Do you remember the first time you decided to turn off your brain?

[tonto]

I do. It was at my first advanced class, in the summer of 1978 at Emporia. My twig coordinator for the class was an apprentice corps girl who told our twig that for someone to become wrong seed they had to get before an altar and declare satan as lord or somesuch nonsense. I knew this didn't go along with way doctrine so another girl and I disagreed with her...argued with her that she was wrong and didn't know what she was talking about. This argument went to the top of the woodpile and DocVic mentioned it later in class. I don't remember all the details, but he didn't call us by name ( like he did with so many of you poor souls). He then turned it over to Craig, who then screamed and yelled at us for daring to question leadership...leadership that was put there by God (by god!), and if we're told to jump don't ask how high... yada yada.

I was so upset...just beside myself that the power structure was more important than doctrine...I knew it wasn't right and I spent the rest of the day and evening distraught. That night I remember standing on some slab of concrete (was there an Uncle Harry slab or is that just what we named it?) talking with my hubs (we were housed seperately and stayed up as late as was allowed). I was crying my eyes out and we both knew what happeded that day didn't make any sense, but I didn't want to "lose the Word". I decided that I couldn't trust my brain...I wasn't spiritual enough...so I just turned off my brain...bend me, shape me, anyway you want to... :(

So, do any of you remember a specific time you decided to turn off your brain?

[skyrider]

tonto......craig's scathing lecture at that class was "over the top." I, too, was there.

Just to give you a little background perspective, this 1978 advanced class followed on the heels of a situation that involved three 8th corps guys who went on a tangent with their own research. Obviously, veepee and lcm were still fuming from the ordeal.......how DARE these corps do independent research and CHALLENGE the way ministry??? This episode had HUGE IMPLICATIONS for years to come.

Perhaps others can give you a little more perspective on it......but I thought you'd like to know this background. I learned of it's existence, and it helped me to understand some of the verbose stances that happened at this class.

Now......back to your topic at hand.

[A la prochaine]

Tonto,

Yes... you just conjured up about 50 million incidents in my brain.

Man oh man... i'll have to think of the very first one and put it down here. You sure did strike a chord in me though.

Never equated 'being humble' (that shut-up/put-up way of thinking) as shutting off your brain, but it is.

Man oh man.. I got some real deep analysis to do. :(

Thanks for bringing this up.

[tonto]

Thanks, Skyrider. I had no idea there was any background...I just know I felt horrible then, and remembered that incident as mind-numbing.

Do you remember what the topics of their forbidden research was?

And really, didn't they name some chunk of concrete after Uncle Harry? :)

[templelady]

Yeah when the voice in my head was screming "Get out , Get out" and I went ahead and married my second husband--an occassion celebrated by TWI--it was all down hill from there

[CoolWaters]

The very first time I decided to turn off my brain for twi...

I was 16yo...my twig leader and his 'wife' (later found out they were married, but not to each other) wanted a 3some...and explained to me how I would understand 'brotherly love' far better if I would participate.

After that, any thinking on my part was suspect...because of what I did to that poor couple.

Sigh.

[skyrider]

tonto,

Vaguely, what comes to mind on this forbidden research........are topics that deal with "Jesus Christ our promised seed" and the "Bethlehem star." But someone else might be able to chime in on this one.

But unmistakeably.......I remember the adamancy of "it's vp & me OR the highway" approach to the whole class. Those three 8th corps guys were confident in their reseach......and, from what I heard, refused to back down from their independent work. I think these guys split out after this ordeal.

In hindsight, I see how situations like this "peppered the outbursts" with lots of flavored speech. It should have spoke volumes to my head, but apparently not in those youthful days. I just discarded it and moved on.

Surely, those like catcup and others could weigh in on this discussion.

[jardinero]

Great question, Tonto.

I'm sure I did it - - just don't remember quite when it all happened. I'm normally so argumentative, a little jaded, and HATE male-ordered, top-down organizations - - I always kept a little fight in me about the "good ol' boy" group twi had goin' and gave a lot of them fits most of the time. But, $*@!, we had a hard time leaving the Waybrain behind once we left.

So.........I'm really trying to figure out now, when did I turn my brain back on???? (at least I THINK I'm back in control of it most days)

J.

P.S. Hi Tonto and Mr. Tonto

[tonto]

I appreciate all your responses. For me it was an important piece of my personal puzzle to pinpoint my first time to throw the switch.

And my lovely Jardinero, hubs says to tell you hi and that he signed up for the cafe but hasn't posted yet because he's waiting for a sign from God or a note from the board of trustees.

[justloafing]

Tonto, There is no rhyme or reason for them to "off" (reprove). You could be doing everything right and they can twist it any way they wanted. Once I relized that my interm year I left. It only took my first year in res. of all the yelling and screaming over piddley crap that I figured out I was in a no win situation for God. I don't remember turning off my mind. If I did I may have stayed longer :( . I just got fed up with the BS because I really do think I did not shut off my mind and as being in the ministry for a short time I could see the bill of goods that they sold us as newbies was not what they meant at all. It was a ton of deception at the begining to get us hooked and then have us jump through hoops and of course they wanted us to jump and not ask how high.

[jkboehme]

I would say for may ex-twi, there was no conscious 'turning off of the brain.' For these folks, the 'waybrain' induction process was a matter of non-consented covert packaged persuasion of which they were unaware. They were strategically baited with a hook of apparent grace, then purposefully switched to control via fear and legalism. Their recruitment was a con to a scam 'ministry.' Any significant good that came about was due to the pure hearts & compassion of the rank & file non-insiders, who have pure motives.

[justloafing]

I would say for may ex-twi, there was no conscious 'turning off of the brain.' For these folks, the 'waybrain' induction process was a matter of non-consented covert packaged persuasion of which they were unaware. They were strategically baited with a hook of apparent grace, then purposefully switched to control via fear and legalism. Their recruitment was a con to a scam 'ministry.' Any significant good that came about was due to the pure hearts & compassion of the rank & file non-insiders, who have pure motives.

jkboehme, Exactly and it scammed people out of money and there own self respect. The "joe believer" had their minds controlled and "knew" if they did not due what leadership told them to do they were letting their lives open to devil spirits. It most certainly is the fear factor they imposed on you. I am so glad I believed enough in myself and took the leap out of that cornfield cult.

Edited January 19, 2006 by justloafing

[WordWolf]

I would say for may ex-twi, there was no conscious 'turning off of the brain.' For these folks, the 'waybrain' induction process was a matter of non-consented covert packaged persuasion of which they were unaware. They were strategically baited with a hook of apparent grace, then purposefully switched to control via fear and legalism.

"Indeed the safest road to hell is the gradual one- the gentle slope, soft underfoot,

without sudden turning, without milestones, without signposts."

-CS Lewis, "the Screwtape Letters"

[oldiesman]

The only time I can recall turning off my brain, as you will, and trying the "blind obedience" principle, was my six months in the corps. I considered it a challenge to do that... to test my abilities.

But as a Joe Believer, if I had a problem with a certain doctrine (tithing, for example) I took it to the top.

Didn't get an answer that satisfied me ... oh well.

At that point in time, I pretty much stopped tithing anyway, because it just didn't make sense to me.

I gave what I felt like giving, and was happy.

[tonto]

It's not that I wasn't conned and scammed. That was just the first time I remember thinking specifically that I had to surrender. After all, who was I? Just a little believer. These were men of gawd. There must be something wrong with me...with my brain...something I'm just not spiritual enough to see. And hey, if you flip the switch once, it's easier to do the second and third time.

I wish I had listened to my gut then, but I thank God we listened when given the opportunity in '86.

And Oldies, I took it to the top. The girl who joined me in disagreeing with this twig leader was chummy with DocVic. She went to him in the coach and talked with him about it. We were screamed at and humiliated anyway. Hey, but you're happy and all was right in your world, so nothing else matters.

[oldiesman]

Hey, but you're happy and all was right in your world, so nothing else matters.

Did I say all was right in my world and nothing else matters?

Take it easy Tonto... folks have varying experiences and we all don't think alike.

[rascal]

I understand Tonto.....

I remember vividly.... after going to my very first state app corpes meeting.

I went expecting to begin learning the inner secrets to walking spiritually...the beginning of my life and walk as a doulos..... we were simply paired up and dropped off for witnessing.

I was so glum driving home alone afterwards..... I remember the hopeless feeling that I was forever condemned to selling oranges door to door....(something we were required to do as a fund raiser in high school) selling a product that nobody wanted and further more resented you for interupting their lives.......I realised that I was expected to utilize much detested high pressure sales gimmicks ....something I had grown to hate in the pet store I worked at........it was such a bleak realization.....with a vivid clarity .....I saw that my spirituality was to be forever measured by how many people that I brought to twig and ran through the classes....any praises or pats on the back...were directly determined on a daily basis by how many people I had talked into attending twig....day in day out for the next 70 years.....

I saw the rest of my life as nothing more than a push to hawk God via pfal....no rest, no respite .....I realised that I was never to be allowed to have any friends or activities outside of those perameters.....

The worst part was that I knew that I wouldn`t be feeling that way if I had been more spiritual.....it was right then that I clicked off my brain ......renewed my mind ...... pretended that my feelings, my desires, any goals that I had ever had were of no consequence.......

It was then and there that I began the process of shutting down my brain....or renewed my mind as we termed it......and coldly, numbly proceeded following instructions to the letter..... that was the day that I began to whither up and die inside.

Edited January 19, 2006 by rascal

[Bramble]

I suspect it was when I first listen and considered--'You know what killed that little boy...'

I think that was the first step down.

Edited January 19, 2006 by Bramble

[excathedra]

good point bramble

i was going to say when someone asked me to a twig fellowship, but i'm just kidding

then i was going to say when i moved into a college way home WITHOUT A TV

bUT REALLY

when i took pfal the man of god came to our 12th session and i went over to the college way home without the TV (i didn't live there yet) and i walked past the bathroom and the door was open. i glanced to my left and lo and behold the TEACHER was standing there blow drying his hair in front of the mirror and he was buck naked. he turned to me as i walked by with a BIG SMILE and a tiny little winkie. i was IN SHOCK on one level but my brain was already f'd up since i was a kid. the gal who was my "leader" told me something about spiritual little thingies being so far above earthly or fleshly little thingies

ugh

i can't remember now if he was in a robe and turned and winked with the robe open or if he was totally nude

i'm trying to remember but it was not a pretty sight and i think i blocked it

[bliss]

Gross Excie~ that would have definatley put me over the edge as a youngin....

For me, it wasn't about shutting "off" my brain, as much as it was "busying" my brain.

Remember, the Way never allowed you to "do nothing" with your mind. If you weren't working at a job, or

"cleaning your house" or studying the Word, or retemorizing, or running a class, studying the collaterals, or

witnessing...................then you should be Speaking in Tongues. When did our brain have a rest?

When did it just "be"?

Well, when folks get to that place of "stillness", then they can hear that "still small voice".

So, when we moved to the sticks, and got quiet, we could finally hear God (screaming ...................

"GET OUT GET OUT!") He must of thought we were deaf all those years.

[excathedra]

excellent point, dear bliss

i still have that "devotion with motion" mode

if i'm not scurrying around, i must not be in fellowship ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha

[tonto]

Thanks again for all your responses...

A la, have you remembered the first one yet?

Excie, ugh and ick. I wish I could go back and slap the snot out of him for standing there like that.

Rascal, I had forgotten about some of our apprentice corps meetings being nothing more than witnessing blitzes. I absolutely hated witnessing. That's another thread...

Thanks, keeds.

[excathedra]

i can't decide what i hated most

being forced to witness to someone

or being forced to minister to someone

[tonto]

Oh geez, I really really really h-a-t-e-d witnessing. I don't like selling and my skin crawls when I feel like someone is selling something to me.

Ministering to someone? I always just prayed for people and I like doing that, but it's when you get into that "And Father, I just thank you for the blood vessels to enlarge, Father, and for the spirit of tension to leave, Father, and Father"...

[bliss]

Father Father Father Father

Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you

Didn't we have any more words to use?

Geez