vpw picked up "athletes of the spirit" somewhere and went off on it in front of lcm. lcm, being a jock through and through, heard that and insisted on making a production about it, something 20 minutes or thereabouts, in 1980, IIRC.
Once lcm was completely in charge, he began to work on the 2-hour dance number. All it took was him watching "Staying Alive", and adding that to what he'd said before. Then he really went on the warpath about AOS, no matter how he had to rewrite everything. It was something he could lay claim to as uniquely his, and is still connected with him to this day.
vpw was at least overtly approving of the 20 minute production. When lcm saw that and extended it to 2 hours, vpw may have realized he'd set the stage for a much bigger problem than he'd imagined. Furthermore, this would be a production that would put all the attention on lcm and not on vpw. Naturally, that was going to ruffle vpw's feathers. So, now that it was too late to do anything about it, vpw may have FINALLY seen at least SOME of the problems he'd encouraged to grow there.
Once lcm was completely in charge, he began to work on the 2-hour dance number. All it took was him watching "Staying Alive", and adding that to what he'd said before. Then he really went on the warpath about AOS, no matter how he had to rewrite everything. It was something he could lay claim to as uniquely his, and is still connected with him to this day.
So, lcm added more wrong teaching to what vp had already taught incorrectly?
So, lcm added more wrong teaching to what vp had already taught incorrectly?
vpw taught incorrectly, and somewhat briefly, on the subject. lcm later stretched that to 20 minutes of error, then stretched it to 2 hours of error. But, yes, vpw started that rolling, with little idea it would balloon out of proportion.
I finally began reading this article. It has been a slow start because I suspect the writer is deeply biased. But I am reading it slowly. It's all very slow and gentle. A gentle reading.
I just finished reading the word "run." If only I had more time. If only the flurry of posts... well, if they would just stop! It's hard to keep up. Slowly. A gentle keeping up.
Like I said, I have made great, if slow, progress in my gentle reading. All I have to say thus far is Yikes! So biased! I wish the article could have been written from an unvarnished perspective. Oh well. Until that day, I'll keep this article in a folder.
One question: How are we suppose to run if we are to stand above all. It seems like a contradiction, albeit a gentle one. If you're standing, you can't very well run. And if you're running, you've obviously stopped standing, even if the running is very, very, very slow.
I finally began reading this article. It has been a slow start because I suspect the writer is deeply biased. But I am reading it slowly. It's all very slow and gentle. A gentle reading.
I just finished reading the word "run." If only I had more time. If only the flurry of posts... well, if they would just stop! It's hard to keep up. Slowly. A gentle keeping up.
Like I said, I have made great, if slow, progress in my gentle reading. All I have to say thus far is Yikes! So biased! I wish the article could have been written from an unvarnished perspective. Oh well. Until that day, I'll keep this article in a folder.
One question: How are we suppose to run if we are to stand above all. It seems like a contradiction, albeit a gentle one. If you're standing, you can't very well run. And if you're running, you've obviously stopped standing, even if the running is very, very, very slow.
Your post got me to go back and read the article again. I'll share more tomorrow but I learned more about the five verses in this article by going back and reading them in their context - a lot more than looking at Greek words used to bolster twi's doctrine of us being athletes of the spirit.
Whether it has to do with my time in twi or not, my habit has never been to just read the Word without looking up the meaning of every third of fourth word on Bible Hub. After reading OldSkool's posts about just reading what's written in scripture, I'm beginning to see the benefits of doing this because it keeps the flow of God's word moving - like what you call "a gentle reading." It's easier this way to hear what the Spirit wants to teach me. Now when I want a better understanding of a verse or passage, I'll read it over a few more times, instead of immediately racing off to see what a commentary or website has to say and it's been pretty cool.
I'm not saying it's wrong to have a desire to study scripture. I'm saying that I needed to balance this with simply reading the scriptures for the joy of it and for what God wants me to see and learn from them.
The following is the first verse used in the article “Spiritual Athletes for God:”
“I Corinthians 9:24: Know ye not that they which run in a race run all, but one receiveth the prize? So run, that ye may obtain.
I don’t read in this verse that Paul is calling the believers athletes of the Spirit.I see him comparing believers to someone who runs in a race in that we both run and we both run with a goal of obtaining a prize.
In my opinion, I think it’s best to read the whole chapter on how Paul conducts himself as an apostle and see what you learn from it yourself. However, here are a few snippets:
for the seal of mine apostleship are ye in the Lord. (vs. 2)
Have we not power to eat and to drink? (vs 4)
Even so hath the Lord ordained that they which preach the gospel should live of the gospel. But I have used none of these things: neither have I written these things, that it should be so done unto me: for it werebetter for me to die, than that any man should make my glorying void. (vs 14,15)
For if I do this thing willingly, I have a reward: but if against my will, a dispensation of the gospel is committed unto me. What is my reward then? Verily that, when I preach the gospel, I may make the gospel of Christ without charge, that I abuse not my power in the gospel. (vs 17,18)
I am made all things to all men that I might by all means save some. And this I do for the gospel's sake, that I might be partaker thereof with you. (vs 22,23)
Know ye not that they which run in a race run all, but one receiveth the prize? So run, that ye may obtain. And every man that striveth for the mastery is temperate in all things. Now they do it to obtain a corruptible crown; but we an incorruptible. I therefore so run, not as uncertainly; so fight I, not as one that beateth the air: But I keep under my body, and bring it into subjection: lest that by any means, when I have preached to others, I myself should be a castaway. (This is explained in chapter 10.) (vs 24-27)
Whether it has to do with my time in twi or not, my habit has never been to just read the Word without looking up the meaning of every third of fourth word on Bible Hub. After reading OldSkool's posts about just reading what's written in scripture, I'm beginning to see the benefits of doing this because it keeps the flow of God's word moving - like what you call "a gentle reading." It's easier this way to hear what the Spirit wants to teach me. Now when I want a better understanding of a verse or passage, I'll read it over a few more times, instead of immediately racing off to see what a commentary or website has to say and it's been pretty cool.
Absolutely, Charity. We became conditioned to check out Greek and other words, to get a better perspective, to understand nuances, etc. La la la. Waste of time, mostly. Just read what's written.
When I first started reading a Bible again (after years of misery) I couldn't read AV (=what you call KJV). My mind would leap to TWI "expoundings" and go off on tracks that weren't helpful. I find it much more helpful to read different versions - any version, really, because those "tramlines" don't operate the same. The more modern English versions are often better for just reading. Epistles and gospels were written in then-contemporary language, not in any fancy historic words; I believe they should be read in good now-contemporary English (or whatever one's first-choice language is - French, Spanish, Bantu...) so as to keep the freshness alive.
Actually somebody gave me The Message - so "contemporary" that I couldn't quite grasp parts of it and had to check in other versions! LOL! The Message isn't my current choice but it was helpful then.
Reading in context is vital, and it's helpful to check out references to OT situations and context, where a verse has been quoted in a NT passage.
The following is the second verse used in the article “Spiritual Athletes for God:
”Philippians 2:16: Holding forth the word of life; that I may rejoice in the day of Christ, that I have not run in vain, neither laboured in vain.
Again, I don’t read in this verse that Paul is calling himself an athlete of the Spirit.He speaks of not running or labouring in vain.
Here are a few snippets from the whole chapter on Paul’s instructions to the believers and information about their relationships with one another. (NIV):
then make my joy complete by being like-minded, having the same love, being one in spirit and of one mind. (vs 2)
In your relationships with one another, have the same mindset as Christ Jesus: (vs 5)
Therefore God exalted him to the highest place and gave him the name that is above every name, (vs 9)
and every tongue acknowledge that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father. (vs 11)
continue to work out your salvation with fear and trembling, for it is God who works in you to will and to act in order to fulfill his good purpose. (vs 12b,13)
asyou hold firmly to the word of life. And then I will be able to boast on the day of Christ that I did not run or labor in vain. (vs 16)
But I think it is necessary to send back to you Epaphroditus, For he longs for all of you and is distressed because you heard he was ill. Therefore I am all the more eager to send him, so that when you see him again you may be glad and I may have less anxiety. (25a,26,28)
The following is the third and fourth verses used in the article “Spiritual Athletes for God:
Philippians 3:13,14: Brethren, I count not myself to have apprehended: but this one thing I do, forgetting those things which are behind, and reaching forth unto those things which are before, I press toward the mark for the prize of the high calling of God in Christ Jesus.”
Once again, I do not read that Paul is calling himself an athlete of the Spirit.I see him pressing toward the mark for the prize of the high calling of God in Christ Jesus. The NIV says, “I press on toward the goal to win the prize for which God has called me heavenward in Christ Jesus.”You get to decide from the context which is more accurate.
Here are some of the verses from chapter 3 – reading the whole chapter is even more enlightening.
Further, my brothers and sisters, rejoice in the Lord! (vs 1)
For it is we who are the circumcision, we who serve God by his Spirit, who boast in Christ Jesus, and who put no confidence in the flesh—(vs 3)
What is more, I consider everything a loss because of the surpassing worth of knowing Christ Jesus my Lord, for whose sake I have lost all things. I consider them garbage, that I may gain Christ (vs 8)
10I want to know Christ—yes, to know the power of his resurrection and participation in his sufferings, becoming like him in his death,
11and so, somehow, attaining to the resurrection from the dead.
12Not that I have already obtained all this, or have already arrived at my goal, but I press on to take hold of that for which Christ Jesus took hold of me.
13Brothers and sisters, I do not consider myself yet to have taken hold of it. But one thing I do: Forgetting what is behind and straining toward what is ahead,
14I press on toward the goal to win the prize for which God has called me heavenward in Christ Jesus.
15All of us, then, who are mature should take such a view of things.
But our citizenship is in heaven. And we eagerly await a Savior from there, the Lord Jesus Christ, who, by the power that enables him to bring everything under his control, will transform our lowly bodies so that they will be like his glorious body (vs 20,21)
The following is the third and fourth verses used in the article “Spiritual Athletes for God:
Philippians 3:13,14: Brethren, I count not myself to have apprehended: but this one thing I do, forgetting those things which are behind, and reaching forth unto those things which are before, I press toward the mark for the prize of the high calling of God in Christ Jesus.”
Once again, I do not read that Paul is calling himself an athlete of the Spirit.I see him pressing toward the mark for the prize of the high calling of God in Christ Jesus. The NIV says, “I press on toward the goal to win the prize for which God has called me heavenward in Christ Jesus.”You get to decide from the context which is more accurate.
Here are some of the verses from chapter 3 – reading the whole chapter is even more enlightening.
Further, my brothers and sisters, rejoice in the Lord! (vs 1)
For it is we who are the circumcision, we who serve God by his Spirit, who boast in Christ Jesus, and who put no confidence in the flesh—(vs 3)
What is more, I consider everything a loss because of the surpassing worth of knowing Christ Jesus my Lord, for whose sake I have lost all things. I consider them garbage, that I may gain Christ (vs 8)
10I want to know Christ—yes, to know the power of his resurrection and participation in his sufferings, becoming like him in his death,
11and so, somehow, attaining to the resurrection from the dead.
12Not that I have already obtained all this, or have already arrived at my goal, but I press on to take hold of that for which Christ Jesus took hold of me.
13Brothers and sisters, I do not consider myself yet to have taken hold of it. But one thing I do: Forgetting what is behind and straining toward what is ahead,
14I press on toward the goal to win the prize for which God has called me heavenward in Christ Jesus.
15All of us, then, who are mature should take such a view of things.
But our citizenship is in heaven. And we eagerly await a Savior from there, the Lord Jesus Christ, who, by the power that enables him to bring everything under his control, will transform our lowly bodies so that they will be like his glorious body (vs 20,21)
So much of this section of scripture for me was used to justify requiring unqualified commitment and obedience to a program and its leaders. And it still is used that way.
That in itself is a twisting of the scripture for an organizational benefit.
In reading this from a fresh perspective it seems like just an encouragement not to give up. Instead of wallowing in the past to focus on productive things and not get the ego inflated by past accomplishments or position (which is everything to TWI).
The group we belong to is a group who spiritually strive to live virtue every day by the power of our Lord Jesus Christ. And there is a future with that group.
When Jesus Christ returns there will be no TWI. There will be no “denominations” or “cults”. All that effort people put in to climbing a ladder and re arranging desk setups in a Tower of Babel are going to amount to exactly nothing.
There will be truth, and virtue, and the entire body of Christ working as one.
All of that is based upon a real and true relationship with Jesus Christ as verse 10 expounds.
Not a fake dashboard Jesus who only lifts a Jesus finger cool sign when the “law of believing” is complied with and a judgment finger when it’s not.
Not a bunch of “manifestations” obscured by charts and rules and keys. And restricted teaching that is not deemed essential based upon debt. Or “gift ministries” propping up a Pharisee internal culture based upon greed and ease of life.
I just have a different perspective not being bound to the same stupid people and bondage tenets that I was bound to in the past.
So much of this section of scripture for me was used to justify requiring unqualified commitment and obedience to a program and its leaders. And it still is used that way.
That in itself is a twisting of the scripture for an organizational benefit.
In reading this from a fresh perspective it seems like just an encouragement not to give up. Instead of wallowing in the past to focus on productive things and not get the ego inflated by past accomplishments or position (which is everything to TWI).
The group we belong to is a group who spiritually strive to live virtue every day by the power of our Lord Jesus Christ. And there is a future with that group.
When Jesus Christ returns there will be no TWI. There will be no “denominations” or “cults”. All that effort people put in to climbing a ladder and re arranging desk setups in a Tower of Babel are going to amount to exactly nothing.
There will be truth, and virtue, and the entire body of Christ working as one.
All of that is based upon a real and true relationship with Jesus Christ as verse 10 expounds.
Not a fake dashboard Jesus who only lifts a Jesus finger cool sign when the “law of believing” is complied with and a judgment finger when it’s not.
Not a bunch of “manifestations” obscured by charts and rules and keys. And restricted teaching that is not deemed essential based upon debt. Or “gift ministries” propping up a Pharisee internal culture based upon greed and ease of life.
I just have a different perspective not being bound to the same stupid people and bondage tenets that I was bound to in the past.
I'm glad you mentioned this because I had forgotten this aspect of the doctrine. I assume you probably heard it used a lot in the corps. It's great reading about how your perspective has changed from the old to the new.
I especially like vs 12 where Paul says he is continuing to press toward his goal to take hold of Christ in his life the way Christ has taken hold of him. It's a beautiful way of saying what our goal as a Christian can be.
13Brothers and sisters, I do not consider myself yet to have taken hold of it. But one thing I do: Forgetting what is behind and straining toward what is ahead,
This kinda jumped out at me today, but from a different perspective.
All of us here have been hurt by TWI one way or another [except perhaps Mike - well, he has, but he doesn't realise it]. Some have got over it well, some are still struggling with aspects. Constantly we come across new things that need to be revisited because of the programming that was effected upon us.
Paul was willing to forget his Pharisee upbringing and indoctrination. Willing to forget the abuse he suffered in Christ's name. To forget the near-misses when he was lowered out of a city, shipwrecked, imprisoned, and generally dragged down by constant undermining from religious Jews. Of course, he didn't forget - he wrote about it so that his supporters then knew, and we today know what he (and others) endured. But he didn't dwell on those things.
He and his companions pushed on forward. He wasn't "running his race" with shackles of the past tied to his ankles.
I'm so thankful to hear of ex TWI folk who have gone on to serve God and their fellow human beings in a myriad ways in their communities. Some help in established, helpful churches. Some have set up charities. Some have written books, documenting and warning.
Others are still sitting on the bench fiddling with their shackles. Or dawdling - on the right course, but not sure if they want to run or not. Hopefully we here can help by giving the key to undoing those shackles. We might even be able to help with a new pair of running shoes, figuratively speaking, of course.
And some are running the wrong way completely; those people are not my concern. The Lord will guard and guide them in his time.
We might even be able to help with a new pair of running shoes, figuratively speaking, of course.
And speaking of running shoes, I was going to upload a photo of mine but I seem to have exceeded allowances. I got my running shoes over a decade ago when I ran my first half marathon (in support of a Christian charity in my city). Then I ran several more half marathons over about 6 or 7 years. And then my knee got too painful and I haven't run in some years. Not bad for someone who hates running.
Recently took to wearing the shoes again just casually. And what happened to the soles?! Toe coming off, strips coming off the edges and middle. Some bits have been stuck on again (multiple times) and every so often one of the missing bits turns up somewhere in the garden. So basically, the undersole, the soft spongy padding, is mostly exposed on one shoe (other shoe remains intact).
Anyway I think I have been sitting on the Christian bench for too long. Time I got back more fully into the "race."
The following is a quote and the last verse used in the article “Spiritual Athletes for God:
“We can see more of this athletic terminology used in I Corinthians 9:25, which says, “And every man that striveth for the mastery is temperate in all things. Now they do it to obtain a corruptible crown; but we an incorruptible.”
The second part of this verse makes a comparison between the crowns an athlete receives and what the believers will obtain.Nowhere in that sentence does it say we are an AoS.
The first part of the verse has many different translations.Below is a list of them as shown on Bible Hub.
- has no athletic terminology - Berean Literal Bible and 6 others Now everyone striving controls himself in all things; then indeed they, that they might receive a perishable crown; but we, an imperishable.
These versions above agree with 2 Interlinear bibles where no athletic words are used whatsoever.
- in the games - New International Versionand 11 others
Everyone who competes in the games goes into strict training. They do it to get a crown that will not last, but we do it to get a crown that will last forever
- athletes - New Living Translationand 5 others
All athletes are disciplined in their training. They do it to win a prize that will fade away, but we do it for an eternal prize.
- athletic contest - International Standard Versionand 2 others
Everyone who enters an athletic contest practices self-control in everything. They do it to win a wreath that withers away, but we run to win a prize that never fades.
- for the mastery - King James Bibleand 2 others
And every man that striveth for the mastery is temperate in all things. Now they do it to obtain a corruptible crown; but we an incorruptible.
- for the prize - New King James Version And everyone who competes for the prize is temperate in all things. Now they do it to obtain a perishable crown, but we for an imperishable crown.
“We have seen some of the Greek athletic terminology that God used to describe our walk as His children. Just like the athletes who competed in the Greek games or the figure skaters of today who train and compete physically, we choose to compete spiritually as God’s children. We train ourselves to exercise self-control mentally and physically, focusing our actions on those things that help us to obtain heavenly rewards. We press toward the finish line, striving to win in the spiritual competition. We are spiritual athletes for God.”
There is nothing in the 5 verses that say we are competing like an athlete.Looking again at “I Corinthians 9:24:Know ye not that they which run in a race run all, but one receiveth the prize? So run, that ye may obtain,” in an athletic race, the athlete is the only one to receive a prize.However, we as Christians are not competing against each other but are striving together so we each can obtain the prize.
As for the last sentence in the article, I agree with what OldSkool posted when he showed twi’s website for it:
“I thought I would put this out here once again, if for no other reason to bring the truth to light once more that Christians are not athletes of the spirit and it's a fraudulent idea that wierwille forced into scripture and rammed through the research department back in the 80s.”
This kinda jumped out at me today, but from a different perspective.
All of us here have been hurt by TWI one way or another [except perhaps Mike - well, he has, but he doesn't realise it]. Some have got over it well, some are still struggling with aspects. Constantly we come across new things that need to be revisited because of the programming that was effected upon us.
Paul was willing to forget his Pharisee upbringing and indoctrination. Willing to forget the abuse he suffered in Christ's name. To forget the near-misses when he was lowered out of a city, shipwrecked, imprisoned, and generally dragged down by constant undermining from religious Jews. Of course, he didn't forget - he wrote about it so that his supporters then knew, and we today know what he (and others) endured. But he didn't dwell on those things.
He and his companions pushed on forward. He wasn't "running his race" with shackles of the past tied to his ankles.
I'm so thankful to hear of ex TWI folk who have gone on to serve God and their fellow human beings in a myriad ways in their communities. Some help in established, helpful churches. Some have set up charities. Some have written books, documenting and warning.
Others are still sitting on the bench fiddling with their shackles. Or dawdling - on the right course, but not sure if they want to run or not. Hopefully we here can help by giving the key to undoing those shackles. We might even be able to help with a new pair of running shoes, figuratively speaking, of course.
And some are running the wrong way completely; those people are not my concern. The Lord will guard and guide them in his time.
I agree, the context of the chapter for each of the verses contain so many gems about who we are, what we have and what we can do as children of God. It is far, far greater than anything that can be found in twi. And Twinky, it's great to have runners when you want to with joy or just for the heck of it jumping.
Spiritual athletes. Hah! Do you see any of the BoD running? Or any of the higher-ups? Running anywhere? LCM was a footballer or some such; I never saw him out running when I was in rez. Can't imagine any of the other Prezes running. (Maybe Vern, but long ago.)
So if they are not running, then they are not athletes. And they are certainly not athletes of the spirit.
Spiritual athletes. Hah! Do you see any of the BoD running? Or any of the higher-ups? Running anywhere? LCM was a footballer or some such; I never saw him out running when I was in rez. Can't imagine any of the other Prezes running. (Maybe Vern, but long ago.)
So if they are not running, then they are not athletes. And they are certainly not athletes of the spirit.
They have their track shoes laced up and are trying to outrun the past and the truth lol.
As opposed to athletes they are fleeing a crime scene.
“We have seen some of the Greek athletic terminology that God used to describe our walk as His children. Just like the athletes who competed in the Greek games or the figure skaters of today who train and compete physically, we choose to compete spiritually as God’s children. We train ourselves to exercise self-control mentally and physically, focusing our actions on those things that help us to obtain heavenly rewards. We press toward the finish line, striving to win in the spiritual competition. We are spiritual athletes for God.”
There is nothing in the 5 verses that say we are competing like an athlete.Looking again at “I Corinthians 9:24:Know ye not that they which run in a race run all, but one receiveth the prize? So run, that ye may obtain,” in an athletic race, the athlete is the only one to receive a prize.However, we as Christians are not competing against each other but are striving together so we each can obtain the prize.
As for the last sentence in the article, I agree with what OldSkool posted when he showed twi’s website for it:
“I thought I would put this out here once again, if for no other reason to bring the truth to light once more that Christians are not athletes of the spirit and it's a fraudulent idea that wierwille forced into scripture and rammed through the research department back in the 80s.”
Thanks OldSkool for starting this thread.
Thanks for the scripture breakdown Charity.
There is an athletic metaphor I think in 9:24. I think you and OS are accurate in that it does not extend into an allegory as taught by VP and LCM. It is a simple comparison.
9:25 brings it back into non metaphor talking about every person “striving for the mastery” showing in “temperance”. The mastery is referring to living a spiritual life I think in general as my read from a non fundy.
Live it with some discipline showing temperance or self control in life.
There is an athletic metaphor I think in 9:24. I think you and OS are accurate in that it does not extend into an allegory as taught by VP and LCM. It is a simple comparison.
9:25 brings it back into non metaphor talking about every person “striving for the mastery” showing in “temperance”. The mastery is referring to living a spiritual life I think in general as my read from a non fundy.
Live it with some discipline showing temperance or self control in life.
I agree Chockfull. When vs 24 says, “So run that ye may obtain,” I understand it means we are to run like an athlete runs. When vp coined the term “athletes of the spirit” and began to teach this is what we were, I had no problem with it at the time. Even his other thought-up phrases like the law of believing, the great principle and the absent Christ sounded good to me back then even though none of them were in the Word. It wasn’t until I became a member last year on GSC that I began to see how completely inaccurate these phrases (and the doctrine attached to them) were and how they took a lot of truth and power away from me as a believer.
I think the phrase “AoS” was the beginning of a slippery slope that led to his screwed-up interpretation of the armor of God in Ephesians 6. Another phrase vp invented was “sonship rights” where both the phrase and the word “rights” itself is not written in the Scriptures (KJV).
I know when we were born again, we received the gift of holy spirit and became the children of God. I know the word says we have been redeemed, sanctified, justified, made righteous and given the ministry of reconciliation. But did vp’s term of sonship rights become another slippery slope which allowed vp to become prideful and use the righteousness given to us by God as an excuse to sin? Did others follow his lead?
By using the word “rights” which is nowhere in the Bible, it was easy for vp to switch over to what a right actually is - a moral or legal entitlement to have or obtain something or to act in a certain way, and an entitlement is the belief that one is inherently deserving of privileges or special treatment. These words have nothing to do with our relationship with God since it’s only through God's love, mercy and grace and the obedience of His son that we became redeemed, justified, sanctified and made righteous.
That’s why I agree with OldSkool to just read what is written. It's a way to avoid making up one's own terminology so we have a better chance of remaining on solid ground biblically. (Mike has been confronted with this many times.)
By using the word “rights” which is nowhere in the Bible, it was easy for vp to switch over to what a right actually is - a moral or legal entitlement to have or obtain something or to act in a certain way, and an entitlement is the belief that one is inherently deserving of privileges or special treatment. These words have nothing to do with our relationship with God since it’s only through God's love, mercy and grace and the obedience of His son that we became redeemed, justified, sanctified and made righteous.
That’s why I agree with OldSkool to just read what is written. It's a way to avoid making up one's own terminology so we have a better chance of remaining on solid ground biblically. (Mike has been confronted with this many times.)
Yup!
In the PFAL material wierwille spoke of certain spiritual realities as a “right” – a legal entitlement to have or obtain something or to act in a certain way. That is PARTLY true. He was really big on teaching theory, but he showed little concern for practice. Here’s how he defined sanctification in the PFAL book, chapter 23, Knowing One’s Sonship Rights, page 338:
I Corinthians 1:30
But of him [God] are ye in Christ Jesus, who of God is made unto us wisdom, and righteousness, and sanctification, and redemption…
…The word “sanctified” means “to be set apart.” Before a man is born again of God’s Spirit, he is a man of body and soul, that’s all. But when he is born again, he is set apart by God for heaven and all hell can’t stop him from going...
End of excerpt
~ ~ ~ ~
In my opinion, wierwille's definition of "sanctification" is an incomplete thought. Consider the dedication of the Temple in I Kings 8 , I Kings 9 and II Chronicles 5ff
The dedicationmeant to set it apart for God’s use…to commit everything to a special purpose…It was not just the building itself that was dedicated for God’s use. It was the building, all the furniture, all the vessels, all the altars, and all the tools that were a part of this glorious Temple.
I believe the sanctification of I Cor. 1:30 may be talking in terms of in principle but not fully realized yet – since in the passage it relates to the achievements of Jesus Christ; considering other passages on this topic, I lean toward the notion there might be two modes:
1. the immediate effect of what Jesus Christ already completed for us.
2. since we have His influence and the power of The Holy Spirit inside us - sanctification is also an ongoing process of becoming more like Christ, by purifying our hearts and minds, through repentance, prayer, and spiritual discipline. In the Bible, sanctification is mentioned frequently as a calling to align oneself with God's will and cleanse oneself from sin. As seen in the following passage:
It is God’s will that you should be sanctified: that you should avoid sexual immorality I Thessalonians 4:3
I think on some topics, like this one – wierwille might have had a smidgen of the right notion – the idea of having stuff like righteousness , sanctification , redemption of Jesus Christ – is more along the lines of theory – it’s abstract, logical, and based on assumptions and observations
Whereas practice is applied theory. Practice is concrete, real, usually based on experience and observed conditions. Theory should explain and solve practical problems, and practice should be informed by theory - even looking at the context of the verse - it's all focused on practice:
1 As for other matters, brothers and sisters, we instructed you how to live in order to please God, as in fact you are living. Now we ask you and urge you in the Lord Jesus to do this more and more. 2 For you know what instructions we gave you by the authority of the Lord Jesus.
3 It is God’s will that you should be sanctified: that you should avoid sexual immorality; 4 that each of you should learn to control your own body in a way that is holy and honorable, 5 not in passionate lust like the pagans, who do not know God; 6 and that in this matter no one should wrong or take advantage of a brother or sister. The Lord will punish all those who commit such sins, as we told you and warned you before. 7 For God did not call us to be impure, but to live a holy life. 8 Therefore, anyone who rejects this instruction does not reject a human being but God, the very God who gives you his Holy Spirit.
What 1 Thessalonians 4 NIVis talking about – is that God wants us to ACT SANCTIFIED– in practice that means avoiding sexual immorality and other sinful behavior...We should ask ourselves how would Jesus Christ act in a situation? Certainly, His actions in the Gospels always exemplified holiness.
In the same line of thought, doing righteous actsis theory put into practice. According to Wikipedia righteousness is the quality or state of being morally correct and acceptable...that makes me think of the 2 great “directives” applied – love God and neighbor :
34 Hearing that Jesus had silenced the Sadducees, the Pharisees got together. 35 One of them, an expert in the law, tested him with this question: 36 “Teacher, which is the greatest commandment in the Law?”
37 Jesus replied: “ ‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.’ 38 This is the first and greatest commandment. 39 And the second is like it: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’ 40 All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.”
Thank you T-Bone for your feedback. It gave me a lot to think on. My thoughts are written in green.
In the PFAL material wierwille spoke of certain spiritual realities as a “right” – a legal entitlement to have or obtain something or to act in a certain way. That is PARTLY true. He was really big on teaching theory, but he showed little concern for practice.
I understand that what we have in Christ was given to us by God - the Righteous Judge - and therefore there is a legal component at play here. But since the word “rights” is not used in scripture (please correct me if I’m wrong), I prefer not to call the gift of holy spirit a right or legal entitlement. Instead, if anyone, even the adversary, wants to judge and condemn me, I can say what Jesus said when he was tempted – “It is written...”
Here’s how he defined sanctification in the PFAL book, chapter 23, Knowing One’s Sonship Rights, page 338:
I Corinthians 1:30
But of him [God] are ye in Christ Jesus, who of God is made unto us wisdom, and righteousness, and sanctification, and redemption…
…The word “sanctified” means “to be set apart.” Before a man is born again of God’s Spirit, he is a man of body and soul, that’s all. But when he is born again, he is set apart by God for heaven and all hell can’t stop him from going...
In my opinion, wierwille's definition of "sanctification" is an incomplete thought.
I think this was how he thought about many things – since all hell can’t stop him from going to heaven, he can damn well do what he pleases. Maybe I’m just being cynical but he must have known that sanctified meant to be set apart for God’s use and in order to do that we needed to be made holy so we can act in a holy manner. It's interesting that he left that part out in his definition on page 338
I believe the sanctification of I Cor. 1:30 may be talking in terms of in principle but not fully realized yet – since in the passage it relates to the achievements of Jesus Christ; considering other passages on this topic, I lean toward the notion there might be two modes:
1. the immediate effect of what Jesus Christ already completed for us.
I agree that because of the finished work of Christ on the cross, God has made us to be righteous, sanctified, justified and redeemed – not in our flesh but through the holy spirit He gave to us. Our righteousness, sanctification, justification and redemption are therefore just as real as the spirit that dwells in us is.
2. since we have His influence and the power of The Holy Spirit inside us - sanctification is also an ongoing process of becoming more like Christ, by purifying our hearts and minds, through repentance, prayer, and spiritual discipline. In the Bible, sanctification is mentioned frequently as a calling to align oneself with God's will and cleanse oneself from sin. As seen in the following passage:
This is such a wonderful truth. Until we receive our new spiritual body, sin continues to dwell in our flesh and what you wrote here about becoming more Christ-like is how the spiritual reality of who we are and what we have in Christ is manifested in our lives.
I think on some topics, like this one – wierwille might have had a smidgen of the right notion – the idea of having stuff like righteousness , sanctification , redemption of Jesus Christ – is more along the lines of theory – it’s abstract, logical, and based on assumptions and observations
Whereas practice is applied theory. Practice is concrete, real, usually based on experience and observed conditions. Theory should explain and solve practical problems, and practice should be informed by theory - even looking at the context of the verse - it's all focused on practice:
Vp’s notion was right on when he used these words because they came right out of the scriptures. It’s his idea to call them rights that I disagree with plus the fact that he didn’t put these words into practice as you explained about.
What 1 Thessalonians 4 NIVis talking about – is that God wants us to ACT SANCTIFIED– in practice that means avoiding sexual immorality and other sinful behavior...We should ask ourselves how would Jesus Christ act in a situation? Certainly, His actions in the Gospels always exemplified holiness.
In the same line of thought, doing righteous actsis theory put into practice. According to Wikipedia righteousness is the quality or state of being morally correct and acceptable...that makes me think of the 2 great “directives” applied – love God and neighbor :
You shared a lot of truth along with some Bible verses. My point is you can talk about these things effectively without using vp's phrase "sonship rights," a phrase that in my opinion explains his narcissisticlack of humility before God. If believers want to use the phrase in a godly way that's their right and privilege to do so. I just wanted to share in my previous post about my concerns with vp inventing terms that are not backed by scripture.
Again, it was nice to hear back from you T-Bone.(mine is a Starbuck's Java Chip Frappuccino since spring has arrived)
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Twinky
It's actually not a bad article - but it's ruined by the pseudo-intellectualism of stuffing in assorted Greek words, which in context add absolutely nothing to the article. If they were removed, the
chockfull
Well my observations are the “second thoughts” of VP had more to do with the extremity of LCMs antics than actual scripture concerns. “The ministry is the Word and the word is the ministry”. VPW
OldSkool
You were quoting T-Bone and my post really isnt aimed at anyone Chock, just quoted you for convenience sake. As for me, I heard that baby and bathwater analogy so many times from various o
WordWolf
vpw picked up "athletes of the spirit" somewhere and went off on it in front of lcm. lcm, being a jock through and through, heard that and insisted on making a production about it, something 20 minutes or thereabouts, in 1980, IIRC.
Once lcm was completely in charge, he began to work on the 2-hour dance number. All it took was him watching "Staying Alive", and adding that to what he'd said before. Then he really went on the warpath about AOS, no matter how he had to rewrite everything. It was something he could lay claim to as uniquely his, and is still connected with him to this day.
vpw was at least overtly approving of the 20 minute production. When lcm saw that and extended it to 2 hours, vpw may have realized he'd set the stage for a much bigger problem than he'd imagined. Furthermore, this would be a production that would put all the attention on lcm and not on vpw. Naturally, that was going to ruffle vpw's feathers. So, now that it was too late to do anything about it, vpw may have FINALLY seen at least SOME of the problems he'd encouraged to grow there.
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chockfull
Yeah the “athlete” allegory in TWI has developed a severe case of “athletes foot”.
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Charity
So, lcm added more wrong teaching to what vp had already taught incorrectly?
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WordWolf
vpw taught incorrectly, and somewhat briefly, on the subject. lcm later stretched that to 20 minutes of error, then stretched it to 2 hours of error. But, yes, vpw started that rolling, with little idea it would balloon out of proportion.
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Nathan_Jr
I finally began reading this article. It has been a slow start because I suspect the writer is deeply biased. But I am reading it slowly. It's all very slow and gentle. A gentle reading.
I just finished reading the word "run." If only I had more time. If only the flurry of posts... well, if they would just stop! It's hard to keep up. Slowly. A gentle keeping up.
Like I said, I have made great, if slow, progress in my gentle reading. All I have to say thus far is Yikes! So biased! I wish the article could have been written from an unvarnished perspective. Oh well. Until that day, I'll keep this article in a folder.
One question: How are we suppose to run if we are to stand above all. It seems like a contradiction, albeit a gentle one. If you're standing, you can't very well run. And if you're running, you've obviously stopped standing, even if the running is very, very, very slow.
Edited by Nathan_JrSuper star gloves
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Charity
Your post got me to go back and read the article again. I'll share more tomorrow but I learned more about the five verses in this article by going back and reading them in their context - a lot more than looking at Greek words used to bolster twi's doctrine of us being athletes of the spirit.
Whether it has to do with my time in twi or not, my habit has never been to just read the Word without looking up the meaning of every third of fourth word on Bible Hub. After reading OldSkool's posts about just reading what's written in scripture, I'm beginning to see the benefits of doing this because it keeps the flow of God's word moving - like what you call "a gentle reading." It's easier this way to hear what the Spirit wants to teach me. Now when I want a better understanding of a verse or passage, I'll read it over a few more times, instead of immediately racing off to see what a commentary or website has to say and it's been pretty cool.
I'm not saying it's wrong to have a desire to study scripture. I'm saying that I needed to balance this with simply reading the scriptures for the joy of it and for what God wants me to see and learn from them.
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Charity
The following is the first verse used in the article “Spiritual Athletes for God:”
“I Corinthians 9:24:
Know ye not that they which run in a race run all, but one receiveth the prize? So run, that ye may obtain.
I don’t read in this verse that Paul is calling the believers athletes of the Spirit. I see him comparing believers to someone who runs in a race in that we both run and we both run with a goal of obtaining a prize.
In my opinion, I think it’s best to read the whole chapter on how Paul conducts himself as an apostle and see what you learn from it yourself. However, here are a few snippets:
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Twinky
Absolutely, Charity. We became conditioned to check out Greek and other words, to get a better perspective, to understand nuances, etc. La la la. Waste of time, mostly. Just read what's written.
When I first started reading a Bible again (after years of misery) I couldn't read AV (=what you call KJV). My mind would leap to TWI "expoundings" and go off on tracks that weren't helpful. I find it much more helpful to read different versions - any version, really, because those "tramlines" don't operate the same. The more modern English versions are often better for just reading. Epistles and gospels were written in then-contemporary language, not in any fancy historic words; I believe they should be read in good now-contemporary English (or whatever one's first-choice language is - French, Spanish, Bantu...) so as to keep the freshness alive.
Actually somebody gave me The Message - so "contemporary" that I couldn't quite grasp parts of it and had to check in other versions! LOL! The Message isn't my current choice but it was helpful then.
Reading in context is vital, and it's helpful to check out references to OT situations and context, where a verse has been quoted in a NT passage.
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Charity
The following is the second verse used in the article “Spiritual Athletes for God:
”Philippians 2:16:
Holding forth the word of life; that I may rejoice in the day of Christ, that I have not run in vain, neither laboured in vain.
Again, I don’t read in this verse that Paul is calling himself an athlete of the Spirit. He speaks of not running or labouring in vain.
Here are a few snippets from the whole chapter on Paul’s instructions to the believers and information about their relationships with one another. (NIV):
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Charity
The following is the third and fourth verses used in the article “Spiritual Athletes for God:
Philippians 3:13,14:
Brethren, I count not myself to have apprehended: but this one thing I do, forgetting those things which are behind, and reaching forth unto those things which are before,
I press toward the mark for the prize of the high calling of God in Christ Jesus.”
Once again, I do not read that Paul is calling himself an athlete of the Spirit. I see him pressing toward the mark for the prize of the high calling of God in Christ Jesus. The NIV says, “I press on toward the goal to win the prize for which God has called me heavenward in Christ Jesus.” You get to decide from the context which is more accurate.
Here are some of the verses from chapter 3 – reading the whole chapter is even more enlightening.
Further, my brothers and sisters, rejoice in the Lord! (vs 1)
For it is we who are the circumcision, we who serve God by his Spirit, who boast in Christ Jesus, and who put no confidence in the flesh—(vs 3)
What is more, I consider everything a loss because of the surpassing worth of knowing Christ Jesus my Lord, for whose sake I have lost all things. I consider them garbage, that I may gain Christ (vs 8)
10 I want to know Christ—yes, to know the power of his resurrection and participation in his sufferings, becoming like him in his death,
11and so, somehow, attaining to the resurrection from the dead.
12Not that I have already obtained all this, or have already arrived at my goal, but I press on to take hold of that for which Christ Jesus took hold of me.
13Brothers and sisters, I do not consider myself yet to have taken hold of it. But one thing I do: Forgetting what is behind and straining toward what is ahead,
14I press on toward the goal to win the prize for which God has called me heavenward in Christ Jesus.
15All of us, then, who are mature should take such a view of things.
But our citizenship is in heaven. And we eagerly await a Savior from there, the Lord Jesus Christ, who, by the power that enables him to bring everything under his control, will transform our lowly bodies so that they will be like his glorious body (vs 20,21)
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chockfull
So much of this section of scripture for me was used to justify requiring unqualified commitment and obedience to a program and its leaders. And it still is used that way.
That in itself is a twisting of the scripture for an organizational benefit.
In reading this from a fresh perspective it seems like just an encouragement not to give up. Instead of wallowing in the past to focus on productive things and not get the ego inflated by past accomplishments or position (which is everything to TWI).
The group we belong to is a group who spiritually strive to live virtue every day by the power of our Lord Jesus Christ. And there is a future with that group.
When Jesus Christ returns there will be no TWI. There will be no “denominations” or “cults”. All that effort people put in to climbing a ladder and re arranging desk setups in a Tower of Babel are going to amount to exactly nothing.
There will be truth, and virtue, and the entire body of Christ working as one.
All of that is based upon a real and true relationship with Jesus Christ as verse 10 expounds.
Not a fake dashboard Jesus who only lifts a Jesus finger cool sign when the “law of believing” is complied with and a judgment finger when it’s not.
Not a bunch of “manifestations” obscured by charts and rules and keys. And restricted teaching that is not deemed essential based upon debt. Or “gift ministries” propping up a Pharisee internal culture based upon greed and ease of life.
I just have a different perspective not being bound to the same stupid people and bondage tenets that I was bound to in the past.
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Charity
I'm glad you mentioned this because I had forgotten this aspect of the doctrine. I assume you probably heard it used a lot in the corps. It's great reading about how your perspective has changed from the old to the new.
I especially like vs 12 where Paul says he is continuing to press toward his goal to take hold of Christ in his life the way Christ has taken hold of him. It's a beautiful way of saying what our goal as a Christian can be.
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Twinky
This kinda jumped out at me today, but from a different perspective.
All of us here have been hurt by TWI one way or another [except perhaps Mike - well, he has, but he doesn't realise it]. Some have got over it well, some are still struggling with aspects. Constantly we come across new things that need to be revisited because of the programming that was effected upon us.
Paul was willing to forget his Pharisee upbringing and indoctrination. Willing to forget the abuse he suffered in Christ's name. To forget the near-misses when he was lowered out of a city, shipwrecked, imprisoned, and generally dragged down by constant undermining from religious Jews. Of course, he didn't forget - he wrote about it so that his supporters then knew, and we today know what he (and others) endured. But he didn't dwell on those things.
He and his companions pushed on forward. He wasn't "running his race" with shackles of the past tied to his ankles.
I'm so thankful to hear of ex TWI folk who have gone on to serve God and their fellow human beings in a myriad ways in their communities. Some help in established, helpful churches. Some have set up charities. Some have written books, documenting and warning.
Others are still sitting on the bench fiddling with their shackles. Or dawdling - on the right course, but not sure if they want to run or not. Hopefully we here can help by giving the key to undoing those shackles. We might even be able to help with a new pair of running shoes, figuratively speaking, of course.
And some are running the wrong way completely; those people are not my concern. The Lord will guard and guide them in his time.
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Twinky
And speaking of running shoes, I was going to upload a photo of mine but I seem to have exceeded allowances. I got my running shoes over a decade ago when I ran my first half marathon (in support of a Christian charity in my city). Then I ran several more half marathons over about 6 or 7 years. And then my knee got too painful and I haven't run in some years. Not bad for someone who hates running.
Recently took to wearing the shoes again just casually. And what happened to the soles?! Toe coming off, strips coming off the edges and middle. Some bits have been stuck on again (multiple times) and every so often one of the missing bits turns up somewhere in the garden. So basically, the undersole, the soft spongy padding, is mostly exposed on one shoe (other shoe remains intact).
Anyway I think I have been sitting on the Christian bench for too long. Time I got back more fully into the "race."
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Charity
The following is a quote and the last verse used in the article “Spiritual Athletes for God:
“We can see more of this athletic terminology used in I Corinthians 9:25, which says, “And every man that striveth for the mastery is temperate in all things. Now they do it to obtain a corruptible crown; but we an incorruptible.”
The second part of this verse makes a comparison between the crowns an athlete receives and what the believers will obtain. Nowhere in that sentence does it say we are an AoS.
The first part of the verse has many different translations. Below is a list of them as shown on Bible Hub.
- has no athletic terminology - Berean Literal Bible and 6 others
Now everyone striving controls himself in all things; then indeed they, that they might receive a perishable crown; but we, an imperishable.
These versions above agree with 2 Interlinear bibles where no athletic words are used whatsoever.
- in the games - New International Version and 11 others
Everyone who competes in the games goes into strict training. They do it to get a crown that will not last, but we do it to get a crown that will last forever
- athletes - New Living Translation and 5 others
All athletes are disciplined in their training. They do it to win a prize that will fade away, but we do it for an eternal prize.
- athletic contest - International Standard Version and 2 others
Everyone who enters an athletic contest practices self-control in everything. They do it to win a wreath that withers away, but we run to win a prize that never fades.
- for the mastery - King James Bible and 2 others
And every man that striveth for the mastery is temperate in all things. Now they do it to obtain a corruptible crown; but we an incorruptible.
- for the prize - New King James Version
And everyone who competes for the prize is temperate in all things. Now they do it to obtain a perishable crown, but we for an imperishable crown.
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Charity
This is the last paragraph in twi’s article.
“We have seen some of the Greek athletic terminology that God used to describe our walk as His children. Just like the athletes who competed in the Greek games or the figure skaters of today who train and compete physically, we choose to compete spiritually as God’s children. We train ourselves to exercise self-control mentally and physically, focusing our actions on those things that help us to obtain heavenly rewards. We press toward the finish line, striving to win in the spiritual competition. We are spiritual athletes for God.”
There is nothing in the 5 verses that say we are competing like an athlete. Looking again at “I Corinthians 9:24:Know ye not that they which run in a race run all, but one receiveth the prize? So run, that ye may obtain,” in an athletic race, the athlete is the only one to receive a prize. However, we as Christians are not competing against each other but are striving together so we each can obtain the prize.
As for the last sentence in the article, I agree with what OldSkool posted when he showed twi’s website for it:
“I thought I would put this out here once again, if for no other reason to bring the truth to light once more that Christians are not athletes of the spirit and it's a fraudulent idea that wierwille forced into scripture and rammed through the research department back in the 80s.”
Thanks OldSkool for starting this thread.
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Charity
I agree, the context of the chapter for each of the verses contain so many gems about who we are, what we have and what we can do as children of God. It is far, far greater than anything that can be found in twi. And Twinky, it's great to have runners when you want to
with joy or just for the heck of it jumping.
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Twinky
Spiritual athletes. Hah! Do you see any of the BoD running? Or any of the higher-ups? Running anywhere? LCM was a footballer or some such; I never saw him out running when I was in rez. Can't imagine any of the other Prezes running. (Maybe Vern, but long ago.)
So if they are not running, then they are not athletes. And they are certainly not athletes of the spirit.
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chockfull
They have their track shoes laced up and are trying to outrun the past and the truth lol.
As opposed to athletes they are fleeing a crime scene.
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chockfull
Thanks for the scripture breakdown Charity.
There is an athletic metaphor I think in 9:24. I think you and OS are accurate in that it does not extend into an allegory as taught by VP and LCM. It is a simple comparison.
9:25 brings it back into non metaphor talking about every person “striving for the mastery” showing in “temperance”. The mastery is referring to living a spiritual life I think in general as my read from a non fundy.
Live it with some discipline showing temperance or self control in life.
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Twinky
Funny as, Chocky!
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Charity
I agree Chockfull. When vs 24 says, “So run that ye may obtain,” I understand it means we are to run like an athlete runs. When vp coined the term “athletes of the spirit” and began to teach this is what we were, I had no problem with it at the time. Even his other thought-up phrases like the law of believing, the great principle and the absent Christ sounded good to me back then even though none of them were in the Word. It wasn’t until I became a member last year on GSC that I began to see how completely inaccurate these phrases (and the doctrine attached to them) were and how they took a lot of truth and power away from me as a believer.
I think the phrase “AoS” was the beginning of a slippery slope that led to his screwed-up interpretation of the armor of God in Ephesians 6. Another phrase vp invented was “sonship rights” where both the phrase and the word “rights” itself is not written in the Scriptures (KJV).
I know when we were born again, we received the gift of holy spirit and became the children of God. I know the word says we have been redeemed, sanctified, justified, made righteous and given the ministry of reconciliation. But did vp’s term of sonship rights become another slippery slope which allowed vp to become prideful and use the righteousness given to us by God as an excuse to sin? Did others follow his lead?
By using the word “rights” which is nowhere in the Bible, it was easy for vp to switch over to what a right actually is - a moral or legal entitlement to have or obtain something or to act in a certain way, and an entitlement is the belief that one is inherently deserving of privileges or special treatment. These words have nothing to do with our relationship with God since it’s only through God's love, mercy and grace and the obedience of His son that we became redeemed, justified, sanctified and made righteous.
That’s why I agree with OldSkool to just read what is written. It's a way to avoid making up one's own terminology so we have a better chance of remaining on solid ground biblically. (Mike has been confronted with this many times.)
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T-Bone
Yup!
In the PFAL material wierwille spoke of certain spiritual realities as a “right” – a legal entitlement to have or obtain something or to act in a certain way. That is PARTLY true. He was really big on teaching theory, but he showed little concern for practice. Here’s how he defined sanctification in the PFAL book, chapter 23, Knowing One’s Sonship Rights, page 338:
I Corinthians 1:30
But of him [God] are ye in Christ Jesus, who of God is made unto us wisdom, and righteousness, and sanctification, and redemption…
…The word “sanctified” means “to be set apart.” Before a man is born again of God’s Spirit, he is a man of body and soul, that’s all. But when he is born again, he is set apart by God for heaven and all hell can’t stop him from going...
End of excerpt
~ ~ ~ ~
In my opinion, wierwille's definition of "sanctification" is an incomplete thought. Consider the dedication of the Temple in I Kings 8 , I Kings 9 and II Chronicles 5ff
The dedication meant to set it apart for God’s use…to commit everything to a special purpose…It was not just the building itself that was dedicated for God’s use. It was the building, all the furniture, all the vessels, all the altars, and all the tools that were a part of this glorious Temple.
I believe the sanctification of I Cor. 1:30 may be talking in terms of in principle but not fully realized yet – since in the passage it relates to the achievements of Jesus Christ; considering other passages on this topic, I lean toward the notion there might be two modes:
1. the immediate effect of what Jesus Christ already completed for us.
2. since we have His influence and the power of The Holy Spirit inside us - sanctification is also an ongoing process of becoming more like Christ, by purifying our hearts and minds, through repentance, prayer, and spiritual discipline. In the Bible, sanctification is mentioned frequently as a calling to align oneself with God's will and cleanse oneself from sin. As seen in the following passage:
It is God’s will that you should be sanctified: that you should avoid sexual immorality I Thessalonians 4:3
I think on some topics, like this one – wierwille might have had a smidgen of the right notion – the idea of having stuff like righteousness , sanctification , redemption of Jesus Christ – is more along the lines of theory – it’s abstract, logical, and based on assumptions and observations
Whereas practice is applied theory. Practice is concrete, real, usually based on experience and observed conditions. Theory should explain and solve practical problems, and practice should be informed by theory - even looking at the context of the verse - it's all focused on practice:
1 As for other matters, brothers and sisters, we instructed you how to live in order to please God, as in fact you are living. Now we ask you and urge you in the Lord Jesus to do this more and more. 2 For you know what instructions we gave you by the authority of the Lord Jesus.
3 It is God’s will that you should be sanctified: that you should avoid sexual immorality; 4 that each of you should learn to control your own body in a way that is holy and honorable, 5 not in passionate lust like the pagans, who do not know God; 6 and that in this matter no one should wrong or take advantage of a brother or sister. The Lord will punish all those who commit such sins, as we told you and warned you before. 7 For God did not call us to be impure, but to live a holy life. 8 Therefore, anyone who rejects this instruction does not reject a human being but God, the very God who gives you his Holy Spirit.
What 1 Thessalonians 4 NIV is talking about – is that God wants us to ACT SANCTIFIED – in practice that means avoiding sexual immorality and other sinful behavior...We should ask ourselves how would Jesus Christ act in a situation? Certainly, His actions in the Gospels always exemplified holiness.
In the same line of thought, doing righteous acts is theory put into practice. According to Wikipedia righteousness is the quality or state of being morally correct and acceptable...that makes me think of the 2 great “directives” applied – love God and neighbor :
34 Hearing that Jesus had silenced the Sadducees, the Pharisees got together. 35 One of them, an expert in the law, tested him with this question: 36 “Teacher, which is the greatest commandment in the Law?”
37 Jesus replied: “ ‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.’ 38 This is the first and greatest commandment. 39 And the second is like it: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’ 40 All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.”
Matthew 22 NIV
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Charity
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