrider said:

Adding the Knupps, Longleys and other corps grads........lots have found the exit doors in the past two years.

Maybe, that's another reason why Bill and Marcia Greene were called in to headquarters.......to repair the storm-torn sails.

Man, it must really suck to sit in that "prevailing auditorium at hq"..........and see deadness all around.  :spy:

 

I wonder if the walls there echo as loud as the halls in the poem that VPW plagiarized from someone and entitled "The Way Corps"?????

:spy:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, skyrider said:

here is their declaration letter and signatures

That is some list of names!  I had seen the points of contention, but not the signature list.

 

8 hours ago, skyrider said:

Maybe, that's another reason why Bill and Marcia Greene were called in to headquarters.......to repair the storm-torn sails.

Yes, I did catch wind of this - you are correct.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
55 minutes ago, Rejoice said:

Does anyone know if this R&R Group just faded off into the sunset?

You could ask Volchic who referenced the group in her post in the New Members forum.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...

×
×
  • Create New...